Michael Jackson- Cardiac Arrest

[Yojimbo]

Just heard that Michael Jackson apparently suffered a Cardiac Arrest in Los Angeles, CA. Was found not breathing by paramedics who administered CPR and then transported him to UCLA Medical Center. Hospital spokespersons declined to comment citing HIPPA regulations
(Federal rules do not allow discussion or access of info by hospital staff about medical patients without the permission of the patient)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090625/en_nm/us_jackson_3

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1195607/Michael-Jackson-suffers-heart-attack-home-rushed-hospital.html

[major jay]

Holy shit, there are reports that he may have died.

[Yojimbo]

Major Jay called it.

Michael Jackson has passed away at UCLA Medical Center.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/06/26/2609021.htm?section=entertainment


So far only TMZ is reporting this and other sources have not picked it up. Since it is TMZ, though, this could be a bunch of bullshit since the other news agencies are reporting only that TMZ is reporting that MJ has died.

[CoinReturn]

CNN is saying he's in a coma.

[capncnut]

He's dead. Official.

[3pidemiC]

Yep. It's been confirmed that he has died.

Terrible news.

It's seriously like the Elvis of our generation passing away.

[CoinReturn]

Yeah, confirmations are pouring in now. Weird...

[Andy]

He's dead. Official.
You just totally ripped off me! i cant beleive this... im actually shocked!

[Yojimbo]

Yeah, though he might have been a strange dude, and possibly a pedophile if you believe the rumors, it is very sad to hear that Michael Jackson has passed.

Michael Jackson RIP.

[CoinReturn]

Yeah, though he might have been a strange dude, and possibly a pedophile if you believe the rumors, it is very sad to hear that Michael Jackson has passed.

Michael Jackson RIP.
The man made Thriller.

Thriller.

[Bub666]

I just heard about this,very sad news.

R.I.P. Michael Jackson

[major jay]

So long Peter Pan. :(

[Danny]

we officially live in a world without the guy who wrote thriller, and we will never hear a new Michael jackson song ever again.

across the world sad pandas will be found tonight.

[capncnut]

we officially live in a world without the guy who wrote thriller, and we will never hear a new Michael jackson song ever again.
Oh, don't even go there. Jacko has enough unreleased material to make Tupac look like a lightweight. I could name twenty or more tunes for starters. And believe me Hells, they will still be releasing new Jacko albums when you're fifty, mate.

Edit: Oh and look at this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/4-x-Michael-Jackson-O2-Arena-Tickets-28th-July-2009_W0QQitemZ320388265304QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Ti ckets_Tickets_LE?hash=item4a98a0f558&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1688|240%3A13 18|301%3A0|293%3A1|294%3A50). :wtf smiley:

[clanglee]

Yeah. . I guess it's sad and all, but after the fiasco his life has become. . . maybe it's a mercy too.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Farrah, now Michael. Two in a day... Jesus Christ.

Two Icons of the 70's and 80's. Sad day, June 25th. :(

[Yojimbo]

Yeah. . I guess it's sad and all, but after the fiasco his life has become. . . maybe it's a mercy too.

I had the same thought. :(

[capncnut]

The coroner just officially announced the death and said Jacko arrived at the hospital in full cardiac arrest. The news channels are on total takover here.

Also, I got say something else about this. Why would he announce 50+ dates in London and name the tour 'This Is It'? Whether it's just some eerie coincidence or not, that is pretty spooky. Makes you think that he might have known about something from the doctor before he announced the tour.

BTW, it has just been said that Jacko's death could be down to a recent medication switch.

[MoonSylver]

Yeah. . I guess it's sad and all, but after the fiasco his life has become. . . maybe it's a mercy too.

Yeah, the first thing I thought of was Elvis. Both had amazing early careers, then went into decline & died there. Very sad.

[zombie04]

Well, despite my very negative opinion on his personal life I will say he did a lot as far as contributions to music and music videos especially are concerned. Tragic he fell from the top of the world and lived his last years the way he did.

[blind2d]

RIP King of Pop. Made me smile as a youngster, though he will never know me. What a legend! Now I'm all depressed... :(

[SRP76]

Yeah, the first thing I thought of was Elvis. Both had amazing early careers, then went into decline & died there. Very sad.

People will be spotting Jackson at a tollbooth in central Montana within a month.

[Doc]

Anybody been to Amazon.com? Check Best Sellers on the music section. Michael's albums are Number 1-16.:stunned:

[Cody]

I can't believe it, kings always die young

[blind2d]

Only the good...

[bassman]

I'm willing to bet that MJ will have more albums released after his death than Tupac....

Sad loss, indeed.

And I would have to agree with Coin. Even though he's had some....um...questionable times, this is the dude made thriller....

[Danny]

I'm willing to bet that MJ will have more albums released after his death than Tupac....


dude, come on.

Tupacs had more postmortem albums than elvis.

[capncnut]

I'm willing to bet that MJ will have more albums released after his death than Tupac...
Indeed. There's probably fifty or more Jackson Five cuts that haven't been widely released and would sell like hotcakes. Not to mention stuff from the 'Got To Be There' and 'Ben' eras. My bet is that they will be totally remastered and re-recorded with a more modern dancy flavour.

And then there's remixes, b-sides, outtakes, concerts, etc.

[AcesandEights]

The man made Thriller.

Thriller.

'Nuff said.

Though it'll be interesting to see what news comes out in the coming years as to his supposed predilections, eccentric lifestyle and the health issues that ultimately led to his demise.

[LoSTBoY]

Indeed. There's probably fifty or more Jackson Five cuts that haven't been widely released and would sell like hotcakes. Not to mention stuff from the 'Got To Be There' and 'Ben' eras. My bet is that they will be totally remastered and re-recorded with a more modern dancy flavour.

And then there's remixes, b-sides, outtakes, concerts, etc.

Hmm, I wonder why they were not released sooner, it looked like he could have done with the money.

Anyway RIP, Chamone!

[capncnut]

Hmm, I wonder why they were not released sooner, it looked like he could have done with the money.
Most have been released but are not widely available now due to deletions and scarceness.

Mmm... I know this probably belongs in the YouTube thread but I couldn't resist. This is a live version of 'Will You Be There' and the profoundness and beauty of this performance (especially the end) is incredibly powerful. If you are still sore over his passing, I strongly suggest you don't click otherwise you will be reaching for the tissues.

PvYygjcMDdQ

[Neil]

Quality web site!

http://www.IsMichaelJacksonStillAlive.com


On a side note, the LAPD is searching for his doctor! - http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article6585015.ece

[darth los]

This is crazy. I've been talking to people and to a man/woman everyone is shocked and at a loss for words. In my lifetime I don't think that's ever happened. Not even for the pope for christ's sake.



There's alot to discuss here. I mean how many people since recorded history began have done what he's done? A handfull?

And at the same time do you ever think that man was ever really happy? This is the same man when he was a boy was told by his father that he had to move quicker while on stage because there were men in the audience with guns....If that doesn't say it all. And ever since he's been a meal ticket for so many people. It's tragic.


But the music is timeless. Love him or hate him there's no arguing that heis a musical genius on par with elvis or the Beatles. Yes, he's in that conversation.








:cool:

[capncnut]

Jesus Harold Christ! Is anyone looking at the CNN news report from Trafalgar Square? Thousands! All doing a mass Moonwalk soon. Seriously, I feel bad for Jacko but those poor commuters coming home from work...

...dayom! :stunned:

[darth los]

Jesus Harold Christ! Is anyone looking at the CNN news report from Trafalgar Square? Thousands! All doing a mass Moonwalk soon. Seriously, I feel bad for Jacko but those poor commuters coming home from work...

...dayom! :stunned:



Seriously though, we're not old men you and I but can you remember anything like this when a star has died? Even using the word star doesn't do him justice. He was more than that.








:cool:

[major jay]

Yeah, the first thing I thought of was Elvis. Both had amazing early careers, then went into decline & died there. Very sad.

It's starting to sound like they both had the same type of scumbag parasites working for them too.

[Danny]

Channel 4's been showing all his best music videos, ending with thriller of course, which i have always thought is the best music video of all time, landis nocked it out the park with that one. it even had vincent price in it, and as ive said before that freaky old bastard was the man. :lol:

[bassman]

Yeah, I agree. Thriller is easily the best music video ever in my book.

It's something that can't possibly be duplicated:

LbvP7dT3Dx0

After all this time it still cracks me up....

[Neil]

Yeah, I agree. Thriller is easily the best music video ever in my book.

It's something that can't possibly be duplicated:

LbvP7dT3Dx0

After all this time it still cracks me up....

What's interesting about that video are there are lots of cuts, almost certainly to improve the appearence/timing etc.

I bet if you watch the original, there's less cuts, showing more of it was done in single takes - ie: The quality of the dancing I bet was amazing...

[Doc]

Saw Mtv today, and while I wasn't around during 80s Mtv, I've heard they showed music videos more frequently back then. Tpday not so much but, it looks like Michael brought it back to its roots. They showed music videos for hours.

[SymphonicX]

hmmm...

[krakenslayer]

I think Jacko's life was as tragic as his death. He spent his entire adult life trying in vain to recapture his lost childhood, and some control in his life, the guy was a total victim of the fame industry and his own family. Yes, he was a fucked up mess of his former self, but I don't think the blame for that lies with him at all.

As for the sexual abuse stuff - I can maybe imagine maybe he did some inappropriate things (e.g. hugging kids in bed, bathing with them, etc.) but probably without any sexual intention, and with no conception of how it might be considered wrong by the outside world because he was so out of touch. Gotta remember that this guy was shown very little love and affection himself as a child, so its not surprising he was unsure of how to express it correctly when he was an adult. I certainly don't think that makes the guy a rapist. If there is anything untoward, then they'll probably find incriminating material at the Neverland ranch, and we'll hear about it, but I don't think there ever was anything like that happening.

Poor guy was chewed up, spat out, and made the object of ridicule by the media who are all now like: "Ohhh, we loved him." :(

[Rottedfreak]

While the individual had faults his art still works.

[Danny]

tVACUjHn6yU

jon lajoui has a point. Honestly some guy on the radio called him wacko jacko and was chastised with you wouldnt say that about jade goody so dont say it about him!":rolleyes:

[Mike70]

People will be spotting Jackson at a tollbooth in central Montana within a month.

:lol: indeed they will.

i was just talking to someone about how long will it be before:

a. the conspiracy theories start coming out of the woodwork.

b. some folks start believing that jackson faked his own death to escape the spotlight and is now living on his own private space station.

c. the folks who believe jackson is still alive and working at a junkyard in east liverpool, ohio.

[capncnut]

Demerol - Painkiller
Dilaudid - Painkiller
Vicodin - Painkiller
Soma - Muscle relaxant
Xanax - Sedative
Zoloft - Anti-depressant
Paxil - Anti-depressant
Prilosec - Proton pump inhibitor

Is it any wonder why he's six feet under when he's taking all that lot. :rolleyes:

[Chic Freak]

Prilosec - Proton pump inhibitor

Is it any wonder why he's six feet under when he's taking all that lot. :rolleyes:

Wtf is a proton pump inhibitor?

[thxleo]

I must be the only one on this board that sees Jackson for what he really was...a pedophile. I was as big of a fan as anyone of his as a kid, I still own my original "Thriller" LP from my childhood. However, the guy paid off families that accused him of molesting their kids. The police found pornography in his room, the same room that kids claimed he gave them "Jesus Juice" in. Why does everyone make excuses for a grown man sleeping in bed with children that are not his own. That is weird people! It's so bizarre to hear people make excuses for someone who was obviously very sick & disturbed. Look at what the guy did to his own face for God's sake.
There are lots of people that become famous as a kid and lose some of their childhood, but they don't carve their face up and start molesting kids. You know? The folks who seem to think he was an innocent soul are probably the same people who think O.J. was innocent of murdering his wife.
Micheal Jackson's life was sad and pathetic, but he mostly did it to himself.

[DjfunkmasterG]

TBH no one really knows what went down, it is all assumed. Every single bit of it. Unless the man was convicted he is not considered anything. you are entitled to your opinion, but, lest we forget he was tried and found not guilty. Neither witness was considered credible, holes in their story and the DA scrambled to keep some away when he found out that in part most of it was an extortion attempt.

While I do not defend nor justify what occurred, keep in mind when Michael was younger he had no friends, not because he was a recluse, but because his own father forbad anyone in the family to have friends or have a childhood, it was all work work work. His Neverland ranch was built to reclaim the childhood he never had, and most likely the psychological and physical abuse the entire group went through at the hands of Father joe probably played a very Large part in why Michael was Michael as we know him.

[Yojimbo]

I must be the only one on this board that sees Jackson for what he really was...a pedophile. I was as big of a fan as anyone of his as a kid, I still own my original "Thriller" LP from my childhood. However, the guy paid off families that accused him of molesting their kids. The police found pornography in his room, the same room that kids claimed he gave them "Jesus Juice" in. Why does everyone make excuses for a grown man sleeping in bed with children that are not his own. That is weird people! It's so bizarre to hear people make excuses for someone who was obviously very sick & disturbed. Look at what the guy did to his own face for God's sake.
There are lots of people that become famous as a kid and lose some of their childhood, but they don't carve their face up and start molesting kids. You know? The folks who seem to think he was an innocent soul are probably the same people who think O.J. was innocent of murdering his wife.
Micheal Jackson's life was sad and pathetic, but he mostly did it to himself.

Though I agree that Michael Jackson was a very troubled person and quite possibly a creepy pedophile, I don't think you are being entirely fair to the members who have posted their thoughts on this thread.

In looking back over the various posts I do not see anyone defending Jackson's penchant for sleeping with young boys, giving minor's "Jesus Juice" or carving up his body to alter his appearance. Along these lines, I also did not see anyone depicting Michael Jackson as an innocent soul as you mentioned. Instead, I notice that a lot of members feel affected by the death of a popular culture icon, and that some of the members have relayed their sadness regarding his death. That they are saddened by his death, however, should not automatically be construed as a defense of the way he lived his life.

Similiarly, I don't think that you are saying that you are necessarily happy that Jackson died at 50 just because you are pointing out that he was a very flawed individual.

Whether Michael Jackson was a product of his own weirdness, or if his weirdness was a coping mechanism brought on by his fame, or if his weirdness was manufactured by the media, or if he was a pedophile or not a pedophile - these are all conjecture and speculation. Folks will believe what they will believe. But to feel sad about the passing of a relatively young person who - however flawed he may or may not have been - had some amount of meaning and influence in popular culture does not automatically put these folks in the same camp as those who feel that OJ was innocent of murder.

[capncnut]

The police found pornography in his room, the same room that kids claimed he gave them "Jesus Juice" in.
1. It is totally legal to own pornography and 2. he was not found guilty of administering an 'intoxicating agent' on children.

The kids claimed that he was showing them the magazines and whispered to his sleeping son, Prince Michael II, who was a baby at the time, "Hey Prince, you're missing out on all the pussy!" Well, if you believe that, you will believe anything. :rolleyes:

And 'Jesus Juice', it's absolutely laughable!


Wtf is a proton pump inhibitor?
Actually, I'm not sure, Chic. But Prilosec is an over the counter drug used to combat heartburn and ulcers.

[krakenslayer]

I must be the only one on this board that sees Jackson for what he really was...a pedophile. I was as big of a fan as anyone of his as a kid, I still own my original "Thriller" LP from my childhood. However, the guy paid off families that accused him of molesting their kids. The police found pornography in his room, the same room that kids claimed he gave them "Jesus Juice" in. Why does everyone make excuses for a grown man sleeping in bed with children that are not his own. That is weird people! It's so bizarre to hear people make excuses for someone who was obviously very sick & disturbed. Look at what the guy did to his own face for God's sake.
There are lots of people that become famous as a kid and lose some of their childhood, but they don't carve their face up and start molesting kids. You know? The folks who seem to think he was an innocent soul are probably the same people who think O.J. was innocent of murdering his wife.
Micheal Jackson's life was sad and pathetic, but he mostly did it to himself.

Michael Jackson was, in the latter part of his life, a self-evidentially abnormal person. Here's what we do know for sure - he clearly had serious emotional issues, psychological problems, prescription chemical dependencies, an addiction to surgery tantamount to self-mutilation, and he had a inappropriately over-the-top affection for children. He was a tragically fucked up person - some of it was his fault, some of it wasn't, we are all to some extent products of our environment, and Jackson grew-up in an environment than none of us on here can even imagine (combining violent physical abuse and massive worldwide stardom). I wholeheartedly believe that if you or I, thxleo, had experienced the same upbringing, we'd be pretty fucked up too. Now that not an excuse for his weirdness, that's just the reason. Everything has a reason, even human behaviour - cause and effect.

None of this, however, makes him a rapist. Parents who genuinely believe their son has been sexually abused do not just come knocking for a few handfuls of cash, they go out for blood and make sure the bastard is sent to jail for a long, long time. Now I'm not saying he definitely wasn't a paedophile, just that since he's never been convicted and has never been any real, court-solid evidence that he has molested anyone, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, as opposed to simply saying "Ewww, he's different to me, so let's make some unfounded allegations and throw some stones!"

[Yojimbo]

Wtf is a proton pump inhibitor?

I wish I could say that I knew the answer, but admit that I had to go to wikipedia , and after reading the entry I realize that answer is much too technical to try to bullshit my way through pretending to be a smart guy who knows all about proton pump inhibitor, which to me sounds like something you would find in a Star Trek episode.

Not that you should ever trust Wikipedia's accuracy but here you go:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_pump_inhibitor

Summarized below:


"Proton pump inhibitors (or "PPI"s) are a group of drugs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medication) whose main action is a pronounced and long-lasting reduction of gastric acid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gastric_acid) production. They are the most potent inhibitors of acid secretion available today. The group followed and has largely superseded another group of pharmaceuticals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharmacology) with similar effects, but different mode-of-action, called H2-receptor antagonists (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H2-receptor_antagonist). These drugs are among the most widely-selling drugs in the world as a result of their outstanding efficacy and safety.[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_pump_inhibitor#cite_note-0) The vast majority of these drugs are benzimidazole (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzimidazole) derivatives; however, promising new research indicates that imidazopyridine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imidazopyridine) derivatives may be a more effective means of treatment.[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_pump_inhibitor#cite_note-1)"

[thxleo]

1. It is totally legal to own pornography and 2. he was not found guilty of administering an 'intoxicating agent' on children.

The kids claimed that he was showing them the magazines and whispered to his sleeping son, Prince Michael II, who was a baby at the time, "Hey Prince, you're missing out on all the pussy!" Well, if you believe that, you will believe anything. :rolleyes:

And 'Jesus Juice', it's absolutely laughable!




Responses like this one are exactly what I'm talking about.
The guy payed $20 million dollars to a family to make their allegations go away. Who does that if your not guilty of something? It's amazing how naive people can be. :annoyed:

[Yojimbo]

Responses like this one are exactly what I'm talking about.
The guy payed $20 million dollars to a family to make their allegations go away. Who does that if your not guilty of something? It's amazing how naive people can be. :annoyed:

thxleo, I respect you, so I say the following with no intention of disrespect: Just because Jackson settled the first allegation of molestation brought against him does not automatically mean that he was guilty, and to state such (that is, the fact that he paid the settlement means that he is guilty) is naive in it's own right. Surely, I would fight an allegation against me if it were not true, but then again I don't have millions upon millions in my bank account that Jackson had at that time, and maybe if money was no issue -as it clearly wasn't for a guy who could spend his money trying to buy the elephant man's remains and stocking his private zoo with exotic wild animals - then I would settle just to spare myself the entire circus the media would erect around me to cover a case such as this. Also, legal cases are very expensive, and the outcome (even if you are innocent) can be very unpredictable, so without knowing the specifics of what had transpired I say that it is possible that the 20 million settlement was a fiscally sound alternative to fighting the case.

I used to be a work comp hearing rep, and I can say that insurance companies with deep pockets would take a case where I would demand 50k and offer a 10K settlement to me in return, all the while telling me that they feel that the case has no merit and that they had evidence to show that my client was attempted to defraud their client. Even with their evidence and doubt they were still willing to pay a "nuisance value" settlement because it was more cost effective to them to do so rather than send attorneys to contest the issue in front of the WCAB. So, what I am pointing out is that settlements cannot be construed as proof of guilt.

Additionally there were aspects of the second accuser's story and family background that seriously makes me question whether or not the second allegation was a complete fabrication. In looking over the what I could regarding the case, it appears to me that there is a great chance that this kid made these allegations at the insistence of his mother, who was certainly not saint and appeared to be a money hungry opportunist.

On a personal level, I think Jackson was pretty creepy, and quite possibly a creep. But I can still be sad that he is dead and should be able to say that without being branded an apologist or naive. And on the subject of guilt or lack thereof, I can safely say that I, like you, can only conjecture as to what the truth really was/is in this situation. We can suspect, but we cannot know for certain and therefore should hold our judgment of him and his supporters.

In the end, I agree with what Kraken posted about the settlement. To paraphrase Kraken, if my kid was molested by someone I would not settle the case for any amount of cash because I would be out to destroy the molester and no amount of money would give me satisfaction. I would imagine that you would feel the same way if you had a child that had been molested by a creepy dude like Jackson. So, in a way the fact that the family accepted a settlement lends as much creedence to the case being a total fabrication as much as the fact that Jackson offered this settlement might be construed by some as an implicit admission of guilt.

[Danny]

Responses like this one are exactly what I'm talking about.
The guy payed $20 million dollars to a family to make their allegations go away. Who does that if your not guilty of something? It's amazing how naive people can be. :annoyed:

whilst its nothing new that were not on the same page, dude really?, if you knew in your heart of hearts that a guy raped your child would you settle for currency as a recompense for that act?, would you let the man walk free?

[thxleo]

whilst its nothing new that were not on the same page, dude really?, if you knew in your heart of hearts that a guy raped your child would you settle for currency as a recompense for that act?, would you let the man walk free?

I'll ask you then, would you pay someone $20 million dollars if you did nothing wrong? I know I would fight tooth and nail to keep my good name in tact and would never pay a dime to someone if they were making it up against me.
As for your question, I would never accept a pay off. But there are plenty of people in this world that would. That's why it's called a pay off and it's been going on for a very long time.

[kortick]

You may all have loved him and thought hes great
and thats fine. If you truly feel that way
then so be it.

Everything about him I find revolting and
disgusting.
The man hangs his baby off a 4th floor balcony.
Yeah ill miss a mind and person that stable.

Its all summed up in this little story:

Farrah Fawcett arrived at the Pearly Gates and God asked her what he could do for her having led such an honest life. Farrah asked God to simply make sure the children of the world were safe. Five minutes later, Michael Jackson died.

Bless you Farrah.

[krakenslayer]

You may all have loved him and thought hes great
and thats fine. If you truly feel that way
then so be it.

Everything about him I find revolting and
disgusting.
The man hangs his baby off a 4th floor balcony.
Yeah ill miss a mind and person that stable.

Its all summed up in this little story:

Farrah Fawcett arrived at the Pearly Gates and God asked her what he could do for her having led such an honest life. Farrah asked God to simply make sure the children of the world were safe. Five minutes later, Michael Jackson died.

Bless you Farrah.

You see, Korick, no one is saying that Jackson wasn't a total mess of a person. The difference between "you" and "us" is that we recognise the singers deterioration from cultural icon to mentally unstable, baby-dangling fuck-up as a sad, tragic series of events. Mental illness does not equal moral badness, and I think he deserves our pity rather than our dogmatic judgement.

Unfortunately, some people are under the false impression that moral arbitration - putting the world to rights, pointing fingers and assigning blame and guilt in almost every conversation with the slightest controversial element - is the "grown-up" and "sensible" thing to do. It's not. This ain't the movies, there isn't always a moustache-twisting evil villain in every story, sometimes there is, but just as often it's simply a bunch of bad shit that might have been avoided but sadly wasn't.

[Danny]

I'll ask you then, would you pay someone $20 million dollars if you did nothing wrong? I know I would fight tooth and nail to keep my good name in tact and would never pay a dime to someone if they were making it up against me.
As for your question, I would never accept a pay off. But there are plenty of people in this world that would. That's why it's called a pay off and it's been going on for a very long time.

he was a freaky man child who back then had the money to just make the whole mess go away, hell if your albums are constantly making your revenue wouldn't 20 million be a price youd pay to stop being called a pedophile?

[thxleo]

he was a freaky man child who back then had the money to just make the whole mess go away, hell if your albums are constantly making your revenue wouldn't 20 million be a price youd pay to stop being called a pedophile?

No I would not, that's my point. If you are innocent of child molestation, you don't pay anything. We're not talking about some guy saying you shoved him to the ground one night and you don't want to be hassled with a court case, so you just give him a little bit of cash to go away. We are talking about molesting a child, an accusation that does not go away. So again, I would not pay anyone a single red cent if they accused me of something that terrible. Hell no.

[Craig]

No I would not, that's my point. If you are innocent of child molestation, you don't pay anything. We're not talking about some guy saying you shoved him to the ground one night and you don't want to be hassled with a court case, so you just give him a little bit of cash to go away. We are talking about molesting a child, an accusation that does not go away. So again, I would not pay anyone a single red cent if they accused me of something that terrible. Hell no.
By that same merit then the parents wouldn't have accepted the money if their children had been molested. If someone is guilty of molesting your children you don't allow them to pay you off.

[mista_mo]

By that same merit then the parents wouldn't have accepted the money if their children had been molested. If someone is guilty of molesting your children you don't allow them to pay you off.


Clearly the families just wanted money. They saw a vulnerable target, that lived his life in a very...odd way, so to speak, and decided to cash in on all the rumors.

[thxleo]

By that same merit then the parents wouldn't have accepted the money if their children had been molested. If someone is guilty of molesting your children you don't allow them to pay you off.

Oh brother.

[krakenslayer]

No I would not, that's my point. If you are innocent of child molestation, you don't pay anything. We're not talking about some guy saying you shoved him to the ground one night and you don't want to be hassled with a court case, so you just give him a little bit of cash to go away. We are talking about molesting a child, an accusation that does not go away. So again, I would not pay anyone a single red cent if they accused me of something that terrible. Hell no.

What you're saying is that Jackson paying the family is essentially a tacit admission of guilt, and I see where you're coming from, but I think that makes some major assumptions and ignores some big parts of the issue. Firstly, you basing the assumption on what you, as a level-headed guy-in-the-street, would do. Jackson was not a level-headed guy-in-the-street. He lived a near reclusive life on his ranch, and had very little contact with the "real" world outside. Quite frankly, he probably didn't give two fucks what the papers said about him so long as it didn't impinge on the Neverland fantasy world he had bought for himself. It's quite possible that multi-millionaire Jackson - who was famous for throwing money at things almost indiscriminately - was happy to pay the money just to keep the unpleasantness of the real world outside the walls of his ranch.

I'm not saying this is more or less likely than him actually being a child molester, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because, as far as I'm concerned, he's innocent until proven guilty.

[Craig]

Oh brother.
By that can I assume you've realised what a pointless circling argument this is?

I was just applying your logic of 'he should fight for his innocence if he's innocent and not pay them off' to the family who 'should fight for his guilt if he's guilty rather than accept his money'.

[Yojimbo]

If you are innocent of child molestation, you don't pay anything.


Not true in every circumstance, thxleo.

As I have previously mentioned, major insurance companies offer to settle cases which the believe have no merit because it is often less costly to settle rather than have a long and drawn out trial. In fact, many major corporations and other deep pocket entities (Michael Jackson with the big royalties from his music and ownership of the Beatles Catalog would most certainly qualify as having very deep pockets) are routinely advised by legal counsel to consider settlement as a viable alternative to facing a trial. Bear in mind that regardless of the entity's innocence or guilt the outcome of a trial is unpredictable and as such can go either in your favor or against it (again, regardless of innocence or guilt)

It also should be kept in mind that Camp Jackson would have offered a settlement in the second case, however was not allowed to due to the passage of a statue prohibiting such a buyout (which did not exist at the time of the first allegation, but was put into place largely because of what had happened with that first allegation) Given that he was found not-guilty of the charges brought forth during the trial pertaining to the second allegation (whether you belief him to ultimately be innocent and guilty) it has been noted that Jackson spent upwards of 20 million in legal fees for the 2005 trial and still owes one of the law firms an additional 200-300 grand. So, as a final total figure, for defending himself in a trial where the verdict was ultimately in his favor he ended up spending in excess of the 20 million he could have offered the family as a settlement - if the regulations had allowed this at that time- to avoid the trial as he had done with the first accuser's family and this would have been less of an expenditure on a monetary level to him than going through the trial.


We are talking about molesting a child, an accusation that does not go away.

I do see what you are saying. But suppose he had gone to trial with the first accuser as he did with the second, and suppose he had been found innocent of the charges as he was with the second set of accusations: wouldn't folks like yourself still feel that he was guilty regardless of the outcome, as you do right now? In that sense, if the accusations will never go away no matter what you do, and if people like you are going to ignore the ruling of the court and still consider him guilty of the crime he was brought to trial for (even though he was found innocent) then I ask you what the point would be of bothering. It seems to me a zero-sum game no matter what you do.

[ProfessorChaos]

kortick, you never let me down, man. nice one.:lol:

[kortick]

Yeah.

And OJ didnt kill his wife.

Oh wait, he was found not guilty. Silly us for ignoring reality
and not a screwed up court system.
If the courts said it, then it must be true.

Like I said, If you like Jackson then I accept
that this is a loss to you. Im not trying to get
anyone to hate him.

I just am less forgiving of pedophiles.
He knew the first case against him he
was going to lose, thats why you settle for cash.
If he thought he could win, he would have fought it.
I mean it was only his entire career and reputation
on the line here, nothing serious.

Yes as a person he was flawed, as we all are.

But this worshipping him is beyond all sense
of reality.

[Doc]

Yeah.

And OJ didnt kill his wife.

Oh wait, he was found not guilty. Silly us for ignoring reality
and not a screwed up court system.
If the courts said it, then it must be true.



But, with OJ wasn't there..evidence.....against him? Wtih Micheal its just allegations.

[major jay]

But, with OJ wasn't there..evidence.....against him? Wtih Micheal its just allegations.

Wasn't there one kid who identified his penis?

[Yojimbo]

But, with OJ wasn't there..evidence.....against him? Wtih Micheal its just allegations.
Precisely.


Wasn't there one kid who identified his penis?
Yes, the first accuser apparently had identified specifics regarding Jackson's naked body. But this alone, unfortunately, is not evidence of molestation, only that the kid saw him naked. As I have said before, Jackson clearly had a relationship which was inappropriate with both accusers. But the rule of the law says that in a criminal case the guilt of the defendant must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so even though we can be sure his relationship was inappropriate, you would need to prove molestation beyond a reasonable doubt. Certainly, in the second case there was not enough to meet that burden.

I will remind you that OJ's case also failed to meet that burden of proof, however he lost the civil case where the burden is not as great as it is in a criminal case.





Yes as a person he was flawed, as we all are.

But this worshipping him is beyond all sense
of reality.

So are we now to assume that folks here are "worshiping" Michael Jackson simply because they feel saddened by the death of this freak?

[thxleo]

By that can I assume you've realised what a pointless circling argument this is?

I was just applying your logic of 'he should fight for his innocence if he's innocent and not pay them off' to the family who 'should fight for his guilt if he's guilty rather than accept his money'.

Maybe the family saw the chance to get rich quick and took the money. Maybe they were complicit with Jackson sleeping in bed with their kid and other things too. Who knows? Nobody wants to answer this question directly...if you were accused of molesting a kid and were completely innocent, would you pay someone to shut up?
"Oh brother" goes back to what I originally said, I must be the only person on this board that sees Jackson for what he was, a pedophile.
Sorry if my different take bothered you. I know that anytime someone disagrees with the politically correct mindset on this board everyone starts nashing teeth. Your age states you are 17, so I will "assume" that means you are not to blame for your p.c. brain. You have grown up in a world that tells you how you are suppose to think, rather than allowing you to actually think on your own. Remember the bad guys are really the good guys and the good guys are actually the bad guys. Isn't that right Craig?





As I have said before, Jackson clearly had a relationship which was inappropriate with both accusers.




I don't mean this to sound hostile because it is not, you are always very respectful and I appreicate your posts. I really do. However, what do you mean exactly? What exactly was inappropriate? You sound like Bill Clinton.

[Yojimbo]

Silly us for ignoring reality
and not a screwed up court system.

In this situation, that which you call reality - it seems to me - is largely subjective. The reality is that he was not found guilty in the second case and that you choose not to accept that verdict because you perceive the system to be broken, and you have already made up your mind that he is guilty.

[Danny]

I know that anytime someone disagrees with the politically correct mindset on this board everyone starts nashing teeth. Your age states you are 17, so I will "assume" that means you are not to blame for your p.c. brain. You have grown up in a world that tells you how you are suppose to think, rather than allowing you to actually think on your own. Remember the bad guys are really the good guys and the good guys are actually the bad guys. Isn't that right Craig?
I don't mean this to sound hostile because it is not, you are always very respectful and I appreicate your posts. I really do. However, what do you mean exactly? What exactly was inappropriate? You sound like Bill Clinton.

really dude?, is this gonna turn into another one of those "you sheeple dont know the secret truths i know" deals?

[ProfessorChaos]

the dude was pretty talented and no one can deny that he made a huge impact on the entertainment industry, revolutionized (and you could even argue, created) the concept of the music video, and made some timeless songs that still gets loads of airplay decades later...

...but, even with all the fucked-up aspects of life-long fame and super-stardom, he would have to be a pretty messed up individual to think that it's okay to be nude with children around.

so while admit that a handful of his songs are on my ipod and i think it's sad his life turned out the way it did, i can't deny that i had a few lulz about kortick's joke and will most likely be telling that one at work tomorrow.

[Yojimbo]

I don't mean this to sound hostile because it is not, you are always very respectful and I appreicate your posts. I really do. However, what do you mean exactly? What exactly was inappropriate? You sound like Bill Clinton.

thxleo, thanks for your kind words. Nothing here that you have written comes off to me as personally hostile- we're cool.

I do agree that the term "inappropriate" as I have used it here is rather Clintonesque, so I should have been more clear.

Jackson admitted that he liked to sleep with young boys in his personal bed - not appropriate for an adult male to want to sleep in bed with young boys.

I think that the evidence presented in the case indicates that Jackson allowed minors in his presence access to pornography or at the very least he allowed them to know where he kept his stash of porno, which I feel is grossly inappropriate.

Jackson is an adult, yet he was hosting sleepover parties with young boys staying overnight in his bedroom which to me is inappropriate behavior for an adult.

Letting a young boy see your naked adult penis? Most certainly inappropriate!!!!

And while I feel that what I have listed above is all inappropriate behavior for an adult, as reprehensible as it might be none of these things prove that he sexually molested that boy, they only prove that Michael Jackson was a total freak.



even with all the fucked-up aspects of life-long fame and super-stardom, he would have to be a pretty messed up individual to think that it's okay to be nude with children around.



I don't believe that anyone here regardless of where they stand on the issue of Jackson's guilt or innocence would argue with ProfessorChaos' statement above.

[ProfessorChaos]

it's like walter from the big lebowski says: 8 year-olds, dude.

[Yojimbo]

it's like walter from the big lebowski says: 8 year-olds, dude.
:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[SRP76]

I don't see what the blubbering is about. I hear he's some "greatest musician in the history of the universe", but not one of the hundreds of people I've met in my lifetime owned a single post-Thriller album from Jackson.

In other words, other than on the internet (in other words, you guys), I know nobody who even cared the dude was alive for the past 25 years. Now that he's dead, all of a sudden it's an Earth-shattering event.

[ProfessorChaos]

michael jackson has been dead since the mid-1980's. the creepy robot with a strange affection for children has been merely posing as him since he died during his third?fourth?fifth? rhinoplasty surgery.

[Yojimbo]

Now that he's dead, all of a sudden it's an Earth-shattering event.

Speaking as a guy who never owned any MJ album and didn't ever really care for his music or his persona even when Jackson was a "normal" little kid singing ABC or appearing as a character on Saturday morning cartoons: Even though I was never a fan the news of Jackson's death is still sad (who can deny that it is sad?) but I wouldn't exactly characterize it as "earth-shattering." I actually would say that even though this dude was relatively young, he had death staring over his shoulder for a long time and this should have been obvious to anyone who heard of his erratic and self-destructive behavior as indicated by his use of drugs, addiction to cosmetic surgery, and the general weirdness he showed anytime he opened his mouth.

[krakenslayer]

Yeah.

And OJ didnt kill his wife.

Oh wait, he was found not guilty. Silly us for ignoring reality
and not a screwed up court system.
If the courts said it, then it must be true.

Like I said, If you like Jackson then I accept
that this is a loss to you. Im not trying to get
anyone to hate him.

I just am less forgiving of pedophiles.
He knew the first case against him he
was going to lose, thats why you settle for cash.
If he thought he could win, he would have fought it.
I mean it was only his entire career and reputation
on the line here, nothing serious.

Yes as a person he was flawed, as we all are.

But this worshipping him is beyond all sense
of reality.

I'm certainly not worshipping him, I'm not even really a fan of his. I just think this whole "I KNOW HE WAS GUILTY" thing is illogical nonsense. You don't know he did it, you can't know it, you have no connection or understanding of what happened except that you saw something about it on TV or in the papers (same as the rest of us) and made up all of your conclusions from there. There is evidence for, there is evidence against, but we know nothing conclusive either way and no one on this forum is in possession of the full facts of the case. You don't convict someone of a crime based purely on second-hand conjecture. Sure, the judicial system isn't perfect, but it's always gonna be in a better position to assign guilt or innocence than any armchair Joe sitting at home setting the world to rights.

[Yojimbo]

I'm certainly not worshipping him, I'm not even really a fan of his. I just think this whole "I KNOW HE WAS GUILTY" thing is illogical nonsense. You don't know he did it, you can't know it, you have no connection or understanding of what happened except that you saw something about it on TV or in the papers (same as the rest of us) and made up all of your conclusions from there. There is evidence for, there is evidence against, but we know nothing conclusive either way and no one on this forum is in possession of the full facts of the case. You don't convict someone of a crime based purely on second-hand conjecture. Sure, the judicial system isn't perfect, but it's always gonna be in a better position to assign guilt or innocence than any armchair Joe sitting at home setting the world to rights.
Well put. And might I add that I find the inference that those who respect the ruling of the court and the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" are guilty of "political correctness" particulary troubling.

[major jay]

Yojimbo & Krakenslayer, you both would have made a great lawyers.

[Eyebiter]

Anyone heard of a Thriller parody song called 'Sizzler' circa 1984? Trying to find either the lyrics or a copy of the MP3 file.

[blind2d]

Nope, sorry. Hey, "Invincible" was a good album. I think his best was "Bad" though. Speed Demon, man. Dancing with a clay rabbit in the desert. Good times.

[zombieparanoia]

I don't see what the blubbering is about. I hear he's some "greatest musician in the history of the universe", but not one of the hundreds of people I've met in my lifetime owned a single post-Thriller album from Jackson.

In other words, other than on the internet (in other words, you guys), I know nobody who even cared the dude was alive for the past 25 years. Now that he's dead, all of a sudden it's an Earth-shattering event.

Right on, same here. You might as well have told me danny bonaduce died. The last time MJ had any even slight relevance or interest to me or anyone I knew he was black. THAT long ago.

But on a side note I hear that since Elton John had already agreed to rerededicate "Candle in the wind" to Farrah Fawcett, Michael would have to get "Don't let your sun go down on me" in addition Wal-mart will be having boys pants half off in honor of Michael. And the cause of death has been revised to state that he in fact asphyxiated while blowing Bubbles.

[Neil]

Did you hear about his father? Seems he's already been working on deals to get the most out of his sons records... Hmmm...

[MaximusIncredulous]

I don't see what the blubbering is about. I hear he's some "greatest musician in the history of the universe", but not one of the hundreds of people I've met in my lifetime owned a single post-Thriller album from Jackson.

In other words, other than on the internet (in other words, you guys), I know nobody who even cared the dude was alive for the past 25 years. Now that he's dead, all of a sudden it's an Earth-shattering event.

Sheesh, Mozart gets dumped in a hole like a bum and this MJ gets the Jesus Christ treatment. The injustice!

[Eyebiter]

Did you hear about his father? Seems he's already been working on deals to get the most out of his sons records... Hmmm...

What kind of a father would try to cash in his kid's demise? Then again Joe has been living off the Jackson kids livelihood since the late 1960's. Why stop now?

[darth los]

The innocent/guilty thing has been done to death in this thread so I won't go there.


One thing I will say though is that human beings are the biggest Hypocrites in the world. And we all know Jesus hates Hypocrites.

People need to check themselves before they condemn other. "Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone". Very wise words considering we all have sinned and therefore fall short of the glory of God.

We know about Mike's sins because he's uber famous. But all the people shitting on him in this thread (which is their right) have sinned too but we'll just never know about it. We all have done something really fucked up that no other soul knows about and if you say you never did you'll full of shit because you're human, That's what we do.


Maybe if people spent more time trying to address his obvious, countless cries for help over the years and a little less making fun of him it would have turned out differently.




On a side note, this is a great illustration of why rape/molestation charges are so damaging to men. Because even if you're found innocent there's still this stigma attached to you (Just ask Kobe Bryant) and there's always going to be people that think you did it. In any case no one will ever look at you the same way ever again.








:cool:

[Neil]

What kind of a father would try to cash in his kid's demise? Then again Joe has been living off the Jackson kids livelihood since the late 1960's. Why stop now?

It's not the fact he's doing it, it's how soon after the death he seems to be starting it... Obviously he didn't grieve for long...

[bassman]

I heard on the radio this morning that Joe was at an awards show last night and immediately after saying basically nothing about MJ he started plugging his production company...

[darth los]

It's not the fact he's doing it, it's how soon after the death he seems to be starting it... Obviously he didn't grieve for long...

Well, it's a given that the vultures will be out so someone has to take care of the finances, even during this early stage. I'm sure Yojimbo can testify that all sorts of what might be considered morbid decisions must be made while funeral/wake arrangements are concurrently being made. These "business" decisions are almost cruel to have someone make while they're grieving but they must be handled none the less.



Now, as to Joe "scumbag" Jackson's state of mind right now, who knows? I'll tell you one thing though. Besides Michael's Kids Joe probably has the most moral (ironic Morals and that man's name being in the same sentence isn't it? :rolleyes: ) if not legal claim/right on michael's money.

I know if I was the one most responsible for kickstarting my son's career and the Brand that is Michael Jackson knowing and that people are going to pop out of the woodwork looking for a payout you're damned right I would feel as is I had as much a right to that money as anyone else and go after it accordingly.









:cool:

[Yojimbo]

I'm sure Yojimbo can testify that all sorts of what might be considered morbid decisions must be made while funeral/wake arrangements are concurrently being made. These "business" decisions are almost cruel to have someone make while they're grieving but they must be handled none the less.


Yes, this is very true. Putting together a funeral is as stressful as planning a wedding, with the added component of dividing assets among the claimant family members which can complicate matters. You would not believe how badly people behave when money becomes involved. Anytime there is a large estate I usually recommend as a prophylactic measure the family immediatly contract the services of a probate attorney, as I am certain will be the case for Camp Jackson.

That being said, usually we tend to concentrate on the immediate task at hand - that is, putting together the funeral, since the resolving the finances are outside of our scope and better suited to an attorney and an accountant.

[capncnut]

Hey, "Invincible" was a good album.
Quite agree, Blind. Off The Wall pwns all though.


And todays newspapers are just sad:

8 stone 1oz
No food just pills in his stomach
Bald
Broken ribs
4 needle marks in his heart

[Yojimbo]

Though you all might enjoy this (some of you more than others) since Jon Lajoie rules.

tVACUjHn6yU

[clanglee]

We all have done something really fucked up that no other soul knows about and if you say you never did you'll full of shit because you're human, That's what we do.:

No reason to bring up that time that I had the threeway with the transvestite tiajuana hooker and the one armed midget in the back of the abortion clinic. . . . . alegedly. . . .

[ProfessorChaos]

thanks for that vid yojimbo, that made my evening.

fuckin' A the media are a bunch of hypocritical vultures!!!

[Cody]

The media makes everyone look bad, even Jesus.

I didn't know about the "your missing out on all the pussy" comment to his infant, thats just creepy.

[darth los]

No reason to bring up that time that I had the threeway with the transvestite tiajuana hooker and the one armed midget in the back of the abortion clinic. . . . . alegedly. . . .


And it's not so much what an individual does, because that's their business. It's that people are all too willing to condemn others when they themselves are far from saints.


The difference is that celebs live 24/7 with a camera in their face and a microscope up their ass.

No one's whatching us so most of what we do goes unoticed. How would any of us like for the five dumbest/scandelous things we've ever done to be broadcast to the world and then to be judged on it? Exactly my point.







:cool:

[bassman]

The difference is that celebs live 24/7 with a camera in their face and a microscope up their ass.



Yep....having cameras follow these people around 24/7 really makes all the difference. Think about all those skanky party girls like Paris Hilton, Britney Spears, and Lindsey Lohan. If those cameras didn't follow them around constantly and report everything they do....they would just be your average 21-27 year old skank that you see on the streets everyday. Nobody cares about them....

[AcesandEights]

they would just be your average 21-27 year old skank that you see on the streets everyday. Nobody cares about them....

Hey, Bassman...I care about those skanks.

[darth los]

Quite agree, Blind. Off The Wall pwns all though.


And todays newspapers are just sad:

8 stone 1oz
No food just pills in his stomach
Bald
Broken ribs
4 needle marks in his heart


What's the sourcing on this cap? Not that i don't believe it but there's some people I'd like to show it to. Links?



Here's an interview from Friday with Deepak Chopra. apparently he and michael were really close. I know we've all had fun at michael's expense over the years but anyone who can watch this interview and still ridicule him is not the type of person I want to be around anyway. This has to be the saddest thing I've ever heard. That man was really sick.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FuBIAQt6FE



:cool:

[Yojimbo]

I didn't know about the "your missing out on all the pussy" comment to his infant, thats just creepy.


You have to consider the source of that information, and in this case that kid was the one who claimed that Jackson said this. I don't know about the rest of you - and keep in mind that I do think Jackson is a weirdo - but that kid and his reprehensible mother comes off as not very credible and very much self-serving. Honestly, that particular quote, along with the "Got Milk?" quip could very well have been a fabrication intended to bolster their side of the case.

Whether you believe Jackson to be a weirdo, or not, or whatever, I think most folks who saw that Bashir interview and followed the trial on even the most superficial level would be correct in viewing the accusers- the unlikable kid and the opportunistic mother - as not having much credibility. Likewise I believe that they would invent whatever they could to support their claims.

I suspect that there likely was some funny business going on between the kid and Jackson, just as I am sure the kid and his mother embellished their side of the story for their own benefit.

On a side note: I heard on the news that Joe Jackson was excluded from Michael Jackson's 2002 will. Bet Old Joe is really pissed off today!

[capncnut]

What's the sourcing on this cap? Not that i don't believe it but there's some people I'd like to show it to. Links?
Make with the clicky (http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/20090628/michael-jackson-autopsy-shows-he-weighed-112-pounds-had-broken-ribs-report.htm).


On a side note: I heard on the news that Joe Jackson was excluded from Michael Jackson's 2002 will. Bet Old Joe is really pissed off today!
And I'm hearing all over the internet that Jordan Chandler has confessed that he lied about Michael touching him. I'm still waiting for this to be confirmed on a more official site though.

[Tricky]

3o8rdNR5tmE

Sorry but this is the best thing to come from jacko in the 2000's :lol:

[Yojimbo]

Have just learned that MJ is being handled by Forest Lawn Hollywood Hills, a large cemetery/mortuary that I am very familiar with. Apparently, they will conduct a private memorial service on Tuesday, 7/7/09 - presumably at their facility. This is to be followed by a public memorial service at the Staples Center, home of the Lakers, in downtown Los Angeles. LAPD is expecting over 1 million people to attend this public memorial, but apparently there is not sufficient room inside the center to allow everyone in.

(Not to be a pessimist, but given how Los Angeleno's react to events, it is quite possible that we may have a riot on our hands next tuesday at the center)

Additionally, you all might find it interesting to see the casket which the family has chosen for Jackson. (My mortuary also sells this casket) Here it is!

237

It is a Promethean Blue, a $25,000.00 hand-finished unit produced by Batesville Caskets of Indiana. Apparently it is the same type of casket that James Brown had.

[krakenslayer]

Have just learned that MJ is being handled by Forest Lawn Hollywood Hills, a large cemetery/mortuary that I am very familiar with. Apparently, they will conduct a private memorial service on Tuesday, 7/7/09 - presumably at their facility. This is to be followed by a public memorial service at the Staples Center, home of the Lakers, in downtown Los Angeles. LAPD is expecting over 1 million people to attend this public memorial, but apparently there is not sufficient room inside the center to allow everyone in.

(Not to be a pessimist, but given how Los Angeleno's react to events, it is quite possible that we may have a riot on our hands next tuesday at the center)

Additionally, you all might find it interesting to see the casket which the family has chosen for Jackson. (My mortuary also sells this casket) Here it is!

237

It is a Promethean Blue, a $25,000.00 hand-finished unit produced by Batesville Caskets of Indiana. Apparently it is the same type of casket that James Brown had.

You'd think that, Jacko being Jacko, they'd have some kind purpose-built, hand-crafted coffin built for him, like the air conditioned one Elvis was supposedly buried in.

Then again, Elvis's "corpse" was placed in an air conditioned casket so that it wouldn't melt because everyone knows his supposed dead body was actually a wax replica built to make his "death" more plausible. :D

[blind2d]

same with jacko, only it's been years since his death.

[clanglee]

Additionally, you all might find it interesting to see the casket which the family has chosen for Jackson. (My mortuary also sells this casket) Here it is!

237

It is a Promethean Blue, a $25,000.00 hand-finished unit produced by Batesville Caskets of Indiana. Apparently it is the same type of casket that James Brown had.

That is one of the most opulant wastes of money I have ever seen!!

[MoonSylver]

That is one of the most opulant wastes of money I have ever seen!!

As in life, so in death...:rolleyes:

[Chic Freak]

I asked my parents what they want to be buried in:

Mum: "A bio-degradable cardboard box with willow tree seeds inside"
Dad: "Don't care"

:thumbsup:

[Tricky]

cC1TTz2bMmM

However dodgy his personal life was,the man had some moves!

[kortick]

Sorry I have been not able to reply.

First of all I never meant that people HERE were
worshipping him. I meant the crowds of people in
the streets all over the world acting like God died
were.

There are even stories that his hardcore fans are committing
suicide because of his death.

I dont agree with his having little boys sleep in bed
with him. its hard to say he wasnt interested in kids
when his whole life he was never dated a woman or a man
but had a fascination with boys.
That alone doesnt prove guilt i admit.

But enough of that. He is dead.
All people are flawed, hopefull he will find peace.

Im not so cruel to realise his life was tortured in
so many ways. His was not a happy life at the end.

I believe at this point the investigation should be where
he got the drug Diprivan. This is a highly controlled and
dangerous drug.

FOXNews.com spoke to Dr. Howard Nearman, department chairman of anesthesia at University Hospitals Case Medical Center in Ohio, about Diprovan.

"Using this drug for insomnia is sort of like using a shotgun to kill an ant," Nearman said. "How someone could get a hold of this medication — and use it for the purpose that he allegedly used it for — is just incredible.”

“It should not be used out of an ICU or an operating room setting,” Nearman said. “Here at University Hospitals Case Medical Center… Diprivan can only be used by anesthesiologists or intensivists… and these people, who by virtues of training and experience, can handle this drug and manage any adverse side effect should they arise.”

He didnt die of cardiac arrest, he was murdered by people willing
to take his money and inject him with stuff they knew could be lethal.

I'll admit after reading the autopsy report I feel sad his last days
were in such shockingly horrible conditions.

[capncnut]

He didnt die of cardiac arrest, he was murdered by people willing
to take his money and inject him with stuff they knew could be lethal.

I'll admit after reading the autopsy report I feel sad his last days
were in such shockingly horrible conditions.
Indeed, Diprovan is lethal. Especially when you consider how many other strong pills he was washing down with it. But were his final days really that bad? Check out the following performance, recorded less than two days before his death:

RgWR9HqFL8U&feature=related

F**ker looks tip-top to me. :confused:

[Danny]

I asked my parents what they want to be buried in:

Mum: "A bio-degradable cardboard box with willow tree seeds inside"
Dad: "Don't care"

:thumbsup:

thats pretty rad, id go with oak tree over willow myself.

[kortick]

http://www.inquisitr.com/27642/michael-jackson-autopsy-leaked/

People are of course saying that this is false info
but the searching i have done about the autopsy doesnt
vary much from this acct. The fact his nose was almost
non existant from plastic surgeries is amazing in that these
plastic surgeons would perfom so much work on him.

[Tricky]

Indeed, Diprovan is lethal. Especially when you consider how many other strong pills he was washing down with it. But were his final days really that bad? Check out the following performance, recorded less than two days before his death:

RgWR9HqFL8U&feature=related

F**ker looks tip-top to me. :confused:

Apparently for years he'd been taking anaesthetics & stuff to sleep & then being pumped with amphetamines & stuff to keep him energetic through the day,no wonder his heart gave out!i took amphetamines for a couple of years in my early 20's & know full well what my heart rate was like for days afterwards :eek: not to mention the psychological impact of stuff like that..

[bassman]

He really did look lively on that rehearsal for being....what was he? 50? I would like to see that entire rehearsal. Apparently they're going to show it on the tube.

If these autopsy reports are true, I'm not that surprised. Just by looking at his face from the 70's up to now you could tell that he had a big problem with tearing himself down. He's probably been on constant medication and had to keep moving up the dosage to get the effect...

[Yojimbo]

Had a bitch of a time getting to work this morning since my route which takes me past Dogers Stadium was totally clogged with folks who won the online lottery for MJ's Memorial Service tickets. Apparently they are giving them out today at the stadium for the service at Staples center tommorow.

LAPD has already begun closing down streets around Staples Center, and the media circus- replete with satellite tricks, reporters, and papparazi - are already lining up.

My hope is that this goes down without a riot - sure don't need that for tommorrow's workday since I am in downtown Los Angeles - and that once the dust settles this will all end. Gotta say, I'm getting burned out on the all Jackson news, all the time crap.

[Tricky]

I dont know about everyone else,but i just find the idea of tickets for ANY funeral,celebrity or not,to be pretty damned distasteful :confused:

[Yojimbo]

I dont know about everyone else,but i just find the idea of tickets for ANY funeral,celebrity or not,to be pretty damned distasteful :confused:

Yojimbo agrees. But much of the crap surrounding the death of Jackson has largely been distasteful to begin with, so this is just keeping up with the theme.

Even though the tickets are for free, I am certain that Staples center will take in quite a bit of cash just on parking and concessions. I have also heard that there are already ebay listings for these free tickets with nice and high asking prices. Fucking vultures, all of them.

Let me go on record as saying that I think this entire public memorial service is a really bad and very unclassy idea.

[major jay]

LAPD has already begun closing down streets around Staples Center, and the media circus- replete with satellite tricks, reporters, and papparazi - are already lining up.

It would be a good day to call in sick, but I'm guessing that wouldn't be an easy thing for you to do. No doubt it's going to be one hell of a spectacle.

[Yojimbo]

It would be a good day to call in sick, but I'm guessing that wouldn't be an easy thing for you to do. No doubt it's going to be one hell of a spectacle.
Thought about it, but have too much crap at work to do (got a big service coming up) so I, like the rest of us regular people, will just be forced to deal with it like always. Which is not anything unusual given the amount of protests, riots and other traffic clogging crap we have to deal with on a regular basis.

But for a moment there, I admit that I toyed with the idea!

[clanglee]

But for a moment there, I admit that I toyed with the idea!

I ALWAYS toy with the idea of calling in.:D

[MoonSylver]

Thought about it, but have too much crap at work to do (got a big service coming up) so I, like the rest of us regular people, will just be forced to deal with it like always. Which is not anything unusual given the amount of protests, riots and other traffic clogging crap we have to deal with on a regular basis.

But for a moment there, I admit that I toyed with the idea!

In case of riots, I hope you've got the steel shutters, bars, on your joint like Errnie Kaltenbrunner...;)

http://a654.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/46/m_4daa84b633720e371107a85e2d6c1f15.jpg

:lol:

[blind2d]

I doubt that Michael would've wanted such hullabaloo for his funeral. Then again....... who knows? Not like it was in his will, or anything.

[bassman]

This coming weekend, March 3rd and 4th, HBO will be premiering the two-part documentary, Leaving Neverland. The doc was previously screened at Sundance, with reviews suggesting that it paints an undeniable picture of the kinds of things that happened on Jackson’s property. Jackson’s reps are very upset with the doc, which doesn’t include anyone from Jackson’s camp, and attempted to get it shelved but had no such luck. I love documentaries, and while this will cover a very sensitive subject, it looks like it will be a good watch.

R_Ze8LjzV7Q

[MinionZombie]

I was reading about this one, but critics of it were pointing out how, in addition to the one-sided natured of it, some of the key testimonials came from people who are now saying the total opposite of what they said under oath ... so then you get into murky territory: were you telling the truth then but are lying now, or are you telling the truth now but were committing perjury before? Either way it ends up sticking a question mark over everything said ... such is the trouble with this case. :confused: Further to that, where does the line fall between emotionally-driven filmmaking and documentary fact-seeking?

There's truth out there, but is this film really going to unveil it - all of it? Hmmm...

[bassman]

Indeed. It will be interesting to see and decide for ourselves as the viewers whether or not the interviewees are being truthful, if there’s an agenda, if it’s one-sided to a fault, etc.

[bassman]

I watched both parts of Leaving Neverland during a sleepless night. I don’t want to say which side I believe right now, as it could potentially influence others’ opinions going into the doc. I think it’d probably be best to go in with a sort of clean slate. In all though, it’s a great watch. It might not need to be around four hours in two parts, but it’s an engaging story. Of course, you should prepare for some unsettling discussions going in...

[Neil]

I was reading about this one, but critics of it were pointing out how, in addition to the one-sided natured of it, some of the key testimonials came from people who are now saying the total opposite of what they said under oath ... so then you get into murky territory: were you telling the truth then but are lying now, or are you telling the truth now but were committing perjury before? Either way it ends up sticking a question mark over everything said ... such is the trouble with this case. :confused: Further to that, where does the line fall between emotionally-driven filmmaking and documentary fact-seeking?

There's truth out there, but is this film really going to unveil it - all of it? Hmmm...

Indeed...

Which story is "more interesting" and "more commercially lucrative"? Jackson was not doing anything wrong? Or he was?

[bassman]

While the doc does tend to lean a touch more toward the victims, it also has some sections that go into the possibility that they’re lying, looking for money.

It’s certainly a possibility, but with one of them being a huge choreographer in the entertainment industry, having worked with boy bands, Brittany Spears, and now doing Cirque De Sole, I can’t imagine he’s really hurting for money. But ya never know.

The doc is great in that sort of viewer investigatory sort of way...

[JDP]

Just saw part 1 of the Leaving Neverland documentary yesterday. Deeply disturbing stuff. Even if you accept the possibility that some of these people may be lying or exaggerating things in order to try to extort money from Jackson, some of the less explicit & direct-to-the-nitty-gritty details are still rather disturbing nonetheless. Why was this grown up man hanging with all these children day & night? Why was he gradually isolating the parents from them so he could spend more time with the children alone? Why was he showering them with expensive gifts? Why was he gradually alienating them as they grew older in favor of new younger "friends"? When you consider all such details, you have to admit that there is something suspicious here. I know adults who love children, but this is not the way they behave. They still behave like other adults and are perfectly aware of the differences between them and the children they enjoy the company of. Jackson's behavior regarding children was plain weird and suspicious, to say the least.

[Neil]

And of course Louis Theroux has come out seemingly as backing the suggestions of this documentary too!

[MinionZombie]

And of course Louis Theroux has come out seemingly as backing the suggestions of this documentary too!

I saw an interview clip from Good Morning Britain in which he talked about that. He was on promoting "The Night In Question", his latest doc, which I saw the other night. It was quite good, although it would have been nice if they'd had the time to delve deeper into that guy (who had been expelled/left FACE) who 'exposed the truth' about the other guy (who was the main subject of the doc).

Anyway, on GMB they also briefly got onto the topic of the art versus the artist, albeit briefly. Theroux made a good point about it being foolish to hold artists to some hugely high moral standard in order for us to enjoy their work, but to also allow an artist to create art ... if that makes sense? Naturally, that's just the basic point and, for instance, I don't think anyone would want to work with Weinstein again even if he does bother attempting a come back (all the court cases are still to come, of course).

The troubling thing with the doc (as a thing unto itself) seems to be that the director wasn't bothered about the other side's version of events ... so if you can't be bothered to do the basic fundamentals of journalism, then I'm not fussed about watching your doc. :rockbrow:

[shootemindehead]

^

Not abusing people would be a pretty low bar to achieve for anyone though, whether they're a star or not. That's a standard that's not particularly high.

But, yeh, it's possible to separate the art from the artist. In fact, I'd say it's essential.

[Neil]

Wow! Just wow! - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-47680378

[shootemindehead]

It's truly amazing just how tone deaf some people can be to their own statements.

[MinionZombie]

New fangled tech and Barbara Streisand have a habit of not mixing well ... hence "The Streisand Effect". :lol: