DAWN of the DEAD Prop Gun

[Skippy911sc]

A1 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A1 (for example, an A1 rear sight) A2 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A2 (for example, an A2 flash hider) A3 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A3, or (in civilian parlance) a flat-top receiver. Note that the M16A3 is essentially just a full-auto M16A2, but civilian manufacturers began using the term A3 for flat-top receivers before the military adopted the M16A3 and M16A4, so there is divergence between military and civilian usage of the term "A3". Without a definitive military context, it is most likely that "A3" refers to a flat-top, civilian upper receiver. Note also that some civilian manufacturers call their flat-tops A3, others A4. A4 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A4 (for example, a flat-top A4 upper receiver)

[Yojimbo]

A1 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A1 (for example, an A1 rear sight) A2 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A2 (for example, an A2 flash hider) A3 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A3, or (in civilian parlance) a flat-top receiver. Note that the M16A3 is essentially just a full-auto M16A2, but civilian manufacturers began using the term A3 for flat-top receivers before the military adopted the M16A3 and M16A4, so there is divergence between military and civilian usage of the term "A3". Without a definitive military context, it is most likely that "A3" refers to a flat-top, civilian upper receiver. Note also that some civilian manufacturers call their flat-tops A3, others A4. A4 - Of or referring to a characteristic of the M16A4 (for example, a flat-top A4 upper receiver) Hey Skippy, thanks for the info!

[FoodFight]

Skippy911sc wrote (QUOTE]I have a ruger in 22 LR and it is a gas powered semi auto.[/QUOTE] I think that you mean it's blowback operated. Yojimbo wrote [QUOTE][I am unfamiliar with the M-16A1 and it's difference from the actual M-16 (which admittedly, I am largely unfamiliar with as well) Is the A1 status simply due to the addition of a forward assist mechanism (to seat the round) or is it a caliber difference (such as some sort of conversion to .22 for training purposes)?/QUOTE] The primary differences between the M16 and M16A1 is the addition of a chromed bore and chamber, a forward assist and modified bolt, and an enclosed flash suppressor. Weird, quote wrap didn't work.

[Yojimbo]

Skippy911sc wrote (QUOTE]I have a ruger in 22 LR and it is a gas powered semi auto. I think that you mean it's blowback operated. Yojimbo wrote [I am unfamiliar with the M-16A1 and it's difference from the actual M-16 (which admittedly, I am largely unfamiliar with as well) Is the A1 status simply due to the addition of a forward assist mechanism (to seat the round) or is it a caliber difference (such as some sort of conversion to .22 for training purposes)?/QUOTE] The primary differences between the M16 and M16A1 is the addition of a chromed bore and chamber, a forward assist and modified bolt, and an enclosed flash suppressor. Weird, quote wrap didn't work. Thanks for the info about the A-1, FoodFight. Yeah, I was wondering about whether or not a.22 had enough juice to run a gas-operated system. I myself have a Ruger 10/22 and it is, as you said, blowback system as opposed to my old Mini 14 which was gas (but .223 has much more to work with in the way of gases than a .22) THat is to say, I guess it isn't impossible for someone to invent a gas powered system that would work for a .22, and if anyone is going to do so it wouldn't surprise me if Ruger was the one that would come up with it. Sturm Ruger and Co. have some awfully clever engineers!

[Skippy911sc]

A blowback system is esentially gas operated since it uses the gas from the fired round to "blow" the bolt back to prepare for another round. this is a close up of the foreward assist on a modern AR15 / M4 type Rifle. here is a close up of Peter pulling the magazine from his M16 at the airport scene...you can see how small it is when comparing it to this... These are 30 20 and 5 or 10 round Magazines similar to what he would have used. and here is a comparison of a .22 LR vs. .223 or 5.56 And just for giggles... here is .50 BMG, .308 Win, 5.56 Nato, .22 Long Rifle, .460 S&W, .454 Casull, .45 Long Colt, .45 ACP, .44 Mag, .44 Spcl, .357 Mag, .32 Auto

[Yojimbo]

A blowback system is esentially gas operated since it uses the gas from the fired round to "blow" the bolt back to prepare for another round. this is a close up of the foreward assist on a modern AR15 / M4 type Rifle. here is a close up of Peter pulling the magazine from his M16 at the airport scene...you can see how small it is when comparing it to this... These are 30 20 and 5 or 10 round Magazines similar to what he would have used. and here is a comparison of a .22 LR vs. .223 or 5.56 And just for giggles... here is .50 BMG, .308 Win, 5.56 Nato, .22 Long Rifle, .460 S&W, .454 Casull, .45 Long Colt, .45 ACP, .44 Mag, .44 Spcl, .357 Mag, .32 Auto Cool pictures. Thanks for the heads up aboput the forward assist, BTW. I do see what you are saying about the blowback system -- I could be wrong, as I am not up on my firearms knowledge, but the gas operated system siphons off the gases as they blow down the barrel of the gun and redirects the gases back to operate the mechanism, whereas -- and again, I could have it wrong -- the blowback system uses the energy from the bullet itself being propelled down the barrel by the charge itself to propell the block itself backwards against a spring which is calibrated to resist at a certain point of compression and spring the bolt back forward. Maybe this is the same thing? I don't know, I had always thought that these were two entirely different creatures. Again, one of the heads more knowledgable about firearm mechanisms can probably clarify.

[FoodFight]

Here's a cool animation of a blowback operation. [URL="http://www.waffeninfo.net/verschluss/bild/massezuschiessani.gif"] Here's gas operation. (Gas piston, in this instance) [URL="http://www.waffeninfo.net/verschluss/bild/rotboltani.gif"] Blowback operation isn't dependent upon gases. Theoretically an extremely powerful spring could replace the powder in a case, which would propel the bullet and cycle the action. Trying the same thing with a gas-operated system would only result in failure. Dang, not even the links are working for me. Cut and paste them, please.

[DubiousComforts]

Just noticed that Steel, Rhodes and Johnson (Greg Nicotero) all use a similar rifle in DAY. But these weapons weren't supplied by Gary Zeller, and all definitely load with full magazines--watch the scene where Rhodes is struggling to load the clip just before Bub shoots him. FoodFight, you have to load those gifs as images instead of urls. Cool animations! Btw, Rhodes is also seen loading/cocking his rifle (I think) similar to the second animation.

[Skippy911sc]

The diagram looks to be a representation of a 1911 design. The only problem it the the slide, does not fire the round. Rather the trigger is pulled slamming the firing pin into the back of the primer which then ignites the powder within the brass case launching the bullet out the end of the barrel. The explosive reaction slams the slide (top portion of the gun) back ejecting the brass, and the recoil SPRING pulls the slide forward pushing the next round into the chamber. The diagram shows the slide slamming forward firing the round. I am not a gunsmith however I have owned several firearms and they all work in much the same way. The difference may be the location of the spring. In an M16 type rifle the spring is in the buttstock, in an AK47 the Spring is around the gas tube. (this allows for a folding stock). In a hand gun the Spring is usually under the barrel. The only types that I can think of that do not use a spring are single shot, pump, bolt action, and lever action. In these types the old case and next round are all removed and fed manually. Even a semi-auto shotgun uses a spring to eject and feed the next round. The other graphic appears to be a representation of an M16 or AR15 and with the exception of the gas tupe the hand gun would work in a similar manner.

[jim102016]

The diagram looks to be a representation of a 1911 design. The only problem it the the slide, does not fire the round. Rather the trigger is pulled slamming the firing pin into the back of the primer which then ignites the powder within the brass case launching the bullet out the end of the barrel. The explosive reaction slams the slide (top portion of the gun) back ejecting the brass, and the recoil SPRING pulls the slide forward pushing the next round into the chamber. The diagram shows the slide slamming forward firing the round. I am not a gunsmith however I have owned several firearms and they all work in much the same way. The difference may be the location of the spring. In an M16 type rifle the spring is in the buttstock, in an AK47 the Spring is around the gas tube. (this allows for a folding stock). In a hand gun the Spring is usually under the barrel. The only types that I can think of that do not use a spring are single shot, pump, bolt action, and lever action. In these types the old case and next round are all removed and fed manually. Even a semi-auto shotgun uses a spring to eject and feed the next round. The other graphic appears to be a representation of an M16 or AR15 and with the exception of the gas tupe the hand gun would work in a similar manner. Good call, Skippy, no firing pin. I think he was just going after the basics for those who aren't familiar with the process. I fired an semi-auto shotgun one time (a blast!) and with the way that bastard kicked it made me wish there was a spring in the stock. Skippy, you work in a firearm shop?

[Skippy911sc]

I don't work in a gunshop, I'm just a nutcase No I am an enthusiast, and a hunter. In real terms the best weapon to have in an out break situation would be a .22 cal semi-auto rifle, IMHO, just for the simple fact that it will penetrate the skull, is simple to use and clean, is not as noisy as other rifles, and has very little recoil. So stock up people!!

[Yojimbo]

I don't work in a gunshop, I'm just a nutcase No I am an enthusiast, and a hunter. In real terms the best weapon to have in an out break situation would be a .22 cal semi-auto rifle, IMHO, just for the simple fact that it will penetrate the skull, is simple to use and clean, is not as noisy as other rifles, and has very little recoil. So stock up people!! Agreed. You can also hump a lot more ammo with a .22, it is easily silenced (and if you are using subsonic ammo then it may be fired without a silencer and only present a sound profile similar to an air pistol) and since it is one of the most popular calibers it should be very easy to find it nearly everywhere (as opposed to a more specialized caliber) Also, since it is perceived as barely 1 step away from a bb gun (wrongly, might I add) it stands less likeey to be banned.

[FoodFight]

The site that I got the gif's from said that the first is representative of an Uzi (open bolt fixed, firing pin), but they erred in putting the recoil spring forward of the bolt. It does make it look like a slam-firing M1911 action (good catch, Skippy!). The second is an AK-type gas system. The rotating key in the bolt carrier corresponds to the unlocking of the bolt lugs in their respective recesses. Waffeninfo has other animations of tilting gas block systems, delayed blowback, etc. Crude drawings indeed, but still useful for conceptualizing.

[Riptides]

Hello everyone. I don't know if it's already been said, the hatch that covers the ejection slot on the side is a cover to prevent debris from entering the bolt while using the rifle in the "field". While not required it's usually a good idea to flip this open with before firing, as it's not uncommon for a spent shell casing to get hung in the bolt from the cover being closed when firing. Also the reason this gun takes a .22LR bullet is because it was modified specifically by the manufacturer to be a training model, usually for live fire exercises (think SWAT teams training on entry tactics where they are expected to shoot live ammo @ some point in the exercise). The reason for this is that .22LR rounds are an order of magnitude less dangerous in these situations than actual .223 rounds.

[Skippy911sc]

Hello everyone. I don't know if it's already been said, the hatch that covers the ejection slot on the side is a cover to prevent debris from entering the bolt while using the rifle in the "field". While not required it's usually a good idea to flip this open with before firing, as it's not uncommon for a spent shell casing to get hung in the bolt from the cover being closed when firing. Also the reason this gun takes a .22LR bullet is because it was modified specifically by the manufacturer to be a training model, usually for live fire exercises (think SWAT teams training on entry tactics where they are expected to shoot live ammo @ some point in the exercise). The reason for this is that .22LR rounds are an order of magnitude less dangerous in these situations than actual .223 rounds. The dust cover will automatically open when the bolt is slid into firing position and the 22lr blanks are A LOT less powerful than the 5.56 or .223 blanks...and yes when a blank is fired something comes out of the barrel...often a piece of wax...think about Branden Lees fate.