if this sint fake its ****ing monstrous

[Danny]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article3481977.ece

Puppy-toss video makes Marine figure of hate

US Marine has become the target of a massive internet hate campaign after a mobile phone video appearing to show him throwing a puppy off a cliff in Iraq became a viral hit.

Some 150,000 people watched the video in less than two days before it was taken down from the YouTube website this morning. More than 4,000 posted comments, overwhelmingly negative, although many questioned whether the dog was already dead.

The low-quality video shows two Marines in combat joking as one holds up what appears to be a motionless black and white puppy, which he then hurls into a rocky gully. A loud yelping sound is heard as it flies through the air.

Major Chris Perrine of the Marine Corps Base Hawaii says it appears the man is based with a unit in the islands. In a statement the Marines called the video "shocking and deplorable" and said it violates "the high standard we expect of every Marine".

The video is both blurred and shaky and it's virtually impossible to tell whether the puppy is alive or dead as it is held by the scruff of the neck by a Marine who shows it to the camera.

“Cute little puppy, huh?” the man says, smiling.

“Aww so cute, so cute, little puppy,” one of his comrade says.

“Uh, uh, uh, I tripped,” the man says before turning and throwing something into the air.

From offscreen, a man says “That’s mean. That’s mean, Motari.”

A number of US websites named the perpetrator as David Motari, a 22-year-old from Washington state who has recently returned from Iraq and is based in Hawaii. Mr Motari's profile on the social networking site Bebo was closed down yesterday.

Some sites posted his personal details, phone numbers and even a picture of his car, while other bloggers called for him to be ostracised. Others said that the video was simply bringing home the horrors of the Iraq war.

"If David Motari is the puppy killer, he is undoubtedly a sociopath who does not feel remorse or shame," wrote Mike on the Crime and Federalism weblog.

"After confirming him as the puppy killer, we must engage in an online campaign to ensure that everyone who does business with or associates with him is warned. The puppy had no choice; humans, through education, will."

Mr Motari's local newspaper, the Herald, reported that it had shown the video to veterinarians at Washington State University, but they could not confirm whether it was genuine or not.

"If this is something legitimate, it's one of the most egregious acts of animal cruelty I have ever seen, if not the most," said Dr Matt Mickas, chief of Community Practice Services at the university's veterinary college.

But Dr Mickas said that the video did not appear fake to him because of the way the animal went slack by being held from the neck.

"To me, the sound on the YouTube clip sounded like a puppy in distress - the same sound we hear when the puppies come into the hospital," he said.


Someone emailed me this video today and i was actually appauled,a dn thats rare for my low standards, is this really real do you think?
for those who havent seen it, i dont recommend it, it looks like a marine holds a not long bron puppy by the scruff and then hurls it 30 feet away and into a ravine.
i can understand if it was a poor taste joke, id probably find it funny, but if it is real thats one of the worst cases of animal curelty ive had the misfortune to see.

[Mike70]

that is totally f*cked. whether that dog was alive or dead that reveals the workings of an incredibly sick, sick mind.

i have seen some incredibly f'd up stuff in my life - including people being blown into little pieces and people being shot and killed (i was in somalia in 92-93 w/the 10th mountain div) but there is something ultra disturbing about this. to bring harm to anything so defenseless is well f(cking monstrous, as you said.

that guy ought to be hung up from a tree while the keebler elves beat him with sticks to see if they can knock the candy out of his ass.

it's scum like this that are representing my country???

ugh.

[MikePizzoff]

Ugh. There is something wrong with this asshole. I would like to have him show up at one of my parties. He could have a nice stomping followed by a weekend in jail.

[Chic Freak]

i have seen some incredibly f'd up stuff in my life - including people being blown into little pieces and people being shot and killed (i was in somalia in 92-93 w/the 10th mountain div) but there is something ultra disturbing about this. to bring harm to anything so defenseless is well f(cking monstrous, as you said.

Slightly OT, but it's cool that someone who's seen people being killed before their eyes hasn't just become desensitised to violence.


it's scum like this that are representing my country???

Aye... and no doubt someone will be using it as evidence of the overall crap-ness of American soldiers, and by extension, America itself :rolleyes: Unfair, but probably true.

