Editing HD footage?

[MikePizzoff]

Does anybody have an HD camcorder? I've got a MacBook Pro from 2009 and am wondering if it would be able to handle editing HD footage in Premiere Pro with the same speed as standard-def footage.

Reason being: I'm thinking of buying a cheap HD camcorder to hold me over until I'm able to afford a DVX-100, because the Sony DCR from 2002 that I'm using really isn't fucking cutting it anymore (nor has been for years), to put it bluntly.

[PJoseph]

I just edited my entire Ghostfacers webseries which was shot on five different HD formats - and had up to 5 streams of HD. I had HVX footage, and four other forms of long-gop had that I converted to DVC Pro HD - they were all fairly bulky, but it worked great.

I used FCP, but I'm sure Premier could handle it easily. It's a hardware issue. I would recommend switching to the higher graphics card (in your power settings) - that definitely helped.

pJ

[Danny]

yes, completely yes. i film stuff in 1080 and theres no difference. just open premier, capture from the tape and start cutting it up just like regular sd footage.

[SymphonicX]

if it does slow down (uncompressed true HD would ruin a normal computer), then you can probably ingest the thing low res and do an "online" later - ie you bring the footage back in full res, rebuild your sequence automatically and hey presto, it's ready for playout....

I work by proxy in that sense but when at work I am lucky enough to use HD tape/P2 media full res straight from the camera...

[MikePizzoff]

Woops, can't believe I said Premiere Pro; I stopped editing with that - I meant to say Final Cut Pro. Thanks for the answers guys, so now I'm pretty set on getting an HD consumer cam to hold me over.

Now for the next question: you guys ever use this camera? http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Sony+-+High-Definition+Camcorder+with+2.7%22+LCD+Monitor+-+Black/9745998.p?id=1218166125484&skuId=9745998 ----- I'm trying to figure out if I can get another camcorder that'll be exactly the same as that one for cheaper. I'm also willing to spend a little more if there's something leaps better but just barely more expensive.

---------- Post added at 01:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:31 PM ----------

Hmm... I'm seeing the Canon HF200 records in 24p. Pretty sweet for a cheap camera. However, the built-in audio is terrible and it's shoe is smaller than normal so you need to build a damn bracket or something to hook up an external mic. Also, no viewfinder = bogus.

Why is it so damn hard to find a camera that will please me 100%?! I'll even settle for 80%!

[PJoseph]

That sony looks pretty decent.

Did you try any of the Canon vixias? They don't shoot in true 23.98, but they look great and are easy to ingest.

We used little Panasonic HD cameras - shot on SD cards - shot at true 23.98 and ingested using the log and transfer - just as you would the HVX100 - they worked great. Very easy to edit with in Apple Pro Res.

[clanglee]

Now for the next question: you guys ever use this camera? http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Sony+-+High-Definition+Camcorder+with+2.7%22+LCD+Monitor+-+Black/9745998.p?id=1218166125484&skuId=9745998 -----

Amazon has it for like 50.00 cheaper

http://www.amazon.com/Sony-HDR-CX110-Definition-Handycam-Camcorder/dp/B0031RGKZI/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

[MikePizzoff]

PJ - I haven't used any Canon camcorders. I think I've decided to go with the Sony since it's much cheaper and basically the same quality, other than not being able to shoot 24p, which is a big bummer.

Clang - Thanks, but I think I'm going to buy it straight from BestBuy so I can get a warranty with it.

[PJoseph]

Hey Mike - I would, just for giggles, check out the panasonic line of HD cameras - they may be around the same price and I found them to be more mac friendly when it came to logging.

Sony's are great - but they get a little proprietary - you have to use their own software to transcode - it can get a little annoying.

Plus, shooting at true 23.98 is a plus.

pJ

[MikePizzoff]

I found a new Panasonic at BestBuy for the same price as that Sony: http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Panasonic+-+High-Definition+1.47MP+Camcorder+with+2.7%22+LCD+Widesc reen+-+Black/9739273.p?id=1218164386000&skuId=9739273

However, no matter how much I search I can't find any info on whether or not it can film in 24p. In fact, I can't really find much info on it at all.

[PJoseph]

http://service.us.panasonic.com/OPERMANPDF/HDCSD10-MUL.PDF

scanned through the manual - don't think this one has a 24P mode - ours did, not sure which model they were.

However, if you don't need 23.98, then it's not a big deal.

pJ

[MikePizzoff]

Finally found a camcorder I'm set on buying! The Canon Vixia HF-R100. It films in 24p, has mic input, has 3 hours of lifetime on the stock battery, and is only $499!

[PJoseph]

That's a good camera - we used a Vixia as well.

One note - the 24p mode on ours was a little phony - and I looked at your specs, looks like the same mode. You might have to do a reverse telecine in Compressor - which worked really well, just a little time consuming.

I actually had to call Canon and they were of no help, so I found a tutorial online that can do it.

This is, of course, if you want to edit at 23.98. If you want to edit at 29.97 and have it look like 24p, then you are all set.

The colors on that camera are really amazing given the chip size - and it worked well in low light.

pJ

[MikePizzoff]

Thanks for all the help, pJ. Is there any huge, significant, difference between editing in 23.98 and 29.97? I've never worked with 24p so I wouldn't know.

[PJoseph]

re: editing in 23.98 or 29.97 - no, there is no difference once you are working in the environment.

When you drag your video to the timeline in FCP, it knows to adjust to the format, compressor, frame size and rate. Once that is set, boom - you are ready to roll.

Now, if you start MIXING formats in that timeline, it gets a little wonky.

Regarding WHY you would work in 23.98 - well, that depends on how you are delivering the video. If this is living on YouTube, you can do either and it works fine. If this is going to DVD, then the DVD will adjust to the correct frame rate. If this is going to TV, then they have specifics.

Lastly, you can get that 24p look (I feel like a Loreal ad - GET THAT 24p LOOK!!!) and still be in 29.97 - like those DVX100s - they shot a 24p mode but it was OVER 29.97 - and back in the day, we only delivered for TV in 29.97 - but these days, like in the case of Warner Brothers where I'm doing Ghostfacers - if you are shooting in HD, you deliver in 23.98.

But again, cutting wise - nothing changes - you just have to get used to counting frames at 24 rather than 30 per second. I cut my first 23.98 with this series, and other than figuring out working with 5 different shooting formats, once I got them all in and matched, it was just cutting.

If you need anything else, you can always contact me directly in private message - I know how frustrating things can get in unfamiliar territory.

pJ

[MikePizzoff]

Thanks, man. You've been a huge help.

I've been doing yet even more research and have decided to save a little more money and pickup Canon's HV40. It's $650 on Amazon. It has native 24p, 24p in 60i, and 30p as well as an accessary shoe, a manual focus ring, and a mic input. Everything I've been looking for. The only downside is that it records to Mini DV instead of an SD card, however, for the price and picture quality, I'm willing to make that sacrifice.

I've been watching YouTube videos people shot with the camera straight-out-the-box and it looks completely incredible. Here are a couple:

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[MikePizzoff]

Got the HV40, PJ! Thanks for all your help. I couldn't be happier!

http://www.vimeo.com/11352643 - My first footage!

[PJoseph]

Hey Mike - that footage looks AWESOME!

I looked up some specs on that camera - it has a native 24p mode - very smart of you to get that. Now you can work at actual 23.98 OR 60i.

Good luck. I'll have to check out that camera myself.

pj

[CooperWasRight]

Im a little late to the conversation but Apple ProRes is a good idea...I highly suggest just making proxy files and then swapping back in your source files when your done.

[TCDarkness]

I just edited my entire Ghostfacers webseries which was shot on five different HD formats - and had up to 5 streams of HD. I had HVX footage, and four other forms of long-gop had that I converted to DVC Pro HD - they were all fairly bulky, but it worked great.

I used FCP, but I'm sure Premier could handle it easily. It's a hardware issue. I would recommend switching to the higher graphics card (in your power settings) - that definitely helped.

pJ
I didn't realize you were behind those. I've been working on the latest Supernatural DVDs/BDs at work and sat through the 10 Ghostfacers webisodes yesterday. Oh man, you guys sure cast some hotties (especially that Ambyr chick). :rockbrow:

Anyway, when I was working in VOD we used Apple Pro Res HQ and it looked better than other formats for HD and BD when I was working with it. So I will back Cooper up on that digital format.

[PJoseph]

Hey TC - just read your post. That's so funny! Yeah, my company produced those for WB. My partner and I co-wrote, co-directed with AJ and Travis, and we produced it. (and as you saw, I cut them) It was a lot of fun - it took us 2 years to get it off the ground!

Now, I'm off to something else, but I had a really great time. Super excited they are on the DVDs because I made the cutoff for delivery in the nick of time. Plus, many fans will get nice copies of the series now! I loved working with everyone at SN and Wonderland - really had a great time working inside the sandlot of Supernatural and being able to have the freedom to really expand the Ghostfacers characters - it was a blast.

And yes, Mircea was great.

pJ