Casketed Corpses

[Gemini]

It stands to reason that dead bodies buried six feet under and dead for years would reanimate upon presence of whatever environmental pathogen caused the outbreak. How eerie would it be for thousands of zombies to be clamoring and moaning six feet under as you stroll pass a graveyard. Make a great scene in a zombie flick.

Six feet up, hospitals and morgues would literally pour oceans of the walking dead (corpses risen from slabs and their victims) into the streets.

[Danny]

it stands to reason that dead bodies buried six feet under and dead for years would reanimate upon presence of whatever environmental pathogen caused the outbreak.


.wat.

[SRP76]

They wouldn't matter, since they're incapable of escaping a coffin on its own, much less one buried under 3 tons of dirt.

[EvilNed]

True, it wouldn't matter but he makes a point about it being quite eerie. Perhaps when you were walking on a graveyard you'd be able to hear faint moans. Creepy!

[bassman]

They wouldn't matter, since they're incapable of escaping a coffin on its own, much less one buried under 3 tons of dirt.

This. Even if you believe that one day zombies may become a reality....there's no way that the buried ones would be able to resurface. Six feet of dirt is a HEAVY amount of dirt. No human, living or dead, could dig up through it.

If opening the casket was even a possibility under six feet of earth, most wouldn't because the caskets buckle under the initial pressure.

As for it being creepy....yeah. I get the thought everytime I go to a graveyard.

[Rancid Carcass]

How eerie would it be for thousands of zombies to be clamoring and moaning six feet under as you stroll pass a graveyard. Make a great scene in a zombie flick.

It did, in ROTLD. :)

[Mike70]

This. Even if you believe that one day zombies may become a reality....there's no way that the buried ones would be able to resurface. Six feet of dirt is a HEAVY amount of dirt. No human, living or dead, could dig up through it.



i am under the impression most folks aren't simply buried in a casket underground. the casket is placed inside some sort of grave liner or vault in most cases and then covered over.

yojimbo, where are you at?? we need your expertise.

[bassman]

i am under the impression most folks aren't simply buried in a casket underground. the casket is placed inside some sort of grave liner or vault in most cases and then covered over.

yojimbo, where are you at?? we need your expertise.

I'm not sure if i'm following you. Are you saying the casket itself is encased in something else? Kinda like septic tanks are generally inside a concrete structure?

If that is what you're saying, it's definitely a possibility. From my personal experiences I've always seen them just straight up bury the casket, though.

[Mike70]

I'm not sure if i'm following you. Are you saying the casket itself is encased in something else? Kinda like septic tanks are generally inside a concrete structure?

If that is what you're saying, it's definitely a possibility. From my personal experiences I've always seen them just straight up bury the casket, though.

yes. they look like this:

http://lifeplanningutah.com/vault.jpg

i also found this after a short search:


Today nearly all modern cemeteries require burial vaults or "grave liners." One reason is because the soil at the time of burial must be compacted with the tool shown below to prevent the ground from settling.

This cannot be done without a vault. In addition, the vault is needed to prevent the casket from surfacing in the event of a major flood.

A "vault" goes beyond the need to compact the dirt, keep grave robbers away, and protect the casket and remains from most of the elements. There is perhaps an emotional perception that somehow the departed are in a "safer" place in a vault.

[SRP76]

What does that change? The concrete shell is still buried under a couple tons of dirt.

Only now, a zombie must first somehow escape a locked casket, then miraculously lift a concrete lid with thousands of pounds of weight on it, and then climb to the surface.

I don't see it happening. No live person can do that, much less a dead one.

[Mike70]

What does that change? The concrete shell is still buried under a couple tons of dirt.

Only now, a zombie must first somehow escape a locked casket, then miraculously lift a concrete lid with thousands of pounds of weight on it, and then climb to the surface.

I don't see it happening. No live person can do that, much less a dead one.

i'm in total agreement with you on this one. i posted info about grave liners to highlight just how impossible it would be for anyone (living or undead) to escape from a grave. the idea is ludicrous.

[BillyRay]

This is why graveyards are one of the safest places to be during a Zombie Apocalypse. At least to get a quick breather. The local zeds are vaulted underground, and the shamblers won't gravitate towards them - no food.

It's gotta be true, Max Brooks said so...

[SRP76]

Oh, damn, I forgot. It's not foolproof. Big Daddy could probably escape a grave. He does everything else.

[Gemini]

yeah, I realize the z's would be harmless, but the clawing and moaning of thousands of zombies muffled by tons of dirt would make for an eerie scene in a GAR-genre zombie flick.

Yeah, ROTLD they actually did claw their way out of the ground which made for a great scene but was totally unrealistic.

In a previous thread we were debating how z's could possibly posses the energy to command their muscles to act; doesn't the ROTLD series, with its focus on infection of the nervous system, act as a more plausible scenario for the dead to walk?

[Wyldwraith]

No,
If we rate Believability of Zombie Origin on a 1-10 scale, ROTLD ghouls get a -5. If you can drive a screwdriver in one temple and out the other without even ANNOYING the zombie, then all rules of biology have been discarded. For Return-Zombies to be viable, the icky green gas would need to possess the capacity to grant true unimpeded sentience even to cadavers missing brains, and the powers of speech to decapitated heads lacking means to move air over the vocal cords they no longer have.

Never, NEVER use the words viable or realistic in even the loosest connection to ROTLD ghouls. ::shudders::

[darth los]

It's gotta be true, Max Brooks said so...

It was a joke from one of his dad's films. :p

:cool:

[sandrock74]

No,
If we rate Believability of Zombie Origin on a 1-10 scale, ROTLD ghouls get a -5. If you can drive a screwdriver in one temple and out the other without even ANNOYING the zombie, then all rules of biology have been discarded. For Return-Zombies to be viable, the icky green gas would need to possess the capacity to grant true unimpeded sentience even to cadavers missing brains, and the powers of speech to decapitated heads lacking means to move air over the vocal cords they no longer have.

Never, NEVER use the words viable or realistic in even the loosest connection to ROTLD ghouls. ::shudders::

Not to mention that skeletons don't have eyeballs and zombies without lips couldn't correctly pronounce several letters in our alphabet...they couldn't speak coherently!

[Gemini]

No,
If you can drive a screwdriver in one temple and out the other without even ANNOYING the zombie, then all rules of biology have been discarded.

Now this just isn't true. If "get the damn screwdriver out of my head" isn't being annoyed, I don't know what is! ;)

As far as believability in the GAR series ...what is up with the living dead pulling us apart as if we're made of soggy tofu? Now that's a stretch for splatter's sake.

[EvilNed]

I'd actually say that if we go by Romero zombies, a fair share of them WOULD congregate to graveyards. Or rather, the churches nearby. Remember the line about the mall being an important place in their lives? Well, there's bound to be a few ghouls who feel the same way about churches.

[Danny]

I'd actually say that if we go by Romero zombies, a fair share of them WOULD congregate to graveyards. Or rather, the churches nearby. Remember the line about the mall being an important place in their lives? Well, there's bound to be a few ghouls who feel the same way about churches.

interesting point there.

[hadrian0117]

I think zombification would only work with the very freshist corpses. Even in Romero's films the longest it was implied a corpse went before reviving as a few days (the funeral zombie in Night'90 that escaped his casket before burial). Dig up someone buried years before the outbreak and their corpse just lay there in the open air. Besides modern funeral practices have a tendency to speed up up decay rather than slow it down. Anaerobic bacteria plus a deady body sealed up in an airtight metal box can produce something alot nastier than a skeleton.

[sandrock74]

I think zombification would only work with the very freshist corpses. Even in Romero's films the longest it was implied a corpse went before reviving as a few days (the funeral zombie in Night'90 that escaped his casket before burial). Dig up someone buried years before the outbreak and their corpse just lay there in the open air. Besides modern funeral practices have a tendency to speed up up decay rather than slow it down. Anaerobic bacteria plus a deady body sealed up in an airtight metal box can produce something alot nastier than a skeleton.

Not to mention that the eyeballs are removed and eyelids and lips are sealed shut.

[JDFP]

Only now, a zombie must first somehow escape a locked casket, then miraculously lift a concrete lid with thousands of pounds of weight on it, and then climb to the surface.

I don't see it happening. No live person can do that, much less a dead one.

Oh I disagree about no living person being able to do it...

http://www.nypress.com/images/chuck_norris.jpg

:)

Seriously though, if a ghoul is buried under six feet of dirt, I wouldn't worry too much about it. A dead person doesn't have the strength to get out of a grave that far underground. Of course, the same could be said about NOTLD ghouls having the ability to break through doors with two-by-four's nailed into them in the film that I'd say no living person could break through...

j.p.

[C5NOTLD]

This is why graveyards are one of the safest places to be during a Zombie Apocalypse. At least to get a quick breather. The local zeds are vaulted underground, and the shamblers won't gravitate towards them - no food.

It's gotta be true, Max Brooks said so...

Also has to be true because George Romero said so - Only "the recently dead" came back to life in NOTLD. Those that were buried stayed buried and were not affected.

[Yojimbo]

i am under the impression most folks aren't simply buried in a casket underground. the casket is placed inside some sort of grave liner or vault in most cases and then covered over.

yojimbo, where are you at?? we need your expertise.

Yes, you are correct. The majority of burial caskets at a cemetery, with some exceptions would be locked shut then sealed inside of a burial vault. These are typically constructed out of reinforced concrete lined with a thick sheath of polyurethane. The lids on the vaults are extremely heavy and usually have to be lifted into place by attaching it by chains to the scoop of an excavator. The exception would be caskets sealed into the preinstalled vaults of a masoleum or a crypt. Allthings considered, it is unlikely that a zombie or anyone else could make their way out of a locked cakset, not to mention the burial vault, several tons of earth and/or a sealed masoleum vault.

[hadrian0117]

Not to mention that the eyeballs are removed and eyelids and lips are sealed shut.

For added gross-out comedic effect the zombie's burial clothes would've all fall off just like the Night'90 funeral zombie. So you'd have a naked blind zombie that can't even bite you slowly shambling along.

[sandrock74]

For added gross-out comedic effect the zombie's burial clothes would've all fall off just like the Night'90 funeral zombie. So you'd have a naked blind zombie that can't even bite you slowly shambling along.

I would SO have to run up to it and trip it or something equally comedic :lol:

[strayrider]

It stands to reason that dead bodies buried six feet under and dead for years would reanimate upon presence of whatever environmental pathogen caused the outbreak. How eerie would it be for thousands of zombies to be clamoring and moaning six feet under as you stroll pass a graveyard. Make a great scene in a zombie flick.

How could this possibly happen? Wouldn't the coffin + the liner + the soil shield the corpse from contamination? I'd say the buried dead would not reactivate at all.

Even they if they did, you still wouldn't be able to hear them under and inside all of that shielding.

:D

-stray-

[DubiousComforts]

This is why graveyards are one of the safest places to be during a Zombie Apocalypse.
Have you ever actually seen the original Night of the Living Dead?


How could this possibly happen? Wouldn't the coffin + the liner + the soil shield the corpse from contamination? I'd say the buried dead would not reactivate at all.
You're correct. It is the recently unburied dead. Not the recently embalmed dead. Not the dead from five years ago. Not great-grandpa's skeleton.

[BillyRay]

Have you ever actually seen the original Night of the Living Dead?

A fluke, that is all. :lol:

That's my story and I'm stickin to it...

[DubiousComforts]

A fluke, that is all. :lol:

It's only a flesh wound?

[SRP76]

You're correct. It is the recently unburied dead.

That's an assumption in the first movie. If the buried dead were reanimating, how would you know? They're buried. And they would have no real reason to go digging people up to check them, since they'd be irrelevant even if they were reanimated. They had enough of a problem just with the bodies that were walking around eating people.

[DubiousComforts]

That's an assumption in the first movie. If the buried dead were reanimating, how would you know? They're buried. And they would have no real reason to go digging people up to check them, since they'd be irrelevant even if they were reanimated. They had enough of a problem just with the bodies that were walking around eating people.
Anything freshly buried in 1968 would have been embalmed, which would effectively kill the ghoul.

We also don't know if the authorities checked this out. You're assuming they didn't because we didn't see it.

[darth los]

The only reason we say if it didn't happen on screen or expressly said it didn't happen is that it would all be keyboard masturbation. (thnx mike)

As was stated at the beginning of dawn:

"We have to operate on what we do know."

Now who's gonna argue with that?

:cool:

[Publius]

Anything freshly buried in 1968 would have been embalmed, which would effectively kill the ghoul.

And for those not embalmed, the brain will putrefy within a few days in most cases. So any body dead more than a few days is very unlikely to reanimate unless it's been refrigerated.

[Yojimbo]

And for those not embalmed, the brain will putrefy within a few days in most cases. So any body dead more than a few days is very unlikely to reanimate unless it's been refrigerated.

Not sure what the regulations were in PA back in 1968, but in 2010 California I can safely say that embalming is not a requirement under the law. But who is to say that emblaming would render a corpse incapable of reanimation.

[Publius]

Not sure what the regulations were in PA back in 1968, but in 2010 California I can safely say that embalming is not a requirement under the law. But who is to say that emblaming would render a corpse incapable of reanimation.

Good point. Embalming doesn't cause physical trauma to the brain, so maybe the mere presence of embalming fluids wouldn't prevent reanimation. It would slow decay of the zombie though. In that case, embalming would definitely be a bad thing, and we would be lucky that so few zombies were embalmed.