More quality teenage behaviour. Killed over a £4 bottle of wine...

[Neil]

http://www.metro.co.uk/news/article.html?Father_beaten_to_death_over_bottle_of _wine&in_article_id=504272&in_page_id=34

[MikePizzoff]

Jesus christ. Kids can get far too out of hand when fighting.

Years back, in high school, a of 17 year old friend of mine was wrongfully tried as an adult and thrown in prison for a fight that happened in my town. A big group of kids, whom he was associated with, jumped one kid and beat him into a coma. It was very big news around here for months (the trials and everything) and even made nation-wide a couple of times. Thankfully, my buddy only ended up doing like 4 months in the clink and stuff got worked out.

The other kids, though... not good. Most of them were younger and weren't tried as adults. I think all but a couple of them got released, however they're most likely still on probation for a while. I do know that at least one of them had to serve time as a juvenile, then was switched over to an adult prison once he turned 18. Not sure how long he'll be in for.

[_liam_]

The Clockwork Orange stuff is getting out of hand. People just need to have fewer kids & raise them better

[krakenslayer]

The Clockwork Orange stuff is getting out of hand. People just need to have fewer kids & raise them better

Yeah, the majority of people have better life prospects and are (quite rightly) holding off having kids until their are in their thirties and forties, while the minority (soon to be majority?) of lowlife thugs are the ones having shitloads of kids at 15 because they don't know or care about contraception and they've fucked up their lives and don't have anything else to look forward to. :(

[_liam_]

Yeah I don't get it? Why doesn't contraception work for idiots... how hard is it to take a pill every day or get a jab every three months

People say oh muh muhh some girls react to the pill

er

then use a condom...?!

Seriously, I know they're shit, but they're not as shit as being stuck with a kid

[krakenslayer]

Yeah I don't get it? Why doesn't contraception work for idiots... how hard is it to take a pill every day or get a jab every three months

People say oh muh muhh some girls react to the pill

er

then use a condom...?!

Seriously, I know they're shit, but they're not as shit as being stuck with a kid

Not unless you're too lazy to work and you see having a kid as your ticket to getting a house and a decent income, and screw actually bothering to look after or raise the little brat.

[Chic Freak]

Not unless you're too lazy to work and you see having a kid as your ticket to getting a house and a decent income, and screw actually bothering to look after or raise the little brat.

Exactly.

Plus I've noticed that slaggy people (male and female) who have no qualms whatsoever about drunkenly shagging all and sundry are often oddly shy about going to a doctor and actually saying "I want contraception." It's a strange and typically British double-standard...

Also bear in mind that one of the major ways people decide whether they are "normal" (i.e. safe) is not through logic but through a process of social comparison- so if your mates all say they don't bother with contraception or that having a baby is a great and normal shortcut to the top of the waiting list for a council home etc, you're more inclined to believe it yourself.

If condoms have negative associations in your peer group you're also more likely to risk not using them because the last thing you want when you fish a condom out of your wallet at the crucial moment is for the other person to laugh/ roll their eyes/ decide they aren't that up for it after all.

(Fortunately I spent my formative years in the company of teenage boys who naturally lived in fear of getting a girl pregnant so that attitude rubbed off and I've been on the pill (and, briefly, the injection) more or less constantly since I was 15. So there will be no Alien-like creatures gestating in my torso for 9 whole months before bursting out of genitals and then demanding my time and money. Hurrah!)

They should give out condoms in schools, and all school toilets should have condom machines if you're too embarrassed to go to the office to get free ones. The idea that it's normal to get contraception as part of having sex needs to be implanted at an earlier age.

First person to say "but that would encourage underage kids to sex each other when they wouldn't have otherwise" is a willy-face :p

EDIT: Sorry for going off on one about teen contraception there... and yes it is appalling that a man was beaten to death in front of his daughter for refusing to be robbed. I can't imagine what his family must be going through.

[capncnut]

Ewww, a £4 bottle of wine from Costcutters? Oh and how were these yobs gonna open it? I take it one of them had a corkscrew handy.

On a serious note though, it's pretty disgusting when a human life is snuffed out over something so minimal like a bottle of wine. I suspect he probably told them where to go when they demanded the bottle and was beaten because of that. In any case, it will be interesting to see what happens to the fifteen-year-old in regards to sentencing.

[Tricky]

Ewww, a £4 bottle of wine from Costcutters? Oh and how were these yobs gonna open it? I take it one of them had a corkscrew handy.

On a serious note though, it's pretty disgusting when a human life is snuffed out over something so minimal like a bottle of wine. I suspect he probably told them where to go when they demanded the bottle and was beaten because of that. In any case, it will be interesting to see what happens to the fifteen-year-old in regards to sentencing.

Nothing will happen,a friend of a friend was beaten to death by a 16 year old back in august round here ( http://www.bridlingtonfreepress.co.uk/condolence/Breaking-News-Assault-victim-Paul.4396510.jp ) and apparently initially the judge said the shit who did it would be getting charged with murder,no question,but now the trial has been called off because he has agreed to plead guilty to manslaughter instead,so he'll likely be out before he gets to the age of the lad he killed,sickening :mad:

[MinionZombie]

Tricky - Manslaughter? You knowingly KILL someone, and that translates to manslaughter ... HOW?

This country is fucking sick, no bones about it - we need some fucking change of our own, thank you very much.

Liam - damn right this Clockwork Orange shit is out of hand ... incidentally I recently re-watched ACO (twice) for the first time in years - a superb film. Although of course, these acts aren't encouraged by ACO - the sort of shits who'd gladly murder someone over a four quid bottle of wine would call ACO "gay" because it was made before 2000 ... but it's a sad thing that ACO was right about the future (now the present).

Actually I'm really bummed out by this now, it's a sick and fucked up Britain out there these days - and what's being done about? Bung up some more CCTV.

Like I've said before many-a-time, I'd rather have a bobby on the beat who can run to my aid and prevent me from being murdered, than simply have a CCTV recording of my murder to be played in a court before my weeping family and the sneering little shits who did the act, only for them to be awarded slack sentences that get reduced afterwards anyway.

Fuck that shit. :mad:

And obviously - I hope I never have to be in such a situation, and I hope nobody here ever has to be either, and I'd dearly hope that nobody full stop would ever have to suffer such an ordeal. :(

[Tricky]

As it turns out the trials finished today,the murdering scumbag will be out before the end of this year,how the hell can they call that justice?????:mad::mad:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/humber/7854523.stm

[AcesandEights]

As it turns out the trials finished today,the murdering scumbag will be out before the end of this year,how the hell can they call that justice?????:mad::mad:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/humber/7854523.stm

Hrm...I wish that article had allowed comments!

[MinionZombie]

It just goes to show that Punishment and Justice are corrupt ideas in present day Britain - and it's disgusting - it's literally costing lives, destroying lives, and letting pieces of shit quite literally get away with murder.

Absolutely sick. :(

[Chic Freak]

You knowingly KILL someone, and that translates to manslaughter ... HOW?

I believe that manslaughter is defined along the lines of intent to cause harm, but being unable to prove that the person intended to actually kill their victim- e.g. if someone killed another person in a street fight it would be hard to prove whether he actually intended to kill him, or "just" beat him up.

Being out of prison in under a year for manslaughter or even GBH beggars belief. And I am very sorry to hear about your loss, Tricky.

[SRP76]

This will continue to happen as long as people stand by and allow it.

This man was beaten to death in a public street, near his home, in a neighborhood. In fact, neighbors who were interviewed give the impression that this is a high-crime area, so they must see this sort of thing a lot.

And yet, nobody stands up against this shit. They just live in the neighborhood, and let a bunch of punks rule their lives. A "no-go" area? These people let thugs scare them into hiding in their homes! What is wrong with people? You can't just let a man get beat to death on your front lawn. Grow some balls.

[Tricky]

Being out of prison in under a year for manslaughter or even GBH beggars belief. And I am very sorry to hear about your loss, Tricky.

To be honest i didnt know the lad,i'd probably met him in passing before,but he was a good friend of a girl im very good friends with & shes obviously devastated,theres nothing i can say to make her feel better either :( i just cant believe such a lenient sentence has been passed :stunned:

[kortick]

there are nights where i would have killed for wine.
anyways...

there are ways around the underage killers getting away with it.
we had a monster here named craig price. He BUTCHERED 2 women and
2 children, I remember them finding the bodies of the kids
in a shed chopped up in garbage bags.

google craig price.

this from wikipedia
"Craig Price (also known as the Warwick Slasher) is a serial killer from Warwick, Rhode Island. He was arrested in 1989 at age 15 for four murders committed in his neighborhood: A woman and her two daughters that year, and the murder of another woman two years prior. He had a previous criminal record for petty theft.

After he was discovered, Price calmly confessed to his crimes. Arrested a month before his 16th birthday, he was tried and convicted as a minor. By law, this meant that he would be released and his criminal records sealed as soon as he turned 21. Price bragged that he would "make history" when he was released. The case led to changes in state law to allow juveniles to be tried as adults for serious crimes, but these could not be applied retroactively to Price.

Due to the brutality of his crimes and the opinion of state psychologists that he was a poor candidate for rehabilitation, a group called Citizens Opposed to the Release of Craig Price formed to lobby for his continued imprisonment. Price was charged with a variety of crimes, including criminal contempt for refusing a psychological evaluation, extortion for threatening a corrections officer, and assault and violation of probation for fights while in prison. He was sentenced to an additional 10–25 years, depending on his cooperation with treatment.

Price maintains that he has paid his debt to society, and that he is being kept in jail partially due to racism."

He thought he was going to serve 4 years for multiple murders
but now he is serving 10-25 years, and had to be removed
from RI prison to Florida for his own safety.

If people take a stand these underage
killers WILL serve full sentences.
We did it here.
We changed the law and locked this animal in a cage
like he deserves to be.
The question is why aren't you doing it where you live?

[Neil]

there are nights where i would have killed for wine.
anyways...

there are ways around the underage killers getting away with it.
we had a monster here named craig price. He BUTCHERED 2 women and
2 children, I remember them finding the bodies of the kids
in a shed chopped up in garbage bags.

google craig price.

this from wikipedia
"Craig Price (also known as the Warwick Slasher) is a serial killer from Warwick, Rhode Island. He was arrested in 1989 at age 15 for four murders committed in his neighborhood: A woman and her two daughters that year, and the murder of another woman two years prior. He had a previous criminal record for petty theft.

After he was discovered, Price calmly confessed to his crimes. Arrested a month before his 16th birthday, he was tried and convicted as a minor. By law, this meant that he would be released and his criminal records sealed as soon as he turned 21. Price bragged that he would "make history" when he was released. The case led to changes in state law to allow juveniles to be tried as adults for serious crimes, but these could not be applied retroactively to Price.

Due to the brutality of his crimes and the opinion of state psychologists that he was a poor candidate for rehabilitation, a group called Citizens Opposed to the Release of Craig Price formed to lobby for his continued imprisonment. Price was charged with a variety of crimes, including criminal contempt for refusing a psychological evaluation, extortion for threatening a corrections officer, and assault and violation of probation for fights while in prison. He was sentenced to an additional 10–25 years, depending on his cooperation with treatment.

Price maintains that he has paid his debt to society, and that he is being kept in jail partially due to racism."

He thought he was going to serve 4 years for multiple murders
but now he is serving 10-25 years, and had to be removed
from RI prison to Florida for his own safety.

If people take a stand these underage
killers WILL serve full sentences.
We did it here.
We changed the law and locked this animal in a cage
like he deserves to be.
The question is why aren't you doing it where you live?


Taking this to the extreme we had the Jamie Bulger. Killed (horribly) by Robert Thompson and Jon Venables who were 10 years old. They were released after 8 years, and given new identities and new life in Australia (I believe). One them now has a child of their own...

Horrible stuff - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_James_Bulger


So after 8 years they get a new life, where as the family have lost their loved one forever, in the most horrible way!

[Chic Freak]

This will continue to happen as long as people stand by and allow it.

They just live in the neighborhood, and let a bunch of punks rule their lives. A "no-go" area? These people let thugs scare them into hiding in their homes! What is wrong with people? You can't just let a man get beat to death on your front lawn. Grow some balls.

That is sooo much easier in theory than in practice though :(

In a really bad "no go" area, just a handful of people standing up will get knocked back down, reinforcing the idea in the rest of the community's minds that it is safer to put up with the situation than try to change it.

You might think that if you lived in a terrible area with kids it would encourage you to change things, but I think the reality is that it would make you less likely to make a stand for fear of your family being targeted in response.

About the only thing I can honestly say that I would be brave enough to do in that situation is call the police- and they often take their time when it comes to sorting out violence in a bad area so they don't get beaten up themselves :mad:

EDIT: I am not saying that it's good or even sensible to do nothing, just that a little sympathy should be given to people who have grown up knowing only that a) people are bad, b) they themselves are weak and incapable, and c) nothing can change :(

I know we fortunately didn't grow up with those lessons; but they're difficult to shake when a) you've been brought up with them and b) your environment appears to confirm their validity.

Again- I am not excusing, but rather trying to explain.

[MinionZombie]

I know - the Bulger case was exceptionally shocking, the stuff that those two evil kids did to that poor toddler is beyond understanding.

As for "why is nobody doing anything?" - what we have in Britain is a "broken society", if I dare be so bold to use the phrase.

You've got people who don't trust the cops to do their jobs, cops who are bound by red tape and target chasing, you've got softies in charge of the cops, you've got gangs who know that they can literally get away with murder and prowl the streets like feral beings doing whatever they like.

As a result, the good people are living in fear and want to desperately stay under the radar - because you know how it is - try and rally a group, and at least half will not follow through with their support - then you've got a minority trying to face up to a majority, and it's all going to end in tears (most likely literally).

What's needed is - tough cops catching these shits, and the judges to be dishing out tough sentences - and then of course (or rather first, to predict the rise in criminal population) you need the prisons to house these thugs.

In prison, they should only get minimal creature comforts in all honesty - we can't treat them like animals, otherwise we become animals, and you need something to distract them from getting up to mischief - but keep it at the bare minimum.

In addition these thugs should be made to do menial work (kind of like in America where prisoners make license plates and such).

Nevermind "community support officers" - they're not real cops, they're mocked by the thugs, can't do squat for the victims and they're even a joke (and/or a nuisance) to the public at large.

Real cops catching these bastards, proper judges dishing out real sentences, and the shits getting banged up and PUNISHED for their crimes.

This shit in the UK has gotten far too out of hand, with Blair and Brown doing absolutely F*** ALL to stop it.

We need some f***ing change in the UK.