[Danny]

Aye... and no doubt someone will be using it as evidence of the overall crap-ness of American soldiers, and by extension, America itself :rolleyes: Unfair, but probably true.


allready one persons uploaded it as "obama supporting soldier throws dog"

the subtlety is mindblowing:rolleyes:

[Marie]

We've looked into the abyss, we got preteens killing people over property they don't own and now young adults tossing puppies over cliffs, oh yea, don't forget the mistreatment of people in retirement homes....

M_

[Mike70]

Slightly OT, but it's cool that someone who's seen people being killed before their eyes hasn't just become desensitised to violence.



Aye... and no doubt someone will be using it as evidence of the overall crap-ness of American soldiers, and by extension, America itself :rolleyes: Unfair, but probably true.

i think that as soon as a person becomes desensitized to violence (note i am not talking about fictional violence, which hardly ever bothers me) they lose a big part of what makes them human. they lose the basic capability for understanding that others having feelings and fail to understand what basic rights and wrongs are.

i have no doubt that this will be held up as some example of how americans behave and that makes me sick too. i was speaking about this particular individual. for every soldier/marine that has acted like a total idiot in iraq (or anywhere else) there are 100 that have acted honorably and not forgotten what right and wrong are. unfortunately you only hear about the muttonbirds.

[Chic Freak]

unfortunately you only hear about the muttonbirds.

Yeah, it's always the way.

[Khardis]

Yeah the video pissed me off mightily... I would like to kick that guys ass into the ground. I just hate the fact that he was suited up as one of our soldiers because you'll have:

A: Die hard conservatives trying to excuse it as "stress relief from the battles he's fought etc"
B: Libtards who want to paint all soldiers as murderers and rapists because they despise the war and the military fighting it.

[DubiousComforts]

i have no doubt that this will be held up as some example of how americans behave and that makes me sick too. i was speaking about this particular individual. for every soldier/marine that has acted like a total idiot in iraq (or anywhere else) there are 100 that have acted honorably and not forgotten what right and wrong are. unfortunately you only hear about the muttonbirds.
It is how a majority of Americans behave, or believe is acceptable behavior. The food on most everyone's plate is raised in much the same way or worse--just recall what prompted the massive beef recall from last February--but do you see a massive public outcry as there has been over this single video? The incident apparently needs to involves a cute, little puppy in order for people to be horrified, while they could give a rat's butt about the condition of the animals that they put into their stomachs.

People can't pretend that that haven't been warned. Activists that have been trying to bring attention to these issues for decades have simply been labeled "anti-business," "communists" and "terrorists."

[SRP76]

The incident apparently needs to involves a cute, little puppy in order for people to be horrified, while they could give a rat's butt about the condition of the animals that they put into their stomachs.



I'm not horrified. There's worse than puppy-killing going on right down the block from your house as we speak, most likely. Only difference is that it probably won't end up on youtube.

[kortick]

You ae both right.

Dubious its true show a cute puppy being hurt
and its an uproar (not that i is right) but the animals
we use for food suffer horribly.
what did you think that cow had a heart attack and ended up
a steak on your plate.
and people say "well thats for food, this is just cruel"
yes, but the animals are treated so badly they are
not even fit for food and are recalled, so it is just cruelty.

and SRP, so much worse happens to children and it is never
put on you tube.

and this guy bieng in the millitary has nothing to do with it
I was at an outdoor party and this cat wandered by and this
drunk guy picked it up and tossed it over a cliff. it was so high i never
heard it hit the bottom.
So cant blame the millitary, a sick mind is a sick mind.

[strayrider]

If this is real it is not "monstrous". The puppy's right to life was not violated since animals do not have rights. It was not one of my dogs, so I can't claim outrage over the destruction of personal property. The soldiers in question, if found to have killed a dog, should be written up and warned not to do this again.

We're talking about the apparent death of an animal here, neither innocent or guilty, just an animal.

If this is a hoax, then the soldiers in question should be written up and warned not to do this again.

Personally, I think it's a hoax committed by young men who, as young men often do, went overboard with their humor. Tasteless, yes. Sick, no. The fact that they are representing our armed forces is all the more reason to write them up.

Don't get me wrong. I love my pets (5 cats, 2 dogs) just as much as you love yours (whatever they may be), but they're just animals, property.

-stray-

[Danny]

funny. id never put the words "love" and "property" together in a serious sentence, but thats just me.

[strayrider]

It is why we're called pet "owners".

