4th episode - "Vatos"

[Mr. Clean]

Well i will say the dude who got shot int he ass has probably been infected. I am sure the brother who is the archer is not on top of cleaning and sanitizing his equipment enough and if i had written this storyline I would have played that angle to throw some of the groups safety off. I didn't think of that. Pretty crazy twist. His arrows had to be pretty nasty. Also, I wonder why they didn't show the Radio that he went back for in this episode.

[Skold]

i think you and a few others are nit-picking this poor series waay too much. it's like the deal with the airport and mall from the original dawn only being a few miles apart. you've gotta draw the line somewhere...taking the height of the sun, seasons of the year, geographical location, etc into such extreme consideration must be such a burden....why can't some of you guys just relax and enjoy the show? Indeed! It doens't take that long to get from Philly to Harrisburg! How was the nurse zombie inside when they locked up the mall and killed them all but outside again? My favortie part of GAR movies was that we could fill in the gaps. They stopped a few times! Nurse zombie walked outside for some unknown reason! If anyone here was this critical of Dawn, it would be ridiculous. Where the hell did they get all those pies?!?

[ProfessorChaos]

dude, trust me, i've read on this site posts about how the pies should've been spoiled by that far into the outbreak....can't recall if it was in jest or serious....

[MikePizzoff]

dude, trust me, i've read on this site posts about how the pies should've been spoiled by that far into the outbreak. Well, it's true...

[babomb]

i think you and a few others are nit-picking this poor series waay too much. it's like the deal with the airport and mall from the original dawn only being a few miles apart. you've gotta draw the line somewhere...taking the height of the sun, seasons of the year, geographical location, etc into such extreme consideration must be such a burden....why can't some of you guys just relax and enjoy the show? i seriously picture some members of this board sitting back with their dvr remotes, a pen, and a notebook just looking for the tiniest detail to rip to shreds for no other reason than they've got to much time on their hands or a strong sense of self-worth from finding the most irrelevant things to prattle on about. this is not entirely directed at you, but this over-examination of things like what you did above are what i'm talking about.... Exactly!!! No offense to anyone who does this, but it does seem to take some of the joy out of it. I like to talk about all this stuff, I like to theorize, but there's a certain suspension of disbeleif that's required to enjoy any work of fiction that includes elements that will never be anything more than fiction. I mean, if some of the small details are so unacceptably unrealistic, how do you get past the premise of the dead walking?

[thxleo]

What the hell kinda show has 6 episodes a season? Most networks only green light a pilot and then based on that they go ahead and order more episodes. AMC was so impressed with the material and the cast, and trusted the production team of Darabont and Gale Ann Hurd so much that they green lit 6 episodes. I'd say we were lucky to have that many episodes to begin with. ---------- Post added at 09:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:02 AM ---------- i think you and a few others are nit-picking this poor series waay too much. it's like the deal with the airport and mall from the original dawn only being a few miles apart. you've gotta draw the line somewhere...taking the height of the sun, seasons of the year, geographical location, etc into such extreme consideration must be such a burden....why can't some of you guys just relax and enjoy the show? i seriously picture some members of this board sitting back with their dvr remotes, a pen, and a notebook just looking for the tiniest detail to rip to shreds for no other reason than they've got to much time on their hands or a strong sense of self-worth from finding the most irrelevant things to prattle on about. this is not entirely directed at you, but this over-examination of things like what you did above are what i'm talking about.... I could not agree more, Professor. These long winded essays that some members pound out on here are ridiculous. I've stopped reading them because they are so silly. What's wrong with keeping it short and succinct? And what about simply watching the show and having fun with it?????? ---------- Post added at 09:10 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 AM ---------- Exactly!!! No offense to anyone who does this, but it does seem to take some of the joy out of it. I like to talk about all this stuff, I like to theorize, but there's a certain suspension of disbeleif that's required to enjoy any work of fiction that includes elements that will never be anything more than fiction. I mean, if some of the small details are so unacceptably unrealistic, how do you get past the premise of the dead walking? 100% agreement!

[Trin]

I attribute Daryl pursuing the Vatos for two reasons. Reason 1. As others have pointed out, Merle was a dead end at that point. For all we know the Vatos have him. And as Daryl said, "No one kills Merle but Merle." So I think Daryl was satisfied that Merle was gonna be okay for the time being. Reason 2. The Vatos totally jacked Daryl in the alley and he was not likely to let that slide. I can totally see him putting his brother on the back burner to go pound some Vato behind. I pointed out a while back that the crossbow bolt would end up killing the Vato dude. He will either succumb to zombie infection or garden variety infection. Puncture wounds through clothing tend to cause infection worse than other kinds of wounds due to the object pushing bits of filthy clothing and matter into the wound. He's a goner. Unless they have some cache of antibiotics around, which I think is unlikely, and he didn't pick up zombie goo. @Wyld - I'm not really sure what you're getting at with the analysis of the time and distance and stuff. Are you pointing out a continuity error or a plot hole or what? I got irritated at the "jogging" back to camp (one of my initial gripes several pages back) because it indicates that the camp was not very far from Atlanta. Thinking about the surrounding areas of a major city like that I'd expect the nearest safe rural spot to be 15-20 miles out. You gotta figure those guys were 3-4 miles just off a main road. Then the distance to town. No way those guys hoofed it that distance at that pace weighted down like that. My point being that without the car/truck they were well and truly screwed. Did they ever explain how Glen and the others traveled back and forth to the department store? Was it all walking? We know they drove the car/truck back after the escape scene, but how were they typically getting there? I guess I'd be surprised if they walked all the way in and out each time. Some of the nit-picking stems from the desire to think through "what would you do" scenarios. That's the fun part of these kinds of shows for some of us. That leads to lots of what-if scenarios that bring into question the surroundings and environment and how things work. How can I know if my decision to hole-up on the department store roof overnight (instead of a daring escape) would work without breaking down the zombie behavior and surroundings, the strength of the doors, the approaching stormfront, etc. That's just an example of course, but it speaks to the tendency to nit-pick. That's the fun for some. Suspension of disbelief is obviously a poorly understood fiction mechanic by some on this board as it is too often used to slam posters who question ANYTHING. Suspension of disbelief is not a blank check to justify any crazy diversion from the laws of physics that the writers decide to film. We allow suspension of disbelief to dictate that zombies exist. That's all. Everything else is expected to obey the known universe.

