tools of the trade

[Shadowofthedead]

lets discuss tools of the trade shall we? what do you all think is a better weapon class for destroying the romero zombie and human threats? melee blade? melee blunt? pistol any caliber? rifle any caliber? shotgun? pick your class or classes, explain use, and why this class works better for you or anyone. if there is any classes i missed let me know. throw in homemade weapons and explosives if need be. or just feel free to dump in your current setup or your favorite setup. i feel we dont have enough of these type of threads so i made this up. lets hear it kids.

i have an odd type of weapon that im sure someone would only use on cars... a two foot or 24" breaker bar. feels good in the hands and hurts like crap when you get hit by one. would be good choice for secondary weapon only down fall would be shiny chrome body unless matte black. also good use for blown tires on side of road.:elol:

[FoodFight]

The lightsaber. A graceful weapon from a more civilised age. Not as random or clumsy as a blaster.

Actually your breaker bar idea has a lot of merit for everyday use. It's not a prepared weapon, as it is legitimately used for automotive purposes "See officer, it's the proper sized socket for lug nuts!. I just haven't put it away since changing that flat..." so it's not like you're off looking for trouble.

[fartpants]

gotta be the good old flamethrower for me, no need for any skill just point and squirt

[Safari Mike]

My most valuable tool in any survival situation is a good knife. With it I can fabricate a spear, staff, club, dress animals, etc..... If I had a choice of firearms its a .22 rifle. With it and a knife, I am pretty much fine.

[Thorn]

Taking fire out of the equation I will go with melee edged weapons such as an axe or a halberd. I am a fan of hammers as well, not household hammers but more like a war hammer. Long shaft, spiked end... offering the best of both words.

[Mr.G]

Vorpal Blade? :)

[Eyebiter]

+5 Throw and Return Meat Cleaver

[Philly_SWAT]

My answer to this question would be "as wide a variety as possible", depending on means. Assuming I had a fortified location that I was using as a base, all foraging missions would include looking for more weapons, unless I was literally out of storage space for such items. Even then, I would look for better weapons and replace as neccesary. TO quote the Matrix..."Guns. Lots of guns". I would want as many firearms that I could get, as long as I could also find ample ammo for that particular gun. I would also want melee weapons. Although the thought of using a flame thrower seems cool, it would be heavy and not convenient to carry to a new location, would require refilling of the fuel source, and the fire itself could become dangerous to me, either accidentally shooting my base, or a zed on fire advancing and catching me or my base on fire.

Guns would be my first preference. Less effort to use than melee weapons. If ammo ran out, then I would resort to melee. Blunt weapons would be good too...blades need to be sharpened and cleaned. A baseball bat for example wouldnt. If I had to abondon the base for whatever reason, I would look to take as many firearms/ammo as I could, and the handiest non-firearm weapons. If I was on foot, obviously I could only carry so much, and the more I carry, the more energy I expend in carrying it. I would try to take whatever weapons I had the most success with in my previous zed fighting experience.

It could be possible that at any minute, my base could be beseiged and overrun, and I might have only a few moments to grab some stuff and run. With this in mind, I would try to carry on my person as much as I could all the time, lightweight small items. Definately a knife (or two, or three), at least two pistols on a gunbelt with ammo, possible other smaller pistols in a leg holster or something. Whatever was not too cumbersome to perform everyday tasks. So I would already have some stuff on my person. I would also try to leave compatiable stuff laying together near varying possible exits from the base, so I could grab a rifle and appropriate ammo without having to search for what goes with what. During a zombie apocalypse, with no job, etc. demanding my time, there would be plenty of time for proper preparation for things like this.

[AcesandEights]

As always, my answer remains the same: lead pipe.

Sure, I'd want a gun, but you better believe I'd have a blunt weapon handy. One that doesn't break.

[mista_mo]

A High Constitution, and a very high Fortitude save.

[Shadowofthedead]

myself personally i love guns and knives. i think the best type of gun all around would be any type of shot gun. lots of uses but ammo is cumbersome to pack in heavy loads. where i live im not even supposed to think gun let alone have one so i collect knives. ive got a variety of knives but i want something in the 11-12 inch blade range for maximum effectiveness and also my personal taste. but nothing beats the random shit you pick up on the street. i love nails in wood planks so much fun!!!

