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Thread: TWD 5x01 "No Sanctuary" episode discussion (Season 5 Premiere)... **SPOILERS WITHIN**

  1. #16
    Just Married AcesandEights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by facestabber View Post
    On to Rick. Rick is my guy and always will be my guy. I see myself in his character that why I relate. Im gonna say something that should bring Wylde out of hiding........Shane was right. Hahahaha. There is no denying that Shane saw the world for what it was faster than the group.
    Nah, Shane's escalation was out of order with his surroundings. Some may say he was "ahead of his time", but the reality is that he was only ahead in so much as racing past the point of no return. With little reluctance to murder to further very selfish ambitions, or out of fear, Shane's parallel to Rick so far is weak at best. In fact, Shane has more in common with several of the worst cases we've seen...all of them had "excuses".

    "Men choose as their prophets those who tell them that their hopes are true." --Lord Dunsany

  2. #17
    Walking Dead Legion2213's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AcesandEights View Post
    Nah, Shane's escalation was out of order with his surroundings. Some may say he was "ahead of his time", but the reality is that he was only ahead in so much as racing past the point of no return. With little reluctance to murder to further very selfish ambitions, or out of fear, Shane's parallel to Rick so far is weak at best. In fact, Shane has more in common with several of the worst cases we've seen...all of them had "excuses".
    Aye, if Shane had been exiled or run off, he would probably have fitted in well at Terminus...the guy was warped.

    Turn your back on Shane or the Governor in the world of TWD and it would be your last mistake...both were prone to killing without thinking or much remorse.

    Oh, and do we think Tyrese beat that punk to death with his bare hands?
    Last edited by Legion2213; 13-Oct-2014 at 04:29 PM. Reason: .
    Oblivion gallops closer, favoring the spur, sparing the rein - I think we will be gone soon

  3. #18
    Just Married AcesandEights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legion2213 View Post

    Oh, and do we think Tyrese beat that punk to death with his bare hands?
    Oh, yeah.

    Don't get Tyrese angry about having to kill people to survive...or he might just kill your ass.

    "Men choose as their prophets those who tell them that their hopes are true." --Lord Dunsany

  4. #19
    Team Rick MinionZombie's Avatar
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    Aye - as Bassman has said, I think part of the reason for Carol 'walker-ing up' was to disguise herself from the Termites just as much as the walkers. It's a slightly iffy rule, but it's been established enough that is got a solid enough grounding ... even if it is a bit iffy as a concept.

    Something I noticed - the guy who Glenn releases from the container has drawings/tattoos on his face, one of which is a circle with an "X" inside it, just like the ones Morgan seens carved into the trees. What's that about? Also, from the videos AMC posts online after each episode, they said that the guy Glenn releases is the same guy who (during the last Terminus flashback in the episode) comes to the train car and takes a girl for nefarious reasons.

    As to whether Tyreese killed the guy in the cabin? We don't know for sure - we never see him dead - and in TWD land that's as good as saying the person is still alive and just unconscious.

    And, as I always do (tagged them so they don't take up a ton of space all the time)...

    TWD 5x01 Memes:
    http://deadshed.blogspot.co.uk/2014/...n-walking.html
     























  5. #20
    Walking Dead Legion2213's Avatar
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    Jesus. The still of that propane 'splosion is fucking ridiculous...I love you, Carol (especially when you are camoed up..ya kinda cute).

    Oh, ghost of the governor...suh-weet!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by MinionZombie View Post
    As to whether Tyreese killed the guy in the cabin? We don't know for sure - we never see him dead - and in TWD land that's as good as saying the person is still alive and just unconscious.
    Legs busted up by the hammer of justice, hands tied, gagged and waiting to be found by a peckish walker...I hope.

    Damn! it's sinking in even more...what a fantastic episode!
    Last edited by Legion2213; 13-Oct-2014 at 05:13 PM. Reason: .
    Oblivion gallops closer, favoring the spur, sparing the rein - I think we will be gone soon

  6. #21
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    so apparently i'm not the only one with this thought, but wouldn't it be too damn clever if, during the "then" sequence, the guy who told the captured terminite that no, things wouldn't be okay, then proceeded to bust one of them with a flashlight, was actually

     
    negan?

    http://www.cinemablend.com/televisio...gan-67813.html

    while i'm highly skeptical, it certainly could have been him, though like the article says, i really don't want them to hurry up and get the next big-bad. maybe introducing him right at the end of the season and revealing it was his gang that terrorized terminus before rick and his crew were led there....


    re: eugene and the cure

     
    man, i really don't like this plot-line at all, not sure if it's how corny rosita, abraham, and especially eugene with his mullet hair-do and asperger's ramblings come off (i think someone on this site even mentioned the word "cosplay" when discussing their appearence when they first appeared) or maybe something else, like how different the show even feels when they mention a "cure". i really hope they drop this whole "herp-derp let's go to WASHINGTON!!!!!" motive once eugene is exposed as the fraud he is......and i really hope they don't put that reveal off till the mid-season finale.

  7. #22
    Walking Dead Legion2213's Avatar
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    Regarding your 2nd point...I generally forget about that storyline about a second after it has been mentioned...it really doesn't grab me either, I'd prefer it if they'd just introduced that group as another road crew/survivor outfit. The only one worth having is the military guy, and even he isn't really very interesting.

     
    is mullet-boys story really BS?


    Edit: another random observation...Bob Stookie dual-wielding machete's...awesome!
    Last edited by Legion2213; 13-Oct-2014 at 05:44 PM. Reason: .
    Oblivion gallops closer, favoring the spur, sparing the rein - I think we will be gone soon

  8. #23
    Team Rick MinionZombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ProfessorChaos View Post
    so apparently i'm not the only one with this thought, but wouldn't it be too damn clever if, during the "then" sequence, the guy who told the captured terminite that no, things wouldn't be okay, then proceeded to bust one of them with a flashlight, was actually

     
    negan?

    http://www.cinemablend.com/televisio...gan-67813.html

    while i'm highly skeptical, it certainly could have been him, though like the article says, i really don't want them to hurry up and get the next big-bad. maybe introducing him right at the end of the season and revealing it was his gang that terrorized terminus before rick and his crew were led there....
    Gimple has spoken on this theory:

     
    It's not Negan. Too soon for him anyway. Indeed, the guy who whacks Gareth with a torch inside the train car is the same guy as the crazy bearded dude Glenn lets go from that container ... although if they'd never said that in interviews I'd have never known it was the same geezer!



  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by AcesandEights View Post
    Nah, Shane's escalation was out of order with his surroundings. Some may say he was "ahead of his time", but the reality is that he was only ahead in so much as racing past the point of no return. With little reluctance to murder to further very selfish ambitions, or out of fear, Shane's parallel to Rick so far is weak at best. In fact, Shane has more in common with several of the worst cases we've seen...all of them had "excuses".
    I hear ya. Shane was a mental case for sure. And I would not confuse the motives of Shane and Rick because they are different. Rick isnt just worried about self preservation but the love of his family and extended family. Shane was selfish and had an unhealthy affixiation on Lori. Shane only offered protection to others in the group, other than Lori/Carl, out of the coincidence that they were merely present. Shane wouldnt shed many tears for the majority of the group if they died but it would affect Rick because thats just who he is. Now Rick has evolved and is now opened up to the cold brutality that is needed to survive that Shane demonstrated. So I definitly see some parallel. Todays Rick wouldnt be concerned with rescuing Randle from that impalement. An innocent person, maybe but not a person that just shot at you.

  10. #25
    Twitching
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    Shane *WAS* right,
    Civilization is gone, a fact underscored by everything we know about how people react psychologically in protracted disaster situations. What Shane was wrong about was as Facestabber said, his obsession with Lori. Which is what propelled him on the trajectory to try and kill Rick. But as for the world-at-large view Shane held? Spot on. Rick is finally "getting it"...and despite having no experience with the comics I believe the group will have cause in the future to regret rejecting Rick's plan to go back and wipe out what remained of those cannibalistic animals.

    Carol's method of killing the woman was PERFECT. In her shoes I'd like to believe I'd do the same thing. That woman was part of a group that has committed unspeakable atrocities...they're spiders sitting at the center of their Web, Terminus, waiting for prey to be lured in by promises of what everyone in that world longs for. Death-by-bullet would have been too clean. She ate people, she deserved being devoured alive.

    I felt NO sympathy for the Terminians. They used the depravity of others as an excuse to abandon their own humanity completely. Had they retaken Terminus and then posted No Trespassing on Pain of Death signs throughout their territory, the story would be completely different. The guy that forced Tyreese outside with the Walkers by threatening to snap Judith's neck emphasizes just how far gone, and unrepentantly so, the Terminians are.

    Looking out for you and yours first, last and always? Totally justified. Using looking out for your own as a justification to perpetrate the horrors the Terminians have is perverse and fundamentally wrong. As I said, had they become vehemently xenophobic and done everything they could to keep from interacting with other survivors, THAT would have been an understandable and even moral stance.

    Using hope as a weapon in a world almost completely devoid of hope is monstrous, and I believe every single Terminian deserves to die for that alone. That's without even touching on how they've taken to cannibalism with such abandon. Gareth is evil, through and through.

