Gory horrible history...

[Neil]

OK, what historical stories are so horrid and despicable they sound like fiction! For me, here's a couple:- Sawney Bean - http://www.sawneybean.com/horrors2/bean.htm Jack the Ripper - http://www.jack-the-ripper.org/victi...the-ripper.htm Elizabeth Bathroy - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_B%C3%A1thory

[Mike70]

H. H. Holmes, also known as "america's first serial killer" was a real life monster. totally repulsive. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H._H._Holmes some of the things that Edmund Kemper did utterly boggle the mind. severing your own mother's head then using it to perform fellatio on yourself. that's beyond disgusting to the point where words fail. this is also a person (if that term applies) who killed his own grandmother just to see what it would feel like to kill someone. I usually do not agree with trying minors as adults but if this dude had been tried as an adult after murdering his own grandparents instead of going to a mental hospital for a few years, his later victims and their families would never have gone through what they did. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmund_Kemper then there is Gilles de Rais, a man who went from real life hero and companion in arms to Joan of Arc to being convicted of sodomizing and murdering at least 40 young boys. another real life monster. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_de_Rais yet another animal whose actions boggle the mind is Andrei Chikatilo, one of the worst serial killers in history. he murdered at least 52 people in 12 years, many of them children. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Chikatilo

[AcesandEights]

H. H. Holmes, also known as "america's first serial killer" was a real life monster. totally repulsive. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H._H._Holmes National Geographic just aired a huge special about him based primarily on The Devil in the White City book yesterday. Pretty well done, too. What about Josef Fritzl? He kept his family locked away from the world, the children for what was almost the whole of their lives. It's not body count and blood heavy, but still horrible and almost unbelievable.

[Neil]

H.H.Holmes! Yes! Astounding story! And how he ever got that 'hotel' made is amazing! As for Josef Fritz, and the fact he was raping his own kids year after year after years...

[Mike70]

National Geographic just aired a huge special about him based primarily on The Devil in the White City book yesterday. Pretty well done, too. i saw that. it was well done and disturbing as hell. that's why i mentioned H. H. Holmes.

[Neil]

then there is Gilles de Rais, a man who went from real life hero and companion in arms to Joan of Arc to being convicted of sodomizing and murdering at least 40 young boys. another real life monster. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilles_de_Rais Eeeek! That's horrid! Reminds me a little of Pedro Alonso Lopez & Luis Alfredo Garavito, reputed to have killed hundreds of children each! http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/s...o_lopez/6.html http://www.murderpedia.org/male.G/g/garavito.htm What I find most horrific about some of these individuals is that when scared/abused, they'd comfort the children, only to then torture/kill them, taking glee in even further suffering of the poor child!

[shootemindehead]

Albert Fish. Nutjob.

[Mike70]

Eeeek! That's horrid! Reminds me a little of Pedro Alonso Lopez & Luis Alfredo Garavito, reputed to have killed hundreds of children each! http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/s...o_lopez/6.html http://www.murderpedia.org/male.G/g/garavito.htm What I find most horrific about some of these individuals is that when scared/abused, they'd comfort the children, only to then torture/kill them, taking glee in even further suffering of the poor child! those two make me physically ill. they are living proof that there are things among us that look like people but are not. a note about Gilles de Rais: if you have seen the movie "the messenger", he is played by Vincent Cassel. Imagine having one of your national heroes exposed not only as a pedophile but also as a monstrous serial killer.

[AcesandEights]

H.H.Holmes! Yes! Astounding story! And how he ever got that 'hotel' made is amazing! It's interesting how some words can become a bit overused or a caricature of what they used to mean, but I think--in the case of H.H. Holmes--diabolical really does fit the bill. -- -------- Post added at 11:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:52 AM ---------- a note about Gilles de Rais: if you have seen the movie "the messenger", he is played by Vincent Cassel. Imagine having one of your national heroes exposed not only as a pedophile but also as a monstrous serial killer. Excellent point! It's funny, I actually included de Rais in a paper I once wrote (about 20 years ago!), and had completely forgotten the era in which he lived. I kept thinking it was a later time period!

[Mike70]

I Excellent point! It's funny, I actually included de Rais in a paper I once wrote (about 20 years ago!), and had completely forgotten the era in which he lived. I kept thinking it was a later time period! from Marshal of France to the end of a rope. I've read a number of things about de Rais. Even though he fought bravely and was instrumental in winning the hundred years war, there were what we would recognize as "warning signs" in his behavior for years but being from highest levels of the nobility, no one ever connected the dots until he had engaged in some really unbelievable behavior. I put the number of victims at 40 because their remains were found. the actual number is most likely much, much higher - perhaps in the hundreds.

[SymphonicX]

I find the actions of one gruesome individual to be scary and terrifying, but nothing as terrifying as the actions of torture that governments, kingdoms and religions have not only been complicit in, but completely active too. Medieval torture for heresy was horrendous - people were boiled alive and their skin slowly stripped off with sharp knives...starving rats ate through the intestines of those trapped underneath it's bottomless cage...people being forced "fed" liquid until their stomach explodes...two words "The Rack", not to mention the punishments like the stocks, Iron Maidens, and various really uncomfortable ways of being maimed or killed. The fact that these things weren't the exception, like with serial killers, but the RULE...I find that absolutely terrifying.

[Neil]

I find the actions of one gruesome individual to be scary and terrifying, but nothing as terrifying as the actions of torture that governments, kingdoms and religions have not only been complicit in, but completely active too. Medieval torture for heresy was horrendous - people were boiled alive and their skin slowly stripped off with sharp knives...starving rats ate through the intestines of those trapped underneath it's bottomless cage...people being forced "fed" liquid until their stomach explodes...two words "The Rack", not to mention the punishments like the stocks, Iron Maidens, and various really uncomfortable ways of being maimed or killed. The fact that these things weren't the exception, like with serial killers, but the RULE...I find that absolutely terrifying. I was thinking the same myself. It's like being hung-drawn-and-quartered where they often kept the victim alive far far longer than in anyway necessary! The sheer lengths they went to, to make people suffer rediculous amount of pain indeed was astounding!

[shootemindehead]

Visited a torture museum on the island of Ischia, off the coast of Italy and the amount of torture equipment that focused on the genitals would make your flippin eyes water. Gruesome stuff indeed.

[Neil]

Brazen Bull

[Mike70]

I find the actions of one gruesome individual to be scary and terrifying, but nothing as terrifying as the actions of torture that governments, kingdoms and religions have not only been complicit in, but completely active too. Medieval torture for heresy was horrendous - people were boiled alive and their skin slowly stripped off with sharp knives...starving rats ate through the intestines of those trapped underneath it's bottomless cage...people being forced "fed" liquid until their stomach explodes...two words "The Rack", not to mention the punishments like the stocks, Iron Maidens, and various really uncomfortable ways of being maimed or killed. The fact that these things weren't the exception, like with serial killers, but the RULE...I find that absolutely terrifying. yeah. that shit is terrifying to think about but thankfully our part of the world has outgrown that sort of nonsense. can you imagine living in a country where stoning still takes place? or trials by putting your hand in boiling liquid to see who is guilty or innocent still take place? that's what i started thinking about after reading your post: that there are some places, here in 2012, where things like that still routinely take place. though there is something intrinsically horrifying in individual actions because they lack that group/mob mentality that allows what you are talking about to be possible or even, in some cases, to be the law. i sure none of the people who lived next to folks like john gacy, jeffrey dahmer or most of the monsters that have been named in this thread had a clue as to what was going on in the house next to them or what that individual was up to when he left for a late night drive. the idea that a friendly stranger can suddenly turn into a murderous psychopath when he has his intended victim in a place where he can engage in torture, murder, etc. strikes a deep psychological chord in us.