1 weapon to use In zombie apocolypse

[horrormad]

If zombs would take over the and I only had the pick of 1 weapon It would be a chainsaw running around chopping their heads off It would be fun.

what would your weapon be?

[CornishCorpse]

Hatchet. Useful in alot of situations and no fuel to worry about, within a couple weeks of the outbreak that stuff would become gold dust. This topic has been covered over and over, search the forums for it. Someone found an amazing hatchet I think its a trench digging tool aswell but damn..Thats all you`d need with the exception of a terminator suit.

[sammylou]

The chainsaw is a total deathtrap. It's loudness will draw all the ghouls right towards you, and it runs out of fuel very quickly. Plus there's the risk of hurting your self by accident.

Although, I must agree with you, it would be awesome to do! :)

Personally, I'd take a machete. It's light, durable, and never needs fuel or reloading. It's a very deadly weapon.

[mista_mo]

my fists, for my faith in the Emperor grants me the strength I require.

[bassman]

I would use my special bomb that kills all the zombies and only the zombies.

I know...there isn't such a bomb. But zombies are ficitonal just like my bomb. So now I have my bomb and i'm safe.:D

[Bub666]

I think I would have to go with a machete too.

[Yojimbo]

Machetes are not the greatest zombie killer (in spite of what Max Brooks says) since they are meant primarily for cutting vegatation and not for severing heads or cleaving skulls. Yeah, no reloading or fuel aside, while a machete might be better than a chainsaw, it is inferior to a tomahawk or hatchet.

Check this out:

http://www.agrussell.com/knives/by_maker/s_through_z/sog_specialty_knives/sog_fusion_tactical_tomahawk.html

Good for breaking down doors (unlike a machete) can be used to chop firewood, AND can cleave a skull easily. Spike end can punch through a skull with little effort, and hatchet end can be used to lop off body parts, including severing a head from the body. Also balanced to be thrown and was used by the Special Forces in Vietnam, so it is battle tested.

Personally, I think Bassman has the right idea with his "zombie bomb"

[Neil]

Phased-plasma rifle in the forty watt range! What else!

[AcesandEights]

Lead pipe with some sort of grip tape on the handle.

Swords would chip, need constant sharpening and eventually break. Other hafted weapons would break eventually, as well and would also be prone to getting stuck in the target. Guns would run out of ammo. Baseball bats (yes, even the metal ones) would break all too soon.

Lead pipe.

[Wooley]

M-4 assault rifle, with a red dot sight and suppressor.

Zombies come in large groups and at close range. I want to deal with them at a distance and be able to quickly dispatch large numbers of them.

[Danny]

monster truck with a cowcatcher plow on front and back.

[acealive1]

lawnmower for a public park :sneaky:

[SRP76]

There is no single weapon that can be used to deal with a zombie infestation. You cannot swing a handheld weapon enough times to deal with them all. You'll be overwhelmed. And vehicles are the most unreliable thing you can possibly get, given the close quarters you have to work in. You get two feet, and find a stopped vehicle. Then the zombies are turning your vehicle over.

[MikePizzoff]

It would be a chainsaw running around chopping their heads off It would be fun.


Are you crazy? You'd have fun for a short period of time... then every zombie within a square mile (at least) would be coming for you. Then, by the time you're knee deep in zombies your chainsaw would probably be running out of fuel.

[Bub666]

How about Dead Reckoning?

[Khardis]

9mm Glock for regular range, sawed off shotty for close range, either a hanzo katana or a serious medieval mace with extra pointy edges for hand to hand.

[moby_dog]

Funny, I was a member of this forum years ago before they changed it and we used to endlessly discuss these exact same topics.

SRP76 is right, every weapon is flawed. But if you have to choose one, don't pick one that makes a lot of noise and runs out of gas or ammo. That tomahawk that Yojimbo talked about is awesome. I'd hate to get that close but like I said, running out of ammo sucks. Here is another axe from that same website I like.

http://www.agrussell.com/knives/by_type/axes/sog_fusion_battle_ax.html

[Yojimbo]

Funny, I was a member of this forum years ago before they changed it and we used to endlessly discuss these exact same topics.

SRP76 is right, every weapon is flawed. But if you have to choose one, don't pick one that makes a lot of noise and runs out of gas or ammo. That tomahawk that Yojimbo talked about is awesome. I'd hate to get that close but like I said, running out of ammo sucks. Here is another axe from that same website I like.

http://www.agrussell.com/knives/by_type/axes/sog_fusion_battle_ax.html

Nice battle axe. Looks pretty vicious too!

Yeah, wouldn't want to get close enough to use a tomahawk either, but if things get that hairy, it might be easier to use that at close range than a long barrelled firearm that can be easily grabbed by a ghoul.

My choices listed on a similar previous post are as follows:

M-1 .30 cal carbine
Ruger .30 cal Blackhawk Pistol (or Raging Thirty .30 cal DA pistol)
.22 Explorer Pistol
Special Forces Tomahawk

[MaximusIncredulous]

Nice axes but the prob is that you can't take yourself out when overwhelmed. So axes or pipes, what have you, and a nice little Derringer for those moments when you "haven't got time for the pain" as the old pain med ad went.

[AcesandEights]

Again, my major problem with axes, tomahawks and other hafted weapons is that they tend to penetrate and get stuck in things. That's not a good quality when you might have to take on more than one opponent at a time and your first opponent may not be dead in one swing...and crawling its way up your axe handle :p

[mista_mo]

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj300/realmoseph/image_1.jpg


are fictional weapons allowed? if so then an Imperial guard standard issue las gun. Can remove a human limb with ease, pin point accuracy, power cells replentish in the sunlight, very little in the ways of moving parts, sturdy, reliable, powercell is good for 60 shots or so, and it is light.

[Trencher]

http://www.kj.dk/katalog/vaerktoej/haandvaerktoej/45634/Kobberhamre/127HCU2000.html

For hand to hand and a shotgun or revolver for shooting.

[Publius]

M-4 assault rifle, with a red dot sight and suppressor.

Roger that. Add an underslung 12-gauge and a .22LR drop-in conversion kit and you have a single weapon system that's ready for just about anything.

[Skippy911sc]

The topic title says 1 weapon...