[AcesandEights]

I can totally see him putting his brother on the back burner to go pound some Vato behind. Can we confirm whether Daryl actually did time, or are we just inferring at this point

[Legion2213]

Most networks only green light a pilot and then based on that they go ahead and order more episodes. AMC was so impressed with the material and the cast, and trusted the production team of Darabont and Gale Ann Hurd so much that they green lit 6 episodes. I'd say we were lucky to have that many episodes to begin with. Absolutely, the most that new series usually get is a 90 minute pilot, even "The Lost Room" only got 3 episodes (it's crime that it was never continued with a proper series, but that is for another thread)

[DEAD BEAT]

I doubt it. This is YOU we're talking about, after all. hey! did you get that pic from my exgirlfriend! lol lol that sucker should be on Easter Island! lmao

[Trancelikestate]

Ok, i guess i didn't know shows worked that way. So should we expect season 2 to be the average number? 12 is it? I did like this episode. As soon as Amy stood up and said "i have to go to the bathroom", i yelled she's dead! And after it happened my girl was like oh, you were right. I think merle may have lead that army of walkers up there in the van, but they certainly weren't loaded on the van. the cargo area had access to the cab. I am definatley liking daryl more and more. That vato who got shot in the ass annoys me for some reason. maybe its "Training Day".

[MoonSylver]

hey! did you get that pic from my exgirlfriend! lol lol that sucker should be on Easter Island! lmao I figured you were humping the ground & it went through the earth & popped up in China.

[kidgloves]

Ok. I've watched this episode again and I'm getting something different each time. If you watch it with the mindset of Rick and co being the bad guys when it gets to the Vatos part it makes much more sense. Quite moving actually with the old people part. I just wish they'd executed it better. It's very jolting when grandma appears. Daryl Dixon continues to rock. Merle light. And Jim. Andrew Rothenberg is doing a great job. My god what a tragic character and yes I've read the comic.

[babomb]

I'd expect the nearest safe rural spot to be 15-20 miles out. That's pretty damn far! It's definitely up to the individual/s sense of safety, but it also depends on a few other things. Like the specific area, the actual topology of the land and how difficult it is to get to the safe zone, is there any natural defense against intruders, etc... I'd personally think that 5 miles from the nearest populated area would be sufficient if the terrain lends itself. Obviously 5 miles out on straight desert wouldn't be wise. But if there's alot of dense woods, possibly some elevation difference, it should be OK. 15-20 miles out would present some logistics challenges when it comes to resource acquisition or god forbid, rescue of group members. The fact that gas isn't in great supply makes using that truck for supply runs on 30-40 mile round trip distances plain ridiculous. I'm inclined to think that they're around 5 miles out give or take. Because they have that rule about keeping fires very low so they aren't seen from a distance, which would be unnecessary if they were 15-20 miles out. The signal from those old 70's radios can't possibly be 15-20 miles, and they just barely were able to hear Rick when he entered the city. I'm thinking 5 miles again on the max distance of CB radios from the 70's with no signal boost. Of course, this is pure speculation with not enough information, based on my own observations of my local terrain and experience hiking and signal distance on radio reception. Some of the nit-picking stems from the desire to think through "what would you do" scenarios. That's the fun part of these kinds of shows for some of us. That leads to lots of what-if scenarios that bring into question the surroundings and environment and how things work. I get that, and I do agree. To an extent. I don't think the spoiled pies in Dawn helps in any what-if scenario though. What seems odd to me is those posts that start out "I loved the latest episode, BUT" and proceed to write an essay about a bunch of small details that don't have much bearing. Or nit picking things that there's no information about. I'd hate to see the good "what-if" discussions stop! It just sucks that sometimes you have to read a whole page of someones nit-pick dislikes of details of no value to get to a 2 sentence area that actually has merit.

[Yojimbo]

In light of the complaints about the one dimensional aspects of the characters as portrayed in VATOS and the other assorted small details that have bothered many of the posters, I now proclaim GAR as relevant and his standing redeemed as the king of all things ghoul. I might be kidding, or maybe not. Either way, it is all a matter of perception. I enjoyed the episode, plot holes and sterotypical characters notwithstanding, but it is exactly these kind of weak points of a film that many of my fellow posters utilize to condemn George A. Romero's recent offerings and judge him as irrelevant.