Sexual predator treatment squeezes budgets

[darth los]

Check this clusterfuck out.

There's no doubt that it's straining budgets but who's going to be the pol with the balls to say, "we just can't afford it so we going to let the sickies go."?

Imo, that's the equivalent of political sucide.

First off let's get something straight. What's happening to them is unconstitutional, but here's another lesson about our country. If you are disliked enough, by enough people you too can have your constitutional protections stripped away.

These men have served their sentences. There is no authority to keep holding them. Yes I know the SC has already ruled that as long as the the purpose is treatment and not detention then it's ok. Huh? Aren't these patients nescesarily being detained? Is there an outpatient option?

I'm sure the purpose of being in afghanistan is to provide security so they can form a stable gov't, blah, blah blah, but the practical effect is that we are occupying their country.



Let's say one day the crime rate spirals out of control and the nation just gets sick of it. So to remedy that they say all people who are convicted of robbery, manslaughter, etc. will continue to be held indefinitely because we just don't feel safe around them.

Now, for the record I have no problem with locking these guys up for life, anyone who touches kids should have worse to them done, imo. But that's neither here nor there.

The point is if you want these guys locked up for life than change the law and sentencing guidlines. I'm sure something like that would pass with overwhelming support.

But to have someone held indefinitely after they have paid their debt to society, regardless of what they have done is something I used to read about cold war Russia.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37819608/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

:cool:

[Tricky]

I'm sure the purpose of being in afghanistan is to provide security so they can form a stable gov't, blah, blah blah, but the practical effect is that we are occupying their country.



There is of course all those minerals that have been found there "recently" , reportedly worth $3 trillion...;)

[darth los]

There is of course all those minerals that have been found there "recently" , reportedly worth $3 trillion...;)

You know, contrary to the way they make this sound like it's a new development they have known about that for years. Let's just say I'm sure it didn't hurt the decision to go there.

Just like were not in Iraq for the oil. :rolleyes:

Anyone who doubts that should check out the percentage of their oilfields that are now under our contractors and affiliates.

Side note: Before Sadam was toppled it was 0%.

:cool:

[Terran]

Or we could legalize marijuana and reduce the time given to non-violent drug offenders....thats prolly a couple billion dollars right there saved....not to mention additional tax revenue off of taxing marijuana sales.

[darth los]

Or we could legalize marijuana and reduce the time given to non-violent drug offenders....thats prolly a couple billion dollars right there saved....not to mention additional tax revenue off of taxing marijuana sales.

Indeed. The drug sentencing laws in country make no sense.

A person convicted of rape, which is usually a C felony in New york, carries a minimum sentence of 7 years and max of 15. A person caught with a kilo of cocaine gets a minimum of 15 years and a max of life.

Yes, you read that right. A pevert gets half as less time than a person caught with a substance which they are forcing on no one.

Someone explain to me how that's right. :confused:

:cool:

[Tricky]

Simple answer - they should both get 15 years minimum :)

[SymphonicX]

Can I ask you Americans, whilst on this subject, about the "3 strikes" program I've heard about?

From my understanding, if you commit three crimes (in certain states?), it doesn't matter what the third crime is, it'll equal a life sentence - so essentially people are getting life sentences for shoplifting or possession of narcotics?

That sounds like a massive expense and drain on communities - not to mention the "big brother" like state of fear it creates around the population...how does it work exactly? What if you get three unpaid parking tickets three years in a row? Or if you dodge tax, get caught drunk driving and then "jay walk" across a street? I don't know much about the civil or misdemeanor laws out in America - I heard about the three strikes thing on a program here and was really fascinated by it, although I think it's a completely terrible thing to have as law if it indeeds subscribes to my perception of it...I could be totally wrong of course...

As for those s*x offenders - I saw a Louis Theroux on it ages ago, creepy guys - a lot of them seem to be there under their own accord? Unfortunately if they have "served their time" then the best thing you can do is create a village somewhere away from major populations - but imprisoning them beyond their sentence isn't fair, regardless of the emotional context of their crimes - it has to be "justice for all"...not that I'd want them in my area, hanging around schools and stuff - this is a really debatable issue, no one wants to face it but I fear by concentrating them all in one place it's like putting all your gunpowder into one room and hoping it doesn't all explode at once....

[Terran]

Can I ask you Americans, whilst on this subject, about the "3 strikes" program I've heard about?



Yeah those types of laws are really filling up prisons...and really costing tax payers....in some places they have set up hundreds on military style bunks in what was once the prison's indoor gymnasium....the offenders in these are usually first timers and nonviolent drug offenders....no bars, no walls, and very crowded....Very hazardous to both guards and inmates..


The problem with laws like these...or any type of legislation involving how crime is handled...is that it is very difficult to undo the law because it makes the politician look like he/she is soft on crime.


Heres prolly all the info you need
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_strikes_law



While I can understand how the law viscerally appeals to the public at large, people need to understand the negative effects of such horrible legislation.

---------- Post added at 05:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:23 AM ----------


Indeed. The drug sentencing laws in country make no sense.


What I think is funny/poignant that no one else seems to find as funny or as poignant as I seem to is this:

People arrested for drug possession.

They are being arrested for committing a crime against themselves.
So a person sitting in prison, for this type of crime, is being punished for being the victim of a crime.:rockbrow:


As a country we spend billions of dollars in tax money to fight a war on drugs....we spend millions of dollars to fund prison time and millions if not billions of dollars in court costs for these crimes....
And essentially all this money is being spent to punish people for committing crimes against themselves.

Using this logic we should arrest failed suicide victims and charge them with attempted murder.:o

[SymphonicX]

Yeah those types of laws are really filling up prisons...and really costing tax payers....in some places they have set up hundreds on military style bunks in what was once the prison's indoor gymnasium....the offenders in these are usually first timers and nonviolent drug offenders....no bars, no walls, and very crowded....Very hazardous to both guards and inmates..


The problem with laws like these...or any type of legislation involving how crime is handled...is that it is very difficult to undo the law because it makes the politician look like he/she is soft on crime.


Heres prolly all the info you need
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_strikes_law



While I can understand how the law viscerally appeals to the public at large, people need to understand the negative effects of such horrible legislation.

---------- Post added at 05:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:23 AM ----------



What I think is funny/poignant that no one else seems to find as funny or as poignant as I seem to is this:

People arrested for drug possession.

They are being arrested for committing a crime against themselves.
So a person sitting in prison, for this type of crime, is being punished for being the victim of a crime.:rockbrow:


As a country we spend billions of dollars in tax money to fight a war on drugs....we spend millions of dollars to fund prison time and millions if not billions of dollars in court costs for these crimes....
And essentially all this money is being spent to punish people for committing crimes against themselves.

Using this logic we should arrest failed suicide victims and charge them with attempted murder.:o



LOL awesome post.
You have to ask yourself - supply and demand always means that an industry WILL find a way of selling it's wares...personally I'd want more money spent on turning people from drugs in the first place, providing top quality education to low economic areas, rather than going through the cyclical nature of locking up this petty crack dealer, only to have him replaced with another - remove people's desire for crack and that'll take care of itself...but the time to do that would have been about 1971...

This has to be the scariest and most unjust thing I've read in a while:

WIKI:
As a result, some defendants have been given sentences of 25 years to life in prison for such crimes as shoplifting golf clubs (Gary Ewing, previous strikes for burglary and robbery with a knife), nine videotapes (Leandro Andrade, received double sentence of 25 year-to-life for 2 counts of shoplifting), or, along with a violent assault, a slice of pepperoni pizza from a group of children (Jerry Dewayne Williams, four previous non-violent felonies, sentence later reduced to six years). In Rummel v. Estelle (1980), the Supreme Court upheld life with possible parole for a third-strike fraud felony in Texas, which arose from a refusal to repay $120.75 paid for air conditioning repair which was subsequently considered unsatisfactory.[11] Rummel was released a few months later, after pleading guilty.[12]