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Thread: TWD 8x04 "Some Guy" episode discussion... **SPOILERS*

  1. #16
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    Yeah I agree about the 50. Cal. Should have ripped through the vehicle but oh well. The Jeep looks like it came from the Savior compound they just came from. All of their own vehicles had the armor plating on it with the exception of Daryl of course.
    "That's the deal, right? The people who are living have it harder, right? … the whole world is haunted now and there's no getting out of that, not until we're dead."

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    Yeah I agree about the 50. Cal. Should have ripped through the vehicle but oh well. The Jeep looks like it came from the Savior compound they just came from. All of their own vehicles had the armor plating on it with the exception of Daryl of course.
    Seeing as this is the apocalypse, and the Saviors are constantly butting heads with other groups, it would have been hardly surprising if some of their vehicles were also fitted with improvised armor. So this is another example of lazy writing. They could easily have made the jeep that Rick commandeered to also have some armor plating, including at the front. That would have made it more believable that it could have withstood several .50 caliber bullet impacts directly on its engine area and still remain operational long enough to allow Rick to catch up with the truck.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    Seeing as this is the apocalypse, and the Saviors are constantly butting heads with other groups, it would have been hardly surprising if some of their vehicles were also fitted with improvised armor. So this is another example of lazy writing. They could easily have made the jeep that Rick commandeered to also have some armor plating, including at the front. That would have made it more believable that it could have withstood several .50 caliber bullet impacts directly on its engine area and still remain operational long enough to allow Rick to catch up with the truck.
    How is that lazy writing? I disagree. Both groups are gonna one up eachoter and one group not using a similar strategy isn’t considered lazy writing imo.

    Lazy writing for me is how they treat wounds. People can get shot, stabbed, ect, and never really sell it after. People heal super quickly. For example, I really don’t get why Michonne wasn’t wearing and bandages on her face or the lack of bruises after her beating at the hands of that one Scrapper during 7x16. Consistency has always been my biggest pet peeve with the show.

    Character flaws will never be considered lazy writing for me unless they write in something that is completely out of character.
    "That's the deal, right? The people who are living have it harder, right? … the whole world is haunted now and there's no getting out of that, not until we're dead."

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    You didn’t like Shiva?
    Stuck out like blow up penis at a meeting of the Sisters of the Immaculate Conception.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by MinionZombie View Post
    Awww ... I really liked Shiva. - Although it was absolutely the right time for her to go narratively speaking.
    I dunno if it's around still in the comics. But for the TV show, yeh, it had to go. Everytime she appeared on screen, it just shattered the realism. It was well done in some cases. But, too often it just looked off.

    Quote Originally Posted by MinionZombie View Post
    Carol - aye - the lady rocks! And McBride's performance has been stellar since season one.
    Easily the best TWD character bar none in my book. The one character arc (<- I hate these film school drop out terms) that's been compelling an satisfying.
    I'm runnin' this monkey farm now Frankenstein.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    How is that lazy writing? I disagree. Both groups are gonna one up eachoter and one group not using a similar strategy isn’t considered lazy writing imo.

    Lazy writing for me is how they treat wounds. People can get shot, stabbed, ect, and never really sell it after. People heal super quickly. For example, I really don’t get why Michonne wasn’t wearing and bandages on her face or the lack of bruises after her beating at the hands of that one Scrapper during 7x16. Consistency has always been my biggest pet peeve with the show.

    Character flaws will never be considered lazy writing for me unless they write in something that is completely out of character.
    It's lazy writing because it is not that difficult to fix, yet they did not, like if they just don't feel like it. Is it so difficult to have had Rick commandeer a jeep that happens to be armored? Or have the Savior shoot Rick's jeep with a smaller caliber gun that would not have caused massive damage on its engine? Instead they just left "as is" and made the whole scene very difficult to digest.
    Last edited by JDP; 5 Days Ago at 09:58 PM. Reason: ;

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    Yeah I agree about the 50. Cal. Should have ripped through the vehicle but oh well. The Jeep looks like it came from the Savior compound they just came from. All of their own vehicles had the armor plating on it with the exception of Daryl of course.
    They can hit dozens of people running around wildly from 200 yards away like a sniper... But not two blokes weaving 10ft left and right slowly just 50 yards away?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    It's lazy writing because it is not that difficult to fix, yet they did not, like if they just don't feel like it. Is it so difficult to have had Rick commandeer a jeep that happens to be armored? Or have the Savior shoot Rick's jeep with a smaller caliber gun that would not have caused massive damage on its engine? Instead they just left "as is" and made the whole scene very difficult to digest.
    Agreed... Like when the were putting the gun in the truck, and Carol come out needlessly to expose herself instead of just shooting covered from where she was? It's just feeling more and more contrived

    And if she'd simply just layed down and looked and shot the two remaining Saviours legs when they were at the front of the truck?
    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    It's lazy writing because it is not that difficult to fix, yet they did not, like if they just don't feel like it. Is it so difficult to have had Rick commandeer a jeep that happens to be armored? Or have the Savior shoot Rick's jeep with a smaller caliber gun that would not have caused massive damage on its engine? Instead they just left "as is" and made the whole scene very difficult to digest.
    It didn’t bother me. It’s not perfect but it didn’t ruin it for me. The episode still accomplished what it had to and was pretty damn good.
    "That's the deal, right? The people who are living have it harder, right? … the whole world is haunted now and there's no getting out of that, not until we're dead."

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    Lazy writing for me is how they treat wounds. People can get shot, stabbed, ect, and never really sell it after. People heal super quickly. For example, I really don’t get why Michonne wasn’t wearing and bandages on her face or the lack of bruises after her beating at the hands of that one Scrapper during 7x16. Consistency has always been my biggest pet peeve with the show.
    The wounds thing has always been a genre "problem" - people get shot and keep on fighting - however, as we've seen with Rosita, she's sitting out the fight because of her wound (and, presumably, scheduling problems! ) If characters in genre fare reacted to violence like real people do in real life, the fights would be over in seconds. The Raid would be a short friggin' movie, that's for sure! But, as another example - look at Rick's recovery from the fight with The Governor in Season 4. He was messed up and it took seveal episodes for him to recover - he almost died of his injuries in 4x09 (one of the finest episodes we've had). I'd also note that we've had consistent scarring to Rick's face in the last few seasons since.

    Something has to give at some point, and you've got to keep the story driving forward. Having to be completely realistic about injuries (in a show where friggin' zombies exist!) causes all sorts of problems for steering the ship. A gun opens fire on a group - someone's gonna get shot - but you can't halt the entire story just for that. Sometimes it can become the story, like in this episode where Ezekiel's leg wound became part of the drama and his unfolding character arc in the episode.

    Quote Originally Posted by shootemindehead View Post
    Stuck out like blow up penis at a meeting of the Sisters of the Immaculate Conception.

    I dunno if it's around still in the comics. But for the TV show, yeh, it had to go. Everytime she appeared on screen, it just shattered the realism. It was well done in some cases. But, too often it just looked off.

    Easily the best TWD character bar none in my book. The one character arc (<- I hate these film school drop out terms) that's been compelling an satisfying.
    1)
    2)
     
    Shiva died a long time ago in the comics. The events of this episode were honouring that death.

    3) It's not "film school drop out" lingo - it's just what it's called, and an accurate descriptor of its function. ... I'd also proffer numerous other character arcs that have been mighty satisfying (Rick, Shane, Daryl, Maggie, etc).

    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    It's lazy writing because it is not that difficult to fix, yet they did not, like if they just don't feel like it. Is it so difficult to have had Rick commandeer a jeep that happens to be armored? Or have the Savior shoot Rick's jeep with a smaller caliber gun that would not have caused massive damage on its engine? Instead they just left "as is" and made the whole scene very difficult to digest.
    Have you written a screenplay? Like everything else on this planet, it's harder than it looks. You've got so many things you need to achieve within a certain amount of pages and, on a show like TWD, you've also got to service episodes that came before and are coming up. It's hard to see the forest for the trees when you're nose-close to what you're writing ... which is why it'd be cool if they could hire someone whose specific job was to look at the scripts just before they were ready to be signed off to go onto the next stage and look for any little tweaks that could help sell a certain moment (e.g. having Negan use human shields and some solid cover in 8x01 instead of being so brazen to be less distracting to those who didn't pick up on certain details in the dialogue). It's incredibly difficult to hit every single detail spot-on within a certain amount of time - these writers don't have years or months to craft and fine tune their screenplays, they've got a matter of weeks to go from a blank page to a fully finished script that's ready to go to the production crew, while also being involved in mapping out fifteen other episodes.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinionZombie View Post
    Have you written a screenplay? Like everything else on this planet, it's harder than it looks. You've got so many things you need to achieve within a certain amount of pages and, on a show like TWD, you've also got to service episodes that came before and are coming up. It's hard to see the forest for the trees when you're nose-close to what you're writing ... which is why it'd be cool if they could hire someone whose specific job was to look at the scripts just before they were ready to be signed off to go onto the next stage and look for any little tweaks that could help sell a certain moment (e.g. having Negan use human shields and some solid cover in 8x01 instead of being so brazen to be less distracting to those who didn't pick up on certain details in the dialogue). It's incredibly difficult to hit every single detail spot-on within a certain amount of time - these writers don't have years or months to craft and fine tune their screenplays, they've got a matter of weeks to go from a blank page to a fully finished script that's ready to go to the production crew, while also being involved in mapping out fifteen other episodes.
    What you are pointing out is valid for smaller details, but not so much when it comes to important ones that have more relevancy for the plot. In this case, it is necessary that Rick's vehicle remains operational long enough to catch up with the truck. If that doesn't happen the events will unfold quite differently. Therefore it is not an element of the story that can be taken lightly. In order to make the audience be able to accept Rick catching up and stopping the truck, you have to try to make it at least somewhat believable. Can you imagine Rick himself or any other human getting hit by a .50 caliber bullet and somehow surviving? No, right, nobody would swallow that one. Well, it is pretty much the same thing with a jeep's engine getting hit several times with the same brutal rounds. So this is an important detail for the plot that needed to be written in a manner that the audience could at least accept as "possible".
    Last edited by JDP; 5 Days Ago at 02:02 PM. Reason: ;

