Something that bugs me about the Dawn of the Dead remake...

[Trin]

@Wyld - I also agree with the RED FLAG post. I'd add that there's no way in heck I ever run out of gas in that boat. At the quarter tank point I turn off the engine and start rowing, knowing I might need the gas for a quick getaway from my island of choice.

[Ragnarr]

Wow. I totally never thought of that. My ferret better not try to pull that crap and start dooking at the wrong time or she's toast along with me. While I'd say ferrets certainly rock, it would take a ferret way too long to get food across the mall parking lot to Andy's gunshop. Besides, the little critter would only be able to carry a few Ritz crackers in its saddle bags at best.

[Wyldwraith]

Thanks guys, And agree with the shutting down the engine at 1/4 a tank of gas. I've been on small outboard yachts once or twice, and something I noticed was while selling WELL is an extremely difficult series of sub-sets of skills, sailing in an extremely inefficient, very crude manner is about as difficult as common sense would indicate. Ie: Stretching cloth over the general mast framework and trying to keep the wind behind it. But, that oversight ill give the survivors, since sailing very much looks so complicated that most people would be extremely hesitant to fuck around w/ things that have been lashed down. I dunno, I'm with the camp that believes the survivors stupid actions screwed the mall situation for them, and that their reasoning for leaving was about as contrived as reasoning can be. I mean Hell, they were losing people left, right and center in a mostly-secured structure. Whatever would've made them believe that the breakout would've gone any better than it turned out it actually went? The whole "I don't want to die here" thing is weak when you follow their pie-in-the-sky goal-setting to its logical conclusion "I dont want to die here, but I'd enjoy dying somewhere I have never seen and know nothing whatsoever about better." For all they knew, the island in question could've been a glorified sand bar with a fishing camp shack on it. For me at least, Dawn '04 started as a not-terrible way to spend 90-ish minutes. However, with many repeated re-watchings, my enjoyment of its good points have diminished even as my irritation with the Caricature-characters has grown. The sad thing is, the "Year of the Zombie" (which has actually been like 2-3yrs at this point) seems to be tapering off. Much fewer new zombie flicks even remotely watchable, and a severe die-off of new zombie novels (except for anthologies for some reason). Ah well, judging by the previews of TWD: Season 2, the series will continue to deliver at least.

[Ragnarr]

You're right about reserving some of the boat's fuel certainly, and also about the characters making a simplistic square sail rigging to catch some choice winds. I would also add the use of oars. I believe maritime law requires small to medium size civilian boats to carry life jackets AND oars. I still like the beginning part of Dawn04; when Ana climbs out the bathroom window to see her neighborhood in chaos, and her frenzied ride out to the main highway. Up until the toilet-through-the-store-window scene, the flick totally had me on the edge of my seat. Go TWD! **Correction: checked Coastguard maritime law & found no reference to oar requirements for boats under 60 ft.**

[Thorn]

Thanks guys, And agree with the shutting down the engine at 1/4 a tank of gas. I've been on small outboard yachts once or twice, and something I noticed was while selling WELL is an extremely difficult series of sub-sets of skills, sailing in an extremely inefficient, very crude manner is about as difficult as common sense would indicate. Ie: Stretching cloth over the general mast framework and trying to keep the wind behind it. But, that oversight ill give the survivors, since sailing very much looks so complicated that most people would be extremely hesitant to fuck around w/ things that have been lashed down. I dunno, I'm with the camp that believes the survivors stupid actions screwed the mall situation for them, and that their reasoning for leaving was about as contrived as reasoning can be. I mean Hell, they were losing people left, right and center in a mostly-secured structure. Whatever would've made them believe that the breakout would've gone any better than it turned out it actually went? The whole "I don't want to die here" thing is weak when you follow their pie-in-the-sky goal-setting to its logical conclusion "I dont want to die here, but I'd enjoy dying somewhere I have never seen and know nothing whatsoever about better." For all they knew, the island in question could've been a glorified sand bar with a fishing camp shack on it. For me at least, Dawn '04 started as a not-terrible way to spend 90-ish minutes. However, with many repeated re-watchings, my enjoyment of its good points have diminished even as my irritation with the Caricature-characters has grown. The sad thing is, the "Year of the Zombie" (which has actually been like 2-3yrs at this point) seems to be tapering off. Much fewer new zombie flicks even remotely watchable, and a severe die-off of new zombie novels (except for anthologies for some reason). Ah well, judging by the previews of TWD: Season 2, the series will continue to deliver at least. I am not so much bothered by the Dawn remake, as you well know... but in the end I can honestly say that there were a lot of decisions made that I question as a sound person sitting back and looking at the choices from a logical perspective. Boat fuel being one of them. Docking a boat to a pier without testing the waters? Like I dont know, mooring near to shore and yelling? Seems to draw attention. You might get shot at but hey then you know there are survivors, and they might need you more than you need them or at least as much or you might need to beat feet. Either way you do that before you tie off and wait for the zombie or redneck rush through your ranks. I hate the ending and lately I just don't watch it. For me the movie should end after they take off in the boat. The rest quite frankly is just plain terrible, and gratuitous Romero-esque no one here gets out alive film making. At least with GAR that death was usually ironic, or in someway meaningful.