[zombieparanoia]

Probably something like the HK MP-7, a pistol sized weapon with better range and magazine capacity than a pistol which can also be used in burst fire as ti may be needed to be used against people too.

http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg49-e.htm

for in close a good solid machete, maybe something like a long kukhri.
http://www.coldsteel.com/allterrain1.html

[Danny]

A High Constitution, and a very high Fortitude save.

that zombie roles for initiative your still f-ed up.

seriously though, this topic seems to be more for the weapon fetishist than me. talking about preferred ways to make things die aint my bag. even in a fantasy capacity is slightly creepy to me.


-but if push comes to shove....

monster truck with chainsaw wheels.

[Wooley]

For humans intent on doing me harm? Electrically initiated IEDs from a concealed position, then mop up with either a scoped deer rifle or a belt fed machine gun.

For zombies, scoped deer rifle or a lightweight carbine such as the M-4 with a reflex red dot sight like the Aimpoint M68 CCO. Distance is always going to be your friend when extra ammo, medical care, and help are limited or just not there. Distance lets you choose when, or even if you'll fight, and it gives you the space to run if you choose to do that too.

[Edison Carter]

Spackle bucket as a form 1/2 filled with cement
100 feet of rope with one end set in the cement.
Gloves,....high obs. point drop,...rinse,repeat as necessary.

[Yojimbo]

I would like this package:

M-1 .30 cal Carbine 181

Raging Thirty 182



Or this one:
Marlin .357/.38 Lever Action184

Ruger Speed Six 357 185


And regardless of whatever package I would always want to have this strapped to my hip:

Vietnam/Special Forces type Tomahawk 183

[lullubelle]

Forget knives, fire, I would want two weapons

1: 10A4C Wincherster Carabine with plenty ammo

2: Smith and Wesson 9mm pistol ( for close encouters )

Machine Gun would be better not sure if I could get it online :D


I would like this package:

M-1 .30 cal Carbine 181

Raging Thirty 182



Or this one:
Marlin .357/.38 Lever Action184

Ruger Speed Six 357 185


And regardless of whatever package I would always want to have this strapped to my hip:

Vietnam/Special Forces type Tomahawk 183

WOW...... I like the way you pack, in case of an uprising I know who I am hanging out with :D

[Yojimbo]

WOW...... I like the way you pack, in case of an uprising I know who I am hanging out with :D
Thanks Lulu. BTW: Excellent choice with the Armalite AR-10 A4 .308 Winchester (I think that's the one you are referring to.) In the event of the dead coming back and walking around you are more than welcome to come and hang with me and my wife!

[strayrider]

Zombies: Ruger 10/22

Humans: Ruger 10/22 (then whatever they happened to be carrying)

http://www.reloadbench.com/ubb/smilies/icon-67.gif

-stray-

[Yojimbo]

Zombies: Ruger 10/22

Humans: Ruger 10/22 (then whatever they happened to be carrying)

http://www.reloadbench.com/ubb/smilies/icon-67.gif

-stray-
Yeah, I have always toyed with the idea of outfitting with a .22 as a primary, since you can find .22 rimfire ammo practically everywhere and can haul thousands of rounds on your person at a lighter weight than if you are humping .308 or 12 gauge 00 buck, but I've always been concerned with the stopping power of a .22. I wonder if it would be sufficient able to put down a crazed meth head swinging a machete while he is running at me and cursing. I mean, if I put ten rounds of .22 into some fool's chest who is coming at me I am certain that he will die eventually, but worried that he will live long enough to make it to my position with his machete. This has always been the reason why I have gone .30 cal and above.

I guess it is moot, however, since if some dude is crazy and determined enough he might be able to do you harm even if you blow out his lungs with a .45 semi-jacketed hollow-point. So in that regard, maybe you've got the right idea going with the Ruger 10/22 which is a fine and accurate piece (I got two at home!)

[FoodFight]

And the .22LR is easily suppressed on that platform. A practical consideration if the dead walk.:D

[strayrider]

I guess it is moot, however, since if some dude is crazy and determined enough he might be able to do you harm even if you blow out his lungs with a .45 semi-jacketed hollow-point. So in that regard, maybe you've got the right idea going with the Ruger 10/22 which is a fine and accurate piece (I got two at home!)

