TWD 4x06 "Live Bait" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN**

[Moon Knight]

Now I'm totally confused on who's who concerning these women. I assumed The Governor banged the nurse cause Meghan is her daughter. Someone must have been talking in my party cause I didn't catch the line with Tara talking about her ex-girlfriend.

[Legion2213]

Okay wiki says the gov is nobbing "Nurse Lilly", but it's "Cop chick muff diver Tara" who looks like Maggie IMO. Next episode is called "dead weight"...Tara is dooooomed!

[Moon Knight]

Muff Diver lol

[babomb]

That was a brutal way of putting that old man down. Bash his skull in while his family watches. Why not put a knife in his ear? Alot less traumatic for everyone. And when the Gov falls into the walker pit, he has to kill the walkers all by hand. Why wouldn't he have a weapon on him? Not even a knife? What's the logic here? When you see a group of walkers coming your way, drop all your weapons and run? This is the lazy writing I'm always talking about. They abandon all logic in order to setup really simple gags. The logic they use is that the Gov has to drop all his weapons and run so that he can fall into the pit and smash a walkers face into another walkers bones, and use another bone to sever a walkers head from its jaw. If he still has his belt on, with his gun and knife, then he'll just use those and the scene won't be as gory or prolongued. Because that's the important thing, getting the walker deaths and gore in there. To hell with logic and realism. And then in that same scene they see the group of walkers and drop all their weapons and run, except the little girl. The little girl freezes up, and what does everyone else do? Instead of doing what any able bodied and mentally aware person would do and run over and grab her, they all stand there yelling for her to come. And even worse, the little girls mother pays no attention to the fact that her little girl is frozen in fear. No, she drops everything and runs, leaving her kid standing there.

[Moon Knight]

Lazy writing? C'mon dude just stop watching already. The Governor killing those walkers by hand was fresh and awesome. This episode was full of interesting things to talk about and still, some of you continue with these dumb ass logic complaints. So negative at every chance possible.

[kidgloves]

Lazy writing? C'mon dude just stop watching already. The Governor killing those walkers by hand was fresh and awesome. This episode was full of interesting things to talk about and still, some of you continue with these dumb ass logic complains. So negative at every chance possible. Agreed. Kills/gags are a staple of the genre. Occasionally the story has to suffer to set up a gag but it has to be there. Personally, I'm extremely impressed with the originality of the gags this season. Great stuff

[Wyldwraith]

I kinda hate to be on the other side of this argument, But I agree. Without stuff like "Fall through the ceiling Walkers", "Pop out the hedge Walkers", and yes even the Pit Walkers (Though you'll pardon me if I continue believing that the two prior example were MUCH more well done than the pit gag) it just wouldn't be TWD. Strange situations Walkers are found in is a staple of the show. They clue you in to that right out the gate with Bicycle Walker. HOWEVER, that doesn't mean if they're going for a kill/kills gag that they don't have a responsibility to set it up well. I really didn't mind the "Reach in the throat and tear" kill...I could see an enraged man protecting an icon/personification of his lost little girl plunging his hand into a half-rotted throat and while probably not SEVER the spinal column structurally, twist and break it enough to sever the cord. On the other hand, despite being a cool visual I wouldn't care for it if anatomically unfeasible kills became commonplace. As a one-off gag it's nothing to get worked up over...I mean c'mon, we accept Michonne's "Katana = Lightsaber" action all the time anymore. Ridiculous stuff, like sheering the front half of a skull as cleanly as a bone saw with one off-hand stroke, and the endless #'s of seemingly effortless decapitations and amputations. Zombie killing in TWD falls into a few subtle sub-categories that are employed as the needs of the story...but (more importantly, whether one likes it or not), the need to make the show something the 18-34 Male crowd continues faithfully tuning in to watch will at times trump realism. The ONE "real" gripe I have related to the topic of zombie-kills in TWD is this: Their use of failed attempts to terminate a Walker by this or that character seemingly on a basis of "realism" ONLY being employed as a mechanism to ratchet up the tension/danger level of a scene. (Such as Carol getting her blade stuck in the Walker's skull when she was outside trying to clear the muck out of the water-tube.) No problem with the mechanism, EXCEPT I'd like to see it happen now and then to a character when a) It doesn't neatly serve the plot's needs at that moment in a fits-like-a-glove way, and b) When it has nothing to do with increased jeopardy to a character. A perfect example of what I'm talking about would be Daryl shooting a Walker in the forehead with his crossbow and the bolt not going deep enough to do the job. Wouldn't automatically place Daryl in grave jeopardy, wouldn't feel contrived, and would add to the grit-level of the show on a realism basis. However, I'll concede that this is a minor gripe in the big-picture view. TWD has always embraced the Trenchcoating Katana-wielder model of commonly occurring Survival Horror tropes, that's just something one has to accept because it's never going away. The fact they realize Walker-kills in a more "realistic" way the majority of the time is something to celebrate when one considers the full spectrum of nauseatingly cheesy and just downright done-to-death kill gags that litter the genre. Hell, at least no one is pouring cut-in-half dimes down saw-offed shotgun barrels, which magically stay in place as if gripped by magnetism until the protagonist wants to fire despite being carried in barrel-pointing-down-type holsters in TWD. (Just thought I'd toss in a bit of perspective there)

[MinionZombie]

Lazy writing? C'mon dude just stop watching already. The Governor killing those walkers by hand was fresh and awesome. This episode was full of interesting things to talk about and still, some of you continue with these dumb ass logic complaints. So negative at every chance possible. Agreed. Kills/gags are a staple of the genre. Occasionally the story has to suffer to set up a gag but it has to be there. Personally, I'm extremely impressed with the originality of the gags this season. Great stuff Agreed with both ye lads on both counts, yarrrr... *ahem* Pirate mode off... Just seeing a bunch of head-stabs or head-shots would get lame very quickly if that was all we got. Same with how they crop up in places. Season 4 has really stretched itself to bring in new scenarios and threats (ceiling walkers, kudzu walkers, pit walkers, tree walker, fence walkers, mah-hoo-sive herds, etc). Also, just maybe, the Governor doesn't have a knife - perhaps he lost it, buried in a walker's skull, and with more coming at him he just had to leave it (remember when Carol nearly got munched when her machete-type deeley got lodged in that walker's noggin when she was clearing out the water hose?) ... three head stabs would have been meh, done before, seen it already ... what we got I've never seen before (tearing a head open with a feckin' bone! ) and lovely gloopy practical blood effects (the throat rip is exactly why it's best to go real if you can).

[AcesandEights]

Lazy writing? C'mon dude just stop watching already. The Governor killing those walkers by hand was fresh and awesome. I think it's pretty fair to call the whole scene from where the Governor takes his surrogate family on the road to his pit and pummel pretty lazy as it both leans too heavily on writer fiat while simultaneously bending the preexisting rules of the story's setting and common sense. That said, the writing as it pertains to the Governor and his meet up with the family was compelling enough, and it was overall a decent episode. Kills/gags are a staple of the genre. Occasionally the story has to suffer to set up a gag but it has to be there. Personally, I'm extremely impressed with the originality of the gags this season. Great stuff This is a bit more balanced of a view overall...we'll always have to accept certain genre staples, like zombies can bite through denim and often even leather, for example, and new situations like zeds dropping through the roof really do bring a cool factor. I'm still not looking for too much reality bending lunacy in TWD, though. But where people draw lines about cool and eyerolling is going to differ. Just seeing a bunch of head-stabs or head-shots would get lame very quickly if that was all we got. Well, I'm sure you and Dave Navarro would both agree on how totally awesome the Gov's throat rip and bone scrape kills were. ... Was that too low a blow? Plus, you guys need to open your eyes and see what's coming down the pipe--this whole Governor story arc is a complete rip off of...Road House. Let me say that again for the sake of reading comprehension: they are rehashing the storyline from Road House. -A new stranger saunters into town -He's a man with a past he's not entirely at peace with -There's some bad elements in town making it rough for the locals -He makes a star crossed connection with a lovely lady -There's an evil bad guy & petty thugs threatening the people the Stranger has just met -and perhaps most damning of all...   the throat rip Admit it, I just blew your minds.

[Moon Knight]

Mind blown.

[blind2d]

Heh, Road House... Yeah, true. But still, good ep. I liked all the kills. They were believable and engaging, which is the most important thing, I feel. She's a lesbian? Oh, no wonder she's the tough one then! Good job propagating stereotypes, guys. Meh, we'll see where this goes.

[Andy]

Heh, Road House... Yeah, true. But still, good ep. I liked all the kills. They were believable and engaging, which is the most important thing, I feel. She's a lesbian? Oh, no wonder she's the tough one then! Good job propagating stereotypes, guys. Meh, we'll see where this goes. Think their reusing the "rule of one" from season 3 but with lesbians now instead of black people? Carol leaves so a younger one is brought in, and will be killed just in time for carol's return

[Neil]

Think their reusing the "rule of one" from season 3 but with lesbians now instead of black people? Carol leaves so a younger one is brought in, and will be killed just in time for carol's return Carol was not a todger dodger!

[MinionZombie]

Well, I'm sure you and Dave Navarro would both agree on how totally awesome the Gov's throat rip and bone scrape kills were. Was that too low a blow? T-Dog is not amused. Cheeky fecker, Aces. Who was a worse Talking Dead guest - Dave Navarro or Marilyn Manson? Plus, you guys need to open your eyes and see what's coming down the pipe--this whole Governor story arc is a complete rip off of...Road House. Admit it, I just blew your minds. ROAD HOUSE! So not only is The Walking Dead a re-telling of Toy Story, it's now a re-telling of Road House. What next ... Back to the Future? I wonder what that would be like... Think their reusing the "rule of one" from season 3 but with lesbians now instead of black people? Carol leaves so a younger one is brought in, and will be killed just in time for carol's return - - - Updated - - - Carol was not a todger dodger! I've never heard that one before.

[babomb]

To clarify, I don't have a problem with the walker kills or gags at all. I know they're a staple and I wouldn't want them gone, it's not the kills/gags I have issue with. It's the setup for them as with the pit walkers. I think they could've come up with a better way to show those kills without abandoning logic.