TWD 2x08 "Nebraska" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN**

[shootemindehead]

Still not getting the "love" for Shane. To me, he's a c*nt of the lowest kind. Extremely unstable and terribly dangerous to the group. I'd rather trust Dale than Shane. I have a problem with Dale sussing out that Shane may have killed Otis though. There's just no real way he could figure that one out.

[Andy]

Still not getting the "love" for Shane. To me, he's a c*nt of the lowest kind. Extremely unstable and terribly dangerous to the group. I'd rather trust Dale than Shane. I have a problem with Dale sussing out that Shane may have killed Otis though. There's just no real way he could figure that one out. I Dont wanna derail this topic becuase there's alot of good points going on, but please tell me one thing shane has done that tells you he is dangerous to the group?

[shootemindehead]

His sheer unstable nature maybe? His violence that erupts? Not only that, but the character is actually being written as an antagonist? Shane is a dangerous f*ckin creep, who I wouldn't trust with the most minimal of tasks, nver mind watching my back. If I was Dale, I'd have blown him away, without a second thought., Dale is right...given the correct parameters He could murder again. But then, I'm privvy to info that others in the show aren't. Either way, Shane is a dick (but Jon Bernthal has done a really good job)

[sandrock74]

Lets be honest, He (Dale) dosnt know what happened to Otis, he is grasping at straws for a reason for the group to turn on shane. Watch the scene of Otis' funeral again. Specifically, watch Dale while Shane gives his account of what went down and Otis' final moments. It looked like Dale wasn't buying Shane's story. Dale's a listener, its what he does. You might figure he's grasping at straws about his assumption about what Shane did to Otis, but Dale is indeed correct. Remember, they don't ask you how you won, only if you won! At the end of the day, Shane is damned by his own words...he only cares about Lori and Carl. He has no interest in the rest of the group, he will abandon and/or sacrifice any/all of them for those two. Do you think Rick, Andrea, Glenn, Dale, T-Dog, Carol, and Daryl would take kindly to that? Shane is a loose cannon and a danger to the safety of the group; again, by his own words. Its only a matter of time before his actions cause some major trouble for all! Still, we're all entitled to our opinions, thats just mine. I'm intrigued by yours. Man, I love this place!

[Neil]

Erm, did you mistake him saying "Daryl" when he in fact said "Dale"? Yes! You got a problem with that? My bad! Ignore me as per usual!

[MinionZombie]

That guy was bit before he hung himself.. remember the note? "Got bit, Infection Hit, World went to shit, Might aswell quit." I put it in my signiture a while back Quite right - I forgot that part ... move along, nothing to see here. Yes! You got a problem with that? My bad! Ignore me as per usual! We all make mistakes. I'm 1 for 1 right now. ... As for Shane - yes, Jon Bernthal has done an amazing job with him, even though Shane is very unstable and has done some very bad things (the main one being Otis - a case of "doing the wrong thing for the right reasons" in my view - it's not clear-cut in this cut-throat world), you still enjoy watching his character. One thing that Dave Navaro did say that was of some worth (aside from all his idiotic statements for the remainder of The Talking Dead) was that in the scene where he's washing Carol's hands, it was often a case of him speaking about himself ... but it's himself within the context of what went on, so again not as clear cut, but as I said previously it is good to see a softer side to him - but it's clear that he's breaking down up in the old noggin. Shane's character is too unstable to be a true leader. Rick is the best - he's proven himself in 2x08 to be ruthless when needs be, but he's also not an idiot, nor is he a hot head. He listens to his head as much as his heart, whereas Shane is much more heart ... but oftentimes his heart is somewhat in the wrong place. He's a very complex man, but complex in a potentially dangerous way. Daryl is a great survivalist and he's loyal, so I'd put him in at number two slot for leader personally (indeed that does match a poll they took on The Talking Dead, where poor old Herschel got 1% of the vote ) ... but with Shane, I couldn't put trust in him because of his lack of consistency. Lori has known Shane for years, whereas Dale has known him for what, a few weeks, so he doesn't have that entire prior life being around him - he's only seen Shane in the context of the zombie outbreak and so he's able to see something isn't quite right (especially as he saw Shane hold Rick in his shotgun sights), while the likes of Lori are thinking of him in the context of the man they used to know (even though there was that incident at the CDC, which she essentially forgived as Shane made it back with the stuff to save Carl).

[Tricky]

Heres another thing I was wondering about, when Lori was asking Daryl for help, he was sharpening what looked like sticks with a big knife, so was he making traps, makeshift weapons or trying to make home made crossbow bolts?

[MinionZombie]

Heres another thing I was wondering about, when Lori was asking Daryl for help, he was sharpening what looked like sticks with a big knife, so was he making traps, makeshift weapons or trying to make home made crossbow bolts? I took at as either: 1) Taking his mind off things, or... 2) Fashioning custom arrows.

[Wyldwraith]

About Dale: Like or dislike Dale, like or dislike Shane, those are opinions and that's great. Why we nosh on every plot tidbit that comes along, because its fun! Anyways, what I absolutely DETEST ABOUT DALE is his hypocrisy! "At least when the world went to sh!t I didn't let it take me down with it" my ass. Dale STOLE Andrea's gun and enlisted the help of others to counter Andrea's attempt(s) to get her property back. As a DIRECT RESULT of this decision on Dale's part, Andrea is subjected to a near-fatal Walker attack and only spared via the incredibly/improbably well-timed intervention of the Maggie-Cavalry. Does Dale show the SLIGHTEST remorse for what his decision/act forced Andrea to go through when the rest of the group tells him of Andrea's extremely close call with a Walker? Not a bit. I'll skip the smaller intervening stuff (like lying to the group about the RV's condition to prevent anyone from being able to make a pragmatic argument to move on after Sophia was lost)...and right into the STEALING and attempted hiding of the bag of guns in the swamp to, once again, make what Dale thinks should happen the only choice for the group. When Shane tracks him down and takes the guns back, Dale has every opportunity to take Shane down effortlessly. Unable to stomach killing Shane, he buckled during their face-to-face confrontation and instead of calling Shane out with his accusations/suspicions in front of the group openly, Dale starts pouring Anti-Shane poison in first Lori's and then (judging by the scene in the teaser trailer at the end of the episode/preview for tonight's episode) Andrea's ears on the sly and behind Shane's back. Wow, if Dale "Didn't let the world take him down when it turned to Sh!t" he must've ALREADY BEEN one deceitful, manipulative, selfish and HYPOCRITICAL old fart before the Zombie Apocalypse began. I'm with the previous poster in wishing Dale would just die already. I understand he fills a certain niche on the overall canvas of interpersonal interactions, but Dale stirs up high-school-like drama to try and make those around him do what HE wants them to do, and then sit back and proclaim his hands are spotlessly clean just because he didn't overtly bully anyone. I've known too many people like that in real-life, (And I truly admire the writers' depictions of Dale. They're VERY true-to-life) and people like Dale accomplish nothing besides tearing apart the bonds of friendship, loyalty and trust between those individuals he thinks he knows better than they what they should be doing. If Shane is a problem for the group, Dale is an apocalypse.

[Andy]

About Dale: Like or dislike Dale, like or dislike Shane, those are opinions and that's great. Why we nosh on every plot tidbit that comes along, because its fun! Anyways, what I absolutely DETEST ABOUT DALE is his hypocrisy! "At least when the world went to sh!t I didn't let it take me down with it" my ass. Dale STOLE Andrea's gun and enlisted the help of others to counter Andrea's attempt(s) to get her property back. As a DIRECT RESULT of this decision on Dale's part, Andrea is subjected to a near-fatal Walker attack and only spared via the incredibly/improbably well-timed intervention of the Maggie-Cavalry. Does Dale show the SLIGHTEST remorse for what his decision/act forced Andrea to go through when the rest of the group tells him of Andrea's extremely close call with a Walker? Not a bit. I'll skip the smaller intervening stuff (like lying to the group about the RV's condition to prevent anyone from being able to make a pragmatic argument to move on after Sophia was lost)...and right into the STEALING and attempted hiding of the bag of guns in the swamp to, once again, make what Dale thinks should happen the only choice for the group. When Shane tracks him down and takes the guns back, Dale has every opportunity to take Shane down effortlessly. Unable to stomach killing Shane, he buckled during their face-to-face confrontation and instead of calling Shane out with his accusations/suspicions in front of the group openly, Dale starts pouring Anti-Shane poison in first Lori's and then (judging by the scene in the teaser trailer at the end of the episode/preview for tonight's episode) Andrea's ears on the sly and behind Shane's back. Wow, if Dale "Didn't let the world take him down when it turned to Sh!t" he must've ALREADY BEEN one deceitful, manipulative, selfish and HYPOCRITICAL old fart before the Zombie Apocalypse began. I'm with the previous poster in wishing Dale would just die already. I understand he fills a certain niche on the overall canvas of interpersonal interactions, but Dale stirs up high-school-like drama to try and make those around him do what HE wants them to do, and then sit back and proclaim his hands are spotlessly clean just because he didn't overtly bully anyone. I've known too many people like that in real-life, (And I truly admire the writers' depictions of Dale. They're VERY true-to-life) and people like Dale accomplish nothing besides tearing apart the bonds of friendship, loyalty and trust between those individuals he thinks he knows better than they what they should be doing. If Shane is a problem for the group, Dale is an apocalypse. Wyldwraith i f*cking love you man, somebody else on this forum see's dale for what he is. i was starting to think id missed something.. I Honestly dont think shane is a danger to the group, he has never done anything to endanger people and has always been there to protect them when they need it, if he is being written as a antagonist then i honestly dont see it, people love saying he's a hot head and dangerous and everything but when i ask for specific examples of this nobody can ever answer Dale on the other hand, like you said, is a manipulative, deceitful, jealous, controlling coward and he's shown it several times. I see him being a major problem for the group if he continues the path he is going down.

[rongravy]

About Dale: Wow, if Dale "Didn't let the world take him down when it turned to Sh!t" he must've ALREADY BEEN one deceitful, manipulative, selfish and HYPOCRITICAL old fart before the Zombie Apocalypse began. I'm with the previous poster in wishing Dale would just die already. I understand he fills a certain niche on the overall canvas of interpersonal interactions, but Dale stirs up high-school-like drama to try and make those around him do what HE wants them to do, and then sit back and proclaim his hands are spotlessly clean just because he didn't overtly bully anyone. I've known too many people like that in real-life, (And I truly admire the writers' depictions of Dale. They're VERY true-to-life) and people like Dale accomplish nothing besides tearing apart the bonds of friendship, loyalty and trust between those individuals he thinks he knows better than they what they should be doing. If Shane is a problem for the group, Dale is an apocalypse. Yeah, I'd hate to have a Dale at work, which I have had. All up in your business, trying to be all behind the scenes and stuff... Creepin'. Shane'd just be trying to bang everybody. Screwed a little, or screwed alot. Take your pick.

[Neil]

Dale on the other hand, like you said, is a manipulative, deceitful, jealous, controlling coward and he's shown it several times. I see him being a major problem for the group if he continues the path he is going down. Wow! I don't see that! And "deceitful?" Really?

[Andy]

Completely.. read my post near the bottom of the previous page, i put my theory about dale in full.

[MinionZombie]

Wow! I don't see that! And "deceitful?" Really? I'm with you Neil, I don't see Dale as this twisted bastard that some of these guys see him as, either.

[AcesandEights]

I'm with you Neil, I don't see Dale as this twisted bastard that some of these guys see him as, either. Seems to be one of the characters people are currently split on. I see him as savvy and knowing he has to "work" people, like he did when he lied in an attempt to stall the group while searching for Sofia. So the character definitely has it in him to read people and react socially to manipulate things to where he feels they need to go, but a lot of people are reading maliciousness into his character where foolishness is more usually the more likely offense (unilaterally removing the firearms). All in all, he is another person who is (usually) acting in a believable, but not always likeable manner.