I would say a 10/22 from Ruger.

I would like a blunt instrument as well but I will go with the topic heading.

[DubiousComforts]

There is no single weapon that can be used to deal with a zombie infestation.
Sure there is: fire. You'll never run out of it while there are walking corpses to burn. The living dead can't use it and are afraid of it. A bullet doesn't stop a zombie unless you target the brain, yet fire stops a zombie every time 'cause they go up pretty easy. :D

[Trencher]

Killing it with flame would take some time as it would require third degree burns or more I would imagne. At what is one of the buring zombies starts grabbing you in its panic? :eek: You get both burned and strangled. Also a burning zombie running around like a um.. burning zombie is just a disaster waiting to happen, you just know it will run right into the gas tanks or whatever. :)

[Dillinger]

H&K MP5 SD6

9mm is a popular and readily available cartridge. Plus MP5 SDs are silenced (hence, SD for all the english and gun noobs here). Silent and deadly. Back off, zombie scum! Good for taking out wannabe badass biker hotshots too if you have to.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/128/318663549_b21cd597b7.jpg?v=0
Get some!

[clanglee]

Yeah, Fire as a weapon is dangerous to control. Give me a sharp short sword. Good for piercing and easy to pull out. Capable of chopping as well.

[Bub666]

Fire is a bad weapon.You could burn your house down,and all your supplies.

[darth los]

The chainsaw is a total deathtrap. It's loudness will draw all the ghouls right towards you, and it runs out of fuel very quickly. Plus there's the risk of hurting your self by accident.

Although, I must agree with you, it would be awesome to do! :)

Personally, I'd take a machete. It's light, durable, and never needs fuel or reloading. It's a very deadly weapon.


If it absolutly MUST be a chainsaw the you might as well go with the chainsaw bayonet gun from gears of war. Can't go wrong there. Few weapons are as bad as as that.

[Yojimbo]

OK, If it is to be one weapon only, I would be inclined to agree with Skippy and go with the Ruger 10/22. It is light, durable, reliable, and you can tote a whole lot of ammo for it in a small space. Plus, if you run out of bullets you can always use the stock as a bludgeon of sorts.

[horrormad]

Your going to day sometime anyway In a zombie apocalypse so better just get a chainsaw and go crazy.

[darth los]

It's funny cause in dead rising you used a bunch of "items" that if you were really put in that scenario, would get your ass bit off in like 10 seconds.

[Mutineer]

The chainsaw always sounds fun but what about splattering blood into your mouth or eyes ?

[Trencher]

Chainsaws are unwieldly weapons and if what you are sawing are moving then it have a tendency to skip and jump, besides its slow it have to saw through things it does not saw through bodies like a hot knife through butter.

[Millard Rausch]

I have to go with a well constructed brick :lol:
http://www.i-mockery.com/minimocks/prince-of-darkness/38.gif

[Yojimbo]

Screw chainsaws, hatchets and machetes. They are mere toys compared to these!



126

Yeah, if I can have only one let it be the one above, or this one:

127

Short of the smart zombie bomb, I think these two beat everything.:lol:

[Cartma7546]

I think I'd like to have a lightsaber, who wouldn't? But if I had to stay in reality i would go with a MP5 silenced. That would go nice.

[Skippy911sc]

I have to go with a well constructed brick :lol:
http://www.i-mockery.com/minimocks/prince-of-darkness/38.gif

Love the scene from another great carpenter flick "Prince od Darkness", one of his best, IMHO.

I also like your quote from Red October at the bottom.

[DubiousComforts]

Killing it with flame would take some time as it would require third degree burns or more I would imagne. At what is one of the buring zombies starts grabbing you in its panic?
I disagree. In my world, the living dead are afraid of fire and back away from flame, not grab at the human who is wielding it. Flame blinds the living dead and dissipates their instinct to attack humans. You can set any part of a ghoul on fire and it's as good as a kill because they don't have the capacity to douse the flame.

A gun will accomplish none of these things and will not stop the living dead unless you use it to destroy the brain.


Also a burning zombie running around like a um.. burning zombie is just a disaster waiting to happen, you just know it will run right into the gas tanks or whatever. :)
In my world, the living dead don't run. You just burn 'em and they go up pretty easy.

[Trencher]

I agree with you that you can scare them pretty good with flame atleast for a while.

[SRP76]

Until you have to sleep. Then you're dead.

And if you happen to get cut off from your fuel supply, you're going to look awfully silly running through a crowd of ghouls while frantically rubbing two sticks together.

[DubiousComforts]

Until you have to sleep. Then you're dead.
The same would apply to every other weapon. Safety during sleep relies on the type of shelter you're in, but this thread is about choosing a weapon.


And if you happen to get cut off from your fuel supply, you're going to look awfully silly running through a crowd of ghouls while frantically rubbing two sticks together.
Surrounded by living dead and you would immediately revert to rubbing sticks together like a caveman? You can start a fire using any variety of methods and materials. Would it be so difficult to carry extras matches? What happens when you happen to get cut-off from your bullet supply under the same circumstances?

[SRP76]

Surrounded by living dead and you would immediately revert to rubbing sticks together like a caveman?

:lol:

You'd have to, if you were cut off from your source. You don't have an infinite supply of lighter fluid in your pocket (and you can't exactly keep risking your life by hoping your lighter flames on the first flick all the time anyway), so you must be relying on re-using a torch that you can instantly light from some central bonfire (since you're stuck in one place; whether flame "scares" them or not, it still attracts them. You'll have a horde that never goes away camped around where you used your fire, preventing you from leaving that spot). If they get between you and that fire source, you won't have much choice.

[Mutineer]

A good old fashioned aluminum baseball bat would be nice.

[acealive1]

concussion grenades

[SRP76]

Go-Go-Gadget weaponry >>>>>>> all.

[acealive1]

Go-Go-Gadget weaponry >>>>>>> all.

it'd be funny. i'd be in the main bedroom of a farm house upstairs and yell "BITCH!" as i tossed a concussion grenade to the ground below :lol::lol::lol:

[DubiousComforts]

:lol:

You'd have to, if you were cut off from your source. You don't have an infinite supply of lighter fluid in your pocket (and you can't exactly keep risking your life by hoping your lighter flames on the first flick all the time anyway), so you must be relying on re-using a torch that you can instantly light from some central bonfire (since you're stuck in one place; whether flame "scares" them or not, it still attracts them. You'll have a horde that never goes away camped around where you used your fire, preventing you from leaving that spot). If they get between you and that fire source, you won't have much choice.
Man, that sure is a lot of rules and conditions you've got there. Since we're stuck in one place with a horde that never goes away and is alternately repelled and attracted to fire, then I suppose no weapon will help and they'll probably get you no matter what.

[SRP76]

Well, yes, they would get you no matter what; that's what I've always said.

But I didn't make those rules; we see them in every movie. Zombies don't try to get away from fire, regardless of how they "fear" it. Fran was waving a flare in front of her ghoul, but it just shielded its eyes and kept coming. And a bright flame is going to attract ghouls like a moth to a lightbulb, just like the burning truck did in Night. If you had, say, a wall of fire between you and them, they might not cross the wall, but they sure would start lining up on the other side of it.

[DubiousComforts]

But I didn't make those rules; we see them in every movie. Zombies don't try to get away from fire, regardless of how they "fear" it. Fran was waving a flare in front of her ghoul, but it just shielded its eyes and kept coming.
You're talking about failure on the part of the human, not the effectiveness of the weapon. While it was blinded, Fran could have stabbed it with the flare and let it catch fire. In the same movie, Flyboy held off dozens of zombie with a lousy blowtorch.


And a bright flame is going to attract ghouls like a moth to a lightbulb, just like the burning truck did in Night.
So you don't see how that attraction could be utilized as an effective weapon? Build a big bonfire out of junk, attract all the living dead in the area and then ambush them with a couple of torches. You don't have to be a good shot. You don't have to conserve ammo. The more zombies there are, the more combustible material there is.

You can still think, plot and cheat; the living dead can't.


If you had, say, a wall of fire between you and them, they might not cross the wall, but they sure would start lining up on the other side of it.
Why does it have to be outside? You can have a fire inside a fortified shelter.
A gun is only as good as long as there are bullets to shoot, but you can burn any number of things lying about the house.

[Publius]

You're talking about failure on the part of the human, not the effectiveness of the weapon. While it was blinded, Fran could have stabbed it with the flare and let it catch fire.


Decomposing flesh really isn't that inflammable. At least not until the corpse is completely dried out, at which point it wouldn't be moving anyways (it'd be too stiff).

[Wyldwraith]

If I had to go with 1 weapon and accessibility wasn't an issue,

The HK-417. Fires all variants of the time-tested 7.62x51mm NATO round, and that's just the first thing I like about it. The fact that the implemented design allows for switching to either 12, 16, or 20 inch barrels greatly increases the weapon's versatility. The 20 round magazine can be swapped out for a 50-round drum. In spite of its relatively modest carrying capacity magazine-wise I feel it's still the best all-around choice. Next generation polymers mean the weapon is incredibly light, yet still very durable.

The barrel switch-outs mean in one weapon you can have everything from a sniper rifle to a close combat weapons.

I could go on at length about how marvelous I think this weapon is, but instead I'll just throw down a link and let others be the judge.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_&_Koch_HK417

[brer]

I would go for a ruger 10/22 with a whole slew of thirty round hot lips mags.

At relatively close ranges, under 50 yards, a .22 from a rifle can make pretty reliable knock down head shots. I've done it enough times with coyotes and problem strays.

With multiple mags and Romero type zombies, this would give the shooter the capability of taking out fairly large groups. In the words of the tough chick from NOTLD 95 "Look at how slow they are.".

Anyone advocating a high capacity .308 probably has not shot one that much.

[DubiousComforts]

Decomposing flesh really isn't that inflammable.
But the clothing they're wearing is. You would only need to ignite one sleeve or pant leg for a ghoul to forget all about pursuing you. They lack the intelligence to stop, drop and roll, and would eventually be consumed by the flame. In Night, Ben held off every ghoul surrounding the farmhouse with a single burning table leg, while his rifle proved useless in that situation.

[acealive1]

But the clothing they're wearing is. You would only need to ignite one sleeve or pant leg for a ghoul to forget all about pursuing you. They lack the intelligence to stop, drop and roll, and would eventually be consumed by the flame. In Night, Ben held off every ghoul surrounding the farmhouse with a single burning table leg, while his rifle proved useless in that situation.

he just said it isnt that INFLAMMABLE. meaning yes it can catch on fire...

[Staredge]

At relatively close ranges, under 50 yards, a .22 from a rifle can make pretty reliable knock down head shots. I've done it enough times with coyotes and problem strays.




I'm keeping my Remington 572 pump .22, but that's primarily because I'm really comfortable with it and a really good shot with it. Nice thing about .22 is......they're EVERYWHERE. Couple that with light weights for a lot of ammunition and you're set.

http://www.remington.com/images/products/firearms/rimfire/smsil_572.jpg

Hit the hobby shop for some brass tubing for speedloaders and away you go.

[brer]

Everyone to their own tastes. I'm pretty big on the 10/22's. I've put more than a few thousand rounds through mine and am also very comfortable with it.

I can assume that the remmie is a tube loader?

Nothing against tubeloaders, but I can get a lot more capacity with a magazine, and quite likely faster reload times.

But then again, a pump has the advantage of being able to clear a jam far faster. Something to think about if you are scavenging ammo of unknown quality.

No matter what, you are going to have to adjust tactics to the weapon you carry.

[mista_mo]

How about this=

when surrounded by a hoard of zombies, you realize how silly the situation is. You realize that the dead coming alive and eating the living is unfeasible, and that it is all a metaphor saying that mankind should stop fighting amongst itself, otherwise a small and relatively harmless scenario will utterly screw us all.

Then with a loud snap, the undead all disappear, and all of a sudden, a searing pain enters your head and your vision clouds over. You black out and collapse where you were standing.

You wake up in a warm, comfortable hospital bed, surrounded by family and friends. The regular scents of a hospital greet your nostrils, a cool, autumn wind carries the smell of leaves and pine needles into the room. Nothing is as it was before, and you ask whats going on. Your wife/girlfriend/best friend explain that you were in a coma for 3 months, and came close to death several times while you were comatose. It was all a dream- a frightening, realistic scenario that had played itself over in your head over the course of the 3 months. You lie back down, and welcome the sudden sense of relief and joy that overcomes you. You gaze into the faces of those around you, and grasp your kids/wife/girlfriends hand with all of your strength, thankful that they are alive and alright.

You stare up into the ceiling with a renewed sense of purpose and life, and for the first time in 3 months, close your eyes and fall into a deep, comfortable sleep.

tl;dr

zombies aren't real and you dreamed it up.

[DubiousComforts]

How about this=

zombies aren't real and you dreamed it up.
Cool. so in your dream, which weapon would you use if you could only pick one?


he just said it isnt that INFLAMMABLE. meaning yes it can catch on fire...
I understood and replied that clothing is more inflammable than skin. Your only problem in this case might be a bald, nude ghoul. I'll let you know if I see any.

[horrormad]

Of course zombies arent real Mo If there was zombies I wouldnt be on this forum now I would be out there kicking ass.

[Wyldwraith]

No,
I can't say I've had a great deal of experience with military prototype weaponry. That said, penetration, range, versatility, reliability and magazine capacity are still the factors one chooses the "best" firearm from. I have fired an M4 quite a bit, and I'd rather take my chances with one of those than risk bouncing .22 rounds off a particularly thick skull.

::shrugs:: Tastes will vary, no reason to tear down someone else's reasoning just by pointing out that unless they were part of the military stress-test experiments they haven't handled the weapon in question.

[Skippy911sc]

No,
I can't say I've had a great deal of experience with military prototype weaponry. That said, penetration, range, versatility, reliability and magazine capacity are still the factors one chooses the "best" firearm from. I have fired an M4 quite a bit, and I'd rather take my chances with one of those than risk bouncing .22 rounds off a particularly thick skull.

::shrugs:: Tastes will vary, no reason to tear down someone else's reasoning just by pointing out that unless they were part of the military stress-test experiments they haven't handled the weapon in question.

I have fired an M4, in fact I own 2, but as far as accessibility of ammo the 22lr is everywhere while the .223 or 5.56 is a little harder to find and takes up more space. I agree as far stopping power and accuracy the M4 or civilian AR-15 would be an outstanding choice.

[mista_mo]

Cool. so in your dream, which weapon would you use if you could only pick one?

The knowledge that it is only a dream and ultimately that any harm they inflict on me will be useless.

If you come to realize that you are in a dream, then you win.

of course...there is the opposite side of the spectrum, and that is the situation is real and you think it's a dream, so you charge into a group of ghouls with a katana and a master chief suit on, thinking you won't die (because it's a dream).

Damn, now I've gone and screwed my self.

in any case, I'd use something simple, durable, easy to find (or create) and powerful. Guns i am not too sure about, i don't have much experience with fire arms...

[Skippy911sc]

The knowledge that it is only a dream and ultimately that any harm they inflict on me will be useless.

If you come to realize that you are in a dream, then you win.

of course...there is the opposite side of the spectrum, and that is the situation is real and you think it's a dream, so you charge into a group of ghouls with a katana and a master chief suit on, thinking you won't die (because it's a dream).

Damn, now I've gone and screwed my self.

in any case, I'd use something simple, durable, easy to find (or create) and powerful. Guns i am not too sure about, i don't have much experience with fire arms...

So...did you take the Red Pill or the Blue Pill? Just remember...there is no SPOON!!!

[Publius]

But the clothing they're wearing is. You would only need to ignite one sleeve or pant leg for a ghoul to forget all about pursuing you. They lack the intelligence to stop, drop and roll, and would eventually be consumed by the flame. In Night, Ben held off every ghoul surrounding the farmhouse with a single burning table leg, while his rifle proved useless in that situation.

Whether that is likely to work in real life depends a lot on what the zombie is actually wearing as well as other factors like how fresh and damaged the zombie is and how well the zombie has been feeding. Some fabrics like cotton and silk will light up pretty easily. Others like wool and polyester are difficult to ignite and burn slowly. And even cotton won't burn very well if it's damp with coagulated blood, etc.


I have fired an M4, in fact I own 2, but as far as accessibility of ammo the 22lr is everywhere while the .223 or 5.56 is a little harder to find and takes up more space. I agree as far stopping power and accuracy the M4 or civilian AR-15 would be an outstanding choice.

If you actually own two M4s, it might not be better to post about that fact publicly unless you have a SOT license.

Good point about availability of .22LR. That's why I suggested a .22LR conversion kit for an M4A1 (or other AR-15 series rifle). You can fire .22LR and .223/5.56mm out of the same barrel.

[Staredge]

Everyone to their own tastes. I'm pretty big on the 10/22's. I've put more than a few thousand rounds through mine and am also very comfortable with it.

I can assume that the remmie is a tube loader?

Nothing against tubeloaders, but I can get a lot more capacity with a magazine, and quite likely faster reload times.

But then again, a pump has the advantage of being able to clear a jam far faster. Something to think about if you are scavenging ammo of unknown quality.

No matter what, you are going to have to adjust tactics to the weapon you carry.


It is a tube load. As I said, brass tubing can be used to make speedloaders. Wouldn't want to rely on it in a close-quarters fight, (at least without counting rounds) but with a little practice I think I can get the reload times down to not much more than a clip. Of course, I can't get a 30 round tube!!!! (Then again.........:evil:)

Nothing wrong with the Rugers either. I certainly wouldn't leave one laying. Your first sentence is the key. It's being comfortable with your weapon.

[Skippy911sc]

If you actually own two M4s, it might not be better to post about that fact publicly unless you have a SOT license.

Good point about availability of .22LR. That's why I suggested a .22LR conversion kit for an M4A1 (or other AR-15 series rifle). You can fire .22LR and .223/5.56mm out of the same barrel.

We actually call them an M4gery, it is a semi-auto rifle not selective. Some ar rifles can shoot 5.56 and .223 (not to be a stickler) and some can't. If the barrle or firearm says 5.56 it will shoot .223 also but not the reverse.

[Wyldwraith]

Hey,
I was referencing the HK-417 I was originally talking about when I made the comment about no one having access to them aside from those who participated in the prototype prelim tests, and the later large-scale stress test.