[Neil]

The rest quite frankly is just plain terrible, and gratuitous Romero-esque no one here gets out alive film making. At least with GAR that death was usually ironic, or in someway meaningful. In most of Romero's films, the hero survives... Night 68 I think is the only exception!

[Thorn]

This is true of course, but those who do survive usually are damaged in some way physically, psychologically, ripped from their circumstances after having watched their fellows killed around them. The illusion of safety destroyed. They flee to an island, they may or may not make it. They take off in a chopper... they may or may not get North. Either way you are not left with a rosy feeling, society is not put back together and everyone is happy go lucky as Disney fireworks shoot off in the background (Land is a vile exception here). In part this is why I like Italian films because in America we seem like we have to have the... "and they lived happily ever after", and that is just not the case in 95% of Romero films. Hell even Ben's death was Ironic, and it told a story. It was death with a purpose. To me that beats "Well we have to kill everyone" or "We can't end on an up-note so how do we screw the survivors and viewers" with an ending that is less than satisfactory. Perhaps I should have clarified more.

[Mike70]

rowing a boat that size with so few people is simply not going to work. not only is the sheer mass of the boat working against you (plus the fact it was never designed to be rowed anywhere), but also any sort of current, even a small one would stop you in your tracks. i've spent 25 years in kayaks, so i'm no novice to the water. the sailboat in dawn isn't going to be rowed anywhere. the energy required to do so would be enormous and the few people left in the boat would find themselves dead tired, dehydrated and generally in a bad mood after such an attempt, because in all likelihood, they'd find it nearly impossible to move that thing. better to try and get it under sail power. which is tricky depending on the type of sails that were set when the boat was taken. not all sails are made equal and an idiot could quickly find themselves being pushed back towards the shore (maybe the very place they left) if the sails are not set right.

[Wyldwraith]

Well, If your group, working together, can make armored transports out of mall shuttles I couldn't buy them not being able to jimmy a measure of sailcloth into position and control it by means of muscling the jib. It's crude as all get out, but people crossed oceans with similar setups just on a bit larger a scale. However, I'll qualify what I'm saying with this: I have no boating experience beyond outboard-driven skiffs & bassboats, and *I* certainly couldn't turn a mall shuttle into an armored transport. That said, I agree with previous posters that the ending was little more than a copycat-effort of the "No one gets out alive" model ending. Which, with time, has grown dull and lost all punch through its constant over-use.

[Trin]

This is true of course, but those who do survive usually are damaged in some way physically, psychologically, ripped from their circumstances after having watched their fellows killed around them. The illusion of safety destroyed. That's true for the people who didn't survive too. Yeah... think about that for a second. But seriously, as for the sailing thing. It never bugged me until now. They left the marina under power, and any idiot can manage that. But navigating a sailboat into an island dock without benefit of the motor - I have to believe that is more difficult than portrayed. Of course, at 90 minutes into Dawn '04 that's probably the least of your plot nitpicking. In minor defense of Dawn '04... the movie never promised compelling and thoughtful plot. I think Dawn '04 does one of the classic "roll over and give up" moves in terms of plot. They have someone opposed to the "plan" (in this case CJ) voice all the reasons why the plan is not viable... which often involves stating a rash of the obvious... then miraculously that person agrees to it with no explanation or reasoning. It's like the movie looking the audience in the eye and saying, "Yup, we aren't even trying to sell it."

[Christopher Jon]

Was reading this thread. Thought I'd clear up the end of Dawn of the Dead since there are a lot of foggy memories. I popped in the DVD to get everything right. Picking up where they use the sewers to reach the gun store. Steve (the a-hole) is left guarding the door that leads back into the mall. They follow the sewer, reach the gun store, rescue the girl and get more guns. On the way back they are unable to close the sewer manhole and zombies chase after them through the sewer. When they reach the door back into the mall, it's locked. Steve ditched them. It's Ana (the nurse) who eventually lets them back in. By this point the stairwell below them is packed with zombies. CJ (security guard) attempts to close the door but is unable too. Too many zombies. They run. The hoard of zombies is flooding into the mall. The survivors have no choice but to head for the vehicles and leave. They've lost the mall. Whatever the escape plan was, it's thrown out the window now. They are running for their lives now. The trucks at this point weren't even finished and haven't been loaded with any supplies. They weren't planning on leaving for a couple more days at the earliest. While driving. Steve, the only guy who knows anything about boats, is killed. Most of the plot holes brought up are a result of bad memories.