-stray-

[kortick]

http://www.straypetadvocacy.org/html/cruelty_laws.html

actually animals do have rights and there are felony punishments
for various offenses

the link lists state by state what the punishment is for each
crime.

some states it is severe other states it is a fine.

but to say that animals lives do not matter in the eyes of the
laws is completely false.

but it still takes a sick mind to hurt an animal for pleasure
wheter it is against the law or not.

[strayrider]

http://www.straypetadvocacy.org/html/cruelty_laws.html

actually animals do have rights and there are felony punishments
for various offenses

the link lists state by state what the punishment is for each
crime.

some states it is severe other states it is a fine.

but to say that animals lives do not matter in the eyes of the
laws is completely false.

but it still takes a sick mind to hurt an animal for pleasure
wheter it is against the law or not.

Kortic, look at the second sentence in the text. "These laws do not give animals rights." These laws are put in place to protect animals from cruelty, which I agree with. However, as I stated before, animals do not have rights.

-stray-

[Dommm]

Kortic, look at the second sentence in the text. "These laws do not give animals rights." These laws are put in place to protect animals from cruelty, which I agree with. However, as I stated before, animals do not have rights.

-stray-

Ahh yes but they are living creatures and to some degree should receive the same rights of life. And as far as ownership goes who decided that we humans (just another animal) can claim right to own anything... This is the same as slavery where other human beings were thought of sub human...

Killing anything should carry the same sentence as killing a human.

[Mike70]

Killing anything should carry the same sentence as killing a human.

what about vermin? why shouldn't rats, roaches and other vermin be eradicated where ever they are found?

do you want to live in a home or area that is infested with rats, ants or roaches? i bet not, so why should anyone else.

i think kortick nailed it in his last post - it is the harming of animals for pleasure (to get a power kick) that i am outraged by.

i find this whole animal rights thing a bit much at times. yes i don't want to see animals mistreated, i want the animals i eat to be treated well and put down quickly BUT that doesn't mean by any stretch of the imagination that i think they have "rights."

fact is people are always to going to judge animals differently. a dog, a cat, a horse, etc. are always going to be looked at differently from rats, ants, roaches, mosquitoes - for many, many a reason.

[Dommm]

what about vermin? why shouldn't rats, roaches and other vermin be eradicated where ever they are found?

do you want to live in a home or area that is infested with rats, ants or roaches? i bet not, so why should anyone else.

i think kortick nailed it in his last post - it is the harming of animals for pleasure (to get a power kick) that i am outraged by.

i find this whole animal rights thing a bit much at times. yes i don't want to see animals mistreated, i want the animals i eat to be treated well and put down quickly BUT that doesn't mean by any stretch of the imagination that i think they have "rights."

fact is people are always to going to judge animals differently. a dog, a cat, a horse, etc. are always going to be looked at differently from rats, ants, roaches, mosquitoes - for many, many a reason.


In present conditions i agree about rats and roaches, but this is a problem that us humans ourselves caused, and as far as treating animals differently to humans of course they are gonna be treated differently. but I also believe that we do not OWN animals we take them into our homes and take CARE of them, this becomes a responsibility, which is why I have never taken an animal home as of yet as I tend to be too busy to take care of one. As long as a a creature is living and breathing and feeling we cannot own it wether it be human, dog, cat, pig, etc...

[strayrider]

In present conditions i agree about rats and roaches, but this is a problem that us humans ourselves caused, and as far as treating animals differently to humans of course they are gonna be treated differently. but I also believe that we do not OWN animals we take them into our homes and take CARE of them, this becomes a responsibility, which is why I have never taken an animal home as of yet as I tend to be too busy to take care of one. As long as a a creature is living and breathing and feeling we cannot own it wether it be human, dog, cat, pig, etc...

I own my dog. If you want to pet her, you ask my permission first. Otherwise, keep your fingerprints off.

-stray-

[kortick]

it seems like possession, rights, and cruelty are
being all tossed around as the same thing.

rights-Something that is due to a person or governmental body by law, tradition, or nature.

of course animals cant have rights per say.
then that would mean they could vote, own
property ect.
rights in this sense means
Something, especially humane treatment, claimed to be due to animals by moral principle.
which is for most people acceptable, vermin don't count as
animals as they are considered pests which cause damage and
spread disease

you may own your dog and be able to say who can pet her
that is true, and she has no legal rights,
but you can say the same thing about someone
talking to your child who does have legal rights.
your child is not a possession but you are putting the
same level of control as who has contact with it as your dog.


but all this is beyond the scope of what i was saying.
it doesnt matter if its legal or the line is blurry.
or if there is no line at all.
scip picked up on the whole point

a sick mind is the type who hurts animals.
in fact it is one of the major 3 signs of a serial killer
1. hurting animals 2. lighting fires 3.bed wetting

so yes there is proven reason to believe that
someone who hurts animals just may move up
to people.

that is the point, a sick mind is dangerous.

[strayrider]

Kor, you will get no argument from me concerning people who hurt animals just for the sake of hurting them.

But, I do not agree with Dommm, that someone who kills an animal should be treated the same as someone who kills a person.

Should a person who killed a dog sit on death row for 12-years, then face the needle?

Or spend the rest of their life in prison for popping a squirrel with a .22 rifle? I used to hunt small game, so I guess by Dommm's standards I'm facing multiple counts of animal "murder". Hell, possibly animal "genocide"?

:D

-stray-

ps -- my wife used to married to a guy from England. This guy was an animal rights nut. One day, while they were driving home, a rabbit jumped into the road in front of the car. She said he slammed on the brakes, swerved violently around, and nearly put the car into a ditch. To save the life of this poor, helpless, innocent little bunny rabbit, he nearly killed himself, her, and her two children. Now that's sick.

[Dommm]

Ahh so what you are saying is that it is fine for us to act as vermin, push animals out of there natural habitats, kill them as we see fit, decide what is cruel and inhumane, put ownership on another creature. But if these animals start invading the land that we have procured we call them vermin?

for example foxes in the UK have been chased out, shot at in the name of population control and for farmers to keep there livestock safe. now foxes are invading the urban areas of cities and are being labled vermin as they are knocking over trash cans for food and jumping on cars scratching up the paintwork. If we as humans didnt put them in a position that they had to invade the city areas then they would have been happily living in th countrysides. Personally I think we (yes I am including myself in this statement) as humans tend to have a overinflated sense of ego in that we think that we own an animal, as opposed to gaining companionship from the animal. This is somtimes what we show towards each other in our relationships as human beings (i.e. MY wife, MY husbund, MY friend). And if you look through history slavery was based on the same assumptions that the black guy was not intelligent, or there soceity is backwards, there religion does not show true knowlege so they are more animal then human. This in turn loses recognition of emotion and feeling that the person/animal may be feeling due to de-humanising (using this term losely) them. If I ever do buy a pet I personnaly believe that I am buying the responsibility to take care of the animal in return for companionship not purchasing the animal itself.

Anyway that is just my personal opionion.

[kortick]

no i dont beleive the same penalties apply for animals
as harming people

it is simply i feel a person who thinks they can hurt someone or something
weaker than themself and get away with it is a danger.

and i dont beleive we own pets or they own us

there are no possessions

we touch things and hold them for a while then they are gone
be it people, animals, or material objects

this is a finite existence
ownership is an illusion.

[strayrider]

Ahh so what you are saying is that it is fine for us to act as vermin, push animals out of there natural habitats, kill them as we see fit, decide what is cruel and inhumane, put ownership on another creature. But if these animals start invading the land that we have procured we call them vermin?

Exactly. And, speaking of vermin, remind me to tell you about my chipmunk extermination program. It involves a five gallon bucket half full of water, enough sunflower seeds to cover the surface of the water, and a three foot length of lumber which acts as a ramp from the ground to the lip of the bucket. Dig holes all over my lawn, will they? Grrrrr. (home owners, it really works)

:elol:


no i dont beleive the same penalties apply for animals
as harming people

it is simply i feel a person who thinks they can hurt someone or something
weaker than themself and get away with it is a danger.

and i dont beleive we own pets or they own us

there are no possessions

we touch things and hold them for a while then they are gone
be it people, animals, or material objects

this is a finite existence
ownership is an illusion.

It's only an illusion if your dog never bites anyone, or runs out in front of a car and causes an accident. Then ...

Kor, I also believe that anyone who harms an animal for the sake of pleasure could very well be a danger and should be looked at closely. But, those soldiers in that video, the only persons they are a danger to are Islamic terrorists and I hope they get some.

:D

-stray-