The comments about the M4 were meant to illustrate that I understand the difficulties inherent in your average person picking up military-grade hardware and trying to use it compared to, say, a .22. That said however, *and considering only the merits of the weapons in question* I still prefer a reliable carbine over many civilian low-caliber firearms. Guns only have two purposes in a zombie apocalypse. 1) (Primary function) Punching rounds through human skulls and doing sufficient damage to the brain inside to deactivate the targeted ghoul. 2) Eliminating hostile human beings.

That second aspect is part and parcel of why I prefer a higher caliber weapon. If one of my bullets hits someone that I needed to shoot I want them sliding into shock almost immediately, whether or not I managed to hit them in a particularly vital location. A copper-jacketed .22 slug that goes right through the meat of a raider's forearm will causing bleeding and a lot of pain. A 7.62x51mm NATO round that impacts in the exact same place is a far more serious (and potentially life-threatening) injury.

Penetration is also a concern if you end up in a shootout where both sides have access to cover. I don't want to be drawing zombies from 10 miles away by getting involved in a conflict where a few dozen rounds get fired on both sides when the proper weapon could've ended the conflict much much sooner.

I will concede that .22 ammunition is far more available, and that the .22 does have a variety of advantages. As a backup weapon, or a weapon used in very specific circumstances I could definitely see myself using one.

My apologies if I came off abrasively. That was not my intent.

[Ov3rlord]

Now I understand that .22's are more readily available but think along the lines that your main sources of ammunition would be gun stores or any store that sells ammo or dead police and military last time I checked the military was using either 5.56mm or 7.72mm NATO rounds and the police had .38, 9 mm, and in some cases .45, along with 12 gauge shotguns and 9mm MP5s used by SWAT. I'm going off topic though because if I only had one weapon I'd go with either the force or Godzilla :elol: Legions of the undead would fall to the destructive force that is the big green guy or they could suffer the wrath of my lightning and mind control to turn them on each other.

[horrormad]

I change my mind I would use this weapon.

http://stevesgunz.com/imgs/75sg.jpg

[Skippy911sc]

Hey,
I was referencing the HK-417 I was originally talking about when I made the comment about no one having access to them aside from those who participated in the prototype prelim tests, and the later large-scale stress test.

The comments about the M4 were meant to illustrate that I understand the difficulties inherent in your average person picking up military-grade hardware and trying to use it compared to, say, a .22. That said however, *and considering only the merits of the weapons in question* I still prefer a reliable carbine over many civilian low-caliber firearms. Guns only have two purposes in a zombie apocalypse. 1) (Primary function) Punching rounds through human skulls and doing sufficient damage to the brain inside to deactivate the targeted ghoul. 2) Eliminating hostile human beings.

That second aspect is part and parcel of why I prefer a higher caliber weapon. If one of my bullets hits someone that I needed to shoot I want them sliding into shock almost immediately, whether or not I managed to hit them in a particularly vital location. A copper-jacketed .22 slug that goes right through the meat of a raider's forearm will causing bleeding and a lot of pain. A 7.62x51mm NATO round that impacts in the exact same place is a far more serious (and potentially life-threatening) injury.

Penetration is also a concern if you end up in a shootout where both sides have access to cover. I don't want to be drawing zombies from 10 miles away by getting involved in a conflict where a few dozen rounds get fired on both sides when the proper weapon could've ended the conflict much much sooner.

I will concede that .22 ammunition is far more available, and that the .22 does have a variety of advantages. As a backup weapon, or a weapon used in very specific circumstances I could definitely see myself using one.

My apologies if I came off abrasively. That was not my intent.

Not offended at all...a good discussion is always a welcome sight. I would have to say that the civilian market place for firearms are usually a better pick than the Govt. Most of the firearms used by the police and milt. come from derivatives of the civilian market and are also at times chosen tby cost and ability. My m4gery is a tack driver with loaded ammo and still can hit sub moa groups with store purchased ammo, I don't think the Govt. M4s can compete with many target guns.

[Publius]

We actually call them an M4gery, it is a semi-auto rifle not selective. Some ar rifles can shoot 5.56 and .223 (not to be a stickler) and some can't. If the barrle or firearm says 5.56 it will shoot .223 also but not the reverse.

Ah, very cool. I assumed otherwise based on the sentence in which you distinguished between "M4" and "civilian AR-15."

I'm aware of the 5.56mm NATO v. .223 SAAMI issue, but my point was that any M-16/AR-15-series rifle (whether chambered in 5.56mm or .223) will fire .22LR through its original barrel with a drop-in adapter. Not as accurate as a dedicated .22LR upper assembly, of course, but probably accurate enough up to the distances at which one would hope to reliably penetrate a human skull.

[Yojimbo]

Dude, you guys with the cool AR-15s make me want to go and shell out the cash for these. If I am not mistaken, even in anti-assault weapon California, we can still get AR-15's, though we are limited to 10 round clips and cannot attach a flash suppressor or have a bayonet lug. Makes me almost wish I had not sold my Mini-14 years back!

[Publius]

Dude, you guys with the cool AR-15s make me want to go and shell out the cash for these. If I am not mistaken, even in anti-assault weapon California, we can still get AR-15's, though we are limited to 10 round clips and cannot attach a flash suppressor or have a bayonet lug. Makes me almost wish I had not sold my Mini-14 years back!

I'm in California too. I don't have an AR-15 yet (been kicking myself for not buying one while I lived in Florida), but it is true that there are ways to legally own them even here in the People's Golden Republic. :p

You can have one without any of the evil "assault weapon" features (which include pistol grips and thumbhole stocks) and use detachable magazines (you can only buy up to 10-round mags in Cali), as you mention. Or you can build one with a fixed magazine with capacity of no more than 10 rounds, in which case you're allowed to have features like pistol grips and flash suppressors. A fixed magazine means you have to open the rifle up to reload it or have to use a tool (rather than just pressing a magazine release button or lever as with a normal detachable magazine) to remove the magazine for reloading.

The final option relies on the fact that the Cali "assault weapon" ban only deals with centerfire rifles. So if you get an AR-15 chambered in a rimfire cartridge like .22LR, you can use detachable magazines and have "assault weapon" features like pistol grips and flash suppressors. Just with a much wimpier cartridge. ;)

[Skippy911sc]

Ah, very cool. I assumed otherwise based on the sentence in which you distinguished between "M4" and "civilian AR-15."

I'm aware of the 5.56mm NATO v. .223 SAAMI issue, but my point was that any M-16/AR-15-series rifle (whether chambered in 5.56mm or .223) will fire .22LR through its original barrel with a drop-in adapter. Not as accurate as a dedicated .22LR upper assembly, of course, but probably accurate enough up to the distances at which one would hope to reliably penetrate a human skull.

You can use the same barrel but the upper which the barrel is attached will have to be changed. The same lower can be used with an adapter for the smaller round. It would be a lot easier to buy a new upper than change out the barrel and then the need for headspace check...etc...etc...etc...

That why I went with a 10/22, you can get huge magazines for these, they are semi-auto and a lot quieter than the 5.56 or .223, which by the way kill your ears if fired repeatedly without ear protection.

[Publius]

You can use the same barrel but the upper which the barrel is attached will have to be changed. The same lower can be used with an adapter for the smaller round. It would be a lot easier to buy a new upper than change out the barrel and then the need for headspace check...etc...etc...etc...

Not with a .22lr conversion adapter like the Ciener (http://www.22lrconversions.com/atch-pg.htm) one. All you have to do is pull the takedown pin, remove the charging handle and bolt carrier group, put the charging handle back in with the adapter (which is essentially a replacement bolt carrier group), and close the rifle up. The rest of the upper including the barrel stays as-is.

[GhastlyJoker]

Zombie and your weapon has no ammunition : Machete
Few zombies but there's more lurking : 9MM with Silencer
Close range : Shotgun
Horde of zombies : Semi Auto
Few zombies in an inclosed space : S&W .500 (makes magnum look pitiful)

No one can stick with one weapon, though fire can work wonders. I have a Wal-Mart right across from a Home Depot. Grab assloads of wood and flammable materials and go back to Wal-Mart. Douse rags, wood and other things in flammable materia and light it on fire. When you run out of fuel, get some matches.

[strayrider]

I'll take any one of the following:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yryV-5TfwvE

:D

-stray-

Ps -- I'm married, so I mean the GUNS ...

[Wyldwraith]

Question,

Lots of people here seem very familiar with the features/capabilities of the various .22s, so I wanted to ask: There's a lot of speculation about how much/which part of the brain has to get splattered to drop a zombie. That being the case, are we sure that a .22 round fired from say, 50-75 feet away would reliably penetrate the skull AND pulp enough brain matter to down the zombie?

I seem to remember that .22 rounds are infamous for bouncing around inside the body when they hit the torso. Is the same true when they enter the skull, or does the fast-moving bullet generally punch straight through?

If it punches through, how much damage do you think it would do to the brain? I think most people would be aiming between where the upper bridge of the nose terminates at the bottom of the forehead and the crown of the head. If that's true, what kind of damage would you expect to see?

[Ov3rlord]

Actually I had that same question a while ago so I went around to a couple places and asked (hypothetically of course). The only ones that seemed comfortable enough to give me the answer were the marines at my local recruiting station. They said that because of the thickness of your skull it would probably bounce around and instead of the bridge of the nose you want to go for the left eye because I heard it's something about your brain being more centered to the left. They then told me it was dumb to bother with a .22 and just use a Javelin shoulder launched rocket system because that would work better, but I digress.

[Staredge]

Question,

Lots of people here seem very familiar with the features/capabilities of the various .22s, so I wanted to ask: There's a lot of speculation about how much/which part of the brain has to get splattered to drop a zombie. That being the case, are we sure that a .22 round fired from say, 50-75 feet away would reliably penetrate the skull AND pulp enough brain matter to down the zombie?

I seem to remember that .22 rounds are infamous for bouncing around inside the body when they hit the torso. Is the same true when they enter the skull, or does the fast-moving bullet generally punch straight through?

If it punches through, how much damage do you think it would do to the brain? I think most people would be aiming between where the upper bridge of the nose terminates at the bottom of the forehead and the crown of the head. If that's true, what kind of damage would you expect to see?

You run the risk of it bouncing off, so accuracy is important. I would think the ability to rattle around inside without going out the back is an asset. Much more likely to scramble rather than just going right through.

[EvilNed]

I felt the weight of a one-handed medieval mace the other week, and I have to say that this is a weapon that would be a prime headbasher (and historically, it was). Here's a weapon designed to bash in skulls. It was very light, and you could easily have one in your hand, and another one hanging by your waist for backup.

Sure, a crowbar would be useful as a tool as well, but it's also more unweildly to swing. I dare say you'd get much further with a mace than with a crowbar.

Of other interest, I also had the chance to try on leather armor, which was, for me, kinda heavy. But imagine if you trained with it and worked up a routine in that thing. And then just ditched the lower torso part of it, to ease up weight. Your arms would be 100% bite proof. I also tried on a pair of medieval gauntlets, and let me tell you... Bashing anyone in the face with those things would break the nose so far upp their heads that they'd definetly die. You could easily bash someone in the forehead with those and kill them outright. And they were very light, too. Wouldn't weigh you down a bit.

[DubiousComforts]

No one can stick with one weapon, though fire can work wonders. I have a Wal-Mart right across from a Home Depot. Grab assloads of wood and flammable materials and go back to Wal-Mart. Douse rags, wood and other things in flammable materia and light it on fire. When you run out of fuel, get some matches.
Finally! Another person who refuses to succumb to the "mah gun is bigger than yer gun" school of survival and sees fire as the weapon of choice. There is simply no limit to the amount of chaos and destruction that can be caused by lighting a single match.

There is, however, one major drawback to wielding fire against an army of living corpses. See if you can figure that one out. :D

[Wyldwraith]

Ok,
So the consensus seems to be that the .22 round has a significant chance of bouncing off the thick bone of the forehead, although if the round does penetrate the internal ricochets would doom the ghoul.

That would seem to be a significant flaw to set against the advantages of widely available ammunition and simple easily-maintained firearm mechanisms.

