TWD 2x12 "Better Angels" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN**

[MinionZombie]

Yeh, I've mentioned before the way characters (especially children) just wonder off alone (into the woods?) without seemingly any real concern annoys me... But I suppose they get around it in this portion of 2x12 because the downstairs windows are boarded up, but not the top ones, and the one where Carl is, is right next to the porch roof (so you can easily escape ... I'm sure Maggie will have done just that for the odd tryst in the family barn on occasion pre-zeds, that cheeky minx ) ... and then well, I suppose kids can easily get away from you, either in a crowded area (like a mall - it's happened many times in the past) or even in a wide open area. Perhaps the group lets their guard down somewhat in that area - it's very peaceful and is wide open (something we've noticed much more in these last few episodes, thanks to Mazzara's wise choice to extend the visual scope of the show to bring in the sense of location scale). So, when you've got a massive debate going on regarding whether to kill Randall or not, you could see how that could happen ... there is a degree of suspension of belief required for it, though. I think they need to watch that in season 3, but I have a feeling that Carl will be less inclined to go walkabout from now on (indeed, the worst times with him doing it recently have been linked to his attitude change where he was becoming rather cavalier about the value of human life - which resulted in poor old Dale getting the chop). However it did have to happen in 2x12 that Carl killed zombie Shane ... or Zhane, if you will ... because it was a tweaking of Carl shooting human Shane in the neck in Volume 1, and it also ties in with Carl not shooting the walker that killed Dale. So thematically it made sense, but yeah, certain members of the group could do with improving their child-minding skills ... if they were in this country they'd never get a certificate!

[Tricky]

As with other threads I cant say much more than MZ has here, although I missed the first bit before the opening credits so I'll have to watch again! Really good episode, I almost thought Shane was going to be ok after his chat with Lori, but obviously that spurred him on to think that if Rick was out of the way he maybe had another chance with her. The only part I did find a little cheesy was when Shane came back from the dead, he suddenly sat bolt upright like in a 50's B-movie horror, and I found it a little odd that Rick was telling Carl to put the gun down but was oblivious to the snarling Shane zombie behind him that wasnt exactly being quiet, it wasnt a bad scene but it just seemed to be suffering from cliches a bit...

[AnxietyDilemma]

The only part I did find a little cheesy was when Shane came back from the dead, he suddenly sat bolt upright like in a 50's B-movie horror, and I found it a little odd that Rick was telling Carl to put the gun down but was oblivious to the snarling Shane zombie behind him that wasnt exactly being quiet, it wasnt a bad scene but it just seemed to be suffering from cliches a bit... Just be thankful that Nicotero rejected Bernthal's request to have his character yell "RIIIIICK" when he re-animated.

[Tricky]

Just be thankful that Nicotero rejected Bernthal's request to have his character yell "RIIIIICK" when he re-animated. I'll be very thankful of that! As soon as TWD walkers start showing any kind of evolution or "Big Daddy" intelligence, I'll stop watching!

[Neil]

Just be thankful that Nicotero rejected Bernthal's request to have his character yell "RIIIIICK" when he re-animated. Really? Did he really not get what a huge mistake that would be!?

[bassman]

Really? Did he really not get what a huge mistake that would be!? Apparently not. I guess Bernthal wanted to go out on a bigger bang, but didn't consider how it could ruin the rest of the series...

[MinionZombie]

Apparently not. I guess Bernthal wanted to go out on a bigger bang, but didn't consider how it could ruin the rest of the series... To be fair, probably not all of the cast members are as versed in zombie lore as us lot and the writers/directors of the show.

[paranoid101]

1) Opening montage was great. The memorial for Dale really felt genuine, no doubt because the actors themselves were sorry to see Jeff DeMunn leaving the show, and combining it with the group taking out their hate on some nearby zombies was awesome. Andrea with a pitchfork? Yes please. She's well versed in weapons these days isn't she? Guns, a scythe, now a pitchfork - good to see T-Dog actually getting something to do too, and the spade-hit to the one zombie's head with it's re-dying moments written across it's face was great. KNB knock it out of the park yet again. The zombie killing scene at the start for some reason Reminded me of the film Office Space when they take out there rage on the Printer lol

[MinionZombie]

The zombie killing scene at the start for some reason Reminded me of the film Office Space when they take out there rage on the Printer lol haha! I dare someone to remix that sequence to the music from that bit in Office Space. Also, just wanted to add a little something - when Glenn kills that zombie, it's a nice tie-in with his character arc in recent episodes. He felt he failed at the bar, but here he takes out zombie Randall ... or Zandall if you will ... and what I also dug was that Daryl was genuinely impressed, and gave him a little belly pat of congratulations. Definitely want to see more Daryl/Glenn zombie huntin' action - I think they'd make a great on-screen duo.

[bassman]

I think it was Aces that actually mentioned that within the first few pages of this thread....

[MinionZombie]

I think it was Aces that actually mentioned that within the first few pages of this thread.... Well that goes to show how much I've scanned back through this thread...

[paranoid101]

I think it was Aces that actually mentioned that within the first few pages of this thread.... Yep he did lol, just need someone that can edit it in slow motion lol

[Neil]

Having seen the end of the episode again, I'm a little annoyed at Shane's makeup when he came back. Within a minute of being dead, drawn in cheaks, protruding eyebrows, misty eyes? Cummon... We know he's dead... We know he's a zombie... We don't need the visual cues... He should have almost looked absolutely normal except his colour, as obviously he'd bled out a bit... Shame that!

[shootemindehead]

Yeh, the "eyes thing" is really annoying.

[ProfessorChaos]

looking back, i kinda wish they'd ended 2x12 and started 2x13 a little differently...and it involves carl's ass staying in the house (like they always tell him). i think it'd been a much more powerful scene if rick had stabbed shane then just sat there with his body till glenn and daryl came to investigate the shot that shane fired on reflex when stabbed. then rick could've told them about what happened between him and shane (daryl was already on the verge of figuring this out) as well as what jenner said...then as soon as shane came to, they could've just shot him (if they were opting for a quick "humane" death rather than bashing the guy's skull in), which would've allowed the story to progress with the herd hearing the shot and making their way to the farm. as a fan of the comics, i know that this really goes out of line of the source material by leaving carl out of the deal, but carl's little rebel routine had worn thin enough this season that by the time he showed up to check on rick and put shane down, i almost laughed that he was once again out fucking off in the middle of the night with an escaped (and presumed armed) prisoner on the loose in the middle of the walker plague....all by himself, like always...oh, i guess he's got his billy-bad-ass hat to protect him. anyhow, 2x13 opening with rick, glenn, and daryl fighting their way back to the house would've been more exciting, if you ask me. and then there'd be one less instance of the "where's carl" routine. just something that popped through my head today. thoughts, anyone?