  10. #25
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    Concerning the wounds, I get more annoyed with the easy stuff, like I had pointed out, Michonne could have easily been wearing bandages at least. Compare her face from 7x16 to how she appeared in 8x1. I’m assuming not much time has passed because she sat out the attack with Rosita due to how she felt.
    "That's the deal, right? The people who are living have it harder, right? … the whole world is haunted now and there's no getting out of that, not until we're dead."

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    Concerning the wounds, I get more annoyed with the easy stuff, like I had pointed out, Michonne could have easily been wearing bandages at least. Compare her face from 7x16 to how she appeared in 8x1. I’m assuming not much time has passed because she sat out the attack with Rosita due to how she felt.
    I hadn't noticed it personally - but then again I've not seen 7x16 since it originally aired. Some of these things are a bit unclear at times - how much time has passed and such - but it can't have been all that long (you wouldn't want Negan to get too prepared), but then again they too would have had to hatch a whole plan of action (get those vehicles armoured, place the bombs to help lead the herd). It might have been a few days ... but if it has, there might be a worry of getting the drop fallen on you from the bad guys, if that makes sense? Then again, the Saviours needed to sort their end out as well. There's a period of mobilisation, I suppose. It'd be nice to have some of that stuff made a little clearer in the episodes - but, space on the script page is at a premium when you've got so much going on, when there's so many things you need to cover. Sometimes things might be in the script but then have to get cut for time.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinionZombie View Post
    I hadn't noticed it personally - but then again I've not seen 7x16 since it originally aired. Some of these things are a bit unclear at times - how much time has passed and such - but it can't have been all that long (you wouldn't want Negan to get too prepared), but then again they too would have had to hatch a whole plan of action (get those vehicles armoured, place the bombs to help lead the herd). It might have been a few days ... but if it has, there might be a worry of getting the drop fallen on you from the bad guys, if that makes sense? Then again, the Saviours needed to sort their end out as well. There's a period of mobilisation, I suppose. It'd be nice to have some of that stuff made a little clearer in the episodes - but, space on the script page is at a premium when you've got so much going on, when there's so many things you need to cover. Sometimes things might be in the script but then have to get cut for time.
    Fair enough but for the love of Jesus Paul Rovia get some bandaids on that woman’s face!

    Comic comparison below.

     
    Comic Andrea caught that beat down instead and in the same exact scene portrayed in the show, where Michonne told Carl “This is your show now”, Andrea had bandages all over her face like Rick had after his fight with Pete.
    "That's the deal, right? The people who are living have it harder, right? … the whole world is haunted now and there's no getting out of that, not until we're dead."

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    Fair enough but for the love of Jesus Paul Rovia get some bandaids on that woman’s face!

    Comic comparison below.

     
    Comic Andrea caught that beat down instead and in the same exact scene portrayed in the show, where Michonne told Carl “This is your show now”, Andrea had bandages all over her face like Rick had after his fight with Pete.
    Like I say, I'd have to re-watch it again for my own benefit, but I agree with you on the continuity principal. Re-watching that bit with Michonne in 8x01 ... yeah, she doesn't look much like she's been in a fight at all (brutal or otherwise)! I wonder what went on there with the make-up?

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinionZombie View Post
    Like I say, I'd have to re-watch it again for my own benefit, but I agree with you on the continuity principal. Re-watching that bit with Michonne in 8x01 ... yeah, she doesn't look much like she's been in a fight at all (brutal or otherwise)! I wonder what went on there with the make-up?
    Yeah, dude, her face was pretty banged up. Busted lip and severely swollen eye; she looked like the Toxic Avenger.
    "That's the deal, right? The people who are living have it harder, right? … the whole world is haunted now and there's no getting out of that, not until we're dead."

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Knight View Post
    Yeah, dude, her face was pretty banged up. Busted lip and severely swollen eye; she looked like the Toxic Avenger.
    Maybe they could have stuck her in a ropey old tutu and replaced the katana with a mop to help distract from the curious lack of continuity to the wounds. Very puzzling - especially on a show famed for it's superb make-up effects! I wonder if any reasons will be revealed on the commentary once the home video release comes out...
    Last edited by MinionZombie; 3 Days Ago at 07:07 PM.

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