On the other hand the points about the fatigue caused by the recoil of high-caliber firearms are well taken. You'd want to be able to shoot your way out of a really sticky situation and still have the energy left to run for your life.

Someone was talking about the .38 as a solid compromise between these two extremes, but I'd always heard that many .38s suffered from poor accuracy beyond very short range. Is this true?

I own a S&W .45 pistol that I inherited from my uncle. I take it to the range 4-5 times a month, and generally fire a couple hundred rounds over 90 minutes or so. Sometimes I take a break after an hour, and shoot for another full hour after a twenty minute break. When I'm done I wouldn't say I'm fresh as a daisy. My hands, wrists (especially wrists) and forearms ache somewhat, but a couple of Tylenol makes it go away for the rest of the day. The next day I'm somewhat stiff and sore though.

Would you say that's too much fatigue for use during a zombie apocalypse?

[Skippy911sc]

No matter what firearm you use there will be a bit of fatigue. The only reason the .22LR was my selection was based on using one. If your talking 75-100 feet, I would not be at the receiving end of a .22. I have a .17 and sight in at over 50 yard, this is used to kill varmints in and around my property. I have shot and killed a ground hog (the hell with his shadow) at 35 yards and hit him right in the head. Granted the ballistics on this weapon are a bit different than a .22 but the felt recoil and sound are incredible less than say your shotgun, 5.56/.223, .308, and as far as the previous post talking about a .500 forget that, you would kill yourself with that one in close quarters. I was thinking about 1 weapon that was not extremely loud and that had little recoil where the ammo was plentiful and light. I would shy away from handguns due to accuracy issues, especially under stress.

[Wyldwraith]

Hmm,
Maybe you're right. Although to be fair I live in Florida and often kill rats with my .45. My thinking is that if I can consistently 1-shot rats at 30-40 feet that move in some of the most bizarre and unpredictable manners as they scoot for the underbrush then combined with my range practice I'm completely confident I could deliver headshots on command, IF I could deal with the fear factor of being confronted by cannibalistic dead people.

Your other points are well taken though. The report from my .45 is LOUD, and it would be useless for long range work. That and I'm not really enamored with the idea of trusting my life to a clip fed semi-automatic that might jam, or have the barrel go screwy on me from constant use, or the spring in the clip itself from being constantly compressed (since I wouldn't EVER want my sidearm to be unloaded. Don't care if I'm sleeping in a bank vault with a six foot thick steel door between me and trouble.)

I think that leads me to take the position that I just couldn't be comfortable with only one weapon. I know my .45 extremely well, and I think that would be more important than just about anything else. The need for a rifle or shotgun to supplement the sidearm is apparent though. The only other gun I'm good with is my 12-gauge though. Rifles have always sort of intimidated me in a weird way.

[EvilNed]

How about keeping a cyanide pill safely tucked away, just in case. If you're being surrounded and you know you have no chance of escape, just bite it.

[Staredge]

How about keeping a cyanide pill safely tucked away, just in case. If you're being surrounded and you know you have no chance of escape, just bite it.


Keep count of your rounds, and save the last dance for yourself.:dead:

[SRP76]

I own a S&W .45 pistol that I inherited from my uncle. I take it to the range 4-5 times a month

And there's the whole problem.

If you do something every day, constantly (like you'd have to do in a zombie situation), your body would adapt. Over time, the effects of doing it will decrease more and more, until it doesn't bother you at all.

[Publius]

Ok,
So the consensus seems to be that the .22 round has a significant chance of bouncing off the thick bone of the forehead, although if the round does penetrate the internal ricochets would doom the ghoul.

I'm not a hunter (I just know that .22LR penetrates cardboard boxes and soda cans pretty reliably :D), but I think you're right. The .22's energy is marginal to begin with and drops off rapidly, so your chances of success depend a lot on range and angle of impact. On forums that talk about varmint hunting, consensus seems to be that a .22LR makes a fine squirrel gun, but will not reliably put down, say, coyotes. At extremely close range you'll get the internal ricochet effect you describe, but at longer ranges you may well find that the round has just enough energy to penetrate the skull if you hit straight on or at a thin part, but not enough energy to do much damage inside.

[Skippy911sc]

I will see about a test later this week with my .22LR. I will take several water jugs in a row and shoot them, to see how far the round will penetrate. I will use the standard Remington bulk ammo. I will post agin in this post with some results.

[Publius]

I will see about a test later this week with my .22LR. I will take several water jugs in a row and shoot them, to see how far the round will penetrate. I will use the standard Remington bulk ammo. I will post agin in this post with some results.

That'd be interesting! I just saw a few videos on Youtube where a guy used a .22LR rifle to shatter coconuts at 25, 50, and 100 yards, and a .22LR revolver to shatter coconuts at 30 yards. He also shot a pig head at 25 yards with the rifle and penetrated the skull.

http://www.youtube.com/user/nightstalkerbob

These tests (especially the pig head one) give me some hope that with an accurate rifle and good shot placement, you'd have good results against zombies at 25-50 yards.

[Wyldwraith]

Hmm,
If you want to use water jugs you could either put something pressed up against the jug that's of the approximate thickness/hardness of the skull, or you could fill the jugs with something that might help you as an indicator of the penetration you're getting against resistance.

Publius: I'm completely in agreement. From everything I've experienced, read and heard from others I just couldn't put my life in the metaphorical hands of a .22
There's just too much danger of insufficient penetration at the range I'd want to be at for me to consider it a trustworthy weapon for this purpose.

All of this has definitely shown me the light about rifles though. I think it'd be a good idea for a variety of reasons to get over my issues with them and develop a proficiency.

By the way: When I go to the range I always shoot several silhouettes aiming for headshots. Not because of zombies, but due to the fact that every time you turn around it seems to be getting more and more common for really bad guys to be in body armor, and if someone ever invades my home and tries one of the classic movie cliches like "Put the gun down or your mom gets it" I want another option besides surrendering my weapon. My stepfather and I have discussed several times the benefit of the fact that after dark the two individuals in the house with instant access to and proficiency with firearms are on opposite sides of the home. Unless there are several home invaders (a much more unlikely occurrence than a solo act or a perpetrator with a partner I feel we have a better chance that way of one of us getting to our weapon(s) in time to respond effectively.

Don't get me wrong, I love my family, but no way am I placing all of us at the mercy of some armed psycho who kicked in our door on the strength of his word that if I give up my gun he won't hurt any of us. My mom's first marriage was quite nearly lethal for her, and she's made it crystal clear over the years that she expects me and my brother to do everything in our power not to end up at the mercy of a human predator like she did.

[JasonEdw]

A baseball bat because of 10 reasons:

1)requires no reloading or foraging for new ammo
2)won't get stuck in something if you miss or won't get stuck in corpse while the others are bearing down on you
3)it's quiet
4)requires no fuel
5)lightweight
6)one doesn't need to be an expert to wield one
7)it's common to find or to find again
8)can be used to hold open doors or be used as a lever
9)comes in wood or metal, depending on the survivor's taste
10)works pretty good on the living as well!

[AcesandEights]

A baseball bat because of 10 reasons:

1)requires no reloading or foraging for new ammo
2)won't get stuck in something if you miss or won't get stuck in corpse while the others are bearing down on you
3)it's quiet
4)requires no fuel
5)lightweight
6)one doesn't need to be an expert to wield one
7)it's common to find or to find again
8)can be used to hold open doors or be used as a lever
9)comes in wood or metal, depending on the survivor's taste
10)works pretty good on the living as well!

11) And breaks very easily* :p








*Sponsored by the Lead Pipe Veterans For Truth Committee

[Yojimbo]

A baseball bat because of 10 reasons:

1)requires no reloading or foraging for new ammo


Nothing against Jason, but the more I hear this mantra about blades or clubs not needing reloading, the more I blame Max Brooks and his tounge-in-cheek book that so many are taking as gospel nowdays.

Again, the above statement is not meant as a diss on Jason - some of the reasons he lists are very sound. But as Aces points out, a baseball bat - at least the wooden ones - can break. Also, there are only so many swings you get in a given time period before you get exhausted, and the baseball bat requires you to be within grabbing distance of the ghoul - a little too close for my tastes.

Jason would be better off with a rifle, even if it was just a .22! And if he runs out of bullets, then he can always use the rifle itself as a bludgeon.

[Shadowofthedead]

a rifle in .357mag/ .38 spl and pistol calibered for the same. two revolvers and a lever action would be my get up. the thread was for one weapon im sporting two calibers capable of being used in two guns. since .38 special rounds can be used in most guns chambered in .357 magum... your amount of ammo possibilities is not as finite as others and there are countless relaoding materials avaible for the two calibers. and also the rifle is rated for 100-150 yards. there is really no need to make a shot any further out than that distance. any shot such as would be a waste of ammo. my rig would consist of:

ruger gp 101 .357 magnum or smith and wesson 686 .357 mag. both guns are single action double action. i might carry two of these if permitted. the smith and wesson 686 has a capacity of 7 in the cylinder so one more shot would help.

colt single action army cowboy pistol in .357 mag or some replica single action revolver. shooting in single action requires you two be more accurate with your shots seeing how you cant just keep pulling the trigger like you would in double action.

some model marlin 1894 or henry lever rifle in .357 magum with a scope possibly. depends on whats available.

all these guns use the cartridges stated above. i might carry a magnum research bfr " big freaking revolver" or a smith and wesson 500 in s & w .500 magnum for "BIG" jobs. but i would run out of room on my holster rig and those guns are freaking heavy. you can go into any department store or sporting goods store and find either cartridge. and the foreign stuff is cheap.

other weapons include :

2x gerber big rock??? camp knife non serrated

gerber gator??? machete (this machete has a razor sharp blade and a saw on the back of the blade.... serrated machete orgasm!!!!)

gerber camp axe

and steel toed boots.

ill be back with more gotta change some break pads:elol:

[Staredge]

Baseball bats aren't a bad idea, but sometimes you wanna reach out & touch someone from a distance. Aluminum is the way to go, if just for the weight savings.

I like the .38/.357 idea. With the rise of Cowboy Action Shooting (at least in the US), that ammo is liable to found in a lot more locations than some of the other pistol calibers. The SAA argument is perfect. You are slowed down a bit, allowing you to aim. The other side of that is also because of the way you load. No speedloaders.

[Dillinger]

.22LR is a good pick. Pretty quiet, really common cartridge, and just enough to penetrate decayed flesh. I wouldn't want to use it against renegade bikers though. Not enough firepower. But exclusively for zombies, it's a good choice.

Plus those Ruger 10/22s have like aftermarket clips that hold like 50 rounds or some ****.

[Shadowofthedead]

.22 lr is a good idea if you have a high velocity load. this would compensate for lack of power with normal loads. my favorite .22 lr load is the remington viper hollow point. at around 7 bucks for 100 rounds its pricey but a heck of a rabbit stopper. its velocity is 1500 fps (feet per second) at muzzle and drops off a little over 1000 fps at under 100 yds. highly accurate as well. ill swear by this round. normal remington golden bullet has enough penetration to kill a deer in one shot. i have the deer as proof or whatever is left of her. i was drunk to but i was about 15-20 yards away from her. she ran a little bit but dropped about 50 yards or less from where i shot her. if a 22 round can pass through the rib cage and hit the heart and lungs in one shot on a deer... im skeptical what the lower powered 22 lr round would do to a human skull. and even in the survival guide it noted that you "might" have to be to close for comfort to pull a shot off on a zombie. i would just look up online for ballistics test videos of a 22lr head shot. assassins are known to carry 22lr silenced weapons and why would a company make a silencer for a walther g-22 22lr semiautomatic rifle if it were not used in this way. up for debate think we should start a "!!!NEW!!!" thread for this debate so as not to clutter fruck it up.:elol:

[DjfunkmasterG]

If zombs would take over the and I only had the pick of 1 weapon It would be a chainsaw running around chopping their heads off It would be fun.

what would your weapon be?

And what do you do when you run out of gas?

[fulci fan]

http://www.gundirectory.com/guns/20454-1.jpg

[Trencher]

Baseballbats are bad if you face hordes of zombies because you will tire yourself out, in hand to hand you need something that can get the work done with a minimun of stress. Like the hammers I showed earlier in the thread, it weights more so you can let the hammer do the job rather than doing it yourself.