    Like many others I really enjoyed seeing Carol ride to the rescue of the group...and it was rather poetic that she used the means by which they lost the Prison to bring death to Terminus. If you showed me ten year olds belonging to Terminians being eaten I wouldn't think twice. The moral rot of the Terminus inhabitants is so all-encompassing that the only sane response to it is to kill all those who have allowed such rot to corrupt their hearts and minds. Some might say "They're kids, they're innocent." To which I would reply look at the Terminus motto. Those people are indoctrinated...probably as early as they can understand such concepts.

    The thing Shane had right was you don't put people you love/care about in danger because your old-world-morality says you should give the shady stranger the benefit of the doubt (for example). In the past Rick made many decisions that put numerous members of the group in harm's way so he could retain his moral code. As a leader others look to, one whose accepted said leadership has a responsibility to the safety of their group that outweighs other moral concerns.

    Look at one of the last times the survivors as a whole took the moral high road. The Governor's 1st invasion of the Prison. Had they gunned down those invaders that would have included the Governor. With major # of Walkers coming for them, the invaders were forced into the open. Had the Governor died then Herschel would still be alive, hell MERLE would still be alive. They let the Governor live to fight another day, and it cost lives. A leader in a post-apocalyptic world doesn't have the LUXURY of morality beyond the good of their group. If someone new comes along and wants to join, if they're thoroughly vetted and the group agrees let them join. Don't go out of your way to harm other humans (unless they've previously attacked you), but be ready to defend you and yours with extreme prejudice.

    Shane was right, but in his case for the wrong reasons mainly. He understood that holding fast to old-world morality was denying the reality they inhabit. Still, he WAS right about many things. The reality is that the vast majority of survivors in a zombie apocalypse would be very clannish and uncaring towards outsiders at best, like the Terminus people at worst. Knowing so many people are going to throw away any semblance of morality once the social mechanisms that deter antisocial behavior are gone means bringing old-world morality to a post-apocalyptic encounter is the moral equivalent of bringing a knife to a gunfight.

  11. #26
    Just been bitten DayoftheZ's Avatar
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    Solid episode and there seems to be plenty of threats for our group now.

    Gareth is clearly still about as are some termites, we have the gunshots that started the termites decline these could be a threat. We know Beth has been taken and that group could be a threat. Add this to the walkers and we have lots of bum clenching scares to come!!

    Edit:- Judging by the plants growing on the "No Sanctuary" sign when Morgan gets there it would seem he is a good few weeks behind the group, perhaps opening him up to "doing a Carol" and saving them against a new threat.
    Last edited by DayoftheZ; 13-Oct-2014 at 10:00 PM. Reason: Additional Thoughts

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bassman View Post
    I've always been of the opinion that the whole "smell" thing was just a theory and the characters were actually just moving along with the walkers because they weren't acting like panicking humans.
    Yeh, that's the way I have to take it.

    Otherwise, I'd be hopping onto the first plane to Georgia and going ballistic.
    I'm runnin' this monkey farm now Frankenstein.....

  13. #28
    Just been bitten Morto Vivente's Avatar
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    Fantastic start to the season. Did anyone else recognize the first victim that had their throat slit (the young blonde guy Sam from 4x04, who Rick and Carol meet while scavenging).
    The look of recognition between him and Rick was a nice touch.
    Come on Robin, to the Bat Cave! There's not a moment to lose!

  14. #29
    Webmaster Neil's Avatar
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    Good episode! Love the brutality of the survivors being killed etc, although the perfect ordering of them at the trough was a tad annoying; The two guys "done" first were practically in red Star Trek tops

    Also the most accurate firework in the world was a tad silly

    But a great first episode!


    Quote Originally Posted by AcesandEights View Post
    I was kind of wondering how much people might bitch about the use of the walker blood and gore element again. I know it rubbed some people the wrong way last time and I almost pictured Shootem or Ned groaning and smacking their foreheads as they watched that scene.
    The only thing that bugged be was how she obviously had enough time to chuck in a quick shower and change of clothes before she met up with the group!
    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
    -Carl Sagan

  15. #30
    Desiderata Satanicus Andy's Avatar
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    It occured to me watching this episode last night.. (possible comic spoiler ahead)

     
    Does anybody else think Andrea and Carole have switched roles from their comic book characters? I mean like in the comics, andrea is badass and saves rick and the group several times where as carol is a lonely weak person who commits suicide becuase she feels rejected by the group.. In the TV carol has turned badass and saves rick and the group twice so far to my mind.. and Andrea was kidna the desperate loner rejected by the group who ultimately died for it.

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