"why don't people like Alan Wake"

[Danny]

And it's not like I'm incapable of playing Alan Wake on "normal" either, cos I completed the game a week after I got it ... what I'm saying is that my personal preference - and indeed the preference of plenty of other people out there - would be to play the game on a "Casual Mode". THEN WHY DO YOU WANT IT? i will speak against this madness everyday until you like it.

[MinionZombie]

THEN WHY DO YOU WANT IT? i will speak against this madness everyday until you like it. Because I don't want to have to be bothered with Normal Mode, that's why. How is this a hard concept to grasp? Each to their own for crying out loud ... fine by me if you want "the challenge" of higher difficulty levels, no skin off my nose, so just accept that not everyone wants to be bothered with that and just wants to enjoy a "Casual Mode".

[Danny]

Because I don't want to have to be bothered with Normal Mode, that's why. How is this a hard concept to grasp? Each to their own for crying out loud ... fine by me if you want "the challenge" of higher difficulty levels, no skin off my nose, so just accept that not everyone wants to be bothered with that and just wants to enjoy a "Casual Mode". its not about challenge or snobbery, its that each game out has a series of difficultys and you seem to think if tis called casual then its some nice enjoyable ride but if the easiest mode is 'normal' then fuck that shit they are overlooking part of the audience or something. when you can take normal on alan wake and something else that calls something just as easy, equally so, casual and treat them differently like theres this unified distinction that isnt there. i have no problem with wanting to play games on the easiest setting thats up to you. its getting sniffy with something because youve designated "casual" as the definitive thing when it could be renamed "normal" and be exactly the same. over so many other terms like easy, child mode, peaceful, spectator or any other of the dozens of names that i find crazy because there isnt really an industry standard y'know? not that there could be given this is a medium, not a genre we are talking about here and "easy" in a puzzle game could be very different to "easy" in a fps game or something. Like why 'casual' in particular? off the top of my head i'm not familiar with any games that list that as a difficulty. what is the source of that for you?

[MinionZombie]

I can't name a game off the top of my head that lists a "casual mode" with those specific letters, but I'm pretty sure I have seen more than one game that lists it as "casual", but really it's just a synonym for "easy mode". Alan Wake has - Normal, Hard, and Nightmare. Gears of War 2 (for example) has - Casual, Normal, Hardcore, and Insane Other games such as CODMW2 have their own range of four-stage difficulty settings (but with 'military-ish' names, but entirely the same purpose as other games with traditional names such as "easy, normal, hard, very hard"). GOW2 has four difficulty options, AW has three ... so that's one less player choice (on the lower end of the difficulty scale) for difficulty settings. Epic approached the difficulty settings for GOW2 in a really good manner. They recognised that their Casual Mode in the first game wasn't casual, and at times frustratingly tricky, so they sorted it out (indeed the only times I died was through my own error making a retardedly obvious mistake) and so those that just wanted to play the game but without having to fuss about "challenge" could do so. Then those that wanted a difficulty-related challenge could also have it with a range of modes with higher difficulty. http://www.bit-tech.net/news/gaming/...asual-appeal/1 "Some developers are nervous about that, but I think that's a dumb response. I think it's great to have more people playing games, and maybe they'll evolve from playing Guitar Hero to playing Gears or Halo or GTA." With that as a tenet, Bleszinski saw that there was a casual mode made for Gears of War 2 in which it it was practically harder to die than it was to survive. Bleszinski claimed that the team went deliberately out of their way to create this mode, specifically so that it can pull casual gamers in and get them interested in the harder modes. "We want casual gamers to get involved this time around," he explained. "Yes it's got blood, monsters and guns, but it is also a story about loss and redemption and a bit of heart." I refer back to Graham Linehan's (if memory serves) dislike for how - for him - he's denied content he's paid for because he's "not good enough" to get beyond a certain point in GTA IV. Personally I was fine at GTA IV and only had to retry a mission once at most to pass it - but some (and Capn is included in this category) find such games quite tricky. Now GTA IV just has one level of difficulty, but it's still a valid point - while I'm personally fine playing a GTA IV, it's unfair for those that aren't "good enough" to play, so there should be a difficulty choice in those sorts of games (as there was in Saints Row 2 - it's just a shame that the game was so insanely unbalanced that, for example, certain side missions were impossible and other side missions were the piss-easiest of piss-easy that even a slab of concrete could beat the side mission). Then, for example, a game like one of the Tony Hawk games ... some people are ridiculously good at them (and Capn is included in this category) while others are pretty rubbish at them (such as me) but I still want to play them (or the odd one anyway) - so I, or anyone, shouldn't be denied content because we're not "good enough" to get to a certain level. Hence, circling back, the broad range of difficulty settings that should always include - for player choice - a "casual" mode. Do I personally want a difficulty-related challenge? No. Same goes for a bunch of other people out there too. Ergo I should have the option to just enjoy the game how I want to play it. Since when was a player wanting to play a game however they want personally a gamer crime? And how can "normal be normal" when it can also be a 'renamed or equivalent' "casual"? You're not making sense. With Alan Wake "normal" was most definitely "normal" ... perhaps it's 'easy' to those of you who routinely play "hard" or "nightmare" - such is your right as a gamer, and personal playing preference and interest - (levels 3 and 4 of difficulty out of the standard four-level difficulty system that is - easy, normal, hard, very hard ... a system which used to be easy, normal, hard as standard a while back) - but to others Alan Wake's "normal mode" was not "easy" or "casual" or any other synonym for level 1-of-4 of the common four-tier gameplay difficulty layout. AW's "normal" was definitely "normal". If it was "easy" there would have been more ammo, you taking more hits, enemies taking less hits, and stronger/longer lasting batteries. I'm baffled why this is such a difficult thing for some in the gaming world to grasp - and I don't mean you hellsing in this sentence, even though this battle between us over this issue has raged longer than all three LOTR movies in one sitting - I'm speaking at this point about the wider gaming world where "casual mode is for fags" is such a common cry from the gaming elite.

[mista_mo]

But...If Normal is the easiest difficulty setting on Alan Wake, would it not be correct to label it as "Easy" as well as "Normal"? You can't just arbitrarily compare difficulty settings on two games, in two completely different genres. Alan Wake has Normal, which I would imagine, would be a walk in the park, especially compared to the other difficulty settings that the game offers. I'm sorry, but I just can't see a basis for an argument here when normal (the easiest difficulty) is pretty fucking easy. I believe he is referring to normal in the sense that in this case, normal is the easiest difficulty setting, so it would also be correct to label it as easy, at least compared to the other difficulties present. I also believe, Hellsing, that he uses the term casual, because it really is a word that conveys ease of use, and a laid back approach to pretty much anything that it is applied too.

[MinionZombie]

Gaming should be inclusive - just like Blezzy was saying - so there should always be a Casual Mode, which can entice those who aren't yet good enough for harder settings (and perhaps inspire them to go harder), as well as continue to entice those who just want to enjoy themselves on their own terms. And while "Normal" is 'the easiest setting on Alan Wake', it's still not equal to an Easy/Casual Mode - AW is missing the first-of-four standard difficulty settings - I refer back to my reasoning with the standard four-tier difficulty system. "Normal" mode hasn't been made easier by not including "Casual", all that has happened is that one of the four standard difficulty settings hasn't been included (and I've laid out exactly how a Casual Mode could have been done in AW). And, frankly speaking, when considering Blez's approach to Casual Mode - as an inclusive device, thus bringing more people in to the party - you would have thought the AW crew would have wanted to have more people playing their game, especially considering the trouble they had flogging units when they launched (and still to this day presumably). I'm not saying, however, that the lack of a casual mode was the reason they didn't do so well on launch, nor is it one of the big reasons why they didn't do so well on launch ... but it will be a reason among many. No doubt some people would be turned away specifically because there is no Casual Mode (anything can happen after all), and no doubt some people would be turned off because it would appear to them to be 'too hardcore for me, not casual enough' - there's a whole swathe of people out there who want that 'pick up and play for a bit' ease of use - the Wii has done so well as it encourages casual gaming. The thing with the Wii though is that the majority of the games themselves are entirely casual games. What I'm saying is that all games should have a proper Casual Mode for the many out there who otherwise find many games inpenetrable - and those of us who prefer Casual Mode (even though we'd technically be classed as "Serious" or even "Hardcore" Gamers) - I'm speaking widely here, not just personally. A great movie or a great book doesn't have levels of difficulty which allow a range of viewers or readers to enjoy the product, but games do - and that should be employed fully, so that casuals, gluttons for punishment, and everyone in-between alike can enjoy the same great products.