"why don't people like Alan Wake"

[Danny]

http://racooncitytimes.blogspot.com/2010/09/so-why-dont-people-like-alan-wake.html

I wrote a somewhat lengthy article about the problems that may have influenced the opinions about Alan Wake, investigate at the link above won't you?

[ProfessorChaos]

pretty good read, learned a thing or two. this site was the first time i'd ever heard of the game, and given what it was hyped to be, what it was, and what it could have been, i see where the disappointment comes from, especially if you were a fan of max payne and had followed it all that time.

i bought the game for 40 bones and still felt like i'd paid too much. sold it to a buddy of mine who's an aspiring writer (he also suffers from insomnia and that game is right up his alley) for 20 bucks. i wasn't that impressed with the game. sure it had its moments, but overall it was pretty weak and short of spectacular.

nice job of bringing up the RE 1.5 issue, that's a game i was beyond excited for. while i totally loved Re 2, i still wonder how that first demo video i saw on a playstation magazine disc would have been like to play....so what's with the tidbit you teased about there?

oh, now you should do an analysis about why people don't like scott pilgrim...:o

[Danny]

oh, now you should do an analysis about why people don't like scott pilgrim...:o

for the exact same reason i like it enough to admin the official forum, because its hipster videogame bullshit :lol:

[AcesandEights]

I'll let you know later this month when I finally bother to pop it in the 360! My GF bought it as her 'video game for the Summer' but that didn't pan out so well for her (I was surprised by her choice of the game, frankly).

I tell you, I've been putting it off, as it seems like another highly involved game amongst a sea of them and I'm just coming down off the high from my return to FO3 after a loooong, loooong break and my time with ME2. Hell, I still have to go back and finish Dragon Age.

[LouCipherr]

All I can say is, I'm glad I didn't know the years of back story to this otherwise I would've been a bit ticked about "what could've been" - that not being the case, I wasn't disappointed with AW at all, but I guess it's like the old saying "ignorance is bliss" :D

Good write-up though, hellsing. ;)

[darth los]

Good write up.

I think the game is much prettier now than what was previously shown.

I have no regrets with the way the game turned out and I absolutely can't put it down, right hells? :sneaky:

I think MZ btought up a while back that he would have loved to have a bit more exploration and interaction in Bright falls during the daytime. I agree.

At other times the game feels linear and like I'm boxed in. I would have liked a more wide open world where there were multiple ways i go go and complete my objectives. Completing these objectives would have different ramifications later on depending on the choices you make.

Hey, if SH homecoming cna do it why not AW?

Imo, there is sure to be a sequel in the works. A game with that pretty an engine and depth of story simply has to.

:cool:

[bassman]

I was all for the game before it's release. Then everyone that played it kinda gave it a "meh", so I decided to hold off...

[darth los]

It's the best game of that kind I've played in a long time bass. Great story, great atmosphere.

I defy you to set the mood, play it with the lights off and NOT run through a forest saying "oh shit!, oh shit! oh shit!".

The funny thing is at times nothing jumps out at you at all. But that's what true horror is. The anticipation of what might happen.

Does it have it's flaws, of course. Almost every game does. But it's a solid 9 out of ten, imo.

:cool:

[BillyRay]

I'll tell ya why I dont like Alan Wake...

Dude broke into my apartment, smoked all my stash, drank all my beer, crank called my Mom, teabagged the cat, produced a movie with running zombies, pissed all over my comics, left polaroids of his genitals everywhere, stole my car and crashed it, shouted racial epithets at the neighbors, burned down my garage, ruined my credit rating, and promoted his new book.

Alan Wake is a dick.

[LouCipherr]

Alan Wake is a dick.


:lol:

BillyRay, I'm sure you already know this, but damn dude, you have problems.. :lol: :D

[BillyRay]

Yeah, got a problem with Alan Wake...

(That greasy-faced, bad-breathed, Palin-voting, flashlight diddler.....)

[Danny]

Yeah, got a problem with Alan Wake...

(That greasy-faced, bad-breathed, Palin-voting, flashlight diddler.....)

technically it was a licensed enigizer fleshlight

[darth los]

technically it was a licensed enigizer fleshlight

Something funny I noticed. We all know that the main game is chock full of product placement but in the signal DLC there is no such thing. The batteries he uses are of a generic variety.

Anyone know why that is?

:cool:

[bassman]

I was just thinking about this and forgive me if it's been covered, but releasing AW at the same time as Red Dead Redemption was probably a big mistake. I remember seeing reviews and shows on TV saying "which one should you get? It's obvious....RDR". Those reviews and the general public's anticipation for RDR probably did the most damage to Wake's income...

[darth los]

I was just thinking about this and forgive me if it's been covered, but releasing AW at the same time as Red Dead Redemption was probably a big mistake. I remember seeing reviews and shows on TV saying "which one should you get? It's obvious....RDR". Those reviews and the general public's anticipation for RDR probably did the most damage to Wake's income...

I agree. It's like releasing a film the same weekend as a much long anticipated summer blockbuster.

People are going to go see that instead.

:cool:

[Legion2213]

I'll tell ya why I dont like Alan Wake...

Dude broke into my apartment, smoked all my stash, drank all my beer, crank called my Mom, teabagged the cat, produced a movie with running zombies, pissed all over my comics, left polaroids of his genitals everywhere, stole my car and crashed it, shouted racial epithets at the neighbors, burned down my garage, ruined my credit rating, and promoted his new book.

Alan Wake is a dick.

It's posts like these that keep me coming back here...this place is chock full of crazy folk! :lol:

[AcesandEights]

Well, without reading the thread and just giving my honest first impression of the game, I will say that after playing through the 1st episode last night, I was really digging the theme, story and mood of the game. My big problem with this chapter is that it seems to be very linear, point A to B, which is not what I like in a lot of my games nowadays. I am hoping that future chapters (though I do not expect all of them) will allow a more open-ended approach and some exploration of the town and its environs in a bit more free form fashion. I think, however, that I'll be disappointed in this regard and hope I'll be able to make do with the well done sense of atmosphere and tense bits of run, run, flashlight/combat, run, run.

[MinionZombie]

Yeah, it was a right old bugger to the bollocks that was. They should have seen if they could have launched earlier, because delaying due to RDR would have been a bit of a PR disaster, but equally going earlier might have been impossible, so RDR rode into town and cocked up their sales figures noticeably I think ... although I bought both brand new ... and Wake did launch a week earlier here in the UK, so you do wonder "why didn't they launch a week earlier in the US as well?" - they might have sold a few more that way.

Ideally they should have launched in 2009, but oh well ... I still love the game, even if it's not what it was intended to be originally, and even thought it has some rough edges or stuff that I'd have done differently/added/tweaked etc (yes, including more daytime play so you can really explore the town and the people - while it's become a more linear, episodic game, having such sections could have given a bigger bite of the 'sandbox' type of gameplay that ultimately they couldn't deliver on fully).

Sometimes devs bite off more than they can chew, but at least they delivered a quality and lovingly crafted product in the end - it's just a damn shame that so many were either switched off to it, or bought RDR instead of getting Alan Wake in addition/in place of RDR. It's a good thing they didn't do a 3D Realms! :eek:

[darth los]

It's good to aim high though. Even if you ultimately fall short of your stated goal atleast the final product will still come out better than most.

In that respect I think hells is right. Knowing what it should have been is definitely affecting people's feelings about it.

The lack of a sandbox format seems to be the major complaint in this thread. No one ever has that gripe about Silent hill. But imagine if Sh was promised to be what alan wake once did. I'm sure people would have a problem with that game as well in that respect.

It's like the saying goes: Sometimes it's best to not know what you're missing. Ignorance is bliss.

:cool:

[ProfessorChaos]

so hellsing, wtf is the news about RE 1.5 that you mentioned?

[darth los]

You can go to you tube and search for it and it will show you in game demo clips of what the original game was supposed to be.

[ProfessorChaos]

yeah, i know that, but if you read hellsing's article closely, you might have noticed:


Yet no matter how great resident evil 2 was, we always want to see the "resident evil 1.5" that might have been (which is actually possible- more on that at another time),...

that's what i was referring to. trust me, i've seen that footage and believe it or not, still would shell out some $$$ for an old-school RE game if it was worth it. i could live with the new controls/gameplay mechanics (maybe add in the ability to move and shoot at the same time, though) as long as there was old-school RE story-line/atmosphere....like the mansion or raccoon city revisted/remade/whatever. just none of that las plagas shit or puching boulders, co-op, dirt-bike rides, etc.

[darth los]

yeah, i know that, but if you read hellsing's article closely, you might have noticed:



that's what i was referring to. trust me, i've seen that footage and believe it or not, still would shell out some $$$ for an old-school RE game if it was worth it. i could live with the new controls/gameplay mechanics (maybe add in the ability to move and shoot at the same time, though) as long as there was old-school RE story-line/atmosphere....like the mansion or raccoon city revisted/remade/whatever. just none of that las plagas shit or puching boulders, co-op, dirt-bike rides, etc.

Yes i did notice that and i would pay to play that as well.

I still think a remake of RE2 is way over due. I still play the remake of the original on gamecube and it holds up remarkably well.

It boggles the mind that they keep churning out bullshit remakes the likes of prince of persia yet this classic has not recieved similar treatment.

:cool:

[MinionZombie]

There was an article on Yahoo about product placement in games, and they blamed Alan Wake's poor sales on just that - product placement - completely forgetting to mention or consider that RDR launched ON THE SAME DAY!

*face palm*

Jesus Christ...:annoyed:

[Danny]

There was an article on Yahoo about product placement in games, and they blamed Alan Wake's poor sales on just that - product placement - completely forgetting to mention or consider that RDR launched ON THE SAME DAY!

*face palm*

Jesus Christ...:annoyed:

yeah, one thing i think is more prevalent is that a massive sandbox game that was made in less than 5 years came out the same day as this, for some, nuetered alan wake.

I think some people saw the final product like halo odst to halo 3, as some small offshoot of a much larger, more varied game. but i think i already wrote enough on the subject,lol.

[darth los]

Odst was the best halo to date, (exluding reach, haven't played it yet.) imo.

Not the storyline of course. Just saying in terms of graphics and gameplay.

:cool:

[Danny]

Odst was the best halo to date, (exluding reach, haven't played it yet.) imo.

Not the storyline of course. Just saying in terms of graphics and gameplay.

:cool:

Fucking brofist ese', best soundtrack as well. neon night is su-fucking-perb/

[ProfessorChaos]

hellsing brah, third time, what does this mean? elaborate, please...


Yet no matter how great resident evil 2 was, we always want to see the "resident evil 1.5" that might have been (which is actually possible- more on that at another time),...

fuck another time, inquiring minds want to know what's up with aforementioned possibilities of playing RE1.5.:gossip:

[Danny]

hellsing brah, third time, what does this mean? elaborate, please...



fuck another time, inquiring minds want to know what's up with aforementioned possibilities of playing RE1.5.:gossip:

that i was gonna write an article about it, maybe torrent a copy and burn it to a disk is all. why not torrent it yourself, the rips from the demo are out there to find, i just recently acquired a chipped ps1 to do it with.

[ProfessorChaos]

oh, okay. thanks for the heads-up, wasn't aware that was possible. would i have to have a playstation to do that or could a pc handle something like that?

wasn't there word recently (last year or so) from capcom concerning a RE2 remake? man, sucks that i don't have a PS system anymore...i still have my copy of RE2...guess i could run it down for the wii.

[darth los]

wasn't there word recently (last year or so) from capcom concerning a RE2 remake?

WHAT!?!

Did I read that right? :lol:

Me and hells have been pining for the possibility of that for years now.

Something along the lines of the gamecube remake of the original. Straight remake with some twists and turns to keep it fresh.

I also like the new "close range" weapons they employed like the stun gun and grenade.

As a matter of fact i need to go play that now.

Is there a link to what you mentioned by the way?

:cool:

[ProfessorChaos]

http://www.destructoid.com/capcom-might-do-a-resident-evil-2-remake-or-at-least-fix-up-another-classic-123429.phtml

this is kinda what i was talking about, seems like the time frame is around when i was referring to...basically it's just vague salesman wording from some capcom guy and internet speculation, but who knows. a RE2 remake would be a monster exclusive for the wii to land. hear that, nintendo?

i actually have the REmake for the gamecube, but it's at my brother's place back in my hometown. will have to get that back next time i'm there. i've not played any gamecube games using the wii.

but yeah, that alan wake, it wasn't nearly as good as RE2, which imo, is the king of survival horror games.

[darth los]

Thnx.

It would be a cool co-op/multiplayer mode to have two players playing claire and leon's scenario's simultaneously in real time, like it was meant to be in the game.

Because you know every game nowdays has to have an element of that in it. That would be interesting. Just none of that resident evil 5 crap they tried to pull on us.

Part of the horror and tension was that you were ALONE. :mad:

:cool:

[SymphonicX]

I'll let you know later this month when I finally bother to pop it in the 360! My GF bought it as her 'video game for the Summer' but that didn't pan out so well for her (I was surprised by her choice of the game, frankly)..

i'd trade in every threesum I've ever had for a girlfriend who plays computer games....

[BillyRay]

i'd trade in every threesum I've ever had for a girlfriend who plays computer games....

Now that's some local co-op! :D

[darth los]

i'd trade in every threesum I've ever had for a girlfriend who plays computer games....

The grass is always greener...

:cool:

[SymphonicX]

Now that's some local co-op! :D

yeah but when I asked "slayer?" she replied "but I don't even know her!"

[MinionZombie]

I've just thought of something - Mark Kermode just did his thoughts on YouTube about Scott Pilgrim vs The World, and he defined it as a "cult hit" - and a true one at that - a film that set out to be great, but which failed to find a wide audience despite trying.

Similiarly, I would consider Alan Wake in the same context a "cult hit". They clearly were trying to make something great and reach a wide audience (naturally), but that didn't happen and they fell short of what they'd hoped - but it doesn't diminish the fact that Alan Wake is a ruddy good game (even if, as hellsing has said in his blog post, it didn't get to the finish line that they originally intended, instead finishing elsewhere as a different - but still superior - product).

[darth los]

Put it this way.

If RE 6, Sh 8 and Alan Wake 2 came out on the same day I'd choose AW. And that's no small thing.

I've been an RE fan for as long as I can remember and Sh has always come in second but to choose alan wake over them both?

Yes, it's that damn good.

:cool:

[Danny]

Put it this way.

If RE 6, Sh 8 and Alan Wake 2 came out on the same day I'd choose AW. And that's no small thing.

I've been an RE fan for as long as I can remember and Sh has always come in second but to choose alan wake over them both?

Yes, it's that damn good.

:cool:

i dunno, silent hill 8 is from a new developer so theres every chance it could be brilliant, and resident evil 6 is, like dmc, an entirely new universe just using past games for inspiration. so i'm not writing them off. As for alan wake every time i've spoken to one of the blokes at remedy they are just the worst at the usual "oh urr......we havent said anything concrete" or "now,ur,um... just because we are working on something doesn't mean its alan wake 2"

BOLLOCKS.

if you released footage on the making of dvd saying "these are things we hope to implement in ALAN WAKE SEASON 2" and have an officially run wiki that already talks about "ALAN WAKE SEASON 2" then its like saying "i am totally not going to demolish this building" AS you are holding out your thumb to gauge where to swing the wrecking ball you are driving :lol:

[darth los]

i dunno, silent hill 8 is from a new developer so theres every chance it could be brilliant, and resident evil 6 is, like dmc, an entirely new universe just using past games for inspiration. so i'm not writing them off. As for alan wake every time i've spoken to one of the blokes at remedy they are just the worst at the usual "oh urr......we havent said anything concrete" or "now,ur,um... just because we are working on something doesn't mean its alan wake 2"

BOLLOCKS.

if you released footage on the making of dvd saying "these are things we hope to implement in ALAN WAKE SEASON 2" and have an officially run wiki that already talks about "ALAN WAKE SEASON 2" then its like saying "i am totally not going to demolish this building" AS you are holding out your thumb to gauge where to swing the wrecking ball you are driving :lol:

lolz

I'm glad to hear it because both of those are among my favorite franchises and are in desperate need of a reboot. I wouldn't even be suprised to see Sh implement some things from AW.

Now as for RE I don't even know where to start. There's no question the old gameplay was getting stale but i don't think any true fans wanted what the series has become. It's basically a 3rd person action shooter now and that's a shame.

If only there was way to implement the best from the old and new styles to make the ultimate RE game.

And they really need to tie up some loose ends already. We haven't heard from Barry or sherry since the mid to late 90's.

:cool:

[slickwilly13]

The only problems I have with AW : lack of gore; weapons not passing over to the next chapter; and it drug on during the first half of the game. I spent most of the time fleeing towards a light.

[darth los]

The only problems I have with AW : lack of gore; weapons not passing over to the next chapter; and it drug on during the first half of the game. I spent most of the time fleeing towards a light.

I see what you mean by gore but until you just now mentioned it i didn't even notice. (Of course i noticed the lack of blood but by that i mea the game was sary as hell without it and didn't need it, imo).

Sort of like the texas chainsaw masacre is remembered as being one of the goriest films of all time when that's really not the case. I actually applaud the devs of AW to keep us scared even without blood.

Repetitive enviroments and enemies were definitely an issue, but I'm nitpicking as I think the game is totally awesome. But I mean, how many times are we gonna have to navigate through a forrest with baddies chasing us?

And not being able to carry over weapons was definitely a bummer but i can see why they did it. It actually fit into the story. Normally, you would come across weapons fairly quickly when beginning a new chapter so it wasn't that big of an issue for me.

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

Finished the main storyline this afternoon, after a day of playing hooky from work. I have to say I have done an almost complete 180 from my initial response to the game! Though I never quite got the free-roaming exploration I wanted, I did get a well crafted story, fun & interesting characters, great level design and intense--at times desperate--action. I really loved the ambience and care that was put into the whole thing, and--even though it seemed somewhat cribbed--the storyline was superb.

I'm enjoying my afterglow.

I'm not going to go back and read the rest of the thread just yet...but I will when I finish The Signal :D

[Danny]

it does get better when its revealed barry is not a greasy cliche' agent but a true fucking bro by the end.

[darth los]

truly sad news peeps. :(

http://g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/post/707643/Alan-Wakes-The-Writer-Is-The-Final-Piece-Of-DLC-For-The-Game.html

:cool:

[Danny]

truly sad news peeps. :(

http://g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/post/707643/Alan-Wakes-The-Writer-Is-The-Final-Piece-Of-DLC-For-The-Game.html

:cool:

...how is this sad news? from the start they said there would be two dlc as a bonus to branch the first game and its sequel together without adding enough story to interfere with people who couldnt get it.

these two were just neat addons dude. im glad they are only putting out 2 and getting onto alan wake season two instead of the bioware route of shitting out little bits every few months instead of working on an actual full game.

[darth los]

...how is this sad news? from the start they said there would be two dlc as a bonus to branch the first game and its sequel together without adding enough story to interfere with people who couldnt get it.

these two were just neat addons dude. im glad they are only putting out 2 and getting onto alan wake season two instead of the bioware route of shitting out little bits every few months instead of working on an actual full game.

If they are indeed coming out with a sequel then I'm all for it. Fuck these add-ons.

But i heard that a sequel wasn't confirmed.

You hear something different?

And if there is a sequel where do you think they could go from here? Is Alan going to go insane again?

That storyline is wearing pretty thin, imo.

Hopefully they go the bioshock infnite route and don't let the future of the series be bound based on what came before.

:cool:

:cool:

[Danny]

If they are indeed coming out with a sequel then I'm all for it. Fuck these add-ons.

But i heard that a sequel wasn't confirmed.

You hear something different?

And if there is a sequel where do you think they could go from here? Is Alan going to go insane again?

That storyline is wearing pretty thin, imo.

Hopefully they go the bioshock infnite route and don't let the future of the series be bound based on what came before.

:cool:

:cool:

current rumors insist alan escapes the darkness in some fashion and appears in brightfalls months later, declared by the world as dead from some hiking accident or something. Based on remedys talk about possible weapons such as fireworks, lanterns and such i reckon its going to take place in october near halloween which would be incredibly rad.

[darth los]

current rumors insist alan escapes the darkness in some fashion and appears in brightfalls months later, declared by the world as dead from some hiking accident or something. Based on remedys talk about possible weapons such as fireworks, lanterns and such i reckon its going to take place in october near halloween which would be incredibly rad.

Tha could mean a possibility for a much wider variety of enemies ( maybe even witches and goblins or something. Dare I say, Zombies? :hyper:)

Anything that would bring different variety of gamelay would be a major plus.

Perhaps Having him warp to a different dimension every episode to altleast have different settings?

Just Please, no more forrests people.

:cool:

[Danny]

Just Please, no more forrests people.

:cool:

yeah, its pretty unanimous on the alan wake forums that, nice as the forests are, everybody wants to explore the town like the original trailer showed.

[AcesandEights]

http://racooncitytimes.blogspot.com/2010/09/so-why-dont-people-like-alan-wake.html

I wrote a somewhat lengthy article about the problems that may have influenced the opinions about Alan Wake, investigate at the link above won't you?

As someone to whom Alan Wake was only a name bandied about till this last Spring, I will say this was remarkably informative. It's also probably a text book cautionary tale as to why following games too closely & too hopefully is a recipe for disappointment.

In any event, it was a very good and full look back on something I knew nothing about, but has wider implications to understanding the game industry. Also, as someone who had hoped for a wider world to explore (see my previous posts in this thread) your points about what may have been really hit home.

Thank you!

[darth los]

As someone to whom Alan Wake was only a name bandied about till this last Spring, I will say this was remarkably informative. It's also probably a text book cautionary tale as to why follow games too closely & too hopefully is a recipe for disappointment.

In any event, it was a very good and full look back on something I knew nothing about, but has wider implications to understanding the game industry. Also, as someone who had hoped for a wider world to explore (see my previous posts in this thread) your points about what may have been really hit home.

Thank you!

We can take a page from that when anticipating GAr films. :p

:cool:

[Danny]

As someone to whom Alan Wake was only a name bandied about till this last Spring, I will say this was remarkably informative. It's also probably a text book cautionary tale as to why following games too closely & too hopefully is a recipe for disappointment.

In any event, it was a very good and full look back on something I knew nothing about, but has wider implications to understanding the game industry. Also, as someone who had hoped for a wider world to explore (see my previous posts in this thread) your points about what may have been really hit home.

Thank you!

Well i am glad some people got it, most people just read he title and replied with emails about "DA HATAS ONLY DONT LYKE IT CUZ THEY NOT TRUE FAN AND ARE LOW BROW GENERAL PUBLIC" Completely oblivious that i wrote an article about knowing about what might have been about a videogame on a reviewers part, nothing to do with the publics response in any way.

[MinionZombie]

yeah, its pretty unanimous on the alan wake forums that, nice as the forests are, everybody wants to explore the town like the original trailer showed.

God yes. ENOUGH forrest stuff! It was good, sure, but there was too much of it in Alan Wake - I desperately wanted more town-based stuff - and not only that, but as I've said several times, more day time exploration and tasks. You could retain the structure which they used to get the game finished, but then also give the player a better sense of the 'free roam' that might have been ... plus it would be a nice change-up to proceedings throughout.

Also - no more contrived scenarios to lose all your goddamn weapons. It became annoying and pointless. A couple of times okay, but it kept happening!

Sounds like I didn't like the game - but no, no, no - I love the game ... but there's no denying there are some things I'd want done differently and better in a sequel ... like the jump mechanic as well, come to think of it.

[darth los]

Sounds like I didn't like the game - but no, no, no - I love the game ... but there's no denying there are some things I'd want done differently and better in a sequel ... like the jump mechanic as well, come to think of it.

Even my 6 year old was like, "Alan wake jumps funny daddy." :lol:

:cool:

[MinionZombie]

Even my 6 year old was like, "Alan wake jumps funny daddy." :lol:

:cool:

Like he's floating on a brief, but very powerful, fart as he flings his legs into the air and tries (half-assedly) to lick his own tip. :p:elol::p

Gotta love Alan Wake though - a true quality product, even with the things that niggle you here or there. It really feels like a lovingly crafted piece, you know? I do hope we get a sequel ... oh, and if we do - introduce a "Casual Mode" for goodness sake! I mean, leaving out a Casual Mode that afficianados of the mode like me want, wtf? :shifty:;):shifty:

[Danny]

OH GOD NOT THIS AGAIN.


Casual is a name you have given some association which is not an industry standard. Alan Wake is EASY, mind numbingly so, but regardless the lowest difficulty is always the LOWEST difficulty.

just because its not called 'casual' does not mean its harder than this level you desire. its the easiest it can be without breaking the game.

i know we've gone on about this before but normal is normal. as in not hard. that is the baseline game with relatively low challenge that at worst means you die and go back 20-30 seconds for a checkpoint. and alan wake has no consequences for dying on any difficulty. you don't NEED a lower difficulty than normal alan wake because you cannot make the game easier.

[darth los]

Me thinks MZ needs a commentary mode ala Left 4 dead where nothing attacks you and there's no chance of dying. :p

:cool:

[MinionZombie]

Actually you could make it easier - longer battery life, Alan taking more hits, enemies taking less hits.

If "normal is normal" then you've proved my point, because normal isn't "casual". :p

I didn't (and don't) want to get into that all again, but you can't accept that some people want to experience a game on "casual" if they ruddy well want to. It's a little something called "player choice" and it's quite rare for a game - at least a big name game - to not have a Casual Mode.

Fine by me if you want to play on normal or hard or insane or utterly retardedly difficult - that's your own individual choice, no skin off my nose - likewise you should calm down if some people, such as myself, would rather play a game to experience everything but the "challenge" aspect. Each to their own, you know? Christ-on-a-bike.

And it's not like I'm incapable of playing Alan Wake on "normal" either, cos I completed the game a week after I got it ... what I'm saying is that my personal preference - and indeed the preference of plenty of other people out there - would be to play the game on a "Casual Mode". So this gamer snobbery deserves a rolly eyes ... :rolleyes:

:elol:

[Danny]

And it's not like I'm incapable of playing Alan Wake on "normal" either, cos I completed the game a week after I got it ... what I'm saying is that my personal preference - and indeed the preference of plenty of other people out there - would be to play the game on a "Casual Mode".

THEN WHY DO YOU WANT IT?

i will speak against this madness everyday until you like it. :lol:

[MinionZombie]

THEN WHY DO YOU WANT IT?

i will speak against this madness everyday until you like it. :lol:

Because I don't want to have to be bothered with Normal Mode, that's why. How is this a hard concept to grasp? Each to their own for crying out loud ... fine by me if you want "the challenge" of higher difficulty levels, no skin off my nose, so just accept that not everyone wants to be bothered with that and just wants to enjoy a "Casual Mode". :rolleyes:

[Danny]

Because I don't want to have to be bothered with Normal Mode, that's why. How is this a hard concept to grasp? Each to their own for crying out loud ... fine by me if you want "the challenge" of higher difficulty levels, no skin off my nose, so just accept that not everyone wants to be bothered with that and just wants to enjoy a "Casual Mode". :rolleyes:

its not about challenge or snobbery, its that each game out has a series of difficultys and you seem to think if tis called casual then its some nice enjoyable ride but if the easiest mode is 'normal' then fuck that shit they are overlooking part of the audience or something. when you can take normal on alan wake and something else that calls something just as easy, equally so, casual and treat them differently like theres this unified distinction that isnt there.
i have no problem with wanting to play games on the easiest setting thats up to you. its getting sniffy with something because youve designated "casual" as the definitive thing when it could be renamed "normal" and be exactly the same. over so many other terms like easy, child mode, peaceful, spectator or any other of the dozens of names that i find crazy because there isnt really an industry standard y'know? not that there could be given this is a medium, not a genre we are talking about here and "easy" in a puzzle game could be very different to "easy" in a fps game or something.

Like why 'casual' in particular? off the top of my head i'm not familiar with any games that list that as a difficulty. what is the source of that for you?

[MinionZombie]

I can't name a game off the top of my head that lists a "casual mode" with those specific letters, but I'm pretty sure I have seen more than one game that lists it as "casual", but really it's just a synonym for "easy mode".

Alan Wake has - Normal, Hard, and Nightmare.
Gears of War 2 (for example) has - Casual, Normal, Hardcore, and Insane

Other games such as CODMW2 have their own range of four-stage difficulty settings (but with 'military-ish' names, but entirely the same purpose as other games with traditional names such as "easy, normal, hard, very hard").

GOW2 has four difficulty options, AW has three ... so that's one less player choice (on the lower end of the difficulty scale) for difficulty settings. Epic approached the difficulty settings for GOW2 in a really good manner. They recognised that their Casual Mode in the first game wasn't casual, and at times frustratingly tricky, so they sorted it out (indeed the only times I died was through my own error making a retardedly obvious mistake) and so those that just wanted to play the game but without having to fuss about "challenge" could do so. Then those that wanted a difficulty-related challenge could also have it with a range of modes with higher difficulty.

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/gaming/2008/10/08/bleszinski-gears-of-war-2-will-have-casual-appeal/1

"Some developers are nervous about that, but I think that's a dumb response. I think it's great to have more people playing games, and maybe they'll evolve from playing Guitar Hero to playing Gears or Halo or GTA."

With that as a tenet, Bleszinski saw that there was a casual mode made for Gears of War 2 in which it it was practically harder to die than it was to survive. Bleszinski claimed that the team went deliberately out of their way to create this mode, specifically so that it can pull casual gamers in and get them interested in the harder modes.

"We want casual gamers to get involved this time around," he explained. "Yes it's got blood, monsters and guns, but it is also a story about loss and redemption and a bit of heart."

I refer back to Graham Linehan's (if memory serves) dislike for how - for him - he's denied content he's paid for because he's "not good enough" to get beyond a certain point in GTA IV. Personally I was fine at GTA IV and only had to retry a mission once at most to pass it - but some (and Capn is included in this category) find such games quite tricky. Now GTA IV just has one level of difficulty, but it's still a valid point - while I'm personally fine playing a GTA IV, it's unfair for those that aren't "good enough" to play, so there should be a difficulty choice in those sorts of games (as there was in Saints Row 2 - it's just a shame that the game was so insanely unbalanced that, for example, certain side missions were impossible and other side missions were the piss-easiest of piss-easy that even a slab of concrete could beat the side mission).

Then, for example, a game like one of the Tony Hawk games ... some people are ridiculously good at them (and Capn is included in this category) while others are pretty rubbish at them (such as me) but I still want to play them (or the odd one anyway) - so I, or anyone, shouldn't be denied content because we're not "good enough" to get to a certain level.

Hence, circling back, the broad range of difficulty settings that should always include - for player choice - a "casual" mode. Do I personally want a difficulty-related challenge? No. Same goes for a bunch of other people out there too. Ergo I should have the option to just enjoy the game how I want to play it. Since when was a player wanting to play a game however they want personally a gamer crime? :rolleyes:

And how can "normal be normal" when it can also be a 'renamed or equivalent' "casual"? You're not making sense. :confused:

With Alan Wake "normal" was most definitely "normal" ... perhaps it's 'easy' to those of you who routinely play "hard" or "nightmare" - such is your right as a gamer, and personal playing preference and interest - (levels 3 and 4 of difficulty out of the standard four-level difficulty system that is - easy, normal, hard, very hard ... a system which used to be easy, normal, hard as standard a while back) - but to others Alan Wake's "normal mode" was not "easy" or "casual" or any other synonym for level 1-of-4 of the common four-tier gameplay difficulty layout.

AW's "normal" was definitely "normal". If it was "easy" there would have been more ammo, you taking more hits, enemies taking less hits, and stronger/longer lasting batteries.

I'm baffled why this is such a difficult thing for some in the gaming world to grasp - and I don't mean you hellsing in this sentence, even though this battle between us over this issue has raged longer than all three LOTR movies in one sitting - I'm speaking at this point about the wider gaming world where "casual mode is for fags" is such a common cry from the gaming elite.

[mista_mo]

But...If Normal is the easiest difficulty setting on Alan Wake, would it not be correct to label it as "Easy" as well as "Normal"? You can't just arbitrarily compare difficulty settings on two games, in two completely different genres. Alan Wake has Normal, which I would imagine, would be a walk in the park, especially compared to the other difficulty settings that the game offers. I'm sorry, but I just can't see a basis for an argument here when normal (the easiest difficulty) is pretty fucking easy. I believe he is referring to normal in the sense that in this case, normal is the easiest difficulty setting, so it would also be correct to label it as easy, at least compared to the other difficulties present.

I also believe, Hellsing, that he uses the term casual, because it really is a word that conveys ease of use, and a laid back approach to pretty much anything that it is applied too.

[MinionZombie]

Gaming should be inclusive - just like Blezzy was saying - so there should always be a Casual Mode, which can entice those who aren't yet good enough for harder settings (and perhaps inspire them to go harder), as well as continue to entice those who just want to enjoy themselves on their own terms.

And while "Normal" is 'the easiest setting on Alan Wake', it's still not equal to an Easy/Casual Mode - AW is missing the first-of-four standard difficulty settings - I refer back to my reasoning with the standard four-tier difficulty system. "Normal" mode hasn't been made easier by not including "Casual", all that has happened is that one of the four standard difficulty settings hasn't been included (and I've laid out exactly how a Casual Mode could have been done in AW).

And, frankly speaking, when considering Blez's approach to Casual Mode - as an inclusive device, thus bringing more people in to the party - you would have thought the AW crew would have wanted to have more people playing their game, especially considering the trouble they had flogging units when they launched (and still to this day presumably).

I'm not saying, however, that the lack of a casual mode was the reason they didn't do so well on launch, nor is it one of the big reasons why they didn't do so well on launch ... but it will be a reason among many. No doubt some people would be turned away specifically because there is no Casual Mode (anything can happen after all), and no doubt some people would be turned off because it would appear to them to be 'too hardcore for me, not casual enough' - there's a whole swathe of people out there who want that 'pick up and play for a bit' ease of use - the Wii has done so well as it encourages casual gaming. The thing with the Wii though is that the majority of the games themselves are entirely casual games.

What I'm saying is that all games should have a proper Casual Mode for the many out there who otherwise find many games inpenetrable - and those of us who prefer Casual Mode (even though we'd technically be classed as "Serious" or even "Hardcore" Gamers) - I'm speaking widely here, not just personally.

A great movie or a great book doesn't have levels of difficulty which allow a range of viewers or readers to enjoy the product, but games do - and that should be employed fully, so that casuals, gluttons for punishment, and everyone in-between alike can enjoy the same great products.