English people, is this true?

[Trencher]

Check out the article.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/education/article1600686.ece

Who the hell are they worried about insulting with the holocaust?

[SymphonicX]

Never heard of that happening, it certainly never happened to me at school....mind you I think this is just **** teachers having an excuse to be ****, not really worried about offending kids.

[Craig]

While I'd rather believe this isn't true, sadly I wouldn't put it past them to do this... I know it sounds racist but I'm guessing a large amount of the people who the government doesn't wish to offend with the truth, are muslims.

While I don't live in an area of the UK with a massive muslim population, you can't deny how much of an influence they now hold in this country. Mainly because the government is too damn polite.

[SymphonicX]

The thing is, I haven't met a single person of the islamic faith who's been offended by any of this stuff - it's treating them all like holocaust denying, christmas hating nutjobs and if you ask me, that's more racist than anything. I grew up, and have lived, in many areas with predominantly muslim populations and they have mainly all been moderate, normal people.

Mind you I did know some f**king nutcases too, but they were gangsta types and of all creeds and colours.

[Publius]

Who the hell are they worried about insulting with the holocaust?

Put together the Holocaust and the Crusades, and it becomes obvious what the "certain races or religions" are that the Times' editors don't want to mention explicitly.


The thing is, I haven't met a single person of the islamic faith who's been offended by any of this stuff - it's treating them all like holocaust denying, christmas hating nutjobs and if you ask me, that's more racist than anything. I grew up, and have lived, in many areas with predominantly muslim populations and they have mainly all been moderate, normal people.

You're right, but unfortunately the lunatic fringe comes to speak for the whole community, because they're the ones willing to make the most noise. It's just like how in the U.S. friggin' Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson manage to appoint themselves as spokesmen for the whole black community.

[Mike70]

*sighs*

ridiculous is the first word that comes to mind. the truth is the truth no matter who it offends. shying away from it is nothing more than educational cowardice and yet another case of religion (or some sort of nutty ass racist social agenda) over reason.

actually, most of the holocaust haters on this side of the atl that you hear about are white power types. i will have to say i am surprised about the crusades being shied away from, usually anything the paints europeans in a bad light gets a lot of attention.

[Danny]

if they want to stop baa baa black sheep from "offending the coloreds" then yeah, i can believe it.:rolleyes:

[Publius]

Here in California, a 40-year-old tradition of kindergarteners from two neighboring schools dressing up as Pilgrims and Indians and getting together for a Thanksgiving dinner was just shut down because one parent with American Indian ancestry complained to the school board.

[DubiousComforts]

Check out the article.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/education/article1600686.ece
Absolutely appaling if it's true, though the American educational system fares no better when it comes to teaching the Holocaust. It's embarrassing to admit that One of the Most Important Books You've Never Read (http://untoldvalor.blogspot.com/2007/08/one-of-most-important-books-youve-never.html) was not required reading when I was in high school.


"All of Dachaus must remain standing. The Dachaus, the Belsens, the Buchenwalds, the Auschwitzes-all of them. They must remain standing because they are a monument to a moment in time when some men decided to turn the Earth into a graveyard. Into it they shoveled all of their reason, their logic, their knowledge, but worst of all, their conscience. And the moment we forget this, the moment we cease to be haunted by this remembrance, then we become gravediggers."

"I happen to think the singular evil of our time is prejudice. It is from this evil that all other evils grow and multiply. In almost everything I've written, there is a thread of this: man's seemingly palpable need to dislike someone other than himself." - Rod Serling

[Danny]

Absolutely appaling if it's true, though the American educational system fares no better when it comes to teaching the Holocaust. It's embarrassing to admit that One of the Most Important Books You've Never Read (http://untoldvalor.blogspot.com/2007/08/one-of-most-important-books-youve-never.html) was not required reading when I was in high school.


"All of Dachaus must remain standing. The Dachaus, the Belsens, the Buchenwalds, the Auschwitzes-all of them. They must remain standing because they are a monument to a moment in time when some men decided to turn the Earth into a graveyard. Into it they shoveled all of their reason, their logic, their knowledge, but worst of all, their conscience. And the moment we forget this, the moment we cease to be haunted by this remembrance, then we become gravediggers."

"I happen to think the singular evil of our time is prejudice. It is from this evil that all other evils grow and multiply. In almost everything I've written, there is a thread of this: man's seemingly palpable need to dislike someone other than himself." - Rod Serling

thats more eloquent than i would put it but yeah thats how i feel. there was this show about jerry springer looking up his past and almst all of them were killed in concentration camps during WWII, at one point he was standing in a train with barb wire around the windows and crying, it wasnt a replica but the real deal, and whilst seeing those horrific things sure youll get angry that we could do this to each other as a species and whatnot but you couldn't get rid of it because its a constant reminder of humanity at its worst for future generations to avoid the mistakes of the past.

[Trencher]

Are there any Muslims on the boards that can confirm or deny this?

Muslims trying to cover up the Holocaust makes as much sense as Mexicans trying to cover up the Viking raids.

[Craig]

Are there any Muslims on the boards that can confirm or deny this?

Muslims trying to cover up the Holocaust makes as much sense as Mexicans trying to cover up the Viking raids.
Islam is a very anti-semitic if I'm not mistaken, at least, fanatic Islam is.

[Neil]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/aug/21/birthofamyth

[Craig]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/aug/21/birthofamyth
So it's not true? Well I'm more surprised at that then when I read it was true.

[Trencher]

That link posted buy Neil only debunk a email campain. It does not say anything about the article link I posted. Are there any board members here who are going to an English school? Can you tell if you are teached about the holocaust or not?

[Tricky]

They only very briefly skimmed over the holocaust when i was at school & that was 11 years ago,i would imagine by now after 10 years of labour they dont teach much about it at all!luckily enough history books & museums exist to make sure its not forgotten,as long as people care to learn about it.
Muslims also took part in the Holocaust anyway,especially in the balkan regions,and that was before Israel even existed so they cant blame it on that, look up the waffen SS "handschar" division,the grand mufti of jerusalem & their war crimes, that part almost certainly wont be taught in schools,but its yet another dirty stain on islams past that shouldnt be forgotten...

[MinionZombie]

Really? When I was at school it was WW2 every single year, each year we'd go into even greater miniscule depth into a handful of topics related to WW2, rather than understanding the conflict over all and it's time line.

The number of times we did WW2 stuff, and it was always when the German exchange students were over. :lol:

It was that, or Henry VIII usually.

I don't know how much of it is taught these days, but it bloody well should be taught every single year, it's pretty much THE event of the 20th Century.

What should be changed though, is how it's taught - there needs to be more of an over all understanding of it, and history in general, none of this miniscule focussing on one or two little moments in history - like Calvinism, christ that was a pain in my ass, it was bloody awful learning that, such minute detail and you gained no general understanding or that period of history.

So far more general understanding of history across time is needed I say, and then you can get a bit more specific the higher up you go - GCSE, A-Level, and then of course really get into the detail at university.

That's how it should be - but we can't have that, because that'd make sense. :mad:

[lullubelle]

I am not English, but I believe that if this were to be true it is a big mistake, just because you do speak about it, it does not mean it never happen, hiding or not talking about something does not make it go away, and as its often said, "those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it"

[Craig]

That link posted buy Neil only debunk a email campain. It does not say anything about the article link I posted. Are there any board members here who are going to an English school? Can you tell if you are teached about the holocaust or not?
Well I'm probably about the youngest Brit here, I officially left school earlier this year and I can tell you we definitely learnt about the Holocaust, in Year 9 I believe. There was even a visit to Krakow which I unfortunately didn't have the money to go on :(

[Trencher]

Well I'm probably about the youngest Brit here, I officially left school earlier this year and I can tell you we definitely learnt about the Holocaust, in Year 9 I believe. There was even a visit to Krakow which I unfortunately didn't have the money to go on :(
And were there Muslims at the school who did not protest?

