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Thread: Arctic Ice is Going Fast--Really Fast

  1. #16
    Walking Dead Cody's Avatar
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    noo...i live in florida hey but f*** disneyworld

  2. #17
    Inverting The Cross MikePizzoff's Avatar
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    To quote Extreme Noise Terror...

    Man is superior, man has the right
    To destroy everything in his sight
    He'll take the world and do as he will
    And make this earth a deformed hell

    Raping the earth and we don't seem to care
    Soon there will be no life left here

  3. #18
    certified super rad Danny's Avatar
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    geez, kinda struggled to find a last line that rymed huh?


  4. #19
    Webmaster Neil's Avatar
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    Ummm... Given we're a reasonable way down the path to oblivion now, and only 30yrs away from drowning... Why haven't the see levels already risen?

    I know many reports say they have/are, but there are also some out there suggesting (again) nothing unusual...
    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
    -Carl Sagan

  5. #20
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    Last edited by LouCipherr; 03-May-2007 at 02:13 PM.

  6. #21
    Twitching fartpants's Avatar
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    couldn't agree more Lou...

  7. #22
    certified super rad Danny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil View Post
    Ummm... Given we're a reasonable way down the path to oblivion now, and only 30yrs away from drowning... Why haven't the see levels already risen?

    I know many reports say they have/are, but there are also some out there suggesting (again) nothing unusual...
    uh neil, havent you seen the news reports about an entire small nation situated ona pininsula thats now gone the way of atlantis?, its been on the uk news for like the last two years on and off, and its not the only place. hell englands had worse flooding over the past 7 years than it ever has in recorded history, wed probably be in the same boat if it whrent for the fact that ,aside from the beaches britains edges are all 30 feet cliffs, so were jsut higher up and sinking slower


  8. #23
    Webmaster Neil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellsing View Post
    uh neil, havent you seen the news reports about an entire small nation situated ona pininsula thats now gone the way of atlantis?, its been on the uk news for like the last two years on and off, and its not the only place. hell englands had worse flooding over the past 7 years than it ever has in recorded history, wed probably be in the same boat if it whrent for the fact that ,aside from the beaches britains edges are all 30 feet cliffs, so were jsut higher up and sinking slower
    Supposedly the experts suggest the oceans have - over the past hundred years - gone up by a cm or two... Hardly enough to sink an island etc...

    Ocean levels are rather hard to measure when everything is moving... ie: Land masses rise and fall etc...
    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
    -Carl Sagan

  9. #24
    Feeding LouCipherr's Avatar
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    Lets let the advocates of the GW "theory" do some talking:


    "I believe it is appropriate to have an overrepresentation of factual presentations on how dangerous it is, as a predicate for opening up the audience." - Al Gore (May 24th, 2006 – The Washington Times)


    "We have to offer up scary scenarios, make simplified, dramatic statements, and make little mention of any doubts we may have. Each of us has to decide what the right balance is between being effective and being honest." -Stephen Schneider (a leading advocate of the global warming theory, in an interview for Discover magazine, Oct 1989)


    "In the United States...we have to first convince the American People and the Congress that the climate problem is real." -Bill Clinton in a 1997 address to the United Nations


    "Even if the theory of global warming is wrong, we will be doing the right thing -- in terms of economic policy and environmental policy." -Tim Wirth, while U.S. Senator, Colorado. After a short stint as United Nations Under-Secretary for Global Affairs he now serves as President, U.N. Foundation, created by Ted Turner and his $1 billion "gift"


    "No matter if the science is all phony, there are collateral environmental benefits.... Climate change [provides] the greatest chance to bring about justice and equality in the world." -Christine Stewart, Minister of the Environment of Canada recent quote from the Calgary Herald


    Then, of course, we have the others:


    "Researchers pound the global-warming drum because they know there is politics and, therefore, money behind it. . . I've been critical of global warming and am persona non grata." -Dr. William Gray (Professor of Atmospheric Sciences at Colorado State University, Fort Collins, Colorado and leading expert of hurricane prediction, in an interview for the Denver Rocky Mountain News, November 28, 1999)


    "Scientists who want to attract attention to themselves, who want to attract great funding to themselves, have to (find a) way to scare the public . . . and this you can achieve only by making things bigger and more dangerous than they really are." -Petr Chylek (Professor of Physics and Atmospheric Science, Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia - commenting on reports by other researchers that Greenland's glaciers are melting - Halifax Chronicle-Herald, August 22, 2001)


    "In the long run, the replacement of the precise and disciplined language of science by the misleading language of litigation and advocacy may be one of the more important sources of damage to society incurred in the current debate over global warming." -Dr. Richard S. Lindzen (leading climate and atmospheric science expert- MIT)


    "Science should be both compelling and widely accepted before Federal regulations are promulgated." -Dr. David L. Lewis (27-year veteran of the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and critic of the agency's departure from scientific rationale in favor of political agenda - in an interview for Nature Magazine, June 27, 1996)

    ____


    So, it all boils down to (since none of us are scientists or climatoligists here), who would you believe? The advocates of the GW theory who freely admit to making stuff up to 'scare' the public into believing, or the level-headed people saying "take a realistic approach"?
    Last edited by LouCipherr; 07-May-2007 at 04:56 PM.

  10. #25
    Inverting The Cross MikePizzoff's Avatar
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    Even if there is no global warming at all... what's the harm in treating the earth a little better? I wouldn't mind being able to breath air that's a little (a lot) less poluted.

  11. #26
    Feeding LouCipherr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikePizzoff View Post
    Even if there is no global warming at all... what's the harm in treating the earth a little better? I wouldn't mind being able to breath air that's a little (a lot) less poluted.
    There's nothing wrong with it at all - but intentionally lying to the public about it (and, on top of it all, admitting to it) is not the right way to go about it. You run a huge chance that your target audience will turn on you.

    Why not just tell the truth?
    Last edited by LouCipherr; 07-May-2007 at 07:24 PM.

  12. #27
    Team Rick MinionZombie's Avatar
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    Indeed, why not tell the truth?

    Also, I was reading an intriguing theory earlier today that in one respect greenhouse gasses or whatever (was skim reading with the TV on in the background ) are handy as they they reflect the sun's rays away from us, which at a time of high solar activity (like right now) comes in handy...

    Also, that biofuel crops are being put in the place of trees - so trees are being cut down to make way for biofuel! Not very nice to trees is it?!

    Also, there was stuff about the thought of just whacking up trees, and part of the "flip side" to that idea involved decreased areas that can amass snow cover, which means less areas of snowy land to reflect the sun's rays again...which is interesting...

    *goes and fetches article from today's paper*

    *distracted by the awesome Volvic bottled water advert - TYRANASAURUS ALAN!! *

    Yeah, it's on about all the gunk and stuff puffing out of factories and reflecting solar heating, which if you got shot of it, would increase the heat here on earth ... as well as cost hundreds of billions to do.

    Also, computer models relating to how pollution impacts on global warming are apparently years from being properly trustworthy ... so that's rather dodgy, and in a world where even a slight mistake in science can reap huge problems, I don't really wanna be barging the situation like it was just a bit of flat pack furniture.

    An interesting bit of info was correlations between increasing global termperatures and falling levels of pollution...interesting ... of course, the sun is in a cycle of high activity, so that doesn't help us out.

    Basically, if only we had a big mirror thing to put into space to reflect changeable levels of the sun's rays. There is actually a group of people who are working on that plan, but it's at least 20 years away from being feasible apparently ... and even then it'd cost a f*ckload of dollah...

    Then there's some examples of scientific bodging:

    *Australia - to get shot of beatles eating sugar cane, the cane toad was introduced, but with no natural enemy, they bread like horny teenagers and Australia ended up with a new pest.

    *1930's - scared of toxic chemicals in fridges and stuff, scientists created CFCs ... that worked out didn't it?

    *A Brazilian hydro-electric plant produced a lake choked with methane-belching vegetation which ended up creating triple the global warming effect that a normal power plant would have!

    Science is far from perfect, so why do people treat the oft-peddled scientific response to climate change as gospel truth? The fact is, planes and cars and us being the main cause is a theory and nothing more, all the other theories are just that - theories. So why not explore all sides of the rubik's cube?

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