Popular Mechanics vs. Loose Change?

[EvilNed]

I missed this debate when it aired a few months ago. But I found this transcript, and I find it immensly interesting how idiotic the Loose Change guys appear to be. Their "We're right, and you're wrong" attitude is just laughable. Belongs in the kindergarten.

http://www.democracynow.org/2006/9/11/exclusive_9_11_debate_loose_change

My favourite quote:


DYLAN AVERY: Well, real quick, I just want to jump in and say, Kevin Ryan has been open about his statement. He has always been public about the fact that he worked for the—I don’t remember the exact name, but it was a subdivision of Underwriters Laboratories, which did water testing. But it was the fact that he got the higher-up from—he got the word from his higher-ups that they actually had certified the steel and, I mean, his science still adds up.

DAVID DUNBAR: In fact, Underwriter Laboratories does not certify structural steel.

DYLAN AVERY: Oh, okay.

[MinionZombie]

God those Loose Change douchebags piss me off...numpties! :annoyed:

[Bruiser235]

Yeah, I watched that debate when it was on. That's the way angry leftists are. "I'm right. You're Wrong". Just as bad as angry rightists.

The Loose Change guys were being calmly and methodically taken apart and they just sat there and lost it. I loved watching them squirm.

[DubiousComforts]

Yeah, I watched that debate when it was on. That's the way angry leftists are. "I'm right. You're Wrong". Just as bad as angry rightists.
I'm not familiar with the Loose Change debate, but right/left or right/wrong the official account still doesn't add up, and neither did the Popular Mechanics article or cable TV documentary that I did see.

[Mike70]

i love seeing nuts like this get exposed in public. these loose changes people are a bunch of very nasty people who are nowhere near as open minded as they pretend.

i love how right off the bat they accuse popular mechanics of being guilty of "hearst yellow journalism." hey if you can't rationally debate someone, call them names.

the loose change people couldn't even get basic facts straight.

there isn't a 9/11 conspiracy. it is a case of yet another bunch of yahoos who want to pretend they have access to secret knowledge and look like they are sticking it to the man.

as for the accounts not adding up - why should they? are people so literal and numb-minded that they think an event like this involving thousands of people in several different locations is going to be neatly explained with all the i's dotted and t's crossed. there is no way in hell that is ever going to happen. too many folks, too much information for everything to simplely line up in one convienient package for the mass consumption. some people realize this and accept it. some people realize this and see an opportunity to stir up the proles and get some attention for themselves with crazy, fantastical "conspiracy" theories.

sometimes conspiracies do happen - the assassinations of lincoln and caesar come to mind. but real conspiracies involve very small numbers of people acting in secrecy. the more people involved in a "conspiracy" the less likely it is to be consumated given the way that so many people like to flap their gums.

[DubiousComforts]

as for the accounts not adding up - why should they? are people so literal and numb-minded that they think an event like this involving thousands of people in several different locations is going to be neatly explained with all the i's dotted and t's crossed.
Yes, it should be able to be explained with a modicum of common sense and intelligence. Have you read the 9/11 Commission report? I don't believe anyone with a functioning brain can read it and be left without questions. How many millions did we pay for it?

Everyone claims that they have the answers--from the experts, to the conspiracy theorists, to the debunkers, to the debunkers of the debunkers, to you on this message board. So why are there so many questions?

[MinionZombie]

Because a ton & a half of crazy sh*t happened that day. Absolute chaos. Ever tried making perfect sense of chaos? Damn near impossible.

I don't believe in any of the 9/11 conspiracies, especially the Loose Change wank. I saw a BBC2 doc about 9/11 conspiracies and those douches were interviewed for it. You should have seen him and his mates on it, he was showing the camera crew around his house like he was on MTV Cribs, they were all wearing their hoodies advertising their stupid 'documentary'. The guy was a complete wanker, and the same 'yeah well, I'm still right' type arguments came from him. Absolutely infuriating that little sh*te is.

Also, I didn't watch it, but I listened to the MP3. Were those Loose Change bastards laughing at certain points throughout? For f*ck's sake, a shedload of people lost their lives that day and the world hasn't been the same since, and they're standing there like school kids with their hushed, mocking laughter. :mad:

[DubiousComforts]

Because a ton & a half of crazy sh*t happened that day. Absolute chaos. Ever tried making perfect sense of chaos? Damn near impossible.
It's not at all impossible if you believe the 9/11 official account: a covert network of 19 predominantly Saudi hijackers armed with box cutters took control of four airliners, crashing them into targets in New York and Washington DC. Seems a rather plain and simple explanation, and not the least bit chaotic, wouldn't you agree? You could have stopped thinking about it on 9/14 when the FBI-issued those 19 grim-faced photos. Case closed.

Now to any rational person, it's obvious that asking a question is not the same as proposing a theory, but apparently any questioning of the event outside of the official account has become akin to "conspiracy theory." The myth debunkers, Popular Mechanics, various media outlets, the current US administration, the President of the United States et al have made certain that dirty phrase--conspiracy theory--has become embedded in our collective conscious. Why just last week, an MSNBC newscaster "hoped" there is a secret prison* for all 9/11 conspiracy theorists. Given that sort of pressure, it's so much easier to not ask questions than be perceived as that "guy in the hoodie."

The problem is everyone that accepts the official story without question has already bought a "conspiracy theory." A covert network 19 Saudi hijackers armed with box cutters taking control of airliners--isn't that a text book definition of a "conspiracy"? And any account not backed up by evidence beyond a reasonable doubt (the standard evaluation of criminal investigation and prosecution in the US) becomes a "theory." Whoops.

Perhaps a bit more thought should be employed by the powers-that-be when coming up with the next all-inclusive catch phrase used to debunk the myths.


(*Isn't the existence of secret prisons in the United States considered "conspiracy theory"?)

[MinionZombie]

Ah but I said "perfect sense" ... there's sense with unexplained patches that can't be explained/chalked up to "sh*t happens", and then there's perfect sense, where very single aspect is answered beyond a shadow of doubt. :sneaky:

(that's just clarifying my previous post, not rubbing myself up and down a conspiracy theory ... just to clarify that too :D)