[MinionZombie]

I take it you didn't take GCSE History then? I'm not sure whether that's a must-do or a true choice at GCSE level these days ... when I was doing GCSE history we went to Belgium and walked in the trenches, saw the grave yards etc. Quite something.

[Tricky]

I take it you didn't take GCSE History then? I'm not sure whether that's a must-do or a true choice at GCSE level these days ... when I was doing GCSE history we went to Belgium and walked in the trenches, saw the grave yards etc. Quite something.

I was in Belgium this week with work, didnt get to do much sight seeing but i drove halfway across the country & could see evidence of the trenches in some of the fields at the side of the road!it all looks so normal now though,hard to imagine the worst war in history happened there!
The Belgian guy who met me when i got off the ferry works for our company & was telling me about in world war 2 the germans built a huge ammunition store under zeebrugge docks which was never emptied after the war,so its absolutely packed with all sorts,and a huge gas terminal has been built over the top of it,he says he hopes it never explodes as he lives 2km from the docks :eek:

[MinionZombie]

in world war 2 the germans built a huge ammunition store under zeebrugge docks which was never emptied after the war,so its absolutely packed with all sorts,and a huge gas terminal has been built over the top of it,he says he hopes it never explodes as he lives 2km from the docks

First thing I thought about with that was a zombie invasion.

[Craig]

Of course I took GCSE history, from what I remember the two big subjects were Apartheid and Nazi Germany in the interwar years.

...and Trencher no there weren't any muslims who complained, mainly because there weren't any muslims :lol:

[MinionZombie]

Of course I took GCSE history, from what I remember the two big subjects were Apartheid and Nazi Germany in the interwar years.

...and Trencher no there weren't any muslims who complained, mainly because there weren't any muslims :lol:
Got confused for a moment there, I got thrown off when I read "Year 9", wasn't reading close enough. :)

Interesting, we never touched on Apartheid at all ... we did do a LOT of Germany though. :D

We did a lot of The Tudors, especially the likes of Henry VIII ... there was also Calvinism, which I mentioned before ... which was the sh*ttest subject ever, I absolutely hated learning about Calvinism and had to re-take an exam on the subject (which I'd never had to do before) ... but this was at the time that the educational authorities were faffing around with the marking systems thanks to Blair's wondrous "education education education" bullsh*te that completely raped A-Level learning when I was there (we were the first year to do A/S Level and then onto A-Level - since then it's just gone down hill and nobody trusts the grades anymore, superb work Blair & Co, really :rolleyes:).

Anyway ... hehe, yeah my high school wasn't exactly a hive of multi-culturalism, although I'd be wary of that sort of society anyway, 'multi-culturalism' always being paraded around by social engineering busy bodies, champagne socialists and general morons who don't know that people like to mingle as they so please at random, or according to what feels comfortable as a community (across the skin colour spectrum) ... but yeah, stepping away from that mini-rant in itself, my high school was pretty much all white - but then it is a semi-rural high school in the shires.

You'd get a couple of Indian kids, or maybe Asian kids, although they often came from families who were connected to the local take away joints in town - which makes sense in a way.

The Golden Horse - the chinese take away I frequent when I get the chance - ah mate, I love that place, been getting food from there since I was eight years old. :cool:

Where was I? ... not sure ... nevermind ... *starts dreaming of Chinese take away*

[Craig]

Yeah, I live right on the South coast of Dorset, just on the West Country fringe so in that respect it's quite rural but at the same time I live in the second largest city of said county which makes a coloured face nothing unusual at all. I have to agree with your 'mini-rant' on multiculturalism, too.

On the history, I also remember we did Ancient medicine as well, probably the least interesting part of the course for me personally... I really don't remember a lot about my last two years since I wasn't all there mentally and had to drop-out of school for reasons I'd rather not talk about 'cause they just make me sound like a whiney teen :lol: