George Romero who??? Darabont the new KING of zombies

[DjfunkmasterG]

Ok i get Romero started it all, but Darabont has now shown us a great zombie world. 40 minutes in and I can even say in words how friggin impressed I am with this show so far. This is just outstanding stuff and of course credit has to go to the source material, but goddamn this is great stuff and Romero needs to take notes on this for future projects.

[bassman]

He'll always be the godfather, but I agree. Darabont and co have taken this genre to GREAT new heights.

Even as a Dawn04 fan, I think DJ can agree that this is the first to get it "right" since Romero...

[DjfunkmasterG]

FUCKIN A I agree with that bassman... This is what Romero should have been doing with Land... not the campy fluff crap.

This is just phenomonal.... it truly is. and gory as hell.... I LOVE IT!

[Gabe_dead]

Ladies and Gentlemen I think we have a winner here... Much props to amc.

[CoinReturn]

So good seeing these gore/zombie effects in HD, they're astoundingly detailed for a TV series.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Oh hell yes,

that whole scene with the husband trying to summon the courage to kill his wife, and rick shooting the half zombie.... FUCKING A... great great stuff.

[bassman]

that whole scene with the husband trying to summon the courage to kill his wife, and rick shooting the half zombie.... FUCKING A... great great stuff.

I'm not gonna play mr macho. I've seen the pilot four times now and it chokes me up every single time.

This isn't just a zombie show, folks. This is drama at it's finest...

[DjfunkmasterG]

It is a great moment Bass no arguing that.

[Mike70]

i am certainly digging it. this is a home run for sure.

[DjfunkmasterG]

i am certainly digging it. this is a home run for sure.

GRAND SLAM.... so far

[bassman]

wait till you guys see the last moments. It's enough to make you cheer and salivate...

[Mike70]

wait till you guys see the last moments. It's enough to make you cheer and salivate...

i had already watched it once. loved it but held off from watching again until it aired.

i have looked into my crystal ball and am predicting a flood of posting in the next few hours to 24.

[DjfunkmasterG]

i had already watched it once. loved it but held off from watching again until it aired.

i have looked into my crystal ball and am predicting a flood of posting in the next few hours to 24.

Can you crystal ball tell you if I will win the lottery?


Holy shit... nice sort of Day homage... the wrecked city looks awesome.... MAN o MAN I am loving this....

[CoinReturn]

the silence is great

[Mike70]

Can you crystal ball tell you if I will win the lottery?

no, my crystal ball can only predict the obvious. it is very C-3PO like.

[DjfunkmasterG]

GRAND SLAM... THIS SHOW IS AWESOME!

and the TOYOTA zombie commercial is a hoot.

[bassman]

my head is full of space junk, but your words are coming through...

[Gabe_dead]

fuck I guess the zombies eat horses...lol

[MoonSylver]

Ok i get Romero started it all, but Darabont has now shown us a great zombie world. 40 minutes in and I can even say in words how friggin impressed I am with this show so far. This is just outstanding stuff and of course credit has to go to the source material, but goddamn this is great stuff and Romero needs to take notes on this for future projects.

Yeah, props to Darabont for bringing it to the screen & I hope evereyone gives credit to the unsung hero here: Robert Kirkman for creating such a great series to begin with & for going the direction all others have failed since GAR: characters & story.


So good seeing these gore/zombie effects in HD, they're astoundingly detailed for a TV series.

I've never been concerned about that one way or the other, but I think this will lay all others fears to rest. :)


i have looked into my crystal ball and am predicting a flood of posting in the next few hours to 24.

Yeah, I've been bracing for impact. :lol:


fuck I guess the zombies eat horses...lol

Gotta get Rick off that horse, on foot, & trapped somehow ;)

One thing I'm mildly bummed they left out from the comic was the caffetera scene. Since they already used the "dead inside" thing I'm thinking they WON'T be using it later on when they discover the gated community? Shame, as it's a hell of a reveal

[JonOfTheShred]

Epic show. I gotta hunch its gonna be sticking around for a few seasons

[Sammich]

Romero's problem is not his directing, it is his recent scriptwriting. If the rumor is true, I think everyone should reserve judgement until season 2 and see how he directs his episode of TWD.

[MoonSylver]

Romero's problem is not his directing, it is his recent scriptwriting. If the rumor is true, I think everyone should reserve judgement until season 2 and see how he directs his episode of TWD.

Geroge has already said he isn't going to:

http://popwatch.ew.com/2010/10/21/walking-dead-george-romero/

Things could always change, but he's pretty much a "do my own thing" guy as alluded to in the interview. :(

[Deaths_Shadow]

Love it! Been waiting for something like this since DAY. Finally someone has got the chemistry right for zombie films. Lets hope this could be an example to others who may create future films.

[childofgilead]

GRAND SLAM... THIS SHOW IS AWESOME!

and the TOYOTA zombie commercial is a hoot.

Yeah, that's probably the first time the owner of a Toyota would be happy their accelerator pedal is stuck.

[CooperWasRight]

I think most of the credit goes to Kirkman so far the show has pretty much spot on stuck to the book.... And Kirkman pretty much stuck to the Romero universe.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Geroge has already said he isn't going to:

http://popwatch.ew.com/2010/10/21/walking-dead-george-romero/

Things could always change, but he's pretty much a "do my own thing" guy as alluded to in the interview. :(

Hate to be the dissenting voice here but... it is probably for the best. With Romero's current track record it is best he stays away from TWD. he has his own thing and Darabont and Kirkman have this and I like the way it is going... Romero may come in and camp it up too much with some dumbass irish fighting clan or a smart zombie named Whopper who howls at female zombies who wear the letter 6

[sirjacktorrance]

it´s just me or i think this is a little overating here. the show it´s great yeah, i love darabont but i think it´s not THAT great. the things i´ve seen in the pilot don´t feel any fresher to me. Same old zombie movie things presented like a drama. and so what? doesn´t feel like a movie to me. the dialog remind me zillions of movies i´ve seen, it´s good it´s ok, but i didn´t feel so captivated, there´s lots of CGI blood and nobody complain? for me, survival it´s not a good Romero but it´s still Ahead anybody who wants to attemp the zombie genre.there´s new things on it, fresh things, fresh escenarios and uses for the zombie(the feud, the wenstern vibe, the 50´s fordesque dialog and acting). i value that more that the execution.

george Romero who? creator, and imitated by the others. that´s the true. yo can make it 1000000 times and different but it´s the same that he created, even ideas land of the dead it´s been ripped now by lots of movies and these comic series. sorry but this show it´s good but it´s not a new king on the table, only a very good imitator/ alumn

[bassman]

You've also got to consider that this was the FIRST EPISODE. There are plenty of new, fresh things to bring to the table. The pilot just sets up the universe. The pilot isn't a movie with a beginning and an end. This is an on-going series and the first episode is to introduce us to the world, characters, and scenarios.

[LouCipherr]

GRAND SLAM.... so far

THIS! TWD = best zombie related show/movie I've seen in god knows how long.. has put Romero's recent shit to shame.


Geroge has already said he isn't going to:

http://popwatch.ew.com/2010/10/21/walking-dead-george-romero/

Things could always change, but he's pretty much a "do my own thing" guy as alluded to in the interview. :(

That's probably a good thing - don't fuck up an already fantastic series. :D

[sirjacktorrance]

yeah, i know. i read the comics. and i assure you that the comics keep taking ideas of the 6 romero zombie flicks and otheres expanding it.also the ongoing series will keep the same shitty CGI blood that makes romero fans angry in his lastets filcks. i assure you that survival has more real headshots than this first pilot. that´s it.

[ProfessorChaos]

but, unlike romero's shitty new films, we won't have the pez-head priest, cheezy defibrillator kills, fire-extinguisher gags, etc.

i can stand cgi as long as it's somewhat realistic and not used for absolutely ridiculous crap like the above examples.

and my initial assessment of the pilot still stands, here's what i posted in the thread from a week or so ago when it was leaked online:


earlier i said that the opening scene was better than anything romero has done since day of the dead. after watching the pilot, i think i'm gonna change my tune: the walking dead just might end up being better than anything romero has ever done.

the pilot was brilliant. great set-up, character development, and reveal of just how fucked things would be if there ever was an outbreak of the living dead. i could go on and on, but since i don't want to give anything away and a picture is worth a thousand words, i'll just sum it up like this:

http://pujolshomeruntickets.com/Pujols_home_run_ticket_pic_for_counter_2.jpg

http://www.e-zrentacar.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/capitol-fireworks02.jpg

http://www.adamriff.com/images/randy_marsh.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_pjGD0MWPkNY/S5BbEE7GUeI/AAAAAAAAEJQ/gMmSwDo8wfI/s320/MorePlease.jpg

oh, and kidgloves: i think i know what part had you on the verge of tears....glad i'm not the only one.

[bassman]

The CGI blood is there, but it's not quite as obvious as some of the latest flicks. Especially Land. There's a few CG blood shots in there that make me gringe.

It's funny that the CG looks better in a TV show than it did in a feature film..

[slickwilly13]

Still not gory enough for my taste, but so far the series, itself, is not bad.

[Mitchified]

It was a fantastic premier episode, no doubt about that. Probably in my top three (right up there with Dexter and Heroes). I don't know if it's fair to say that it's superior to everything that Romero has ever done, though. Anyone that reads The Walking Dead comics knows that a lot (and I mean a LOT) of it is pulled from ideas that Romero pioneered ten/twenty/thirty/six hundred forty-three years ago when it comes to the zombie aspect.

But something else that anyone who reads The Walking Dead should know is that it's not the horror aspects that make the series fantastic, it's the human elements. The relationships between the characters, how they grow and change due to the environment they've been placed in, etc. I'd almost say it's more of a fair comparison to judge The Walking Dead against shows like Lost or Mad Men than against Romero's work. There's only so much that you can shove into a two hour movie and still have a major payoff at the end; The Walking Dead can afford to go for a more paced approach that delves into the characters more because of its format.

[bassman]

It was a fantastic premier episode, no doubt about that. Probably in my top three (right up there with Dexter and Heroes). I don't know if it's fair to say that it's superior to everything that Romero has ever done, though. Anyone that reads The Walking Dead comics knows that a lot (and I mean a LOT) of it is pulled from ideas that Romero pioneered ten/twenty/thirty/six hundred forty-three years ago when it comes to the zombie aspect.


I'm fairly certain that DJ was meaning Romero's latest offerings. Land, Diary, and Survival.

[Mitchified]

Well, if that's the case, then no offense to Mr. Romero but I've gotten more enjoyment out of Geiko advertisements than the new stuff. Stuff like 28 Days/28 Weeks Later and [REC], while not strictly zombie movies, dethroned him way before The Walking Dead could have.

[sirjacktorrance]

but, unlike romero's shitty new films, we won't have the pez-head priest, cheezy defibrillator kills, fire-extinguisher gags, etc.

i can stand cgi as long as it's somewhat realistic and not used for absolutely ridiculous crap like the above examples.

and my initial assessment of the pilot still stands, here's what i posted in the thread from a week or so ago when it was leaked online:

yeah you can stand cgi blood if it´s in a grade A tv series. your assesment it´s your opinion. For me it´s clear that the inicial escene of land o f the dead it´s far away of all the 2000´s zombie movies and so on. even this pilot. there´s a diference on a well directed secuence and a diferent and fresh zombie story.Land and survival are these.

[ProfessorChaos]

something is lost in translation there. i see your location so i'm not gonna hold this against what you've just said, but i really don't understand what the hell you're trying to say.

i was saying cgi blood is one thing, cgi gags like romero's latest shit is another.

[LouCipherr]

yeah, i know. i read the comics. and i assure you that the comics keep taking ideas of the 6 romero zombie flicks and otheres expanding it.

I think you missed one thing at the end of that last sentance, SJT: "...and making it better"


also the ongoing series will keep the same shitty CGI blood that makes romero fans angry in his lastets filcks.

Looked a lot better than what I've seen in Land/Diary/Survival, that's for sure.


i assure you that survival has more real headshots than this first pilot.

Perhaps so, but overall, survival was a complete piece of garbage compared to just one episode of TWD.


Bottom line: Darabont got it right. :thumbsup: to the man.

[ProfessorChaos]

it's all a matter of opinion, but i gotta concur with lou that even the weakest episode of TWD will stand head and shoulders above land or any other new romero films.

and as for TWD series in whole, i think it's gonna be better than any romero film.

[MikePizzoff]

HOLY SHIT. That was incredible. I don't know if there has ever been a show so incredible.

Also, PLEASE people, start giving Kirkman some credit. It's not like Darabont pulled this stuff out of thin air.

[LouCipherr]

I'm fairly certain that DJ was meaning Romero's latest offerings. Land, Diary, and Survival.

btw: I meant to add, I'm not so sure of that, bassman.. lets see what he says when he gets back in here, but from what it sounded like when I talked to him about TWD, he might've meant more than the last 3 movies.... :shifty:

[DEAD BEAT]

Ok i get Romero started it all, but Darabont has now shown us a great zombie world. 40 minutes in and I can even say in words how friggin impressed I am with this show so far. This is just outstanding stuff and of course credit has to go to the source material, but goddamn this is great stuff and Romero needs to take notes on this for future projects.

You know a year or 2 ago i would have dissagreed with you but, after last nights premeire your right!

I just posted a thread last week on how i ignored Survival of the dead for sale and bought a double pack of the 28 days later movies!

Havn't even seen Survival and for the first time ever...dont really care to! "sorry GAR"

Of course the original Dawn has yet to be topped.....but he's lost it since Land that was one thing but the garbage that followed after really made me chuck! :(

[kidgloves]

Try not to compare this with Uncle George's later work and there is no need to slate the man either.
I do think some people are still stuck in the past though and stubbornly refuse to accept that time has moved on. These same people see it as blasphemy to even like other directors work because the genre "is GAR's". There is a whole lot going on in this series that is far superior to any recent zombie movie from direction to writing to acting. Shit, even the choice to have silence in long sections of the pilot is inspired. Its all about the atmosphere and "zombie sandbox" that Darabont likes to call his take. TWD shows the utmost respect to the Romero movies but expands it. Whats not to like.

And i wish people would stop banging on about "we've seen it all before" or "nothing new". Thats because its been done to death and there's not really much more to this genre than the world ends and people try to survive. Its how this is presented to the audience that matters.

[bassman]

btw: I meant to add, I'm not so sure of that, bassman.. lets see what he says when he gets back in here, but from what it sounded like when I talked to him about TWD, he might've meant more than the last 3 movies.... :shifty:

Wow. If that's the case....I'll be shocked. Very shocked.

"nothing new" - when you try to add too much new stuff you come out with velociraptors, howling revolutions, and horseback riding. :p

I've heard from a few people that the comics really change it up further down the line, so we'll see if the show does the same. Some changes that I'm not so sure should be included.....

[darth los]

HOLY SHIT. That was incredible. I don't know if there has ever been a show so incredible.

Also, PLEASE people, start giving Kirkman some credit. It's not like Darabont pulled this stuff out of thin air.

Certainly was, but let's not judge it too quickly yet, as series tend to lose steam or get redundant a season or 2 in.

I think it would be more fair to judge it against gar's work once this whole season is done and then go from there.

Gar's films are complete works. One episode of TWD no matter how stellar it is, is not and therefore it's not fair or appropriate to compare the 2.

Yet.

:cool:

[LouCipherr]

Certainly was, but let's not judge it too quickly yet, as series tend to lose steam or get redundant a season or 2 in.

I think it would be more fair to judge it against gar's work once this whole season is done and then go from there.

Gar's films are complete works. One episode of TWD no matter how stellar it is, is not and therefore it's not fair or appropriate to compare the 2.

Yet.

Well, at least we're off to a good start.

TWD was what, 90 minutes? Which means it was really an hour's worth of material. Considering GAR's latest 3 films were less than 2 hours long, I think we can certainly assert one thing: this episode of TWD was fantastic, and better than anything GAR has done since Day. We don't need a whole season to tell us that.

Even if the rest of TWD sucks balls, Darbont already trumped GAR's last 3 films in every way possible... in one episode.

That says a lot, my friend. ;)

[ProfessorChaos]

...let's not judge it too quickly yet, as series tend to lose steam or get redundant a season or 2 in.

i don't think that's gonna be the case here. fans of the comic know that some very interesting characters and events are in store for rick and the other survivors in the future.


And i wish people would stop banging on about "we've seen it all before" or "nothing new". Thats because its been done to death and there's not really much more to this genre than the world ends and people try to survive. Its how this is presented to the audience that matters.

correct. if this argument about TWD ripping everything off of GAR is true, then romero himself ripped off TWD because of the RV surviors of TWD use.....he clearly stole that idea for diary, right?:rolleyes:

[Danny]

Knowing whats to come from being a longtime reader of the comic book i can safely say at least half of you will get your MAD on and say "man fuck this preachy shit" after a while. Trust me, we will see many a poster on here change there tune. :lol:

[MikePizzoff]

Certainly was, but let's not judge it too quickly yet, as series tend to lose steam or get redundant a season or 2 in.

As long as they continue being true to the story, then there's no way for it to get redundant.

[sirjacktorrance]

i don't think that's gonna be the case here. fans of the comic know that some very interesting characters and events are in store for rick and the other survivors in the future.



correct. if this argument about TWD ripping everything off of GAR is true, then romero himself ripped off TWD because of the RV surviors of TWD use.....he clearly stole that idea for diary, right?:rolleyes:

rv survivors? i don´t get it.what idea?

[Legion2213]

I'm not gonna play mr macho. I've seen the pilot four times now and it chokes me up every single time.

This isn't just a zombie show, folks. This is drama at it's finest...

Believe me, you aren't the only one who choked a bit...that scene was aimed straight at the heart. Brilliant.

[ProfessorChaos]

there was an RV in the background during the pilot of TWD when it showed lori, carl, shane, and the rest of their survivors. this RV becomes an important part of the story later.

i was joking that since it was in TWD (comics) long before diary came out, perhaps romero ripped this idea off from kirkman, since the argument was made earlier that most of TWD is a rip-off of romero's work.

[darth los]

As long as they continue being true to the story, then there's no way for it to get redundant.


Well, at least we're off to a good start.

TWD was what, 90 minutes? Which means it was really an hour's worth of material. Considering GAR's latest 3 films were less than 2 hours long, I think we can certainly assert one thing: this episode of TWD was fantastic, and better than anything GAR has done since Day. We don't need a whole season to tell us that.

Even if the rest of TWD sucks balls, Darbont already trumped GAR's last 3 films in every way possible... in one episode.

That says a lot, my friend. ;)


i don't think that's gonna be the case here. fans of the comic know that some very interesting characters and events are in store for rick and the other survivors in the future.

Just saying that one of Gar's films is a complete work. One episode of TWD, not saying if it's better or not, is an unfinished idea. It would probably take about six episodes to complete a story ark while Dawn for example does it in two hours.

I think one thing we can all agree on is that TWD is like a nuclear weapon and GAr's last 3 offerings, to use sarge's word's, are rusty pea shooters by comparison.

Somebody should be taking notes.

:cool:

[DEAD BEAT]

lol may i add that it would have been extra killer if before the series premiere they had show the original Dawn rather than the remake!

(now time to vent) That was lame they should have showed the original and give GAR a little kudos, seems to me they want to leave him in the past along with his movies!

This genre is almost turning into Anna Nicole Smith baby situation, a couple of lops see something that is gonna bring them lots of money so they pretend like they give a shit about it!

Meaning that after they have anal raped the genre long enough till it isnt good anymore then leach onto the next victim, and GAR and true fans are left with a gapping canyon of a corn hole!

Anyone think im lieing here? If so where was Universal pictures back in the day when GAR was desperatly looking for distributing for the original Dawn?

Almost 30yrs later these blood suckers after GAR has proven himself and an audience for the genre,
"oh of course we'll finance the film Georgie!" I wouldn't doubt if they were part to blame for Lands flop!

[LouCipherr]

Just saying that one of Gar's films is a complete work. One episode of TWD, not saying if it's better or not, is an unfinished idea.

Unfinished idea?! The only unfinished ideas I have seen lately are Land, Diary or Survival. :lol:

"Unfinished idea" or not, that one epsiode is better than those three films combined. They could cancel TWD right now, and I would still stand behind that statement - and no further episodes are needed to confirm it's greatness. :D

The good news is, we are getting more episodes. Even if those new episodes aren't up to the caliber of the first, bottom line is, Darabont has gone the direction GAR should've years ago. ;)

I agree about TWD being nuclear - I couldn't have said it better myself, darth. :cool: :D

[Legion2213]

TWD was always an "unfinished idea" anyway was it not? "an ongoing story of survival horror". I don't think this is like a JMS series with a start a middle and an ending.

Anyways, unfinished idea or not, I enjoyed episode #1 more than "Land" and "Diary" put together...still not been motivated enough to lay out money on the "Survival" BD.

[Doc]

lol may i add that it would have been extra killer if before the series premiere they had show the original Dawn rather than the remake!


They probably didn't because they thought the remake would appeal more to mordern folks.......that and maybe, Rubstein was a dick and didn't let them...since, he owns the rights and all.

As, for Walking Dead....... I liked it! Was a bit slow, but I guess thats the standard pace for a series as they have more than 2 hrs to develop a story. Great visuals and backdrops.:)

[Legion2213]

I thought it was quite clever to have the very first scene being a zombie killing...just so folks didn't tune in and think it was "just another cop show"...they really set their stall out by headshotting a little zombie kid - "this is what this show is going to be about" - sort of thing.

[darth los]

Unfinished idea?! The only unfinished ideas I have seen lately are Land, Diary or Survival. :lol:

"Unfinished idea" or not, that one epsiode is better than those three films combined. They could cancel TWD right now, and I would still stand behind that statement - and no further episodes are needed to confirm it's greatness. :D

The good news is, we are getting more episodes. Even if those new episodes aren't up to the caliber of the first, bottom line is, Darabont has gone the direction GAR should've years ago. ;)

I agree about TWD being nuclear - I couldn't have said it better myself, darth. :cool: :D

It will be very interesting how the series ends up turning out.

My hopes are high that if it's a critically acclaimed show that it will garner a renewed interest in the genre and serious, good films will start to be made again. That there is more than a niche' market out there for that sort of thing.



TWD was always an "unfinished idea" anyway was it not? "an ongoing story of survival horror". I don't think this is like a JMS series with a start a middle and an ending.

Anyways, unfinished idea or not, I enjoyed episode #1 more than "Land" and "Diary" put together...still not been motivated enough to lay out money on the "Survival" BD.

Why do that when I can watch it on my ps3 Netflix service for free and in HD no less? I'll wait for the bargain bin to snatch that one up thank you very much.

:cool:

[sirjacktorrance]

there was an RV in the background during the pilot of TWD when it showed lori, carl, shane, and the rest of their survivors. this RV becomes an important part of the story later.

i was joking that since it was in TWD (comics) long before diary came out, perhaps romero ripped this idea off from kirkman, since the argument was made earlier that most of TWD is a rip-off of romero's work.

but the diary script was written even before land was shoot. ;)

OK. the thing is that there´s nothing really new in the kirkman comics. it´s a more developed zombie universe and that´s cool, but they keep taking ideas from all Romero movies. Remember the "gladiator" scene , the governor etc..

[Jamn]

I don't have a schedule of weekly shows I watch. I tend to stick to movies or might see a preview to a show that looks interesting, like the Lost Tapes episode, even though I don't watch it every week or wait for the new one to air. My wife has a list everyday of what show is on that she must watch. Last night she added the Walking Dead to her list so no complaints here. She is not even a horror fan. The DVD menu from Devil's Rejects made her stay awake until 3 in the morning.

[DEAD BEAT]

I don't have a schedule of weekly shows I watch. I tend to stick to movies or might see a preview to a show that looks interesting, like the Lost Tapes episode, even though I don't watch it every week or wait for the new one to air. My wife has a list everyday of what show is on that she must watch. Last night she added the Walking Dead to her list so no complaints here. She is not even a horror fan. The DVD menu from Devil's Rejects made her stay awake until 3 in the morning.

Same with me dude!

Never in my life have i ever anticipated a series before! You know i actually feel good about this series because with the past record of hit award winning series AMC has been putting out....it's safe to say that they really nit picked this show till it was ready! "any questions?" ;)

[MoonSylver]

Yeah, that's probably the first time the owner of a Toyota would be happy their accelerator pedal is stuck.

:lol:


I think most of the credit goes to Kirkman so far the show has pretty much spot on stuck to the book.... And Kirkman pretty much stuck to the Romero universe.

:thumbsup:


That's probably a good thing - don't fuck up an already fantastic series. :D

Eh...as others have pointed out, it's not his directing chops necessarily that have suffered. It's his writing. If he were directing someone else's scripted work. I think he'd be fine. But I don't think he has ANY interest in directing something he hasn't written himself (for better or worse...), so I'm dubious that it's much of an issue... :|


Knowing whats to come from being a longtime reader of the comic book i can safely say at least half of you will get your MAD on and say "man fuck this preachy shit" after a while. Trust me, we will see many a poster on here change there tune. :lol:

I refuse to believe anyone on HPOTD would bitch about anything....:lol:

[AcesandEights]

I know a large percentage of people on this board, myself included, have read the series to one degree or another, but please wrap spoiler tags around material you're refercing from future issues.

It just takes a little effort to not be a douche.

[Debbieangel]

All I can say is WOW it was what I have been waiting for...BRING ON NEXT WEEK's SHOW!!!
Comparing GAR and Darabont is like comparing apples and oranges if you ask me. I am just glad Darabont is staying with GAR's formula and running with it with Kirkman's comics. It is a win/win situation.
I think TWD is keeping all of us gore loving deadheads happy.
Look we have an AWESOME ZOMBIE series guys!
They actually listened to the fans and started a series just for us!!!
KUDO's to Darabont and Kirkman and the rest of the cast and crew...you have my interest for sure!

I want more and more and more PLEASE!!!!!:)

[Legion2213]

All I can say is WOW it was what I have been waiting for...BRING ON NEXT WEEK's SHOW!!!
Comparing GAR and Darabont is like comparing apples and oranges if you ask me. I am just glad Darabont is staying with GAR's formula and running with it with Kirkman's comics. It is a win/win situation.
I think TWD is keeping all of us gore loving deadheads happy.
Look we have an AWESOME ZOMBIE series guys!
They actually listened to the fans and started a series just for us!!!
KUDO's to Darabont and Kirkman and the rest of the cast and crew...you have my interest for sure!

I want more and more and more PLEASE!!!!!:)

Bolded bit is the most important bit for me...add the fact that is of sterling quality and this is pretty much the best early christmas present most of us could ask for.

Bring on the Blu-Ray!!!

[MoonSylver]

It just takes a little effort to not be a douche.

But it takes less to just go ahead & be one. :lol:

[ProfessorChaos]

Anyways, unfinished idea or not, I enjoyed episode #1 more than "Land" and "Diary" put together...still not been motivated enough to lay out money on the "Survival" BD.

yeah, don't bother with survival. you're not gonna change your tune over that shitty film, for sure. and after seeing the pilot for TWD, it'll be even more unbearable.

[clanglee]

OK. the thing is that there´s nothing really new in the kirkman comics. it´s a more developed zombie universe and that´s cool, but they keep taking ideas from all Romero movies. Remember the "gladiator" scene , the governor etc.. There is nothing new . . . . .period. I don't think that Kirkman is "copying" Romero so much as exploring the same themes. When you have a zombie movie or comicbook or newletter or whathaveyou, you are going to touch on the same types of themes over and over again. Hell Romero admits that he stole the genre from Richard Matheson. . .so I really don't see your point Jack. "Nothing new under the sun." Everything is "stolen" from something else, if you look hard enough you will find that everything you like has been done before and even better, and if you continue down that jaded road you will end up with a good case of the crazies. . . .

[MikePizzoff]

I know a large percentage of people on this board, myself included, have read the series to one degree or another, but please wrap spoiler tags around material you're refercing from future issues.

I was actually just about to suggest a mod adding *SPOILERS* to the title of this thread...

[DjfunkmasterG]

yeah, i know. i read the comics. and i assure you that the comics keep taking ideas of the 6 romero zombie flicks and otheres expanding it.also the ongoing series will keep the same shitty CGI blood that makes romero fans angry in his lastets filcks. i assure you that survival has more real headshots than this first pilot. that´s it.

Did we watch the same thing... TWD had more realistic headshots than any of romeros new stuff. You must be blind.


The CGI blood is there, but it's not quite as obvious as some of the latest flicks. Especially Land. There's a few CG blood shots in there that make me gringe.

It's funny that the CG looks better in a TV show than it did in a feature film..

Because Darabont insisted it be done right and not rushed.... Romero rushed all his work, mostly because of time constraints, but Darabont and Hurd insisted it look the best it could look.


I'm fairly certain that DJ was meaning Romero's latest offerings. Land, Diary, and Survival.

Pretty much..


yeah you can stand cgi blood if it´s in a grade A tv series. your assesment it´s your opinion. For me it´s clear that the inicial escene of land o f the dead it´s far away of all the 2000´s zombie movies and so on. even this pilot. there´s a diference on a well directed secuence and a diferent and fresh zombie story.Land and survival are these.

Land and Survival are total shit, and I now have to admit your opinion is worthless. Sorry Jack, but in this instance you are wrong. Darabont has clearly upstaged Romero and you need to accept this FACT and move on.[COLOR="Silver"]

---------- Post added at 12:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:11 AM ----------




Well, at least we're off to a good start.

TWD was what, 90 minutes? Which means it was really an hour's worth of material. Considering GAR's latest 3 films were less than 2 hours long, I think we can certainly assert one thing: this episode of TWD was fantastic, and better than anything GAR has done since Day. We don't need a whole season to tell us that.

Even if the rest of TWD sucks balls, Darbont already trumped GAR's last 3 films in every way possible... in one episode.

That says a lot, my friend. ;)

Excellent point Lou and I agree 100%, the pilot episode of TWD was 1,000,000 times better than Romero's last 3 efforts and I have already watched the pilot 2 times tonight alone since I got back from philly.

[JonOfTheShred]

I have to agree with the majority, this initial pilot is better than anything Romero has done post-Day. Its miles ahead of Diary and Survival.

But I still love Land. Maybe since its the first zed film I saw in theater, but I think with some adjustments Land could've been one of the best ever. (No more Big Daddy, a better actor to play Riley, at least a half hour of more footage but also some cuts to the rest of the movie.) With a more serious tone, something along the lines of this very pilot we're discussing, Land woulda been the tits.

[panic]

Romero has not made a decent movie since the 1980's. You can nitpick the TWD all you want, but its head-and-shoulders above anything Romero has done in a LONG time. Depending on how the balance of season one goes, it may turn out to be better than anything and everything Romero EVER did.

People that nitpick TWD should go back and watch early Romero with a critical eye. There are continuity errors all over the place. Romero's characters make stupid decisions left and right. Not to mention they are mostly unidimensional stereotypes.

Don't get me wrong I love Romero zombie movies, but trying to argue that Romero is some sort of movie genius is very difficult. He is the creator of the modern zombie meme, nothing more, nothing less.

[ProfessorChaos]

well said, panic.

i agree on all points.

[DjfunkmasterG]

I agree as well with Panic. those trashing TWD are just trying to hold Romero ona pedestal he doesn't really belong on anymore... hell even Edgar and Simon out shined him with SHAUN

[Danny]

ITT:

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y91/khazrak/ArthurGamesBinkysFactsandOpinions-PBSKids_1240880536393.png

[Neil]

I agree as well with Panic. those trashing TWD are just trying to hold Romero ona pedestal he doesn't really belong on anymore... hell even Edgar and Simon out shined him with SHAUN
Here we go into black and white territory!?

Who exactly is trashing TWD? I don't think anyone here is?

[mista_mo]

Land was pretty good, yea.

[LouCipherr]

I'm fairly certain that DJ was meaning Romero's latest offerings. Land, Diary, and Survival.


Pretty much..

*taps foot and stares at Dj*

"Pretty much..."? that's a bit ambiguous of a statement, isn't it?

C'mon, Dj.... :poke: :lol:

[AcesandEights]

Romero has not made a decent movie since the 1980's. You can nitpick the TWD all you want, but its head-and-shoulders above anything Romero has done in a LONG time. Depending on how the balance of season one goes, it may turn out to be better than anything and everything Romero EVER did.

People that nitpick TWD should go back and watch early Romero with a critical eye. There are continuity errors all over the place. Romero's characters make stupid decisions left and right. Not to mention they are mostly unidimensional stereotypes.

Don't get me wrong I love Romero zombie movies, but trying to argue that Romero is some sort of movie genius is very difficult. He is the creator of the modern zombie meme, nothing more, nothing less.

I agree with Prof, well said and good to see you posting again!

[DjfunkmasterG]

So i think the majority of us agree Darabont has upstaged Romero and we can now move on from this topic.

[AcesandEights]

So i think the majority of us agree Darabont has upstaged Romero and we can now move on from this topic.

I'll agree with all the people who consider the above an overly simplistic statement. :poke:

[DjfunkmasterG]

I'll agree with all the people who consider the above an overly simplistic statement. :poke:

Simplistic... but TRUE!

Moving on... :fin: :lol:

[AcesandEights]

Simplistic... but TRUE!

Moving on... :fin: :lol:

Give Romero his due & proper for blueprinting the whole thing and Kirkman credit for plot, conceptualization and characters, then revise your statement about about Darabont upstaging Romero to specify it's Romero's recent works and you'll have something you can hang your hat on.

By the way, if you need something else to hang a hat on, try this: :fin:

:lol: I love that thing.

[DrSiN]

Why the people feel the need to compare is beyond me. Who cares!

TWD is the absolute perfect storm of story telling. Darabont is an amazing characters director. His movies are almost all great character films and he has a knack for getting incredible performances out of his actors. That mirrors great with the material Kirkman has done since his comics are defined by the human characters and their flaws.

In S1E1, Darabont did what he did best, Krikman did what he did best and thankfully AMC was smart enough to give them the freedom and $$$. The results, a kick-ass episode which leaves little to complain about. It's unseated Dead Set as the best TV zombie to date!

I'd love to know the budget. I hear it's high though.


The additions to the comic so far have been pretty good. I really like what I think is the new dynamic for Lori/Rick/Shane. In the comic, it's more one night stand one the road but I got a distinct affair impression from the first Episode. I think this will ratchet up the tension later on.

Also, the whole scene sequence where Morgan's son get's upset that his dead mom is back.. man, so well done. Everything in this episode was pitch perfect.


I will say that I didn't care for either CG blood shot (the biker girl, or the deputy head shot). I'm sure it's a budget issue, but why use CG was a physical effect will do just fine. And some of the "destroyed" building CG was obvious. But for the most part, the sets and effects where AAA.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Give Romero his due & proper for blueprinting the whole thing and Kirkman credit for plot, conceptualization and characters, then revise your statement about about Darabont upstaging Romero to specify it's Romero's recent works and you'll have something you can hang your hat on.

By the way, if you need something else to hang a hat on, try this: :fin:

:lol: I love that thing.


I gave Romero his due int he first post... I will leave it at that. :D

[bassman]

I'm sure it's a budget issue, but why use CG was a physical effect will do just fine.

You nailed it. It's down to time and money. Heard Romero say it and heard Darabont say it. It just takes too long to have everyone standing around while the practical effects guys set up the wound, blood, etc. Then you've got to wait around while they clean it all up and do it all over again. Much easier and cheaper to have someone jerk their head back a few times and then add it in later.

Kirkman says in an interview that there is actually tons of CG work in the pilot. When Rick first rides off on the horse("whoa whoa whoa...") his hat actually flew off in the take they wanted to use. So they had the digital guys remove the real hat, and add another back to Rick's head.:eek:

[AcesandEights]

I will say that I didn't care for either CG blood shot (the biker girl, or the deputy head shot). I'm sure it's a budget issue, but why use CG was a physical effect will do just fine. And some of the "destroyed" building CG was obvious. But for the most part, the sets and effects where AAA.

Hmmm, it's interesting, I'm not a gore connoisseur so I don't have an eye for effects like that, but I really felt like they nailed all the effects. I guess if you know what to look for you catch these things.

[kidgloves]

You nailed it. It's down to time and money. Heard Romero say it and heard Darabont say it. It just takes too long to have everyone standing around while the practical effects guys set up the wound, blood, etc. Then you've got to wait around while they clean it all up and do it all over again. Much easier and cheaper to have someone jerk their head back a few times and then add it in later.


Also actors aren't allowed to wear squibs anymore. It has to be a stuntman.

[LouCipherr]

*taps foot and stares at Dj*

"Pretty much..."? that's a bit ambiguous of a statement, isn't it?

C'mon, Dj.... :poke: :lol:

*taps foot impatiently*

I see you glanced right over my stick-poking.. :lol: :p

[darth los]

People that nitpick TWD should go back and watch early Romero with a critical eye. There are continuity errors all over the place. Romero's characters make stupid decisions left and right.

Like rushing into a city of the dead alone and on horseback?

The people on the radio in the tank were right to call him a dumbass.

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

*taps foot impatiently*

I see you glanced right over my stick-poking.. :lol: :p

https://donate.wspa.org.uk/uploads/images/bearbaiting_baigent%29image.JPG

:D

[bassman]

Like rushing into a city of the dead alone and on horseback?

The people on the radio in the tank were right to call him a dumbass.


It was pretty silly, but at the same time he thought that the military had control of Atlanta. He really had no warning of it being overrun with the dead. And I'm sure he thought the horse would be quick enough to high tail it out of there if necessary. But then of course he gets cornered...

[AcesandEights]

Like rushing into a city of the dead alone and on horseback?

The people on the radio in the tank were right to call him a dumbass.

:cool:

Dunno, he was only out of a coma for a few days, only had his wife and child in mind, had slept through the worst--hence most informative portion of the 'rising'--hadn't seen a massively excited herd yet (scrubs out front of the house early on don't count) and thought there might be a military and CDC holdout.

Yeah, I know I say I wouldn't go to a place like that all the time on these boards, but if it really happened and all the factors weighed in above, I think that's a lot more damned reasonable than...."Muldoooooooooon!" :D

[DjfunkmasterG]

*taps foot impatiently*

I see you glanced right over my stick-poking.. :lol: :p


:poke: Awwww, do you feel left out cuz I didn't poke you back?

[darth los]

It was pretty silly, but at the same time he thought that the military had control of Atlanta. He really had no warning of it being overrun with the dead. And I'm sure he thought the horse would be quick enough to high tail it out of there if necessary. But then of course he gets cornered...


No warning of being overrun perhaps. But as John said it was definitely a dead place. That much was apparent upon entry and he was way too lax.

I bet he won't make that mistake again though. :lol:



Dunno, he was only out of a coma for a few days, only had his wife and child in mind, had slept through the worst--hence most informative portion of the 'rising'--hadn't seen a massively excited herd yet (scrubs out front of the house early on don't count) and thought there might be a military and CDC holdout.

Yeah, I know I say I wouldn't go to a place like that all the time on these boards, but if it really happened and all the factors weighed in above, I think that's a lot more damned reasonable than...."Muldoooooooooon!" :D

That muldoon line cracks me up every time.

Oh gAr. :rolleyes:

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

No warning of being overrun perhaps. But as John said it was definitely a dead place. That much was apparent upon entry and he was way too lax.

I bet he won't make that mistake again though. :lol:




That muldoon line cracks me up every time.


I know, I think that would make an awesome Tshirt. BillyRay is the one who likes to throw it out a lot, iirc and I always want to laugh when I see it.

[bassman]

No warning of being overrun perhaps. But as John said it was definitely a dead place. That much was apparent upon entry and he was way too lax.

I bet he won't make that mistake again though. :lol:

Perhaps he was thinking the military was holed up in one small region? I doubt they would have the whole city secured like Pittsburgh in Land. They could have taken over the Georgia Dome(if youire familiar with the area)? It's close to 85(the interstate he came in on) and actually would have been an interesting parallel to New Orleans....

It was kinda silly how calm he was about it, but it's not that big of a stretch to think I would go into the city looking for my family. I probably would have stuck close to fire escapes so I could climb up if I had to, but I definitely would have tried...

[ProfessorChaos]

can somebody fill me in on the muldoon bit? i had to shut survival off and guess i didn't hang around enough for this gem of dialogue....

[AcesandEights]

can somebody fill me in on the muldoon bit? i had to shut survival off and guess i didn't hang around enough for this gem of dialogue....

Depends on who is saying it and how it's said.

For a lot of people I would say it's just a sort of all-in-one condemnation of certain choices GAR has made with his current projects, but it literally refers to the over (emotive) refrain of the O'Flynn patriarch when referencing his one-dimensional overly simplified enemy Muldoon (of clan Muldoon). :skull:

[LouCipherr]

https://donate.wspa.org.uk/uploads/images/bearbaiting_baigent%29image.JPG

:D

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Awwww, do you feel left out cuz I didn't poke you back?

No, I feel like you left something out. :p :lol:

[BillyRay]

can somebody fill me in on the muldoon bit? i had to shut survival off and guess i didn't hang around enough for this gem of dialogue....

O'Flynn keeps yelling it about every 5 minutes.

MULDOOOOOOOON!!!!!

Then he does a jig, eats a potato and some Lucky Charms, and thinks of more ways to be a parody of an irishman.

[darth los]

Then he does a jig, eats a potato and some Lucky Charms, and thinks of more ways to be a parody of an irishman.

ROLMMFAO! :lol:

Post of the day and defo sig worthy.

:cool:

[Trin]

So i think the majority of us agree Darabont has upstaged Romero and we can now move on from this topic.
I disagree with this. TWD has one episode under its belt. All it has done is establish a situation, a few characters, and a few plot twists. It has a lot left in front of it. And right now the fans are blinded by anticipation.

Comparing TWD with a GAR movie is difficult. As others have pointed out, GAR has to fit setting, character development, plot development and conclusion into a 90-100 minute format. TWD was able to spend a solid half that amount of time just establishing the setting and a couple characters.

Want a more appropriate comparison? Compare the TWD first episode with the first 10 minutes of Land. Land didn't suffer its criticisms for how it opened. It suffered for how it developed and concluded. We don't know how TWD will sustain and conclude. It may get preachy (as hellsing suggests), the plot may get weird, the ending may be trash. If I just compare the TWD opening to the Land opening I'm still of the opinion that GAR's was better.

Don't get me wrong... TWD was good. It was a strong start. It left me believing that it can deliver a solid zombie storyline. But it's not flawless by any measure!!

Here's my breakdown.

The good:
- No silliness. The story had a very real, practical, tangible feel to it. It took the subject matter very seriously.

- Good character identification. The characters were well conceived and well acted. The direction conveyed a solid sense of who these people are and convinced us to care about them.

- Awesome depiction of the environment. The wrecked hospital, the bodies about, the town, the evidence of military presence... just everything. Every little detail of the world added to our understanding, and kept the intrigue alive.

- The suspense was palpable. We know at some level what's coming, but watching it unfold through his eyes as it unfolds is very chilling.

Here is the bad:
- 28 Days Later opening? Not good. I didn't buy it in 28 Days and I didn't buy it here. No one survives unconscious for a month as the world dies around them, then magically wakes up fine.

- The pace was too slow. Too many long introspective moments. Too many long drawn out scenes of incidental stuff. I got the feeling they were looking to stretch the events out over as long a time period as possible. At some point that is going to shift from building anticipation to building fan frustration. If weeks drag by and the plot barely budges they'll have a mess.

- The relative sparsity of zombies (I've not read the comics, so I don't know how it unfolds) is a ticking timebomb. With the long drawn out scenes of exploration both out in the rural areas and in the fringes of Atlanta they (perhaps unintentionally) sold me that survivability outside the city is relatively easy. If they want to now sell me a world that's tough to survive... well, they've created an uphill battle for themselves.

- Let's face it... the dude got cornered in a wide open set of streets while on a horse. That's pretty f'in lame. He'd been riding around the streets for a long time with only seeing a few here and there. Then, boom, he's surrounded. They used tricky tight camera angles and close ups to make it look like he had no place to run, but I'm not buying it. We just got done with sweeping views of open streets. All he had to do was retreat along his entry path a few hundred yards and he woulda been fine.

So, all in all, a good start. I'll be glued to my set. I'll be very surprised if it maintains its current level of awesomeness.

[DjfunkmasterG]

I disagree with this. TWD has one episode under its belt. All it has done is establish a situation, a few characters, and a few plot twists. It has a lot left in front of it. And right now the fans are blinded by anticipation.

Comparing TWD with a GAR movie is difficult. As others have pointed out, GAR has to fit setting, character development, plot development and conclusion into a 90-100 minute format. TWD was able to spend a solid half that amount of time just establishing the setting and a couple characters.

Want a more appropriate comparison? Compare the TWD first episode with the first 10 minutes of Land. Land didn't suffer its criticisms for how it opened. It suffered for how it developed and concluded. We don't know how TWD will sustain and conclude. It may get preachy (as hellsing suggests), the plot may get weird, the ending may be trash. If I just compare the TWD opening to the Land opening I'm still of the opinion that GAR's was better.

Don't get me wrong... TWD was good. It was a strong start. It left me believing that it can deliver a solid zombie storyline. But it's not flawless by any measure!!

Here's my breakdown.

The good:
- No silliness. The story had a very real, practical, tangible feel to it. It took the subject matter very seriously.

- Good character identification. The characters were well conceived and well acted. The direction conveyed a solid sense of who these people are and convinced us to care about them.

- Awesome depiction of the environment. The wrecked hospital, the bodies about, the town, the evidence of military presence... just everything. Every little detail of the world added to our understanding, and kept the intrigue alive.

- The suspense was palpable. We know at some level what's coming, but watching it unfold through his eyes as it unfolds is very chilling.

Here is the bad:
- 28 Days Later opening? Not good. I didn't buy it in 28 Days and I didn't buy it here. No one survives unconscious for a month as the world dies around them, then magically wakes up fine.

- The pace was too slow. Too many long introspective moments. Too many long drawn out scenes of incidental stuff. I got the feeling they were looking to stretch the events out over as long a time period as possible. At some point that is going to shift from building anticipation to building fan frustration. If weeks drag by and the plot barely budges they'll have a mess.

- The relative sparsity of zombies (I've not read the comics, so I don't know how it unfolds) is a ticking timebomb. With the long drawn out scenes of exploration both out in the rural areas and in the fringes of Atlanta they (perhaps unintentionally) sold me that survivability outside the city is relatively easy. If they want to now sell me a world that's tough to survive... well, they've created an uphill battle for themselves.

- Let's face it... the dude got cornered in a wide open set of streets while on a horse. That's pretty f'in lame. He'd been riding around the streets for a long time with only seeing a few here and there. Then, boom, he's surrounded. They used tricky tight camera angles and close ups to make it look like he had no place to run, but I'm not buying it. We just got done with sweeping views of open streets. All he had to do was retreat along his entry path a few hundred yards and he woulda been fine.

So, all in all, a good start. I'll be glued to my set. I'll be very surprised if it maintains its current level of awesomeness.

You're misreading my statement TRIN... I am just referring to the DARABONT directed episode "Days Gone Bye" That is it. In this one episode DARABONT, IMHO, has outshined Romero. I cant compare Darabont to Romero n further episodes because Darabont isn't directing 2-6, nor is he writing 2-6, just producing.

[AcesandEights]

It's too late, DJ!

Don't say you weren't warned...

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Wvkd8i9RN4Q/S_06nQEbbQI/AAAAAAAAAMA/BIxzv23f8Ak/s1600/3b9f4cf5-burn-the-witch-burn-witch-kill-monty-python-demotivational-poster-1223816026.jpg

[bassman]

I cant compare Darabont to Romero n further episodes because Darabont isn't directing 2-6, nor is he writing 2-6, just producing.

Actually...I think he wrote episodes 1-3. Kirkman wrote 4. Not sure about the other two.

But as for the first episode. Don't you dare form an opinion of it without seeing the rest. People won't have that around here.(see the "overrated" thread)

[DjfunkmasterG]

Actually...I think he wrote episodes 1-3. Kirkman wrote 4. Not sure about the other two.

But as for the first episode. Don't you dare form an opinion of it without seeing the rest. People won't have that around here.(see the "overrated" thread)


I believe you are correct BM, Darabont did write 1-3, but again I am just comparing Romeros work to Darabonts episode and if people don't like my opinion fuck'em. (not saying you, just everyone in general who doesn't like my opinion) I am sorry if it is a blow to their Romero purist ego, but from what I have watched, the statement stands. I do give Romero his props for bring this breed of zombie too life, so to speak, but in this instance DARABONT has clearly upstaged Uncle George.

[Legion2213]

Trin, quick point about the horse. It was natural that it would bolt...this wasn't a police horse that had had years of crowd training. It was also confronted with like zombies while being riden by a total stranger. Totally believable for me.

As for the "Day of the triffids opening" (or 28 days later if you prefer). Just a way of saving money, would've eaten half their filming budget to show the initial breakdown of society in any sort of detail IMO. Hopefully, as time goes on, we might see a few flashbacks of that sort of stuff, or maybe we'll have to wait for WWZ if we want to see the military fighting hordes of zacks.

TWD's first and only episode to date, might not be perfect, but it's the best zombie stuff I've seen since for many years.

[Deckard]

- 28 Days Later opening? Not good. I didn't buy it in 28 Days and I didn't buy it here. No one survives unconscious for a month as the world dies around them, then magically wakes up fine.


Well this has been discussed in various threads, but simply the hospital might have recently been over ran as the military might have been using it as some sort of command post or supply and first aid station.



- The pace was too slow. Too many long introspective moments. Too many long drawn out scenes of incidental stuff. I got the feeling they were looking to stretch the events out over as long a time period as possible. At some point that is going to shift from building anticipation to building fan frustration. If weeks drag by and the plot barely budges they'll have a mess.

I think this will change to a degree as more characters are added in upcoming episodes.



- The relative sparsity of zombies (I've not read the comics, so I don't know how it unfolds) is a ticking timebomb. With the long drawn out scenes of exploration both out in the rural areas and in the fringes of Atlanta they (perhaps unintentionally) sold me that survivability outside the city is relatively easy. If they want to now sell me a world that's tough to survive... well, they've created an uphill battle for themselves.

Keep in mind that Morgan said that they become more active at night as we see through the window of the house when the street is literally filled with them. Morgan also gives several of his own explanations for why they are more active at night than the day. I think the night time scenes will certainly be more dangerous (most scenes in the pilot were during the day), but I agree with you based on the pilot, the day time has way to few zombies even for the small town that Rick lives in.


- Let's face it... the dude got cornered in a wide open set of streets while on a horse. That's pretty f'in lame. He'd been riding around the streets for a long time with only seeing a few here and there. Then, boom, he's surrounded. They used tricky tight camera angles and close ups to make it look like he had no place to run, but I'm not buying it. We just got done with sweeping views of open streets. All he had to do was retreat along his entry path a few hundred yards and he woulda been fine.

If you watch the scene, after he turns the corner and backtracks there are no longer any open streets or areas, zombies are everywhere. If you want to argue that there couldn't be that amount of zombies all of a sudden that is a fine and a valid point. However, the zombies particularly in the day (which the Atlanta scene occurs in) seem not to move around much ie the zombies around the corner, the zombie near the driveway laying against a fence post of the house Morgan and his son live in, the zombies in the bus. Maybe they were in the buildings because the sun bothers them or makes them decay faster who knows. We do know that sound gets them moving no matter what the time, and between Grimes on horseback on pavement and the helicopter, those noises might have stirred the zombies from whatever "lair" they were in.

[darth los]

I disagree with this. TWD has one episode under its belt. All it has done is establish a situation, a few characters, and a few plot twists. It has a lot left in front of it. And right now the fans are blinded by anticipation.

Comparing TWD with a GAR movie is difficult. As others have pointed out, GAR has to fit setting, character development, plot development and conclusion into a 90-100 minute format. TWD was able to spend a solid half that amount of time just establishing the setting and a couple characters.

Want a more appropriate comparison? Compare the TWD first episode with the first 10 minutes of Land. Land didn't suffer its criticisms for how it opened. It suffered for how it developed and concluded. We don't know how TWD will sustain and conclude. It may get preachy (as hellsing suggests), the plot may get weird, the ending may be trash. If I just compare the TWD opening to the Land opening I'm still of the opinion that GAR's was better.

Don't get me wrong... TWD was good. It was a strong start. It left me believing that it can deliver a solid zombie storyline. But it's not flawless by any measure!!

Here's my breakdown.

The good:
- No silliness. The story had a very real, practical, tangible feel to it. It took the subject matter very seriously.

- Good character identification. The characters were well conceived and well acted. The direction conveyed a solid sense of who these people are and convinced us to care about them.

- Awesome depiction of the environment. The wrecked hospital, the bodies about, the town, the evidence of military presence... just everything. Every little detail of the world added to our understanding, and kept the intrigue alive.

- The suspense was palpable. We know at some level what's coming, but watching it unfold through his eyes as it unfolds is very chilling.

Here is the bad:
- 28 Days Later opening? Not good. I didn't buy it in 28 Days and I didn't buy it here. No one survives unconscious for a month as the world dies around them, then magically wakes up fine.

- The pace was too slow. Too many long introspective moments. Too many long drawn out scenes of incidental stuff. I got the feeling they were looking to stretch the events out over as long a time period as possible. At some point that is going to shift from building anticipation to building fan frustration. If weeks drag by and the plot barely budges they'll have a mess.

- The relative sparsity of zombies (I've not read the comics, so I don't know how it unfolds) is a ticking timebomb. With the long drawn out scenes of exploration both out in the rural areas and in the fringes of Atlanta they (perhaps unintentionally) sold me that survivability outside the city is relatively easy. If they want to now sell me a world that's tough to survive... well, they've created an uphill battle for themselves.

- Let's face it... the dude got cornered in a wide open set of streets while on a horse. That's pretty f'in lame. He'd been riding around the streets for a long time with only seeing a few here and there. Then, boom, he's surrounded. They used tricky tight camera angles and close ups to make it look like he had no place to run, but I'm not buying it. We just got done with sweeping views of open streets. All he had to do was retreat along his entry path a few hundred yards and he woulda been fine.

So, all in all, a good start. I'll be glued to my set. I'll be very surprised if it maintains its current level of awesomeness.

Damn Trin. Did you read my mind. I've never been one to put up long posts so I am relieved you're here to do it for me.

I agree with everything you said. The episode was good. I don't know if it was from watching the trailer or not but there was nothing that knocked my socks off. No "Oh Snap!" :eek: moment.

-As you can tell from my earlier post I agree about him getting cornered in the streets like that. Not believable. It just seemed like an easy way to explain him getting locked in the tank. An unbelievable scenario in order to advance the plot/show. ( And isn't that what so many people's criticism of Dawn 04' is? A film filled with inexplicable decisions like that?)

-As for the sparcity of zombies, I totally agree. How someone could walk for a mile and not come across more than token resistance is inexplicable. I also didn't like the fact that they would disperse after a while. The Gar ghouls are relentless. Whether it's at the mall doors or the gates to the underground bunker, once they know you're in there they will never leave.

-And yeah, waking up in a hospital alone in the midst of all that is not plausible. He should have been eaten up a while ago.

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

Well this has been discussed in various threads, but simply the hospital might have recently been over ran as the military might have been using it as some sort of command post or supply and first aid station.



I think this will change to a degree as more characters are added in upcoming episodes.



Keep in mind that Morgan said that they become more active at night as we see through the window of the house when the street is literally filled with them. Morgan also gives several of his own explanations for why they are more active at night than the day. I think the night time scenes will certainly be more dangerous (most scenes in the pilot were during the day), but I agree with you based on the pilot, the day time has way to few zombies even for the small town that Rick lives in.



If you watch the scene, after he turns the corner and backtracks there are no longer any open streets or areas, zombies are everywhere. If you want to argue that there couldn't be that amount of zombies all of a sudden that is a fine and a valid point. However, the zombies particularly in the day (which the Atlanta scene occurs in) seem not to move around much ie the zombies around the corner, the zombie near the driveway laying against a fence post of the house Morgan and his son live in, the zombies in the bus. Maybe they were in the buildings because the sun bothers them or makes them decay faster who knows. We do know that sound gets them moving no matter what the time, and between Grimes on horseback on pavement and the helicopter, those noises might have stirred the zombies from whatever "lair" they were in.

Excellent points, all! :thumbsup:

The fact that many of the Dead seemed to have had their attentions brought to bare by a combination of Rick's horse and the chopper was spot on, to me.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Damn Trin. Did you read my mind. I've never been one to put up long posts so I am relieved you're here to do it for me.

I agree with everything you said. The episode was good. I don't know if it was from watching the trailer or not but there was nothing that knocked my socks off. No "Oh Snap!" :eek: moment.

-As you can tell from my earlier post I agree about him getting cornered in the streets like that. Not believable. It just seemed like an easy way to explain him getting locked in the tank. An unbelievable scenario in order to advance the plot/show. ( And isn't that what so many people's criticism of Dawn 04' is? A film filled with inexplicable decisions like that?)

-As for the sparcity of zombies, I totally agree. How someone could walk for a mile and not come across more than token resistance is inexplicable. I also didn't like the fact that they would disperse after a while. The Gar ghouls are relentless. Whether it's at the mall doors or the gates to the underground bunker, once they know you're in there they will never leave.

-And yeah, waking up in a hospital alone in the midst of all that is not plausible. He should have been eaten up a while ago.

:cool:


Well if they are drawn to Noise as was said int he show them not eating Rick in the hospital is believable because he was in a coma... plus when he walks out a gurney is blocking his door, now while it easily rolled away it was also suggested the military had control of that hospital until it was too far gone but the dead were locked away so again, everything that occurred is believable from a rational point of view.

[mista_mo]

And yeah, waking up in a hospital alone in the midst of all that is not plausible. He should have been eaten up a while ago.

Door was closed, locked and a gurney was placed in front of the door. unless the undead know for a fact that something edible was in the room, i highly doubt they would attempt to even open the door. Also, Power was off in the city, yet the lights were still on in the hospital. This implies that the hospital was running on a back up generator, and I doubt it could do that for very very long. The hospital also seemed to be a nest of activity for the military, so it isn't out of the ordinary for the hospital to have survived relatively unscathed for a little longer than the rest of the city did. I think that Rick woke up a few days at the most, after everyone was killed or took off, so it isn't strange to think that he survived at all.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Door was closed, locked and a gurney was placed in front of the door. unless the undead know for a fact that something edible was in the room, i highly doubt they would attempt to even open the door. Also, Power was off in the city, yet the lights were still on in the hospital. This implies that the hospital was running on a back up generator, and I doubt it could do that for very very long. The hospital also seemed to be a nest of activity for the military, so it isn't out of the ordinary for the hospital to have survived relatively unscathed for a little longer than the rest of the city did. I think that Rick woke up a few days at the most, after everyone was killed or took off, so it isn't strange to think that he survived at all.

Agreed

[kidgloves]

Door was closed, locked and a gurney was placed in front of the door. unless the undead know for a fact that something edible was in the room, i highly doubt they would attempt to even open the door. Also, Power was off in the city, yet the lights were still on in the hospital. This implies that the hospital was running on a back up generator, and I doubt it could do that for very very long. The hospital also seemed to be a nest of activity for the military, so it isn't out of the ordinary for the hospital to have survived relatively unscathed for a little longer than the rest of the city did. I think that Rick woke up a few days at the most, after everyone was killed or took off, so it isn't strange to think that he survived at all.

Theres also signs that the dead didn't make it as far as the corridor where his room was. When he steps out the room the corridor is fairly normal but dark. As he makes his way further out you can see the situation unfolding. The head height gunshot holes in the wall with blood splatters was ace. The whole hospital segment was setup to provide some sort of backstory but if people didn't enjoy it as much as the rest of us seem to have then they aren't going to go back and pick up these details

[Legion2213]

Let's be honest, there isn't a film or TV series in creation that you couldn't pick holes in if you really wanted to. TWD is no different.

Bottom line: We have (for the first time in our lives) a zombie TV series, it looks to be very high quality, the positives for me far outweigh any negatives. :cool:

If the pilot is an indication of the overall tone and quality of future shows, then I am one happy bunny. :)

[DjfunkmasterG]

I thinkt his show is going to do very well and with a 5.3 viewer rating, meaning 5+ million tuned in that is great stuff, considering it is a cable channel. Word of mouth may help it grow and you can bet us die hards will be buying the BR day and date of release.

[Trin]

Thanks Darth!! I was cheering for your similar post a few pages back.

@Deej - Even if you're only referring to the Darabont directed episode I still disagree. I'm not sure how you can compare them at all, much less conclude one upstaged a series of movies.

Personally, I think Darabont did a great job of doing something completely different than what GAR has done. I think that before he can upstage GAR he has to undertake a much bigger challenge. I also think that TWD has proven that Darabont deserves a shot at that challenge.

@Legion - I agree with you about the horse. I was actually a bit miffed he chose the horse for just that reason. I don't know much about horses, but it seems an unreliable, unpredictable mode of transport. I wouldn't say I was actively going "wtf" over it, but I was none too happy.

On a side note, can we really justify him running out of gas? I don't see how that happens with the dozens of cars he passed ... literally everywhere. Especially since we established right off that he was gas-hunting. It seemed a bit like contriving plot to me, and that gets into GAR territory!! *shudder*

I suppose one could argue that gas was depleted as society crumbled, but the evidence suggests that people fled and abandoned areas, or holed up in areas, which doesn't jive with resources being depleted uniformly. In a WWBMD analysis I see finding a source of gas and filling up all the 5-gallon containers you can find as job #1. And not traveling on any less than half a tank away from a source without finding a new source.

What do you feed a horse anyway? Is that easier to find than gas?

@Deckard - I agree with all your observations, and my main point on the crowd of zombies is just as you said, I don't see there being that amount around all of a sudden. That represents a serious lack of awareness to his surroundings in a situation where he would be looking over his shoulder constantly. Again, it has the subtle smell of plot contrivance, and that sort of thing tends to get worse, not better.

@Everone... Don't let my balanced opinion fool you... I enjoyed the show immensely and am looking forward to the rest. The Good list definitely outweighs the Bad list. I'm totally stoked to see where it goes, but at the same time I'm keeping my expectations on the leash just in case.

[Legion2213]

Just a few thoughts on the horse choice...

I'm pretty sure horses can "get by" on cropping grass for a while, the horse may have seemed like a good idea because it provided a good vantage point to scan the area he was heading into.

Also it's able to weave in and out of traffic jams and tackle uneven ground if need be.

I'm no expert but I think the above points are pretty valid. Hell, maybe he even thought that being an animal, it would be able to sense zacks a bit sooner than it did.

*looks forward to BD/DVD commentaries that explain lots of things we'd like to know* :)

[rongravy]

How many days was that guy alone in a coma? My main question is why weren't his backside choked with poo? Or would there be a shitbag already attached to him? I didn't see him pull one off. I kept picturing a Hot Tub Time Machine gag where he's pulling out his catheter...

[clanglee]

It is a testament to our argumentative nature that so soon after the release of this highly anticipated show and we are already picking it apart like so many vultures.
I don't see any reason to compare the show to a George Romero project at all. Nothing . . . .NOTHING would ever replace the love I have for the original holy trilogy, but By that same token, I can see myself loving the Walking Dead just as much in the future because of its own greatness.
I love peanutbutter sandwiches. . .and I love banana/peanutbutter sandwiches. Banana/peanutbutter sandwiches would not be around if the peanutbutter sandwich hadn't been here first. And I loved the peanutbutter sandwich first, but now I love the banana/peanutbutter sandwich as much as just the peanutbutter sandwich. . . . . .damn I'm hungry. . . .

---------- Post added at 05:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:53 PM ----------


How many days was that guy alone in a coma? My main question is why weren't his backside choked with poo? Or would there be a shitbag already attached to him? I didn't see him pull one off. I kept picturing a Hot Tub Time Machine gag where he's pulling out his catheter...
:lol: I thought of that too.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Just a few thoughts on the horse choice...

I'm pretty sure horses can "get by" on cropping grass for a while, the horse may have seemed like a good idea because it provided a good vantage point to scan the area he was heading into.

Also it's able to weave in and out of traffic jams and tackle uneven ground if need be.

I'm no expert but I think the above points are pretty valid. Hell, maybe he even thought that being an animal, it would be able to sense zacks a bit sooner than it did.

*looks forward to BD/DVD commentaries that explain lots of things we'd like to know* :)



I am hoping for an extended cut BR... I have a feeling Frank shot a lot of footage and I wanna see what had to be cut to get the running time down. I feel a gorier version is on the way, and I hope and pray it has tons of extras.

[Legion2213]

I am hoping for an extended cut BR... I have a feeling Frank shot a lot of footage and I wanna see what had to be cut to get the running time down. I feel a gorier version is on the way, and I hope and pray it has tons of extras.

Mmm, a true 90 minute pilot with no adds... :cool:

[DjfunkmasterG]

Mmm, a true 90 minute pilot with no adds... :cool:

Yep, zombie goodness.... however, i would love to see the series air at a cinema, i would love to have seen all of that from Ep 1 on the big screen.

[MoonSylver]

So i think the majority of us agree Darabont has upstaged Romero and we can now move on from this topic.


I'll agree with all the people who consider the above an overly simplistic statement. :poke:


Give Romero his due & proper for blueprinting the whole thing and Kirkman credit for plot, conceptualization and characters, then revise your statement about about Darabont upstaging Romero to specify it's Romero's recent works and you'll have something you can hang your hat on.


Why the people feel the need to compare is beyond me. Who cares!


O'Flynn keeps yelling it about every 5 minutes.

MULDOOOOOOOON!!!!!

Then he does a jig, eats a potato and some Lucky Charms, and thinks of more ways to be a parody of an irishman.

:lol::lol::lol:


It is a testament to our argumentative nature that so soon after the release of this highly anticipated show and we are already picking it apart like so many vultures.
I don't see any reason to compare the show to a George Romero project at all. Nothing . . . .NOTHING would ever replace the love I have for the original holy trilogy, but By that same token, I can see myself loving the Walking Dead just as much in the future because of its own greatness.
I love peanutbutter sandwiches. . .and I love banana/peanutbutter sandwiches. Banana/peanutbutter sandwiches would not be around if the peanutbutter sandwich hadn't been here first. And I loved the peanutbutter sandwich first, but now I love the banana/peanutbutter sandwich as much as just the peanutbutter sandwich. . . . . .damn I'm hungry. . .

Thanks for saving me all that typing guys. ;)

[bassman]

I feel a gorier version is on the way,

I don't think it will be too much more gory. Taken from a Kirkman interview:


EW: Even your original comic didn’t kick off in such a brutal fashion. Was there much discussion about that whether that was a good idea?

RK: You know, it was just something Frank put into the script. At no point did AMC say, “Yeah, maybe we shouldn’t be doing this.” So I guess because it was treated like it wasn’t a big deal, it didn’t really occur to me how bold that was until I was on set. It was always a question as to how much of that they were going to show, and AMC has surprised us with everything that they’re allowing us to do. There was a plan at one point to shoot a lot of gore—which is what we did—but the original plan was to have re-edited versions of the episodes, that would go on DVD. But at this point, AMC hasn’t really made us pull anything.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Hopefully then it gets gorier... who knows, I am glad AMC has been on board with this stuff. However, it irks me though that people feel TWD has a set of balls because they shot a kid in the first 5 minutes. TWD wasn't the first to kill a child. Hell I had zombies eating flesh out of stroller in Deadlands 1, and that was 4 years ago

Anyway, I just hope the BR is packed with tons of extras, and hopefully they add some stuff back in because I noticed a few major continuity errors that I reasoned to be stuff cut out for running time. Rick's windshield and mirror in the police cruiser are damaged, and it doesn't look like damage from the shoot out weeks before, so I am curious as to what happened there, plus a few other minor things.

[bassman]

However, it irks me though that people feel TWD has a set of balls because they shot a kid in the first 5 minutes. TWD wasn't the first to kill a child. Hell I had zombies eating flesh out of stroller in Deadlands 1, and that was 4 years ago


True, they're not the first to kill a child....but on national television? In the first five minutes? That's a bit ballsy. Maybe not to zombie nuts like ourselves, but to the average viewer it could be a bit jarring. Most shows would probably jusy show Rick's gun firing and then cut to the credits. This had the wound, the splatter, the landing, the dripping....the whole nine yards. At 10 pm on a cable network...


On a side note - Everything online is saying the series will continue to air on Sundays at 10pm, but when I checked my DVR schedule(Dish Network) it lists the second episode, "Guts", to be airing at 11pm. Anyone else notice this?

[DjfunkmasterG]

True, they're not the first to kill a child....but on national television? In the first five minutes? That's a bit ballsy. Maybe not to zombie nuts like ourselves, but to the average viewer it could be a bit jarring. Most shows would probably jusy show Rick's gun firing and then cut to the credits. This had the wound, the splatter, the landing, the dripping....the whole nine yards. At 10 pm on a cable network...

I will admit that is a kick ass opening to a show and that little girl was creepy even if they did sort of rip it off from DAWN 2004, with her make-up FX. But the slow motion reflex of being shot in the head and the landing were cringe inducing but part of me was going FUCK YEAH at the same time.

[AcesandEights]

Regarding the little girl, I didn't like her make up too much, but it was okay and the dramatic/emotional angle worked well.


I will admit that is a kick ass opening to a show and that little girl was creepy even if they did sort of rip it off from DAWN 2004, with her make-up FX. .

Thankfully she didn't go all supersonic. :D

[DjfunkmasterG]

Regarding the little girl, I didn't like her make up too much, but it was okay and the dramatic/emotional angle worked well.



Thankfully she didn't go all supersonic. :D


LOL... Yeah. But damn it was creepy seeing her walking with that stuffed animal, it just helped add to the horror when she turns around and is revealed to be a zombie.

[AcesandEights]

LOL... Yeah. But damn it was creepy seeing her walking with that stuffed animal, it just helped add to the horror when she turns around and is revealed to be a zombie.

Oh, yeah, they played it and shot it really well. Very creepy.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Oh, yeah, they played it and shot it really well. Very creepy.

I remember when the trailers aired I thought seeing the kid in the line of cars reminded me of the mist a bit

[bassman]

Since this thread is on the subject of the show and Darabont, I thought I would point out something that I love about TWD that differs from his last film, The Mist - The camera work. I like The Mist. I think it's a great movie and the camera work works for that particular film, but I was worried Darabont would bring the same to TWD. Then of course to my surprise most of TWD feels like a movie. Some of those shots seem insane for a TV production. They must have really given Darabont and his DP extra time to set up that stuff.

Although I'm not sure the other episodes will be the same. Looking at the few clips available for the next episode, it looks like it may be much more of that hand held crap. Hope not...

[DjfunkmasterG]

Darabont had a very limited schedule and budget for The Mist so he used the camera crew from the TV show The Shield to get it done quick and dirty... considering that i think The Mist turned out great, but when you only have $17 million and 29 days to shoot a movie... you have to do the best you can with what you got and I think it worked although some of the CG was terrible but again i attribute that to budget, but then again there are 100 million dollar films with terrible Cg as well.

[bassman]

Yeah, I saw that stuff on the special features. Two cameras at once and nobody ever knew where they would go. "You would be having a close up and have no idea!" :lol:

That was my point though....the need to film quickly kinda helped The Mist. I'm sure they could've made it work in TWD, but i'm so glad they went with more traditional and "big" camera work.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Yeah, I saw that stuff on the special features. Two cameras at once and nobody ever knew where they would go. "You would be having a close up and have no idea!" :lol:

That was my point though....the need to film quickly kinda helped The Mist. I'm sure they could've made it work in TWD, but i'm so glad they went with more traditional and "big" camera work.

Oh hell yeah... the opening alobe was 50ft big screen theater worthy alone. Especially if it had been filmed in 2.35:1.

That is what i enjoy about TWD it doesn't have the typical TV show feel it feels more like a movie and that is what i dig about it besides the great story told in the 1st episode.

[Trin]

Regarding the little girl. How gutsy was it to show that? I mean, we've debated the depiction of children in a zombie outbreak dozens of times, and in every case there's a huge split between whether that's appropriate to depict or not. We all know children would be part of the equation. But to show a child being headshot? The closest we've come is Dawn '78 where we knew Peter shot the kids (but didn't see it) and Dawn '04 with the ridiculous zombie baby.

I was surprised that TWD put that on screen, and in the opening minutes. I think it did good to set the tone of the show. It essentially said, "Yeah, that's right. We're going there, and we're gonna show it." It left me with that, 'strap in, it's gonna be a wild ride' feelling.

I thought the episode was very well shot. It did feel like a movie. And they avoided some super-irritating techniques... like showing a headshot 5 different times from 5 different angles like movies do with car crashes. They'd show it once. From a good angle. Very well done.

[bassman]

My favorite irritating and over used technique left out of TWD? None of that cheap "cat jumps from a dark corner and the music swells" shit...

[darth los]

Thanks Darth!! I was cheering for your similar post a few pages back.

@Deej - Even if you're only referring to the Darabont directed episode I still disagree. I'm not sure how you can compare them at all, much less conclude one upstaged a series of movies.

Personally, I think Darabont did a great job of doing something completely different than what GAR has done. I think that before he can upstage GAR he has to undertake a much bigger challenge. I also think that TWD has proven that Darabont deserves a shot at that challenge.

@Legion - I agree with you about the horse. I was actually a bit miffed he chose the horse for just that reason. I don't know much about horses, but it seems an unreliable, unpredictable mode of transport. I wouldn't say I was actively going "wtf" over it, but I was none too happy.

On a side note, can we really justify him running out of gas? I don't see how that happens with the dozens of cars he passed ... literally everywhere. Especially since we established right off that he was gas-hunting. It seemed a bit like contriving plot to me, and that gets into GAR territory!! *shudder*

I suppose one could argue that gas was depleted as society crumbled, but the evidence suggests that people fled and abandoned areas, or holed up in areas, which doesn't jive with resources being depleted uniformly. In a WWBMD analysis I see finding a source of gas and filling up all the 5-gallon containers you can find as job #1. And not traveling on any less than half a tank away from a source without finding a new source.

What do you feed a horse anyway? Is that easier to find than gas?

@Deckard - I agree with all your observations, and my main point on the crowd of zombies is just as you said, I don't see there being that amount around all of a sudden. That represents a serious lack of awareness to his surroundings in a situation where he would be looking over his shoulder constantly. Again, it has the subtle smell of plot contrivance, and that sort of thing tends to get worse, not better.

@Everone... Don't let my balanced opinion fool you... I enjoyed the show immensely and am looking forward to the rest. The Good list definitely outweighs the Bad list. I'm totally stoked to see where it goes, but at the same time I'm keeping my expectations on the leash just in case.

YW.

And I feel that way too. I like the show alot, although it can't touch gar's Original trilogy IMO.

Also, imo, pick apart the minutia of things like this is what we do here. If we can do it to the Godfather of the genre we can do it to this show. No free passes. If it seems contrieved or if it doesn't make sense it should be pointed out.

And about the little girl. Very well done imo. Now as deej said it's a rip-off from dawn 04' but still well done. My kids even noticed it.

But that's not what bothers me. Yes, I am aware of the herds but it seems very strange that in several places there would on be be like one zombie for what amounts to a relatively vast area.

The little girl, nothing else around.

The police station, abandoned, one police zed, again nothing else around.

When he first meets the black guy and his son, one solitary zombie whose brains he splatters all over the sidewalk.

The half zombie woman, well, you get the point.

It's always seemed to me that zombies travel in packs. They're like roaches. When is there ever just one roach? Were there's one there's more.

Now if it happened once or twice that's fine, but there seem to be entire stretches of land (miles maybe?) where you wouldn't even know there's a plauge going on. Safe zones so to speak. It doesn't seem as if that should be the case.

Also, the scene where he gets mobbed in the city elicits the mental image of miguel running back toward the chopper for some reason. That's probably why he high tailed it out out of there. Smart dude. Gives me a whole new perspective on that.

:cool:

[ProfessorChaos]

well, the reason there weren't many zombies around rick's house, at the police station, and at the park is because he supposedly lives in a small town, so there wouldn't be quite so many around.

the same argument could be pitted against diary, where you have like 20 zombies at some amish dudes farm and a shitload at that rich kid's house the next day, but none in the dorms, none in the town that the "people with sun-tans" have taken over, etc.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Well it was said in Dawn by Doc Roush, they seem to congregate in heavily populated areas.... why, more food.

[kidgloves]

Rick's windshield and mirror in the police cruiser are damaged, and it doesn't look like damage from the shoot out weeks before, so I am curious as to what happened there, plus a few other minor things.

The opening scene is extended. After Rick shoots the little girl it wakes up all the zombies in the cars and chaos ensues

[darth los]

Well it was said in Dawn by Doc Roush, they seem to congregate in heavily populated areas.... why, more food.

Yes he did say that but look at two similar scenes.

1st we have the "I'm a man scene" from dawn. Where there is a ruckus yes, which would logically attract more ghouls toward them. but even so we see rural areas with a steady zed pupulation along with them encroaching on the living.

Now we have his wife and kid in that camp living as if it's a safe zone in a wide open area. No fortification. No perimiter that we can see. Just a band of people and some tents.

Now the major difference is they weren't shooting guns, drinking beer and acting a fool. I understand that.

Just seems weird for a world overun with zombies. Too convienient you know? Like when we want to have a bleeding heart scene in a tent, no zeds for miles. When we want to pick up the pace then all of a sudden there's no place to run.

:cool:

[Trin]

I'm with darth on this one. As I contended originally, the relative sparsity of zombies is potentially misleading. We all as zombie apocalypse fans figure that there are tons and tons of zombies out there somewhere. But is that what conclusion any normal person would draw? The small town Grimes lived in may have been rural, but that was not a tiny hospital he came out of. As he roamed around I thought that 99% of the people were unaccounted for. Did the bulk of the zombies trail along after the survivors that fled to Atlanta? Were the bulk of the people from town even dead? We really don't know.

We also have to work in the knowledge that the zombies only come out at night unless roused. The small town had plenty of shamblers about after dark as we saw from looking out the windows at night. And they showed no indication of herding without something to attract them.

But where were they during the day? They weren't staying in the hospital. Or in Grimes house. Or in the police station. Or anywhere else he went. They didn't come out when he roared by in the police cruiser or when he shot his gun in the park. I hope we get a better glimpse into the ratio of zombies to survivors, and more on how/where the zombies congregate.

I'm not saying it's unexplainable. It's just odd. As Darth says it's awfully convenient where the zeds are and where they aren't.

[hadrian0117]

How many days was that guy alone in a coma? My main question is why weren't his backside choked with poo? Or would there be a shitbag already attached to him? I didn't see him pull one off. I kept picturing a Hot Tub Time Machine gag where he's pulling out his catheter...

He can't have been comatose for more than a few weeks. He didn't appear to have any problems with muscle atrophy. He wouldn't be pooping much after a few weeks being fed formula through a gastric tube, but there still would've been "discharge" and would've had either a diaper or a rectal catheter (in additon to the catheter for urination). Nobody's willing to show that level of detail on the big or small screen yet. Somebody must have been caring for him up until a few days ago. More than 3 days without water or someone changing his IV and wouldn't have woken up at all.

Also he was wearing shorts; everytime I've been in hospital I've had to bring my own to have something on under the gown, yet this hospital put's them on a coma patient automatically? Jim being naked was the one thing that didn't bother my mother (a nurse) about the openining scene in 28 Days Later (which she hated). Apparently if the facility (& it's laundry) was completely overwhelmed and understaffed they'd just keep him covered with sheets and a blanket.

[darth los]

The black dude also said that his bandages and wound were pretty rank. How regulary does that have to be changed?

Might give a further clue as to how long he was there/alone.

:cool:

[sandrock74]

The black dude also said that his bandages and wound were pretty rank. How regulary does that have to be changed?

Might give a further clue as to how long he was there/alone.

:cool:

A serious gunshot wound would have to be cleaned/disinfected on a daily basis. (possibly a couple times per day) His lack of water and his unchanged bandages would make me think he was only alone and unlooked after for a couple days, tops.

[Wyldwraith]

A few things about the TWD plot,
1) About Grimes surviving unconscious & alone in the hospital: While I agree that the waste-disposal details were omitted just for the "eww factor" people don't want to deal with, as for HOW Grimes actually survived multiple days unattended I have a POSSIBLE answer for you from real life.

I'm not a doctor or a nurse, so pardon my lack of technical jargon, but I once accompanied my mother and grandmother to a long-term-care facility for individuals essentially in a protracted vegetative state. When we entered the room of the very elderly comatose neighbor-lady we'd come to see, I noticed that the IV-bag-stand had 4 bags of what looked like saline solution to me. All four bags fed into this little multiple-valve-and-clip arrangement via tube, before the tube continued on into the actual site of the IV-needle on the inside of her elbow. Curious, I asked one of the orderlies about the setup, and he told me that two of the bags were saline solution, and the other two were both mixtures of glucose, trace minerals and mild antibiotics, and that at any one time the little valve and clip setup (which he mentioned had a mechanical timer that he described as being more like a wind-up alarm clock than a computerized digital alarm clock) was regulating one bag of saline for awhile, before switching and allowing the glucose-mixture to drip for awhile. Then (assuming that no one came to modify the settings) when the first two "active bags" were depleted, it could somehow begin the alternate-drip-process all over again using the 2nd pair of bags.

Anyways, the reason I remember all this is that he mentioned that assuming the person didn't expire or need a major change of the medication, there was no reason you couldn't hang a maximum of 12 IV-bags and allow the mechanical valve system to work through the bags 2 at a time until all 12 bags were emptied. What stuck in my memory though was him saying that, ideally, there was no reason you couldn't pre-arrange to hydrate and nutritionally nourish a patient for up to a month if you set up 2 12-bag systems, and set up 2 IV-feed-sites (say, on the left and right arms) without any further human intervention.

That creeped me out, because I had visions of warehouses of human vegetables, all being sustained by a consistently alternation drip-system no more complicated than an alarm clock. I remembered thinking about that again when I first saw the Matrix, and Neo being removed from his fluid-filled-tube.

Anyways, the bottom line is that, assuming nothing goes wrong enough that you'd perish without human intervention, there's no medical reason to get in the way of getting a comatose patient all set for at least a month alone with a little prep-work up front. Now, that obviously wasn't the case for Deputy Grimes, but it could well explain say, Alice's waking-up-in-deserted-hospital scenario in Resident Evil 2: Apocalypse, or the main character in 28 Days Later.

2) How did Rick Grimes end up boxed in, surrounded and swarmed while on horseback in the outskirts of Atlanta: Rider Error. As he wheels the horse upon coming face to face with the zombie-packed street, you can see the horse's stride begin to widen to about 2-3 body lengths short of a full gallop. Unfortunately, just then Rick sees the zombies beginning to crowd the street he just came down from either side. Now, if he'd let the horse have its head it would have hit top speed at about the same time it smacked into the first couple of zombies. Instead, you can see him pull back hard and a bit to the left on the reins, bringing the horse up short as he pulls its head to the left. It's as this point Rick gets surrounded and pulled off the horse.

Had see simply laid his head across the horse's neck, leaned in and put his heels into that horse's sides a bit, several hundred pounds of horseflesh would have struck a few 150-195lbs undead bodies. Various scribes and chroniclers throughout history have done a wonderful job of describing the awful destructive power of a charging horse upon the bodies of footmen in their way, so I shall not essay to improve on their efforts. Suffice to say that Rick didn't leave Atlanta on the horse he rode in on because Rick had no faith in his mount's abilities, leading to the sad and systematic dismemberment of said steed.

[Gryphon]

This was a great rebirth of the Zombie Genre :D

[DEAD BEAT]

wow! its official, GAR who? Last nights new episode of The Walking Dead was even better than the 1st episode!

Granted GAR will always be the founder of the genre, but he should have been the 1st to do this. Seriously its a dream come true, its almost like gettin a new zombie flick every week!

This is great! ;)

[Boogiedowndead]

George is a pioneer

Nothing will ever change that.


The walking dead is giant leap in the right direction.


The torch has been passed.

[SymphonicX]

After only seeing the first episode, I wouldn't go that far at this point to call Darabont the "king" of anything.

He's a great director and a great filmmaker in general - and TWD is pretty decent.

But if I'm totally honest, the first episode was flat, had very few new ideas (the most striking moment I thought was the firing of the gun inside the tank and it's resulting deafening of our protagonist - little touches like that were very cool) and really didn't feel that exciting.

Hopefully ep2 is better. But did I get the same feeling of inspiration, excitment and joy from this show as I did from 28 DAYS, or the original Dawn? Nope. Not even close. I enjoyed it, but there's no way I came away from that pilot ep thinking that Darabont has just shat all over Romero. Not even close. It just didn't have the heart.

However ep2 sounds well promising so obviously, my opinion is subject to change.

[AcesandEights]

But did I get the same feeling of inspiration, excitment and joy from this show as I did from 28 DAYS, or the original Dawn? Nope. Not even close. I enjoyed it, but there's no way I came away from that pilot ep thinking that Darabont has just shat all over Romero. Not even close. It just didn't have the heart.


I can agree with this sentiment somewhat, though some things have been handled with an emotionally poignant and deft hand so far, from my point of view, but I think the episodic nature and the slower timescale of how things are developing lends somewhat to what you're sensing, Symph. The true test will be after they set the table more properly, bring the cast together and set the basic tenets of the world up...then, will they be able to maintain a sense of progression and keep everyone interested? The comic could do this no question, but the mediums are different.

[BillyRay]

I'm just enjoying a steady weekly stream of well written, well acted, well FX'ed, well directed, decent budget zombie epic.

Isn't this what we've wanted all these years?

And that's no rejection of Uncle George, or hailing Darabont as the Chosen One.

We have a great series on our hands. I plan to continue enjoying it with my friends.

[AcesandEights]

I'm just enjoying a steady weekly stream of well written, well acted, well FX'ed, well directed, decent budget zombie epic.
Hell yes!


Isn't this what we've wanted all these years?
Hell yes!




We have a great series on our hands. I plan to continue enjoying it with my friends.
You know my sentiment about this, by now, I trust. :)

[bassman]

Michelle MacLaren is the new king....err...Queen of zombies!

This will change on a weekly basis....

:shifty:

[ProfessorChaos]

George is a pioneer

Nothing will ever change that.


The walking dead is giant leap in the right direction.


The torch has been passed.

well said, sir or ma'am.

[SymphonicX]

I can agree with this sentiment somewhat, though some things have been handled with an emotionally poignant and deft hand so far, from my point of view, but I think the episodic nature and the slower timescale of how things are developing lends somewhat to what you're sensing, Symph. The true test will be after they set the table more properly, bring the cast together and set the basic tenets of the world up...then, will they be able to maintain a sense of progression and keep everyone interested? The comic could do this no question, but the mediums are different.

yeah totally agree

[DEAD BEAT]

True i wouldn't go so far as to say Darabont is the king of zombies but, @ least he gets the genre and so far has followed the formula...unlike the recent turds trying to take on the genre!

Even thought he stole the waking up in the hospital from 28 days, stole the zombies banging on the department store windows from Dawn '78 and it hasn't got to this part yet but i believe he also is gonna steal the quarantined city from resident evil as well!

AHHH yall didn't know i was watching these things did ya? lol
As said before its a dirty job but somebody's gotta do it!

[Gryphon]

I'm just enjoying a steady weekly stream of well written, well acted, well FX'ed, well directed, decent budget zombie epic.

Isn't this what we've wanted all these years?

And that's no rejection of Uncle George, or hailing Darabont as the Chosen One.

We have a great series on our hands.

Wholeheartedly agree :D:elol:


I plan to continue enjoying it with my friends.

That's what SHE said :p

[MoonSylver]

I plan to continue enjoying it with my friends.


That's what SHE said :p

Yep, she sure did! :D :lol:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y255/PinkRevival/thatswhatshesaid.png

[DjfunkmasterG]

True i wouldn't go so far as to say Darabont is the king of zombies but, @ least he gets the genre and so far has followed the formula...unlike the recent turds trying to take on the genre!

Even thought he stole the waking up in the hospital from 28 days, stole the zombies banging on the department store windows from Dawn '78 and it hasn't got to this part yet but i believe he also is gonna steal the quarantined city from resident evil as well!

AHHH yall didn't know i was watching these things did ya? lol
As said before its a dirty job but somebody's gotta do it!

Once again it was not stolen from 28 Days Later.... Jesus can't people friggin' read. As stated this was taken from a different film way before the comic was made, which was before 28 Days later was made.

[DEAD BEAT]

Once again it was not stolen from 28 Days Later.... Jesus can't people friggin' read. As stated this was taken from a different film way before the comic was made, which was before 28 Days later was made.

;) kudos 2 ya DJ!

But you gotta admit it the 2nd episode in the department store was total Dawn '78 wont say Dawn '04 cause he also is a theif in the night! ;)

[DjfunkmasterG]

;) kudos 2 ya DJ!

But you gotta admit it the 2nd episode in the department store was total Dawn '78 wont say Dawn '04 cause he also is a theif in the night! ;)

Oh I definitely got a DAWN vibe from that... but it irks me when people claim the hospital scene rips 28 Days later

[DEAD BEAT]

Oh I definitely got a DAWN vibe from that... but it irks me when people claim the hospital scene rips 28 Days later

lol apologise bud....running outta friends around here so ill stay civil! lmao

lemma just run my check list off tell me if im wrong on anything else:

we covered the department store scene and the hospital scene...but ive got 2 more the quarantined city (Resident Evil 2) and eating the horse (Return of the Living Dead series remember part 2 the pet shop scene) in GARS world the animals always live.

[bassman]

lwe covered the department store scene and the hospital scene...but ive got 2 more the quarantined city (Resident Evil 2)

When was a quarantined city mentioned in TWD?

[darth los]

Oh I definitely got a DAWN vibe from that... but it irks me when people claim the hospital scene rips 28 Days later


;) kudos 2 ya DJ!

But you gotta admit it the 2nd episode in the department store was total Dawn '78 wont say Dawn '04 cause he also is a theif in the night! ;)


Dawn is legendary because of that. I've given it alot of thought over the years and there is no cooler place to hole up. Who amongst us has not fantasized about being in that situation?

Henceforth anything with a mall and zombies will automatically be compared to dawn.

Another thought. Perhaps that's why GAr could never recreate the magic he caught in a bottle with dawn. No setting will ever be that kick ass and inspiring.

:cool:

[bassman]

Another thought. Perhaps that's why GAr could never recreate the magic he caught in a bottle with dawn. No setting will ever be that kick ass and inspiring.


As much as I love the mall, I also think the Government bunker is jsut as inspiring. Especially when you consider that for most of the film, the dead aren't the threat. Also you could say it was funny because the movie is called DAY and spends about 90% of its runtime in darkness...

[darth los]

As much as I love the mall, I also think the Government bunker is jsut as inspiring. Especially when you consider that for most of the film, the dead aren't the threat. Also you could say it was funny because the movie is called DAY and spends about 90% of its runtime in darkness...

Inspiring? Maybe.

But the mall is like an theme park fantasy. The bunker is blah and hopeless.

Very depressing.

:cool:

[bassman]

Inspiring? Maybe.

But the mall is like an theme park fantasy. The bunker is blah and hopeless.

Very depressing.


But...isn't that one of the points behind the mall in Dawn? The mall SEEMS like a great idea, but you would quickly realize it's just as blah and hopeless as that bunker?

[darth los]

But...isn't that one of the points behind the mall in Dawn? The mall SEEMS like a great idea, but you would quickly realize it's just as blah and hopeless as that bunker?

What I got out of it was that you could have all the material things in the world and it still wouldn't matter because that's not what life is about.

But both the bunker and mall being equal I'd bet that most would choose the mall.

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

But both the bunker and mall being equal I'd bet that most would choose the mall.

:cool:

Well, sure, maybe over that bunker. ;)

[Mitchified]

As long as I could still drink a Slushie while watching football on a big screen TV and waiting for my photos to be developed, I'd choose the bunker. You don't have to deal with powerwalking retired zombies and annoying giggling teenager zombies in a bunker.

[darth los]

As long as I could still drink a Slushie while watching football on a big screen TV and waiting for my photos to be developed, I'd choose the bunker. You don't have to deal with powerwalking retired zombies and annoying giggling teenager zombies in a bunker.

Well, assuming that there still would be broadcasts there's still the problem of, as cooper said:

You can't get any reception in a basement *Expletive*.

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

Well, assuming that there still would be broadcasts there's still the problem of, as cooper said:

You can't get any reception in a basement *Expletive*.

:cool:

Pretty easy to run a line or have one run by contractors for antenna reception, in the case of a home bunker, government bunkers eve more so.

[Mitchified]

Well, assuming that there still would be broadcasts there's still the problem of, as cooper said:

You can't get any reception in a basement *Expletive*.

:cool:

I was born and raised a Browns fan. All I would need is a few recorded games showing them get demolished by teams they have no business losing to and it would be just like watching a live game. Frankly, the Slushie would be the dealbreaker.

[darth los]

I was born and raised a Browns fan. All I would need is a few recorded games showing them get demolished by teams they have no business losing to and it would be just like watching a live game. Frankly, the Slushie would be the dealbreaker.


:lol::lol::lol:

The patriots sure don't think so.

:cool:

[DEAD BEAT]

When was a quarantined city mentioned in TWD?

well Bass i could be blowing my wad a bit early but i believe thats why they only mention Atlanta in the early promos!

As i said not sure if thats where thats headed but, if it is you owe me a beer! lol ;)

[Gryphon]

well Bass i could be blowing my wad a bit early

Hate it when that happens. :shifty: :sneaky: :clown:

[Trin]

Once again it was not stolen from 28 Days Later.... Jesus can't people friggin' read. As stated this was taken from a different film way before the comic was made, which was before 28 Days later was made.
I maintain that it stole the 28 Days Later start from 28 Days Later.... it stole it from the future using advanced time travel. :p:D:sneaky:

[AcesandEights]

I maintain that it stole the 28 Days Later start from 28 Days Later.... it stole it from the future using advanced time travel. :p:D:sneaky:

I like your gumption, Trin :p

[Mitchified]

I maintain that it stole the 28 Days Later start from 28 Days Later.... it stole it from the future using advanced time travel. :p:D:sneaky:

So what you're saying is that Biff also brought back a copy of 28 Days Later when he took that sports almanac to his past self?

[Trin]

So what you're saying is that Biff also brought back a copy of 28 Days Later when he took that sports almanac to his past self?He also brought back a copy of Dawn '04 which GAR used as his template for Dawn '78. It's true. And the legendary "original script for Day?" It was Contagium. Yeah. Fact is stranger than fiction.

[MoonSylver]

He also brought back a copy of Dawn '04 which GAR used as his template for Dawn '78. It's true. And the legendary "original script for Day?" It was Contagium. Yeah. Fact is stranger than fiction.

http://getnloose.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/barf.gif

Dude. You're making me ill. :lol:

[krakenslayer]

Finally got around to watching the first episode. I'm not going to wade through 13 pages of discussion so I'm just going to drop in with my opinion, whatever that's worth.

It was... pretty decent. Lots of action, some reasonably effective emotional hooks, good effects, great production values, slow zombies and loosely Romero-esque zombie rules. However, I have a few moderate gripes with it.

First of all, the biggest disappointment was the lack of originality. Seriously, there were only a couple of scenes that I hadn't already seen played out in another horror movie. It wasn't Mattei-level plagiarism, but it was a little uninspiring, like the writers (of the comic, I'm guessing) were just smashing movies together and seeing which parts stuck to the others. Meh.

Secondly, the main character is among the most uninteresting, straight-laced, bland, dry-bread male leads I have seen in a TV show since Jack Shepherd opened his eyes in the jungle. Only here there is no John Locke or Sawyer to balance him out, not yet anyway. I liked the older black guy with the kid, he seemed to have some real depth and I cared about them, and it was genuinely upsetting when he was getting ready to put a bullet in his undead wife. On the other hand, I honestly couldn't care less if whitey (whatever his name was) finds his wife and kid. There was that other cop at the camp too, but so far he seems like basically Cop #1 with a slightly different haircut.

Finally, and this is a gripe that I have with some of Romero's recent offerings too: the zombies are not represented as threatening enough. In fact, they pose almost no threat until the very end of the episode. For the best emotional and visceral impact, I've always said you need to hit hard, early: get the zombies in there in their droves, kicking ass, or at the very least, making people fight like hell just to stay alive. Then the audience has a chance to be scared of them before the humans can turn the tables, and it makes it more exciting when they finally do begin to successfully fight back. If, within a few seconds of seeing our first zombie, it has been effortlessly exterminated, you've just slashed the possible tension level.

Overall, I did enjoy it, but not that much more than your average HPotD Fiction Section fanfic. That's what it felt like actually; like a half-decent fanfic with a good budget, nothing more, nothing less.

I actually surprised at this, but I still like Survival better. While it shares most of the same flaws and doesn't have anything approaching TWD's budget, it was quirkier and had more character, I think.

[ProfessorChaos]

I actually surprised at this, but I still like Survival better.

http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx114/xx195xxcc/HIMYM%20%20How%20I%20Met%20Your%20Mother/HIMYM/2d135ol.gif

holy fuck...never, ever, ever expected to see that opinion...

what took you so long to see TWD? we've been going on for weeks about it...seen any of the other ones, or plan to anytime this year?:p

[krakenslayer]

holy fuck...never, ever, ever expected to see that opinion...

what took you so long to see TWD? we've been going on for weeks about it...seen any of the other ones, or plan to anytime this year?:p

I had a lot of fun with Survival, despite its obvious faults. I just didn't have as much fun with this; it was more "realistic", but lacked flavour and at no point was I surprised by anything that happened.

TWD, at least in its first episode, has nothing unexpected, no unique spin on anything, it's just plain vanilla, trope-recycling, paint-by-numbers zombie entertainment. It does nothing to subvert the viewers' expectations, instead it just plays up to their expectations.

But sadly I think that's what a lot of fans have been crying out for: they have spent so much time imagining their own zombie world that they can't handle new ideas or offbeat tones or anything that contradicts their entrenched worldview, so the only thing they can now enjoy is a show that offers nothing new whatsoever.

It took me so long to get around to seeing TWD because I don't have a standalone TV and generally I don't follow TV shows (excluding Lost, X Files and Doctor Who, two of which are now over and the other one I can watch on iPlayer). I ended up having to watch it on StageVu. I'll probably wait until the box set comes out to rent before watching the rest.

[DjfunkmasterG]

Well, as a lifelong zombie fan (well pretty much lifelong) New and Improved zombies isn't what is going to really make me happy... someone actually making a good movie or show is what will make me happy. TWD does just that, and does it very well might i add.

I know some fans want some new kind of twist and angle, but when Romero tried it with Big Daddy it backfired miserably.... when Danny Boyle and Zack Snyder went with track star zombies... the community had a snit fit. ROTLD introduced un-kill-able, talking zombies and some Romero purists had a holy shit fit with that as well. Any INdie zombie movie called COLIN that follows everything from a zombies perspective was new and inventive, but because it is indie people won't even give it a shot.

I must say, and I don't mean this to be an ass but most zombie fans, myself included are mythology hypocrites. We are, we say we're not, but we are, and honestly when something new is brought into the fold we criticize the hell out of it because most of the time it is handled so poorly.

I am shocked Kraken is defending Survival.... and scorning TWD. I respect his opinion even though I 100% disagree with him on it. However, he is entitled to his opinion.

Just out of curiosity what new stuff do you want to see?

[MoonSylver]

TWD, at least in its first episode, has nothing unexpected, no unique spin on anything, it's just plain vanilla, trope-recycling, paint-by-numbers zombie entertainment. It does nothing to subvert the viewers' expectations, instead it just plays up to their expectations.


Well, as a lifelong zombie fan (well pretty much lifelong) New and Improved zombies isn't what is going to really make me happy... someone actually making a good movie or show is what will make me happy. TWD does just that, and does it very well might i add.

^ This. I don't need to see something new done WITH the genre, just something well done WITHIN the genre AS IT EXSISTS. I've said it before, but I think it bears repeating, the genre is the canvas, it's what you paint on it that matters. I don't need somebody to paint on a wall instead of a canvas just for the sake of doing something new, because canvas has been used before.

Characters, situations, stories. These are what matter. Kirkman himself said that he wanted TWD to be "a zombie movie that never ended." Where you got to "see what happened next". And THAT is what's groundbreaking here. Instead of, for example, seeing Peter & Fran fly away in the helicopter & going "I wonder what happend next?", now you get to find out. :)

[krakenslayer]

Well, as a lifelong zombie fan (well pretty much lifelong) New and Improved zombies isn't what is going to really make me happy... someone actually making a good movie or show is what will make me happy. TWD does just that, and does it very well might i add.


^ This. I don't need to see something new done WITH the genre, just something well done WITHIN the genre AS IT EXSISTS. I've said it before, but I think it bears repeating, the genre is the canvas, it's what you paint on it that matters. I don't need somebody to paint on a wall instead of a canvas just for the sake of doing something new, because canvas has been used before.

Characters, situations, stories. These are what matter. Kirkman himself said that he wanted TWD to be "a zombie movie that never ended." Where you got to "see what happened next". And THAT is what's groundbreaking here. Instead of, for example, seeing Peter & Fran fly away in the helicopter & going "I wonder what happend next?", now you get to find out. :)

There's a little misunderstanding here, I am not talking about the lack of New and Improved Zombies, or really anything "canvas breaking". The lack of originality and new ideas has nothing to do with the zombies themselves, which I thought were absolutely fine, and everything to do with the stock characters and situations that made up most of the pilot's running time.

[MoonSylver]

There's a little misunderstanding here, I am not talking about the lack of New and Improved Zombies, or really anything "canvas breaking". The lack of originality and new ideas has nothing to do with the zombies themselves, which I thought were absolutely fine, and everything to do with the stock characters and situations that made up most of the pilot's running time.

Hurm. Well, that one I can't even debate, because I just don't see it, so... :confused: Maybe it's because I'm coming from the comic on this, but I don't see them as "stock" characters or situations at all. And even if they were, keep in mind that since it's a TV SERIES, you're going to have a certain amount of "set up" at the get go. Where you're going to see the evolution is over a long arc. It's a a long haul format.

I've got to admit, I'm really baffeled. If we've seen this all before, where? If it's all be done before, by who? Why have we all been clamoring for something like this if it already exsists in abundance? Outside of GAR's original 3 there are VERY few examples that I can think of that focus on the characters, the story, character development, & approach the genre itself in serious & respectful manor.

Not trying to be contentious, but I'm quite puzzled... :confused:

[krakenslayer]

I've got to admit, I'm really baffeled. If we've seen this all before, where? If it's all be done before, by who? Why have we all been clamoring for something like this if it already exsists in abundance? Outside of GAR's original 3 there are VERY few examples that I can think of that focus on the characters, the story, character development, & approach the genre itself in serious & respectful manor.

Not trying to be contentious, but I'm quite puzzled... :confused:

Most of what makes up the central focus of TWD, is just considered background detail in pretty much every other urban-set zombie movie I've seen. It's people fighting zombies and sometimes hiding from them - that's the canvas, but here it's like there is only that blank canvas.

Since Dawn, and to a lesser extent since Night, Romero has always painted his stories on top of that canvas. Sometimes some people haven't liked those paintings, sometimes they've found those paintings distracting, because they'd rather stare at the canvas itself. They don't want any moral ambiguity or interesting observations, they just want the fantasy of people trying to survive in an undead world, without such distractions. Now they have it. But to me, it's boring, like eating unbuttered bread.

I've not seen the follow-up episodes yet, so I can't really comment too much on character, but with the exception of the black family, there doesn't seem to be a lot of interesting character stuff going on in the first episode either. The guy wants to find his wife and son? What an utterly predictable and generic motivation. Sure, that's what everyone would do, and that's why I don't find it interesting. He's not given much of a personality, even his friends rib him about what a boring, poor conversationalist he is. There's no depth, no dark side peeking through, no humour or pathos, he's just a bland authority-type that I really don't care about.

[Trin]

I pretty well see what Kraken is saying. And I tend to agree. The characters are getting a lot of attention and a lot of screen time, which is good, but they aren't doing much to make them interesting. You can't look at Grimes and compare him with, say, Neville from I Am Legend. And he's the MOST interesting character so far. The series has explored the space of stereotypes more than developing unique and interesting characters.

I also agree with Kraken's zombie take. It's a zombie apocalpyse and the better part of the pilot showed people with absolutely no struggle to survive. And when we finally get to the zombie mob scene it feels contrived. Ep 2 improved that sense of peril a bit, but again, to me it felt contrived. I just kept thinking it really didn't look that bad.

I wouldn't classify it as ho-hum like Kraken. I think it's very enjoyable. And I don't really care that it's full of warts. It beats out almost every zombie everything in recent memory.

[MoonSylver]

Ah. Well, as I said, it IS the pilot, which merely sets the stage. The development comes later. I need to keep in mind your coments ARE limited to the pilot. But I can't help but getting the vibe that this is like meeting a guy for the first time. He sticks out his hand & says "Hi, how are you?". The person meeting him shakes it, walks away, & goes "Gee, that guy is dull!". You might want to at least get to know the guy first.:p

But then again, if you didn't like the pilot, you may not like the series either, so don't bother. To each their own. :)

[Trin]

You're shaking that guy's hand for 90 minutes though. Grimes has had more screen time that Cooper from Night, John from Day, or Charlie or Cholo from Land. And each of those character is more well defined in my mind than Grimes. I think AMC is trying to milk the show with slow pacing - one of my previous gripes. They're sticking one twist into each episode and filling in around it. I understand that they have loads of time to work with and don't want to feel rushed. And sometimes that filler is very very good. Like the sweeping shots of the world or little things to display how society crumbled as the zombies surged. But at the same time I kinda have a hard time getting psyched to watch it. I have a hard time justifying an hour for that much actual content.

[MoonSylver]

Might be best just to give it a pass then. No need to watch something you don't enjoy.:)

[krakenslayer]

I think my negative comments have been blown out of proportion because I've spent the last few posts defending my negative comments, to the point where the positive things I had to say about it have become buried further up the thread.

I did actually quite like the pilot, overall. Just because I think it's overrated doesn't mean I think it's bad, per se.

[MoonSylver]

I think my negative comments have been blown out of proportion because I've spent the last few posts defending my negative comments, to the point where the positive things I had to say about it have become buried further up the thread.

I did actually quite like the pilot, overall. Just because I think it's overrated doesn't mean I think it's bad, per se.

Fair enough. :) I don't know if it's overrated though, because honestly, I'm having a hard time getting a gague on how it's rated to begin with? It's generated a lot of talk & discussion, but other than a few hyperbole driven comments early on, I don't THINK it's getting rated any higher than it should...? :confused: Hard to keep track with all the discussion going on, nor would I want to.:)

I dunno. I like it. I enjoy it. That's all. I can't really place it any better than that contextually at this point. It just is what it is. :)

[Trin]

I think the overall tone of the posts would be different if people weren't posting in light of the thread title. If the title of the thread were "Darabont blew it!! GAR still KING of zombies!!" the negativity would likely become shifted to positive.

Cause it really is good entertainment.

[Gryphon]

ROTLD introduced un-kill-able, talking zombies and some Romero purists had a holy shit fit with that as well. Any INdie zombie movie called COLIN that follows everything from a zombies perspective was new and inventive, but because it is indie people won't even give it a shot.


I've always been a fan of ROTLD and ROTLD2, and Colin rocked :) I bought a copy of it after I watched it online. I highly reccomend it. Course, I wouldn't have even known about it had I not did a zombie search on Rotten Tomatoes... it needs more publicity.

[Thorn]

It is a good and entertaining series in my opinion, it is Zombies on TV and in the mainstream and so many of us have wanted that for a very long time. You are not going to like everything about it. If you like everything about everything and everyone in the world I want what you are smoking. Lots of it.

It should be allowed to stand on it's own two feet, and not HAVE to be compared to Night, or Dawn, or Day in order to determine it's worth and value. It is it's own offering that respects what came before while putting its own twist on it.

I wan to see more zombies of course, and more of a sense of dread and fear. We have some of that, but of course this series is about the people and zombies are the back drop We need to understand that. Also, I need to add to that that while we are comparing offering. Survival had ZERO sense of dread or urgency... so this to me was a step up from that. Contrived? Maybe. I did not see it that way but I respect your opinion.

So far it is really enjoyable, and I dare call it great. Better than GAR. I think it is silly to even worry about such things.

It is what it is.

[Trin]

It is a good and entertaining series in my opinion, it is Zombies on TV and in the mainstream and so many of us have wanted that for a very long time. You are not going to like everything about it. If you like everything about everything and everyone in the world I want what you are smoking. Lots of it.

It should be allowed to stand on it's own two feet, and not HAVE to be compared to Night, or Dawn, or Day in order to determine it's worth and value. It is it's own offering that respects what came before while putting its own twist on it.

I wan to see more zombies of course, and more of a sense of dread and fear. We have some of that, but of course this series is about the people and zombies are the back drop We need to understand that. Also, I need to add to that that while we are comparing offering. Survival had ZERO sense of dread or urgency... so this to me was a step up from that. Contrived? Maybe. I did not see it that way but I respect your opinion.

So far it is really enjoyable, and I dare call it great. Better than GAR. I think it is silly to even worry about such things.

It is what it is.
Hahahaha - Even as you tell us to stop comparing it with Night/Dawn/Day you then compare it with Survival and end with "Better than GAR." You ARe OnE oF US!! *twisted laugh*

You gotta figure that the group of people who can spend 20 years picking apart 3 movies will pick apart a fresh new TV series nonstop for weeks. Comparing, constrasting, debating, analyzing, agonizing, etc. It's who we are.

Face the facts. TWD is the zombie-lover equivalent to a daytime soap opera and we are the coffee clutch of housewives sitting around chatting about it!! :D:p;)

[Thorn]

Hahahaha - Even as you tell us to stop comparing it with Night/Dawn/Day you then compare it with Survival and end with "Better than GAR." You ARe OnE oF US!! *twisted laugh*

You gotta figure that the group of people who can spend 20 years picking apart 3 movies will pick apart a fresh new TV series nonstop for weeks. Comparing, contrasting, debating, analyzing, agonizing, etc. It's who we are.

Face the facts. TWD is the zombie-lover equivalent to a daytime soap opera and we are the coffee clutch of housewives sitting around chatting about it!! :D:p;)

LOL, I noted that at the end and was hoping not to be called on it.

Let me rephrase by saying one does not need to be the best of the best they are their own offerings, and it is possible to compare and contrast but it is not needed to crown a new king ;)

Damn you Trin. ;)

[bassman]

So if Darabont is the king up to this point, who will be crowned king when episode four airs? Darabont's got nothing to do with that one. :p

[Thorn]

So if Darabont is the king up to this point, who will be crowned king when episode four airs? Darabont's got nothing to do with that one. :p

Andy.

[Trin]

So if Darabont is the king up to this point, who will be crowned king when episode four airs? Darabont's got nothing to do with that one. :p
One would hope that the series storyline and overall feel won't change. Which would imply that even future episodes can be somewhat attributed to the style set forth by the first few episodes (which may or may not be all Darabont's doing). It would be very jarring for viewers if the series changes tone or mood or pacing midway. But I suppose we need to be prepared for that?

[MoonSylver]

Hahahaha - Even as you tell us to stop comparing it with Night/Dawn/Day you then compare it with Survival and end with "Better than GAR." You ARe OnE oF US!! *twisted laugh*

You gotta figure that the group of people who can spend 20 years picking apart 3 movies will pick apart a fresh new TV series nonstop for weeks. Comparing, constrasting, debating, analyzing, agonizing, etc. It's who we are.

Face the facts. TWD is the zombie-lover equivalent to a daytime soap opera and we are the coffee clutch of housewives sitting around chatting about it!! :D:p;)

:lol:


So if Darabont is the king up to this point, who will be crowned king when episode four airs? Darabont's got nothing to do with that one. :p

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_29e1U3S8x4M/SMj4zQOGsfI/AAAAAAAAAxs/k07H6ftsJQA/s400/king+zombie+copy.jpg

;)

[Legion2213]

:lol:



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_29e1u3s8x4m/smj4zqogsfi/aaaaaaaaaxs/k07h6ftsjqa/s400/king+zombie+copy.jpg

;)

t.c.b! :cool:

[AcesandEights]

:lol:
I like you, Moon. Always have...
http://www.thesharkguys.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/true-romance-elvis-kilmer-300x246.jpg
Always will.

[MoonSylver]

t.c.b! :cool:

http://www.popbunker.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/kilmer-elvis.jpg

"Ah like you Legion. Always have...always will."

;) :lol:

[AcesandEights]

Ninja'd your Meme, Moon :D

[MoonSylver]

Ninja'd your Meme, Moon :D

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_v9f07wQPYxE/Rz3jfQ2_awI/AAAAAAAAATQ/BVBkEH3FDuI/s400/sour+face.jpg

Oh well...just goes to prove we have some of the greatest minds on the planet in a telepathinc group think here. That, or we're like a bunch of old yentas yenta-ing it up... :lol: