TWD 2x12 "Better Angels" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN**

[Thorn]

Really good point! Though I'm not rooting for Rick or Lori to die next episode, they'll be a bit hard pressed to shock us with fatalities for the season closer. T-Dawg had a lot of lines this episode so either they are making right on his under use or building him up so we care about him so they can give him the axe We should post who is left and see who we think will die and the winner receives 3 Internets...

[babomb]

I too am a little disappointed that Shane is no longer part of the show. I thought he was the most powerful character in the series so far. I think that's a testament to the actor that played him. Not that the other actors suck, just that Jon Bernthal really did an outstanding job playing Shane! I think that should definitely boost his career. I don't think I've ever seen him in anything else. The only actors I have seen otherwise are Dr. Jenner, T-Dog(maybe), Dale, and Daryl. And Meryl of course. Which is why I commented in one of the spoiler threads relating to Shane's death that their gonna have to do some major upgrades to the characters or introduce some really great new ones. Because like him or hate him, Shane was pretty much the driving force behind both seasons so far. You take him out of the equation and you got a big hole to fill!

[Thorn]

I too am a little disappointed that Shane is no longer part of the show. I thought he was the most powerful character in the series so far. I think that's a testament to the actor that played him. Not that the other actors suck, just that Jon Bernthal really did an outstanding job playing Shane! I think that should definitely boost his career. I don't think I've ever seen him in anything else. The only actors I have seen otherwise are Dr. Jenner, T-Dog(maybe), Dale, and Daryl. And Meryl of course. Which is why I commented in one of the spoiler threads relating to Shane's death that their gonna have to do some major upgrades to the characters or introduce some really great new ones. Because like him or hate him, Shane was pretty much the driving force behind both seasons so far. You take him out of the equation and you got a big hole to fill! So very well said on all counts, he will be greatly missed, he already lined up another acting gig, and I think his career is moving in a great direction. He will be missed as a character, and the tension and drama he created will now need to be filled by other sources. They did a fine job of that in the trades, also at introducing new characters that might serve to fill the void left by Shane. Not in that he would be the foil, no one wants the group to be predictable that gets old. So killing Shane to bring in another Shane would be a mistake, but to bring in another strong presence... a great fighter certainly. Even someone with an attitude.

[bungi43]

personally i dont care about spoiler tags but acknowledged and understood. ill poke the bull some other way cuz thats what i do. Does that make you feel tough on a message board to try to "test the boundaries" and such? -- -------- Post added at 01:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:37 PM ---------- Agreed Professor, Just more sad than angry at the moment. The same sort of sad when Survival came along to trumpet the death of Romero's work. There'll never be another zombie-apocalypse-based TV show. If I'm anything besides sad it's frustrated, because continuity and out-of-plot logistical concerns made Shane's death into a tasteless joke. Worse, as I said, the oncoming swarm of Walkers will because of those same show logistics be unable to claim anyone of any significance. If the interpersonal reactions to the apocalypse lack an iota of realistic effect on the characters actions and thought-processes, and the chief danger of the show isn't allowed to be, well, DANGEROUS...what's that really leave? More cling-to-unrealistic, eminently idiotic, learning-nothing-from-their-experiences morality rhetoric? Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll nuke Andrea. I'd say there are 5 essentials left (Lori, Rick, Andrea, Daryll and Glenn). I'd be happy if she died. But I agree that next weeks episode is setting up to be a bit more of a let down than anything else, simply because there are too many minor people left to kill and say "who cares". I think killing Herschel would be very sad, but if they are leaving the farm, really, what do we expect? C'mon, Carl didn't even hesitate to gun down Walker-Shane an instant...and they just HAD to go all loving-conviction in his daddy's motives and not have Carl even consider that Rick mighta been the bad guy there. He did come upon him knife in hand over top of the body of his chief rival without a mark on him. Maybe my moral code is even further out-of-step with the average civilized 1st-worlder than I thought. Last note, I REALLY REALLY liked Rick for the first few episodes of Season 1. I even had really high hopes for him when the symbolism of him putting away his cop uniform came along. Hopes I had begun to, well, HOPE would be realized as he adamantly set out to correct his horrible mistake of saving Randall by executing him on his knees. Then...poof, all the shiny new toughness wiped out by Dale's death. I LITERALLY gagged when I first heard the line "From now on, we do it his (Dale's) way. That's how we honor him." Referencing the bold...unless from the moment I knew my father he was a horrible human being, my considerations wouldn't be that my father was the bad guy. If I had walked up on that as Carl and not heard the conversation (before Rick stabbed Shane) and saw Shane holding a guy to my father, I would've blown a hole in his head. I could really connect there. I didn't feel Rick's pleas though. Felt forced. Disaster drags people down. Every single time, and every single one if the disaster goes on more than a few weeks without help arriving to abate the effects of the disaster. We all joke about Khardis's extremism, but the reality of 30,000 years of human history is that the tougher times get the faster humanity IN ITS ENTIRETY swan-dives into the moral abyss. And that during disasters that the utter collapse of ALL civilization GLOBALLY + the reanimation of 99.9% of the population as cannibalistic ghouls makes look like a species-equivalent of a 24hr bug. I don't know if I agree with this entirely. Looking back through history, if this were the case, we'd live in a martial law type system everywhere, and many civilizations wouldn't even exist. Individual humans may rise above their base natures during disaster, but ONLY temporarily. The very people who risked their lives rescuing people from rooftops during Hurricane Katrina's aftermath would have KILLED AND EATEN the people they'd gone to so much trouble to save had the CDC found some sort of mutated highly infectious pathogen in the sewage-contaminated water everyone in the Wards had been exposed to and established a strict Quarantine Cordon surrounding New Orleans. Heroism, altruism, and modern morality in its entirety are like candle-flames. They'll burn for a long time, unless something comes along to disturb the air strongly enough and for long enough. Atavism is the UNIVERSAL human reaction to prolonged disaster/societal collapse. I just don't get the appeal of having the show's world-setting conspire to allow them to maintain such unrealistic cute and comfy moral stability. That's an interesting thought really. I would venture to say none of us have come anywhere close to a societal life threatening event. But I do know some people who've killed in war. Where survival is obviously key. People come back messed up. But some people don't.

[Wyldwraith]

@Thorn: By "stealing" I didn't so much mean Lori. Shane's relationship with Carl was something Lori had been actively trying to stamp out since late Season 1, and that I consider stealing from Shane to a mild extent..but the real theft, the one that makes me see red and crave Lori's brutal death like a junkie craves their fix is the whole "Even if the baby's yours it will be Rick's, and there's NOTHING you can do about it!" Her apology this episode was a non-apology, because it offered no attempt or willingness to make amends for the wrong she did him. Lori could admit she didn't know whose baby it is, but had she TRULY intended to make amends she would have told Shane this: "Shane, you have to understand that I love my husband and my son. We're a family, and that's how it's going to stay. HOWEVER, if it turns out that the child I'm having is yours I won't stand in the way of you being just as much a father to him/her as Rick will be, and when he/she is old enough to understand me, you and Rick will explain things, together. Secrets have poisoned everything for months now, and I'm done with secrets and lies. I won't wrap the birth of my child in yet more lies, and if the baby IS yours I won't allow Rick to rob you of your rightful place in his/her life anymore than I'll ever allow you to try and take Rick's place with me and Carl. You didn't force me to be with you, and my decision to be with you then has obviously had consequences for all of us. I have to take responsibility for my decisions, and that starts right now, but it also means you really do have to turn over a new leaf. I know I've made things harder on you than they had to be, but we're going to start fresh when it comes to trust because of that. But Shane, you REALLY need to hear me when I tell you that if I can't trust you to watch Rick's back like he watches yours...and to really be the man this group has relied on from the beginning, how could I trust you with a child as much mine as it may be yours? Not because of Rick, but because of you making me unable to trust you. Can you understand that?" Had Lori TRULY taken responsibility for her decision to be with Shane back then, and take responsibility for the consequences that may well have come from that decision she would have done the right thing and potentially opened a door into Shane's life as a father, as she definitively nailed shut the door she'd closed between her and Shane, and Shane and Carl as a father-figure. With something REAL, something GOOD to live for...Shane very well might have dragged himself back from the brink. Sure, if it turned out the child wasn't his he very well might've reverted to his near-psychosis and had to be put down, but in the months to come he may well have done lasting good...saved one or more lives, and possibly his own soul. So much else is open to interpretation, but if a woman consensually beds down with a man and a child comes from that decision she has NO RIGHT to STEAL that man's RIGHT to be a father to his child in favor of giving the fatherhood she'd stolen to another man. Not even a husband. It's wrong, and nothing anyone will ever say will convince me otherwise. If it was done to me and I was unable to remedy the situation by talking it out, followed by attempted legal remedies if that fails...and if all else failed I'd see the woman who stole my right to be a father dead, and the man she allowed to usurp my place with her. (Edit: If you're EVER going to believe a word I say, these are the words to believe, because when I say here that I would kill in cold blood and without qualm if given no other choice to regain my place in MY son or daughter's life I mean every word, in my blood and bone, my Oath before God.) It's simply, INARGUABLY IMMORAL to defend Rick's right to Lori and Carl but deny Shane's right to be a father if the child turned out to be his...or even if the paternity could not be determined either way (though I doubt that would be the case, since Shane possessed several dominant-gene phenotype expressions absent in both Rick and Lori...and even in their primitive circumstances Herschel could easily identify the child's blood-type simply by mixing blood samples from the child with donor samples from members of the group who know their blood-type. Other than the Universal Donor O (I forget if its negative or positive despite knowing im the O thats the Universal Recipient), the aforementioned Universal Recipient and the child's own blood-type, all other types will VISIBLY fail to become a homogenous sample when mixed with the child's blood. Not a perfect system by any means, but it could well be indicative when used in tandem with examination of the child's expressed physical phenotype-genetics. Ie: Curly hair or straight, eye color etc.

[Thorn]

@Thorn: It's simply, INARGUABLY IMMORAL to defend Rick's right to Lori and Carl but deny Shane's right to be a father if the child turned out to be his...or even if the paternity could not be determined either way (though I doubt that would be the case, since Shane possessed several dominant-gene phenotype expressions absent in both Rick and Lori...and even in their primitive circumstances Herschel could easily identify the child's blood-type simply by mixing blood samples from the child with donor samples from members of the group who know their blood-type. Other than the Universal Donor O (I forget if its negative or positive despite knowing im the O thats the Universal Recipient), the aforementioned Universal Recipient and the child's own blood-type, all other types will VISIBLY fail to become a homogenous sample when mixed with the child's blood. Not a perfect system by any means, but it could well be indicative when used in tandem with examination of the child's expressed physical phenotype-genetics. Ie: Curly hair or straight, eye color etc. I respect your right to your opinion even if I do not agree with all of it, some of it indeed does resonate with me. Sadly when Lori spoke those words I feel she was under the impression Shane lied to her to manipulate her out of her home city, and abandoned her husband to his fate. She viewed hi m as a liar that denied her the right as a wife and therefore all rights to anything he would have had in her mind were off. Further add to that the attempted rape, and other actions by an imbalanced Shane and how sincere can she really be? She knows he killed Otis... she did her best to make amends. Shane's response was to try and kill Rick and take it all by force. Again you justify the actions of one but not the other, I am not saying you are not capable of seeing both sides I am saying you are not allowing yourself to consider all aspects. I agree if someone had my child I would fight for my child, in this case what Lori said was wrong and in a court of law after the baby was born Shane would be allowed to make a case to prove the child was his. Right now there is no court in the Walking Dead so the right thing to do is let it play out and see where the chips fall. If it is your kid fight for your right to be a father then, and do it the right way not y lying, murdering, manipulating, and shooting your best friend in cold blood. I know this is where you will justify his actions, and explain he was given no choice, or how he was treated made him do it, or drove him to it. I am going to also stop agreeing with you there. Shane at no point has a right to gun down his friend in cold blood before that fact is even established and do so in cowardly fashion through deception, manipulation, and murder. I would again kindly ask you to step back from the situation and consider all of the factors around the events that unfolded before passing judgment on Rick and Lori, we know Shane tried his best with Rick she doesn’t. We have a tv screen we saw it, all she has is his word, a tainted word. One that has been increasingly worth less and less as the season and series has progressed. He has been caught in lies, and observed being a unhinged wild man throughout… her going to him might not have met your ideal criteria for what she should have done but it was a start and you are not giving her credit for that. She made an effort to fix it, he made an effort to kill her husband (his best friend, and the father of a young boy). I would respect Shane’s claim to his son or daughter if that was confirmed, but to Lori I don’t even get how that comes into scope. There is no questioning Rick and Lori’s claim to each other no one can question that so we can leave that out. Shane WOULD in my mind have a claim to any child proven to be his despite what was said pre apocalypse and post. Shane elected to handle that in a a manner that is horrible. Real world terms and application. You get a woman pregnant, you then try to rape her, and commit murder, lie, deceive, and conduct yourself as a sociopath… would a court grant you custody of the kid? Would they make your attempted rape victim play house with you? Not if it is a sane court, and to suggest there is a means to make this OKAY post apocalypse is absurd in my opinion. The only way to do it is with brute force and SHANE has NO IDEA if this is his kid so any action before that determination like ohh I don’t know shooting the crap out of your best friend is not just wrong it is evil, and demented, cruel, and barbaric all at the same time. I am sorry I just can’t get my mind around how anyone is okay with it.

[Wyldwraith]

First, You're cherry-picking from my statements Thorn, and doing it in such a way as to imply things I did not say and downplay other things. I'll start from the top and work my way down. 1) I NEVER, at ANY TIME said that what Shane was intending to do to Rick was acceptable for reasons of "taking" Lori and Carl. I DID say that Lori DEFINITIVELY threw down an ultimatum that no matter what, regardless of paternity, Rick would have all rights as a father to the unborn child and Shane would have none. You're right about one thing though, there aren't any courts in a post-apocalyptic environment and with Rick being more popular than Shane, any conflict between them of a verbal nature over paternity rights to the child would certainly result in the group majority going with Rick. Not because he's right, but basically as the result of a popularity contest. Shane has every reason to know that, and every reason to know that nothing he could ever say or do was going to change that. You say he should wait and see where the chips fall. Why? Lori didn't wait in handing down her ultimatum the very INSTANT she found out Shane knew she was pregnant. Additionally, you have the way she phrased it "And there's NOTHING you can do about it!" which indicates Lori was prepared for a fight with Shane on this issue and fully intended to have things her way even if Shane had to die to make it happen. Let's remember Lori was urging Rick to do EXACTLY what Shane tried to do last episode. RICK gets positive-morality points for resisting Lori's urging, but Lori's still guilty of solicitation to commit murder. And for what reason? Because she pulled a Rick, ran off and crashed a car and despite nearly getting herself eaten was adamantly intending to continue onward towards town in search of Rick. Yes Shane lied, again, but his motives were a lot purer than what Lori construed them to be. Shane's first expressed concern was for the baby Lori's crazed behavior was jeopardizing by running off ALONE without any kind of plan. 2) Shane's Assault of Lori at the CDC. I've SEEN attempted rape and attempted GANG RAPE. BELIEVE ME, while what Shane did was utterly unacceptable and certainly criminal, it stopped WELL SHORT of Attempted Rape. I'm with you on charges of felony Battery and a misdemeanor charge of Lewd and Lascivious Conduct, but characterizing that attack as Rape a) Embellishes the reality of what happened, and b) Is a dire insult to every woman who's ACTUALLY been raped or nearly raped. Drunken pawing that doesn't end until the woman scratches the hell out of the man's cheek is at least 4 kinds of criminal/immoral, but rape it's not. It just isn't. I don't fuck around about that word, as I consider it an equal crime to Murder and will kill to stop it, and have both maimed and been maimed to stop it. 3) You may well be right about Lori's thought-processes concerning justifying her immoral ultimatum to Shane. It's in line with Lori's habit of habitually dumping the responsibility for her own choices and decisions on others. That said, just because Lori thought that because Shane lied to her and that influenced her decision to leave with him it in no wise justifies her negation of Shane's potential paternity-rights. Lori can twist it how she wants, but Shane's lie about Rick being dead caused her to take Carl and leave the city with Shane. It DID NOT CAUSE her to CHOOSE to get it on with him like a couple of horny teens. That's on Lori. In Lori's mind, admitting that fact and admitting she doesn't know whose child she's carrying absolves her and gives her the right to decide who will be father to the baby. It doesn't work that way. 4) Lori going to Shane: You're absolutely right. I give Lori NO credit for this, because none is merited. Her confessions have no weight because they are accompanied by no significant change in her choices/prior ultimatums. It's not a start, it's what Lori thought she had to say to appease Shane and end it. Nothing she said indicated she was any less determined that Rick be the child's father regardless of its paternity. You have a right to read what you want into the scene, but factually there is no support for the position that Lori's apology was anything but empty words spoken for self-serving ends. Just as you point out that Shane has often lied, Lori has just as often abdicated responsibility for her decisions. As I said before Thorn: Nothing more had happened to make Shane believe Lori was any less determined that she have 100% of the say about the child's fathering. Simultaneously, even the cast members of the show have said on Talking Dead that Rick's recent statements to Shane were declarations that Rick would dictate how things would be and Shane would have to "swallow it" (as Rick said to him 3x in the last 2 episodes). So, Lori is handing out absolutist ultimatums, Rick is indicating Shane has no power....and Shane has every reason to know a social conflict within the group over the issue will resolve itself in Rick and Lori's favor as a mater of popularity. So tell me, Talking = Out. Appealing to the other members of the group = Shane loses. Other than simply accepting Lori's ultimatum, how was Shane supposed to "fight for his right to be a father" if not by force when force was all that remained? No, that's not justifying Shane's murder-attempt, that's me EXPLAINING a DAMNED GOOD REASON for it. Shane had lost EVERYTHING at that point and Rick and Lori were getting EVERYTHING THEIR WAY! You're damned right, I am too close to that issue. Except for a miscarriage it nearly happened to me when my childhood sweetheart left her husband, told me dozens of lies to make him out to be a monster she needed to be protected from, made the first, second and third moves about anything physical herself while I'm still back in Supportive Friend Mode. She got pregnant, and I found out about the same time she'd been calling her allegedly wife-beating rapist of a husband she had supposedly already filed divorce papers on behind my back, and she then trotted on back to him....after first spinning a story that I'd been holding her prisoner and abusing her to escape any recriminations from her family and husband...which resulted in the police coming to my house, cuffing me and treating me like an animal while they searched the house...only to have her call the station once her bus arrived in Panama City to tell the police a wild tale about how her mother was worried out of her mind and completely misconstrued things and she didn't say anything like that. And I was forced to eat it, because in FL, as in most states where spouses are not at least legally separated (which she would've been by Florida Law, which was a big part of her motivation for the criminal action lie) the husband retains all paternity rights regardless of biology if the wife screws around on the side. Rage doesn't even BEGIN to describe the feeling of being left with NO socially acceptable option but laying down for another man raising your son or daughter. The entire situation messed me up so badly I was GLAD when I found out she miscarried, and while a part of me is STILL ashamed of feeling that way, the majority of me has never stopped thanking God he simply refused to let my only son or daughter be born to such a vile bitch while I would be forced to stand by as her loser husband stole my place. It actually HURT ME you saying that I was trying to say Shane's murder-attempt was OK. It wasn't, but I know from personal experience with such a situation that its VERY hard to feel there's any choice at all besides doing something crazy. That doesn't absolve the character, and it doesn't justify what he intended...but Lori and Rick both are directly complicit in Shane's swan-dive from the brink. People who know what they did was wrong who are genuinely repentant don't offer empty words. They do what's in their power to make the wrong right. Not justify their wrong with a wrong done by the one they're now wronging. Besides, ultimately Shane couldn't go through with it. He had every opportunity, but he didn't take it. He all but pleaded with Rick to put him down. Shane was a broken, twisted man by that point...but he didn't GET THAT WAY ALONE. You're right though, I am very close to the issues and I'll allow for the possibility that prevents me from seeing the entire picture. Add my personal bias to my unhappiness the show is (at least temporarily) swinging in an utterly unrealistic direction and it's certainly more than possible. I am curious though. What would you have had Shane do? Kiss ass and plead for what was his by right if it's his child?

[rongravy]

Danggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg. Anyhoo, I noticed Carl drew that pistol before Shane got up. Was he aiming it at daddy first? I thought so. Also, during the zombie stomp at the beginning, my daughter and I both mentioned the Office Space scene. Lots of chuckles were had. I hate that no one at my work watches TWD. I wanted so much to shout out what happened last night, but it would've been to no avail. I asked if anybody even watches it, and I was met with blank stares. WTF?!?!? And finally, Shane is on Letterman tonight, for anybody who wants to catch it. Just thought I'd throw that one out there...

[Tricky]

I havent seen this episode yet so trying not to read much, but a mate of mine has just plastered the entire finale spoiler across facebook which I saw, dang!!

[niiru]

Two things: 1) The zombie with a broken neck walking around fighting like it was going out of style was far too Return-esque for me. I mean, I guess the difference between this and flip top from Land is minimal (I think flip top gets an exception due to sheer awesomeness) but shouldn't broken neck have resulted in a quadriplegic zombie? The earlier suicide hung zombie I figured died from asphyxiation rather than a broken neck. I can't quote episodes, but I think I remember a few crawlers in Walking Dead (other than bicycle zombie who obviously had no legs). I hope they're not going in a weird direction on this. 2) At the end of 2x11 I thought they were going to go for zombie cows. The cow is there, eviscerated but still mooing. Not just eviscerated, partially eaten, gaping hole where ribs used to be. Still mooing. I figured that'd get a mention at the start of this episode, but I guess not. I guess the mooing was just so you'd know it was a recent killed cow and not another pile of charred corpses? So, does anyone else think they needed to slow that opening scene down where the group bitch stomped the zombie and add the music from Office Space? THIS. I'm glad someone else had that thought.

[shootemindehead]

...but shouldn't broken neck have resulted in a quadriplegic zombie? Not if the spinal cord isn't damaged. The neck may have partially broke, or the vertebrae fractured and probably damaged the trachea and oesophagus, resulting in death. But, if the spinal cord is undamaged, then it's possible to be mobile. I agree though, he was a bit TOO mobile.

[Legion2213]

Dear God...what an episode! I can't take in what I've just seen. Real stonker this week...redeemed Carl for being a dick lat week, made me really feel the loss of Dale, made me laugh at what a limp-wristed tool Glen is, reinforced my belief that Daryl is some kind of god and even had my feeling some sort of non-hatred for Lori for a second or two. R.I.P Shane, you dangerous unstable sociopathic bastard! Your character will be missed. Edit: So hyped I forgot to mention the brutal walker massacre at the start...seriously, who's endangered now you undead fuckers! This show needs to be renewed for at least 5 more seasons...now...today.

[AnxietyDilemma]

Anyhoo, I noticed Carl drew that pistol before Shane got up. Was he aiming it at daddy first? I thought so. I thought that too, but upon re-watching it I just realized that it was an editing/camera tactic to make us think that. He draws the pistol and is pointing it at his Dad, then it cuts to Shane getting up, but it's timed in a way where he probably would've pointed because he saw Shane starting to move.

[krisvds]

Poor Shane... I felt pity and revulsion for the man, at the same time. This episode was well paced and well written IMO. The only scene that 'took me out' of the show was that little moment between Andrea and Glenn. Bit of stiff and unbelievable acting there. Pacing was great, really liked the opening montage and then the slow build up to THAT ending. The setting did remind me of the final shot in survival like it did Bassman, but that's not a bad thing as that was an awesome shot to begin with. I like the showdown feeling heightened and stylised. Great suspense too; that moment where Rick asks Shane if this is where he was planning to do it sent shivers down my spine. Shane will be missed; every show needs a good ambiguous 'bad' guy you just love to hate/hate to love. Big shoes to fill. I'm glad we are rid of the tiresome love triangle. Luckily they downplayed that angle a bit to have the conflict be about 'whose the better leader' than 'whose the best partner.' Still surprised it happened so fast. I was expecting this moment as a 'finale' or as a start to the new season. BTW. What a great leader he would have been huh, the lying weasel! 'We need to kill the kid to save our beloved...' and all that crap. Selfishness disguised as altruism. Shane would have made a great politician. And then that final shot: hurray! Sidenote; Randall coming back as a zombie confirms we are dealing with Romero-rules (tm) here right? The dead come back as flesh-eating ghouls. The guy was not bitten but died of a broken neck AND came back. There. Cool. Now can someone please explain to me why all the dead people on the highway, behind the wheels of their cars, were, you know, dead?

[shootemindehead]

Well, I'm taking it that they had head trauma in some way, or wounds you couldn't see. It's that, or bad production. Besides, there weren't too many bodies of that nature, so I can let it go. As for the ep, it was good, but it leaves the producers with an issue for the series finale. It's been mentioned above, that with the death of Shane, only potential zombie fodder will be sacrificed in the last episode. I hope T-Dog gets done, because he's useless and has an irritating moniker that makes me cringe ever time I hear it. But, there's also some extra bits of useless flesh hanging around the house that can be offed as well, of whom I don't even know their names, so there might be a nice slice of gory delight coming our way next week. The pending zombie attack doesn't sit right with me though...what the hell where they doing there anyway? and how long where they in the woods, not bothering to head over to the big house and investigate all the din coming from their noisy neighbours? Rick and Shane's yap would have drawn them out long before the gunshot from Carl. It's a bit odd.