Is Miguel A Fool?

[clanglee]

I think that John and Mcdermott were the only 2 that were worth a crap. They knew their worth, they knew the situation was FUBAR, and they stayed out of the way of everyone else. They lived it up as best they could, because who knows when it would all end.

[Trin]

The other soldiers were never seen doing their jobs in the several days over which the movie took place. They were busy drinking, and growing/smoking weed while in a serious crisis situation. Miguel didn't almost kill Rickels--Steel and Rickels combined idiocy almost killed Rickels. Miguel was the convenient scapegoat for a group of dangerous loud-mouths. Woo-hoo!! Well said!! *clapping* And let's not forget that Miguel was on the helicopter barely able to stay awake, then got pulled into zombie pen duty the minute they landed. The hell he wasn't doing his job. @scipio70 - Great post. The separate agendas of each was definitely a catalyst for the breakdown. It seems like there are signs that they started out working as a team, but as each group met with failures they began drifting apart.

[Legion2213]

i think the main thing driving events in day toward destruction was the polarization among the different groups. no one wanted, nor even had the slightest interest, in working together. the different units had to function as a team and when that team concept started to breakdown the whole mass was doomed to failure. you have rhodes hanging on the idea of power. in a world shrunk to 12 people what does that matter? it doesn't. his inability to let his little dicked ego take a back seat to survival was deadly to the rest of the group. then there is logan. what the hell does it matter if you can make a few of the zombies behave? it doesn't. there are jillions of the them and you can't make them all behave. his point of view is drivel and nonsense in the extreme. sarah's need to "find an answer" is self-delusional and given the resources available not realistic at all. she is hanging onto the empirical past where everything can be stamped and deliniated into its proper category. all that has been blown away and the only that matters (which none of these characters seem to get) is surviving. then you have john and mcdermott not only do they not lend a hand in anything that doesn't strictly pertain to their "jobs" (again a meaningless concept in this format) they sequester themselves away from the rest of the group in their own private "honkey paradise" (in the words of one of the family from "the omega man"-yeah i know john was black, i'm not blind-it's just a funny phrase) the failure to work together and the failure to look past their own petty concerns is what doomed the folks in day. Good post. A bunker full of folks who are all pulling in different directions and all clinging to the "old order". Not the most optimum chances of survival for these folks.

[sandrock74]

If what Miguel did was strictly due to religious reasons, then why didn't he simply jump the fence, leaving it locked? Why let the zombies into their complex? He was selfish and fairly useless. He decided that it was his own time to die and he also wanted everyone else dead as well. He was a coward. I see nothing logical or worthwhile in his actions at the end of the movie. At least we all KNEW Rhodes was unhinged! He let you know where he was coming from. He wasn't sneaking around to let the zombies in!

[Trin]

If what Miguel did was strictly due to religious reasons, then why didn't he simply jump the fence, leaving it locked? Why let the zombies into their complex? He was selfish and fairly useless. He decided that it was his own time to die and he also wanted everyone else dead as well. He was a coward. I see nothing logical or worthwhile in his actions at the end of the movie. At least we all KNEW Rhodes was unhinged! He let you know where he was coming from. He wasn't sneaking around to let the zombies in! If you don't see his actions as logical then that adds credence to a religious view. Religious motives often transcend worldly logic. That's fundamental to the concept of faith. If Miguel concluded that God's will was that a plague of zombies should wipe clean the earth of humans then it makes perfect sense that he would let them in. He wasn't committing suicide. He was making himself a pawn of God. In a religious context that's a brave and selfless act. Personally, if I'd seen him trying to open the fences I'd have put a bullet in his head because I don't share that view. But I see where he was coming from. All the more reason they should've watched him closer. And, yes, we knew Rhodes was unhinged. So was Dr. Logan. If you tell me someone should've put a bullet in either of their heads I'd agree wholeheartedly. And they earned it far, far earlier in the movie than Miguel.

[Wyldwraith]

Reality check, Survival situation often = suspension of morality. Look at justified uses of martial law and the seemingly harsh actions often taken during it. Rhodes: Power-mad, either in the midst of or on the edge of a psychotic break. Fast acting poison in his booze prolly the best way to go here. Start shooting and you end up with an insane firefight from a bunch of soldiers way past their breaking points. Everyone talks about Rhodes being serious about his order to have Sarah shot. What about the fact that when push came to shove the guy he was ordering to do it was willing? Dr. Logan: Perfect (immoral, but perfect) way to offer an olive branch to the soldiers. Snitch on him to Rhodes, play up to him that after discovering what Dr. Logan was up to you now "get it" and see where he's coming from and are very sorry you were being such an ignorant ass in not seeing what a wise and powerful leader he was. Let them publicly torture, humiliate and finally murder Dr. Logan. Why? The soldiers (including Rhodes) MIGHT have had their frustration and bloodlust temporarily sated, buying time for the remaining scientists/civilians to figure a way out of this mess. Sarah: John should've grabbed her by the shoulders and shook her, HARD. Told her she needed to stop frigging obsessing on the cause of it all and accept that whatever the cause the situation was dire and survival needed to be the primary concern. I feel like Sarah could've been reached had one of the civilians been blunt enough about her obsession. Yes, a great deal of what I just wrote is ugly. It was a horrible, depraved situation they found themselves in. Such situations don't come tailored with tidy and morally upright solutions. Real survivors are the ones who can sleep (lightly) with having done *whatever* it took to survive. Continued life offers the possibility of better days. Retaining your conventional morality short-term and allowing it to drag you down into death when for all you know your little band are the last living people is arrogant and selfish IMO. The group failed like many have said because everyone was focused on EVERYTHING BUT making the hard and ugly choices that might've given a better chance of survival. Miguel is no different here than anyone else. If it was religious obsession or just insanity the same is true for him. Obsessed with something besides the glaring necessity before him. If you're going to lay down your life lay it down for something that lets you die content. Not for an abstract rambling judgmental internal monologue about unpureness. Self-sacrifice is a noble trait, yes. But only when applied rightly.

[sandrock74]

I think Rhodes and Logan were the ones making the situation worse. With them out of the picture, I think everyone else would have been more loose and not as stressed. Sarah's obsessiveness was the other sticking point. She needed to just forget about it! It was WAY too late to save the world at this point! As a side bar, did anyone else think it was weird at just how many zombies were coming out of the pen when it was left open at the end of the movie? The way Sarah was complaining, it seemed like there were only a few left! There must have been a hundred shambling out of there!!

[SRP76]

As a side bar, did anyone else think it was weird at just how many zombies were coming out of the pen when it was left open at the end of the movie? The way Sarah was complaining, it seemed like there were only a few left! There must have been a hundred shambling out of there!! I think that was just a blooper, since many of those zombies were the same ones that just came down the elevator. Thing is, the never-ending, "more every day" zombie homing doesn't fit with them being on an island. If they were tethered to the mainland by highways, the FIRST thing the military would have done when they dropped them there would be to blow every bridge in and out of the place. There should have been a finite number of dead surrounding their area.

[7734]

As a side bar, did anyone else think it was weird at just how many zombies were coming out of the pen when it was left open at the end of the movie? The way Sarah was complaining, it seemed like there were only a few left! There must have been a hundred shambling out of there!! I think sarah just complained too much period. But the way Rhoades was whining made me think there were a lot of zombies in that pen and he was getting more worried day by day.

[sandrock74]

OK, I just have to ask. I always wondered. Just how did they get those zombies into the pen in the first place? Hope that they fall into the missle silo? And why make the pen in the darkest, scariest corner of the whole complex? Why give the zombies so many places to hide?

[Yojimbo]

the failure to work together and the failure to look past their own petty concerns is what doomed the folks in day. Certainly is the predominate theme of GAR's apocalyptic films. Still think Miguel was a waste case, mind you, but you make a very good point. Collectively they all were feeding their own agenda's, whether that is getting high, or posing in the mirror, etc, but not really working cohesively on a master plan.

[Legion2213]

OK, I just have to ask. I always wondered. Just how did they get those zombies into the pen in the first place? Hope that they fall into the missle silo? And why make the pen in the darkest, scariest corner of the whole complex? Why give the zombies so many places to hide? I expect that Rhodes men had to round them up from the outside...hence the loss of several of his men before we join the story...no wonder he was pissed at the scientists who didn't have to do anything dangerous.

[DubiousComforts]

OK, I just have to ask. I always wondered. Just how did they get those zombies into the pen in the first place? Hope that they fall into the missle silo? And why make the pen in the darkest, scariest corner of the whole complex? Why give the zombies so many places to hide? It seems that they selected a remote corner of the facility that was easy to seal off with a single gate. Obviously, they also developed a very specific system for corralling the zombies long before they became lazy and the team started falling apart. In the film, they seem to be sloppily going through the motions which is very dangerous given the situation.

[acealive1]

I think that John and Mcdermott were the only 2 that were worth a crap. They knew their worth, they knew the situation was FUBAR, and they stayed out of the way of everyone else. They lived it up as best they could, because who knows when it would all end. they knew when to play and when to work. and both could co exist which is great. that'll keep u alive a long time

[jim102016]

Woo-hoo!! Well said!! *clapping* And let's not forget that Miguel was on the helicopter barely able to stay awake, then got pulled into zombie pen duty the minute they landed. The hell he wasn't doing his job. @scipio70 - Great post. The separate agendas of each was definitely a catalyst for the breakdown. It seems like there are signs that they started out working as a team, but as each group met with failures they began drifting apart. Speaking of Miguel and his getting roped into helping after he came down the elevator, why the hell didn't Miller help? Miller says the flight was another waste of time, the elevator doors close, and he's just there....what the hell is he doing, hiding or playing with himself? You don't hear the elevator start up again. I think that was just a blooper, since many of those zombies were the same ones that just came down the elevator. Thing is, the never-ending, "more every day" zombie homing doesn't fit with them being on an island. If they were tethered to the mainland by highways, the FIRST thing the military would have done when they dropped them there would be to blow every bridge in and out of the place. There should have been a finite number of dead surrounding their area. Who ever said the research complex/bunker was on an island? How did you come up with the idea they were on an island? Their little operation was pretty pathetic, they even mention it was put together in a matter of days. They could barely scrape up enough resources for what they had, no way in hell they could have knocked out massive land bridges in the far out concept that it was an island.