[rongravy]

Ehhhh, say what you want about how much this movie sucks, but it is one of the thangies that brought zeds back to the forefront. Do I like sprinting zombies? No. Why? Because I'm a semi fat f*ck who would run out of air after about, say........... 45 seconds. Did I enjoy this movie at the theater and a second time at the drive inn with my kids and nephews? Hell yes, it was a great time. So, yeah, pick this movie apart as you will, but the FX were great. Sure, I fall asleep by the time they go through the "hanging out at the mall" montage, but dayumn. The Walking Dead has just as many plot holes in it, but I don't hear NEARLY as much bitching over it. Some of you need to lighten the f*ck up. I'm just saying...

[Yojimbo]

Steve (the a-hole) is left guarding the door that leads back into the mall. They follow the sewer, reach the gun store, rescue the girl and get more guns. On the way back they are unable to close the sewer manhole and zombies chase after them through the sewer. When they reach the door back into the mall, it's locked. Steve ditched them. It's Ana (the nurse) who eventually lets them back in. By this point the stairwell below them is packed with zombies. CJ (security guard) attempts to close the door but is unable too. Too many zombies. They run. The hoard of zombies is flooding into the mall. The survivors have no choice but to head for the vehicles and leave. They've lost the mall. Whatever the escape plan was, it's thrown out the window now. They are running for their lives now. The trucks at this point weren't even finished and haven't been loaded with any supplies. They weren't planning on leaving for a couple more days at the earliest. While driving. Steve, the only guy who knows anything about boats, is killed. Most of the plot holes brought up are a result of bad memories. "They follow the sewer, reach the gun store, rescue the girl and get more guns." Question: Why didn't they do this in the first place rather than trying an overly elaborate plan involving the dog? Alternatively, why didn't they simply drive over, running over a lot of zombies on the way, to get the guy from the gun store. If the first set of survivors could climb up to the mall roof from the top of the truck, gunstore chess dude could likely climb down. "On the way back they are unable to close the sewer manhole and zombies chase after them through the sewer." Question: Instead of taking the sewer, why didn't they use the truck parked outside? "When they reach the door back into the mall, it's locked. Steve ditched them." Question: You realize that Steve is an asshole, self serving and self obsessed and this is the guy you have controlling your exit? Really? "It's Ana (the nurse) who eventually lets them back in. By this point the stairwell below them is packed with zombies." Why the hell wasn't Anna guarding the door in the first place instead of known asshole Steve? Had she been on door duty, they would have gotten back into the mall and secured the door well before the stairwell below became full of zombies. "CJ (security guard) attempts to close the door but is unable too. Too many zombies." Again, should not have happened. Also, why not use the 12 gauge to take out the zombies all clustered together as they come up the staircase? A few blasts would have knocked the zombies in the front backwards into the others, further delaying their approach. "They run...The hoard of zombies is flooding into the mall." Again, should not have happened. Their obvious errors in judgement made this possible. Along this line, shouldn't they have secured the keys from the truck in the first place so that the ridiculousness with dog girl - or being taken by a passing looter - could not occur? "The survivors have no choice but to head for the vehicles and leave. They've lost the mall. Whatever the escape plan was, it's thrown out the window now. They are running for their lives now. The trucks at this point weren't even finished and haven't been loaded with any supplies. They weren't planning on leaving for a couple more days at the earliest." Why didn't they plan for this contingency? Seems inconceivable that they would do anything but be ready to leave in a moments notice should the mall be breached, "shatter proof" glass notwithstanding. "While driving. Steve, the only guy who knows anything about boats, is killed." Yeah, predictable plot twist - could see this one coming since it was heavily telegraphed in the script with Anna's dialogue and since morally reprehensible cowards stereotypically get killed off in the third act. I do know that a lot of the fans including myself have sometimes been a little overjudgemental with "DOTD the remake in name only" - some of it is justified, and some of it admittedly is a lot of fan-boy outrage that someone had the audacity to take a beloved film and do an inferior version of it in a manner that seemed to have little respect for the source film. Giving it a second thought, I do still that this "remake" is a film full of plot holes, MTV type presentation taking precedence over substance, characters who are poorly fleshed out and largely unlikable stereotypes, stereotypical dialogue, and severe jumps in logic that require more than just a suspension of disbelief to swallow. I will admit that there were some moments that I truly enjoyed in this film. The bit at the beginning with the suburban neighborhood going to hell was pretty cool. I did like the nods to Romero's films, however tacked on and supercillious they might have been. But in the end, recollective fuzziness can only be a benefit to this film rather than a detriment.