You hit someone with a .45 they are going DOWN (crazed, or not). The .45 is a big, slow-moving round. It doesn't have the penetrating power of smaller, higher velocity bullets so it doesn't "punch through" a person's body. It hits, penetrates to a certain depth, then stops. All of that left over kinetic energy is then transferred to the body resulting in an immediate effect. It's called "knockdown", or "stopping power".

So, I guess I'll add a holstered 1911 to my list of "tools".

:D

-stray-

[Yojimbo]

You hit someone with a .45 they are going DOWN (crazed, or not). The .45 is a big, slow-moving round. It doesn't have the penetrating power of smaller, higher velocity bullets so it doesn't "punch through" a person's body. It hits, penetrates to a certain depth, then stops. All of that left over kinetic energy is then transferred to the body resulting in an immediate effect. It's called "knockdown", or "stopping power".

So, I guess I'll add a holstered 1911 to my list of "tools".

:D

-stray-

Well stated.

I guess advantages as well as disadvantages can be found with whatever weapon one chooses, but I think that I would err to the side that has better stopping power when the dead start to walk. Like always, I am more worried about the other survivors than I am the hurricane, or the ghouls. Maybe a .45 long arm and sidearm is a nice way to go? Any recommendations for a long arm .45, Stray?

[strayrider]

Any recommendations for a long arm .45, Stray?

Specifically for .45 ACP, there are a few. But, keep in mind that this round was originally developed for pistols (hence ACP, Automatic Colt Pistol). Because of this, its accuracy suffers at longer ranges. From what I've read, you get decent results out to about 100-yards.

Here are a couple of examples: http://www.gundirectory.com/body.asp?gun=Rifle&pp=1&sort=-3&ammoID=450&ammo=.45%20ACP&ammoD=.45+Automatic+Colt+Pistole

I personally wouldn't go with a .45 ACP long gun but, heck, if there was one laying on the ground I sure wouldn't leave it lay either. ;)

:D

-stray-

[Crappingbear]

The .45 might be the best defensive/offensive pistol caliber ever invented for stopping power balanced with controllability for followup shots; its a great package and not called the "flying ashtray" for nothing.

I've always believed if I could only have one firearm it would be a .22 rifle. The Ruger 10/22 is probably the best one out there for many reasons as Stray chose. In an armageddon situation, I wouldn't be unhappy with a break open single shot .22 rifle. Very few working parts to break or wear out, no magazines to break/wear out, good accuracy and extremely easy cleanability. Sure you could eventually scavange up some solvent and oil or replacements which semi-autos must have but lets say you can't. In that situation, a break top single shot is going to go bang for a long time dirty and dry. Granted, you can't get caught in a situation of needing a high rate of fire but with any short distance at all you could walk around popping zombies all day long with a single shot. Against humans, you don't need to kill them unless they are right up on you. You wound one with a .22 and they are in a world of trouble in a zom world. Blowing out someones knee might be crueler than just dropping them in this type of world.

A good knife would be the no 1 tool though as so much of your survival depends on it.

Back in the old days I brought up the idea of using electricity as an offensive/defensive mechanism with varying views of agreement and disagreement so I'll mention it again. For instance.....

In Dawn in the mall when the bikers were coming to raid and intrusion was inevitable, why not open up the fire hose valves on the ground floor to start flooding it, then from the 2nd floor drop off extension cord with exposed wire end to electrify the water. Sooner or later, the bikers would make some kind of contact and get a little surprise. You would only have to be careful of electrical transferance up to metal items on the 2nd floor.

In a rural situation use a similar method. There is always barbed wire on a farm or ranch, so just loosely unstring it and encircle the house. Run your 110 extension cord out to the barbed wire to make it live. Be a hell of a surprise for anyone sneaking up on your place.

Downsides are if no electricity. Also, after something big enough hitting it you will probably blow breakers sooner or later but it would work pretty good at least once. Some will say zoms aren't effected by electricity but I think they would since they are "brain" oriented so there must be some type of electrical stimulation going on and electricity will disrupt that.

Anyway, its just one more thing to try vs wading into them with a baseball bat or trying to be Sgt York and burning through all your ammo.

[strayrider]

Here's the variety of 10/22 rifles that are available.

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firearms/FAProdResults?function=famid&famid=39&variation=10/22%AE%20Rimfire&bct=Yes&type=Rifle

I think I'd go with any of the 20" barrel models. I believe you'd get very good accuracy out to about 300-yards and still have the velocity to penetrate a skull with the .22LR round.

There's even a pink stocked model for the ladies (or, I suppose, for the sissy boys). Still, in a TEOTWAWKI scenario, I sure wouldn't leave it laying on the ground (I'd just spray paint it black, or rub it down with mud, or something ... either that, or I'd have to dress up in some Osh Kosh short-short overalls and do my hair up in a Richard Simmons pixie afro cut, then prance my way across the barren landscape shooting zombies ... or scratching their eyes out ... :o )

:D

-stray-

[MaximusIncredulous]

How would the gun folks deal with rust on blued weapons and limited solvents such as naval jelly? Even without firing them, rust can be a pain in the ass on blued guns. Would everyone go stainless steel?

[strayrider]

How would the gun folks deal with rust on blued weapons and limited solvents such as naval jelly? Even without firing them, rust can be a pain in the ass on blued guns. Would everyone go stainless steel?

Rust would only be a problem if one failed to keep the weapon clean. And then only rust inside the barrel and on certain moving parts would cause problems. A firearm won't last forever. It'll eventually wear out, but, by keeping it clean it should last for years and 10s of thousands of rounds fired.

Any type of oil can be used to lubricate the weapon, as long as it is used sparingly and often. A single bottle of motor oil would last for years.

:D

-stray-

[Yojimbo]

Rust would only be a problem if one failed to keep the weapon clean. And then only rust inside the barrel and on certain moving parts would cause problems. A firearm won't last forever. It'll eventually wear out, but, by keeping it clean it should last for years and 10s of thousands of rounds fired.

Any type of oil can be used to lubricate the weapon, as long as it is used sparingly and often. A single bottle of motor oil would last for years.

:D

-stray-


Agreed. Vaseline would work in a pinch to protect weapons for long term storage. Olive oil, motor oil, even canola oil would do for lubrication and cleaning.

[AcesandEights]

Agreed. Vaseline would work in a pinch to protect weapons for long term storage. Olive oil, motor oil, even canola oil would do for lubrication and cleaning.

Excellent. All stuff I have on hand in spades!

:shifty:

I mean...all stuff I should be able to...salvage...easily once needed. ;)

[Shadowofthedead]

i still like the idea of .357 mag/ .38 spl package deal but i wont argue with .22 lr except that i wouldnt feel confident going up against someone with say a full auto ak. i would run for the hills. im not the type of person to do so thats why i would pack for anything. i still would carry lots of melee weapons i like the idea of hacking a head off better than blowing it to hell. let the next hippie wearing sandals get bit... ha jk.:elol:

[Crappingbear]

Rust would only be a problem if one failed to keep the weapon clean. And then only rust inside the barrel and on certain moving parts would cause problems. A firearm won't last forever. It'll eventually wear out, but, by keeping it clean it should last for years and 10s of thousands of rounds fired.

Any type of oil can be used to lubricate the weapon, as long as it is used sparingly and often. A single bottle of motor oil would last for years.

:D

-stray-

Bluing rusting off the outside means nothing as you point out. Its the internal action parts that need to be cleaned and lubed as well as the barrel swabbed out. A good substitute for solvents/oils (which I think you could find in probably every other home garage) is to simply get gasoline and engine oil from any of the bajillion abandoned cars you will walk by daily in a dead world. Gas certainly works as a solvent and while the engine oil would be dirty to an extent, it is still a lubricant. Also as you point out, a little oil goes a long way. Most people use far too much oil not realizing oil attracts dirt and too much oil = gumming up the works. Food oils could be used but would be a second choice over petroleum oil in my op. If nothing else, grab a can of spary Pam cooking spray when scavaging the kitchen pantries. :)

Semi autos require more and regular cleaning than bolt actions and single shots to run properly. Lever actions also shoot dirty pretty well. The advantage of semi's is fast followup fire power and often large cap magazines. The disadvantage is more moving parts to break or gum up. For close in work I'd definitely prefer a semi auto. My own choice for close in work would be a quality semi auto .22 pistol with a pocket full of xtra mags. The Browning Buckmark, any of the myriad Rugers or S & W semis are good choices.

The Ruger Mark III with bull barrel would be a great choice for close in work with great accuracy and reliability. I'd rather have that than a rifle for going around doors and corners. http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firearms/FAProdView?model=10112&return=Y

[MapMan]

Sig Sauer P226 Primary Handgun

Sig Sauer P220 Compact back up

Mossberg 930 SPX .12 gauge with pistol grip

H&K 416 5.56 carbine

[Crappingbear]

Lest we get into "gun porn" is anyone that spooked that they wouldn't be find with a big stick to fend off the slow-lies? The dead aren't the bigges threat, its the other survivors sucking off of you.

[Yojimbo]

Lest we get into "gun porn" is anyone that spooked that they wouldn't be find with a big stick to fend off the slow-lies? The dead aren't the bigges threat, its the other survivors sucking off of you.



Mmmmm...gun porn....mmmm....hollowpoint .22 LR rimfire...oh yeah, that's it! You're a bad 12 gauge...oh yeah! :)

[SRP76]

Lest we get into "gun porn" is anyone that spooked that they wouldn't be find with a big stick to fend off the slow-lies? The dead aren't the bigges threat, its the other survivors sucking off of you.

In the end, it comes down to "whatever I can grab without becoming lunch". That's the reality; the gun porn is a fantasy. People would pick up a slotted spoon and start smacking zombies with it if they were under attack.

[Yojimbo]

In the end, it comes down to "whatever I can grab without becoming lunch". That's the reality; the gun porn is a fantasy. People would pick up a slotted spoon and start smacking zombies with it if they were under attack.

SRP is totally correct.

[Craig]

Mmmmm...gun porn....mmmm....hollowpoint .22 LR rimfire...oh yeah, that's it! You're a bad 12 gauge...oh yeah! :)
Ungh, please, stop before I... blow my load.

[Yojimbo]

Ungh, please, stop before I... blow my load.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

[lullubelle]

Thanks Lulu. BTW: Excellent choice with the Armalite AR-10 A4 .308 Winchester (I think that's the one you are referring to.) In the event of the dead coming back and walking around you are more than welcome to come and hang with me and my wife!

Right winchester, man knows his weapons, tell the little woman to put 3 extra plates on the table, I am coming with the kids. :D:D:D:D

[capncnut]

Fork. Those things can get through a decent steak, ya know. Failing that, a shovel maybe. Half of the steaks I buy from the local butcher require that combo.

[Crappingbear]

Mainly it comes down to what are you good at. Defense, offense? Are you a skiillied gun fighter, knife fighter, closed combat fist fighter? Or a clueless idiot who thinks that they will magically become Bruce Lee in an apocalyptic situation? If you have never hunted trapped or fished then don't expect to become self sufficient in a dead world. If you have never shot a gun, you damn well won't be Wild Bill Hickock. In a dead word, the manually experienced will become invaluable and the smarty pants doofs will be catfish bait.

[FoodFight]

Ain't that the truth. An x-box pistolero would be in for a real eye-opener when the stakes are for real. Developing necessary skills and preparation must be done before events force your hand. I've kicked myself many times for having squandered time that would have been better spent prepping and studying a subject that would benefit in a tough situation.

[Crappingbear]

Ain't that the truth. An x-box pistolero would be in for a real eye-opener when the stakes are for real. Developing necessary skills and preparation must be done before events force your hand. I've kicked myself many times for having squandered time that would have been better spent prepping and studying a subject that would benefit in a tough situation.


One of my fav quotes is by George Eliot, "Its never too late to be what you might have been."

As far as survival stuff, my own zen master is David Alloway who was the king of desert survival based out in West Texas. Sadly, he is dead. Learn shelter building, fire starting, basic fishing, hunting, trapping and you are fine. In a dead world, a boy scout is more valuable than a millionaire.

[Yojimbo]

In a dead world, a boy scout is more valuable than a millionaire.

Wise words. A great resource, BTW, for wildnerness survival tips is the Boy Scout Handbook. That training has saved many lives.

[MaximusIncredulous]

In a dead world, a boy scout is more valuable than a millionaire.

Wise words is right. It's almost signature worthy.