Too many of them, not enough ammo!

[Wyldwraith]

A problem with the bioengineered virus source, Custom bio-weapons (not talking about stocks of anthrax, smallpox etc. I mean truly weaponized pathogens) are the province of those with access to a great deal of funding, the right personnel, and the necessary equipment and facilities to both create the pathogen, and maintain control of it so they don't end up infecting/killing themselves before they can utilize it elsewhere. One thing that almost all true bio-weapons have in common is that whoever is pulling the strings insists upon an antidote/counter-agent for the pathogen. Yes, there ARE people insane enough to dispense with this precaution, but not many who possess the prerequisites to develop the bio-weapon in the first place. Not saying it couldn't happen. Logistically difficult doesn't mean impossible, as those involved with the Manhattan Project proved. The scenario just doesn't strike me as any more likely than any other scenario. How's this for a natural disaster large enough to get the unsecured body count up. What about a relatively clean miss by a Gamma Ray burst? Say something that missed us by a huge margin, but just enough to cause a few weeks of electronic havoc, tumble a few satellites out of the sky and increase global unrest via the cumulative result of these and several more minor but significant events? Too improbable? How about unusually intense solar flare activity that builds up a sufficient electrostatic charge in the atmosphere. You'd end up with large geographical areas subjected to electrical discharges sufficient to cause havoc with unshielded electronics, with the next discharge as difficult to predict as a lightning strike. A zombie epidemic set against such a backdrop would stand a strong chance of getting extremely serious in a hurry. Going back to my original theory for a moment though. I think you're underestimating the sheer number of people being moved around all over the place in the wake of something as localized as a severe hurricane. Katrina hits Louisiana and the next thing you know the surrounding states are inundated with refugees. That huge mass of homeless individuals that ended up encamped at that stadium would've been ripe for the infection to spread through their ranks like wildfire. Overall though, I do believe you need a global-scope source for the zombie epidemic if it's going to become a global issue. The bioterrorism gone wrong angle does have certain benefits in that area. It could be as simple as the next SARS being a pathogen that creates zombies out of the infected when they die, has a high rate of contagion/easily infectious, and the world has the misfortune of having a few infected individuals who aren't seriously symptomatic yet getting on international flights. Infect thirty people who are getting on thirty planes headed to twenty different countries and you have the makings of a zombie epidemic. Why not? Mother Nature seems to enjoy designing viruses to kill us horribly of late. Don't really blame the planet either, all things considered. Why NOT a virus or bacterial infection that uses the host's body to actively spread itself?

[Trin]

What about a relatively clean miss by a Gamma Ray burst? That would be fine except for all the Incredible Hulks it would create. The first round of zombies wouldn't have a chance against all those Incredible Hulks. It would only take a few Incredible Hulks to wipe out hordes of zombies given their strength, endurance, and tolerance to pain/injury. Of course, the first round of zombies would get quite a few bites in, which means that the second round of zombies would be Incredible Hulk zombies. Which, by itself is not a problem. Zombies don't tend to get mad so the Incredible Hulk zombies would, by and large, never be worse than regular zombies. With the noteworthy exception of the Big Daddy Incredible Hulk zombies. Now THOSE would be some badassed zombies indeed. They'd get mad, howl into the air, and turn into zombie Incredible Hulks and go on a serious rampage. No barricades or defenses would withstand the Big Daddy zombie Incredible Hulks once angered. And for that reason, I agree that Gamma Rays could form the basis of a serious zombie outbreak.

[AcesandEights]

Of course, the first round of zombies would get quite a few bites in, which means that the second round of zombies would be Incredible Hulk zombies. Shhhhh! Zack Snyder might hear you.

[Publius]

And for that reason, I agree that Gamma Rays could form the basis of a serious zombie outbreak. LOL

[sandrock74]

That would be fine except for all the Incredible Hulks it would create. The first round of zombies wouldn't have a chance against all those Incredible Hulks. It would only take a few Incredible Hulks to wipe out hordes of zombies given their strength, endurance, and tolerance to pain/injury. Of course, the first round of zombies would get quite a few bites in, which means that the second round of zombies would be Incredible Hulk zombies. Which, by itself is not a problem. Zombies don't tend to get mad so the Incredible Hulk zombies would, by and large, never be worse than regular zombies. With the noteworthy exception of the Big Daddy Incredible Hulk zombies. Now THOSE would be some badassed zombies indeed. They'd get mad, howl into the air, and turn into zombie Incredible Hulks and go on a serious rampage. No barricades or defenses would withstand the Big Daddy zombie Incredible Hulks once angered. And for that reason, I agree that Gamma Rays could form the basis of a serious zombie outbreak. I would HATE to meet the zombie who can bite thru the Hulks skin!

[Trin]

Too improbable? How about unusually intense solar flare activity that builds up a sufficient electrostatic charge in the atmosphere. You'd end up with large geographical areas subjected to electrical discharges sufficient to cause havoc with unshielded electronics, with the next discharge as difficult to predict as a lightning strike. That is the same effect as the EMP I described, except from solar flares the effect is much smaller. However, even with solar flares it's still not small. The most severe of these occurred on March 13, 1989, and took out areas of North America and the UK. The US and Canada lost the power grid in many places along the North Eastern seaboard. To the tune of 6 million people out of power. An EMP would do the same thing to the entire US. Shhhhh! Zack Snyder might hear you. Dang man, you're right!! How irresponsible of me!! What about zombies with frickin laser beams on their heads? Do you think Zack has throught of that? I would HATE to meet the zombie who can bite thru the Hulks skin! The Hulks would only get bitten when they're not Hulked-out.

[SRP76]

Hulk couldn't remain Hulk. Once bitten and dead, the shambling "Banners" would no longer possess emotion, so they couldn't trigger the transformation. Any that were Hulk when they croak would have the same problem: they'd calm, then revert.

[Trin]

Hulk couldn't remain Hulk. Once bitten and dead, the shambling "Banners" would no longer possess emotion, so they couldn't trigger the transformation. Any that were Hulk when they croak would have the same problem: they'd calm, then revert. Yes, I mentioned that, but you need to go back and read about the Big Daddy Incredible Hulks. They get plenty mad.

[AcesandEights]

the Big Daddy Incredible Hulks. They get plenty mad. Hrm...point, counterpoint. Well played, Mr. Trin. Well played, indeed.

[MoonSylver]

You guys better tone down your comic-book-geek-thread-derailer...someone may come along & lock you out.

[sandrock74]

You know...only Iron Man would be safe from zombies. He could sleep in the middle of the street and not have to worry about zombies! That's where I would be during a zombie apocalypse...in the Iron Man armor!

[Crappingbear]

You guys need to read the Marvel Zombies graphic novel series. Hulk is the baddest zombie of all and Iron Man gets nails pretty easily. Even Galactus goes down to them.

[Trin]

You guys better tone down your comic-book-geek-thread-derailer...someone may come along & lock you out. Yeah, we wouldn't want the thread locked before its run its course. But, in all seriousness, Wyldwraith made some good points before I derailed it. Everyone should go back and read his posts... I think it's worth mentioning that a slightly different kind of infection works well to add plausibility to a global scenario. Look at I Am Legend (book more than movie). The populace became infected - self-infected actually since it was a drug they voluntarily took. The length of time between the populace becoming infected and the effects being seen justifies how the infection spread to the world and became global prior to anyone realizing the nature of the problem.

[Wyldwraith]

Thanks Trin, I am Legend was actually something I thought about when trying to come up with viable means for a zombie-uprising cause that could go global. Everything I follow through to a foreseeable conclusion says it would HAVE to be one of two general sources. 1) The various and previously discussed pathogen theories. A virus, bacteria, microbial parasite, fungus, mold etc. The key to this theory is either a 1-2 environmental + pathogen punch. Like say if the mold-based illnesses that developed in the wake of the tsunami in Asia, or Katrina zombified the victims the mold killed. Viable, because what does science really know about the various microorganisms which normally make their home at the bottom of millenia-old swamps/bayous and on the ocean floor below a few hundred feet? 2) Something from space. The tail of a close-passing comet disseminating some chemical, alien pathogen, radioactive dust into a large portion of the upper atmosphere. A significant-sized meteorite impact that accomplishes the same atmospheric saturation by different means etc. Everything else I come up with just doesn't seem to have the endurance, ability to widely proliferate, or cause enough deaths in enough places to get a sufficient number of zombies up and killing/infecting others to cause a major undead pandemic. Bio-terrorism was the runner up, but most terrorist organizations love taking credit for their work, so that's a built in warning to the authorities to get on the ball. Even without it, it's still a somewhat localized event unless very well planned. In which case it would amount to the same thing as a natural epidemic. The reason the disaster + zombie-causing pathogen scenario is a favorite of mine is that any significant natural disaster would already be stretching national resources pretty harshly to respond in a timely manner. An additional threat on the heels of such a population-displacing/mass-casualty situation has all the right earmarkings to spell big trouble even in a developed nation. In the Third World the results could be exponentially worse. End of the day: Zombies are all about the numbers. Fans of survival horror tend to be fascinated with the endgame scenario. Something about 98.5% of the world population shambling around eating the few remaining humans tickles our love-affair with potential extinction. Which is really just a play on large-scale applications of the Man vs Wild principle. Of course that's just my theory. Whatever the reason, we fans don't tend to give nearly as much thought as to how those massive undead hordes get spawned. We just blithely assume that the police, military and every other type of agency fails, then the world descends into an anarchy-buffet for the undead. I think that might by why even people who don't particularly like (or even hate) Dawn '04 tend to say things like "The first fifteen minutes were cool..." Because we don't get those glimpses of how it all kicks off very often. It was novel. I think the OTHER reason we don't tend to dwell on the beginning and middle of such a scenario is that the thousand of personally horrifying moments that would make up the beginning of the end of the world aren't entertaining in the way that the more abstractly horrifying endgame is. It's one thing to look at a deserted city populated by thousands of zombies like the scene at the beginning of Day. It's quite another to watch neighborhood after neighborhood be slaughtered, reanimate and join the cresting wave breaking over what's left of the population centers. Which is weird, because in limited doses we enjoy that too. World War Z proved that. You know, in writing this I've become to wonder what's more macabre. The idea of reanimated human beings hunting down and eating humans, or our fascination with the possibility. Must be that fascination with the unnatural and the breaking of taboos. Another theory anyways. Just my meandering thoughts.

[Crappingbear]

Just to remind everyone that a survivor attitude is critical. You think you are bait and you are. You think you are the top of the food chain and you at least have a chance. Remember the Alamo! It they want it, they have to come and take it; no rolling over and giving up. I'd rather face a horde with 3 people armed with 2x4 boards who will never give up than a battalion with shotguns who are already convinced they will die.