I don't know why everyone has a problem........

[joeharley666]

Grimes decision to use the horse, and why everyone thinks this show is overrated.

First, he's out of gas, he's exhausted all options. He see's the horse, has some experience with the horse, maybe a little rusty, but nonetheless comfortable. Complain all you want about the way Darabont set up the mob zombie scene, but Grimes reacted like a normal human being under duress. He was over-come with a horde. Yes he was warned by the black guy that in groups they are dangerous, but he only had experience with a walker here and there. As far as he was concerned there were human beings in Atlanta. I don't care how much training he had as an officer, this was a new world that he in a coma when it went down. This was a threat that was a greater force. What was he supposed to to, pull off the 200 plus walkers one at a time off the horse while he was surrounded. No! He did what any normal being who loves animals would do, try the best he can to survive a swarm that had blanketed him and the horse in seconds. No way no how, this was as realistic as it gets for a human being. I think most of you were expecting Rambo to save the day, no way, Darabont know what works.

And as far as being overrated, can't see that either. Just thank your lucky stars that Darabont is presenting us a world with the general rules with something extra and with great character driven development and horror. Thank your lucky stars this is not based on "Return of the Living Dead" or something worse. Darabont is giving us something we waited our whole lives for on American television that we will probably never get again. We are lucky that this genre is finally presented with some respect, and it's because of Kirkman and Darabont. Thanks guys. I see nothing overrated at all.
Just my thoughts......

[bassman]

A. Not everyone has a problem with these things.

B. I hope you like worms. You just opened a whole can of em. :p

[MoonSylver]

All good points. Not everyone feels that same on either of those topics. I just think that voices that try to be moderate get misunderstood &/or lost in all the back-&-forth of opinions. Besides, it's the internet:

http://positivesharing.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/08/complaining.jpg

:lol:

[Mitchified]

The only reason I believe the show is overrated is because some people are basically touting it as the second coming of Christ (which, given the whole 'rising from the dead' thing...). It is a fantastic show, the best new show on television in years (probably since Dexter debuted), but it isn't the greatest achievement in the history of television, entertainment and mankind all rolled into one.

As for the horse and its untimely death, well, speaking for myself, yeah, I'm letting the horse die if it gives me a chance to get the hell out of there. The only thing I would have done differently is I would have doused it in barbecue sauce first on the off chance that would gain the interest of even more zombies. For everyone complaining about it, if the roles were reversed do you think that the horse would go all ninja on the zombies to get them off of Rick? It's the zombie apocalypse; survival of the fittest isn't a theory, it's a requirement.

[kidgloves]

We over analyze this stuff cause we love it. The comic has to be followed though and there will be some WTF scenes but imagine the outcry if iconic moments from the book were ignored.
Besides, Rick lied to that horse goddamit. He promised him food, shelter and other horses and look what happened. Poor fella.

[Danny]

The only reason I believe the show is overrated is because some people are basically touting it as the second coming of Christ (which, given the whole 'rising from the dead' thing...). It is a fantastic show, the best new show on television in years (probably since Dexter debuted), but it isn't the greatest achievement in the history of television, entertainment and mankind all rolled into one.

As for the horse and its untimely death, well, speaking for myself, yeah, I'm letting the horse die if it gives me a chance to get the hell out of there. The only thing I would have done differently is I would have doused it in barbecue sauce first on the off chance that would gain the interest of even more zombies. For everyone complaining about it, if the roles were reversed do you think that the horse would go all ninja on the zombies to get them off of Rick? It's the zombie apocalypse; survival of the fittest isn't a theory, it's a requirement.

/thread.

[Ghost Of War]

I'm not even gonna over analyse it, it's friggin' awesome, end of.

[Andy]

A few of ricks decisions i dont think i would of made myself in that situation, but that dosnt mean i dont understand his reasoning, it stuck to the original story well.

[joeharley666]

A few of ricks decisions i dont think i would of made myself in that situation, but that dosnt mean i dont understand his reasoning, it stuck to the original story well.


Kind of my point in a way. We are all different and we all handle extremely difficult predicaments differently, so just imagine how many different ways any human being would handle oneself under the zombie taking over the world holocaust.
There is no right way. At least Darabont didn't have Grimes going across the parking lot of an infested zombie army trying to save a dog cough*dawn04*cough

[Sammich]

I thought it was clever how they satisfied both the running and the shambling fans by showing the aggroed horde scenes in slow motion.

I like the show because recently all of the zombie movies (with the exception
of Romero's) have been targeted to the high school crowd. Like the steaming
pile of turds known as ROTLD: Rave to the Grave with no plot, stupid
stereotypical characters, and crap special effects.

[Legion2213]

It's very easy for us to sit here and make cold, calculated, rational dicisions with our "viewers/readers eye view" we aren't the folks being thrown into arma-freaking-geddon. :)

[Trin]

My main problem with the horse hinges on the contention that he was actually out of gas options. I can't buy that. There was a pickup truck literally right there. He didn't check it. I don't believe he couldn't find gas along the way. Heck, pull into any residential area and start opening garage doors. You may be able to argue that the cars on the highways were out, and the filling stations were dry, but not cars in people's garages. If Grimes believed that riding a horse into Atlanta was safe enough, then surely he wasn't scared of moving about in any of the small towns between him and Atlanta. I mean, the radio alone was worth the cost of finding gas.

Once he's on the horse I am kinda okay with it. Not exactly okay. But not enough to get uptight. I thought the mobbing scene was contrived, but whatever. I really enjoyed his "everyman" feel. It woulda been just as contrived had he been a Rambo. So that part I'm totally good with.

And I agree with kidgloves... it's only being called overrated when the rating is "OMG this is so the best thing evah."

[joeharley666]

My main problem with the horse hinges on the contention that he was actually out of gas options. I can't buy that. There was a pickup truck literally right there. He didn't check it. I don't believe he couldn't find gas along the way. Heck, pull into any residential area and start opening garage doors. You may be able to argue that the cars on the highways were out, and the filling stations were dry, but not cars in people's garages. If Grimes believed that riding a horse into Atlanta was safe enough, then surely he wasn't scared of moving about in any of the small towns between him and Atlanta. I mean, the radio alone was worth the cost of finding gas.

Once he's on the horse I am kinda okay with it. Not exactly okay. But not enough to get uptight. I thought the mobbing scene was contrived, but whatever. I really enjoyed his "everyman" feel. It woulda been just as contrived had he been a Rambo.
So that part I'm totally good with.
And I agree with kidgloves... it's only being called overrated when the rating is "OMG this is so the best thing evah."

I think Darabont just didn't want to overspend minutes of him searching for gas, I think he wanted us to believe he's been searching for gasoline all along up until that point. And as far as gas being readily available. I'm not buying that point or argument. Imagine the panic, imagine the disorder, imagine the chaos. Even though there was no place to escape, people trying to survive would have brought the one commodity along with them......gas. Extra gas. Just take a look at all those cars attempting to escape out of the city.

[White_Zombie]

I'm pretty sure he could of siphoned gas out of an abandoned vehicle, i've yet to see that come out of some ones post yet. Not that hard at all, if not siphoning gas with a hose then crawl under the car and puncture the gas tank and put something underneath to catch the fuel. Not really rocket science.

[blind2d]

Unless perhaps your rocket is fueled by gasoline...
Anyhow, yeah, I don't see where all the fuss about the horse comes from. He likes horses! Some people just do, okay? He's probably lonely too, and it makes a good companion. But yeah, sad about old Eddy (I'm naming the horse Eddy) going out like that... shame.

[Wyldwraith]

The only issue I had I expressed,
I believe that Rick coulda broken the zombie cordon forming behind him easily enough before it solidified into a swarm much like the one pursuing him, but (perhaps reasonably, as a modern citizen unfamiliar with the absolutely devastating power of ANY horse capable of a full gallop that strikes unprotected and GOD HELP THEM, **STATIONARY** human/zombie flesh) he hauled the horse up short/hesitated, and that hesitation directly led to him being pulled off the horse and forced to scramble under the tank.

It's realistic enough, and upon further consideration I realized one good reason for them NOT to do a "Rick gallops over and through the zombies" scene. Beyond the ones already discussed, plot necessity and so on. If they HAD done a scene of him galloping the horse into a double-row of zombies, they would've had to do it down an empty street and CGI ALL of the falling/knocked down/badly crushed zombies. Lot of comp. time to burn up for one scene that wouldn't get u closer to where u want ur protagonist. Ie: Trapped and in need of help from the Atlanta survivors.

[Mr_Shadow]

Rick lied to that horse goddamit. He promised him food, shelter and other horses and look what happened. Poor fella.

Well he didn't lie intentionally since Rick believed Atlanta was safe. Morgan and Duane still believed it too. So I'm thinking Rick felt the horse was good enough transportation to get him to Altanta, believing he'll arrive at some sort of refugee center with military protection.

[Gemini]

The whole horse scenario and climax to the pilot was perfect, imo.

I'll take a survivor on a horse over a zombie riding a horse any day :rolleyes:

The attention to detail was great, as Lincoln took 5 shots before deciding to save the last one for himself. There was a tense moment where you actually believed somehow that would be the end of him. Also anyone notice Lincoln was thinking of suicide again (holding the pistol against his forehead) just before the voice came over the radio? Also, the music at the end was not jarring imo, it immediately lifted the tension and was the perfect transition to close out the first episode.

Someone else here thought Lincoln was not satisfactorily surprised when told of the walking dead. Well, he had already seen bicycle zombie so he must have processed and understood much of what was going on already. And he was utterly shocked as he made his way around the hospital, great acting.

This show was great as far as showing the aftermath of the plague. WWZ's challenge/opportunity is to depict the plague spreading as it happens, in a grand, epic scale. Or so we hope.

I am sure this one's been dissected to death on this board, but if bites are contagious then why isn't blood splatter as well?

[sandrock74]

I am sure this one's been dissected to death on this board, but if bites are contagious then why isn't blood splatter as well?

Well, I figure that a bite from a zombie isn't "contagious" per se; a bite from a zombie will kill you, plain and simple. Everyone is already infected with whatever reanimates the dead. I guess whatever is in a zombies bite that will kill you is specific to their mouth as opposed to the blood? I'm no doctor (I don't even play one on tv), so I could be grasping at straws....

[Danny]

Well, I figure that a bite from a zombie isn't "contagious" per se; a bite from a zombie will kill you, plain and simple. Everyone is already infected with whatever reanimates the dead. I guess whatever is in a zombies bite that will kill you is specific to their mouth as opposed to the blood? I'm no doctor (I don't even play one on tv), so I could be grasping at straws....

Now, this is it. The Walking dead doesn't follow the "oh no, bites!" virus bollocks thats been oversaturated to death in zombie movies. we still have no idea years later in the comics why the dead are rising. just anyone that dies does. A human mouth contains lots of nasty bacteria, now imagine a dead rotting one, you get bitten by one and you are going to suffer massive infection if not treated. -where are you going to get treated in this world?


-that said, the filler about morgan and his wife and "her fever'? completely added in, nothing to do with the comic, so its highly likely this WILL go down the virus bite cliche shitty route to give some semblance of hope that not everyone will eventually be a zombie, because honestly this is a television show. censors, especially american censors are going to tone down or completely cut a fair few things in this. I imagine the slightly hopeless, nihilistic nature that everyone turns eventually is not 'tv friendly'.

[Andy]

I Wondered that myself, honestly how far down the route of the comics will the TV series go? Greaat scenes like..
..
When the women (i cant remember her name i need to read the comics again) commits suicide by hugging a zombie
..I can see being totally missed to keep the series 'TV-Friendly', but then again i have been wrong and pleasently suprised by things like this before.

[MikePizzoff]

I went through the IMDB forum for TWD. Couldn't stay on there long because I was becoming infuriated with all the hate for the show.

A bunch of people are saying this show is "cliched" and "like every other zombie movie" ... :confused: maybe I'm just a fanboy, but they really pissed me off.

Like most people here, I've seen PLENTY of zombie movies and none of them, spare early GAR, take the time to concentrate on character development like TWD does. Also, the majority of zombie flicks either have humans killing shloads of zombies with an unlimited supply of ammo, or zombies ripping apart shloads of humans, whereas TWD elegantly spread out any sort of violence.

In conclusion, how can this be like something that it's nothing like?!?!

:mad::mad::mad:

[Danny]

well honestly you are being slightly fanboyish, all you have seen is the pilot with no progression, only establishment of the 'rules' so to speak. So whilst there hate is premature, defending a pilot is just as unfounded. it was a decent pilot, but neither the people who liked it or disliked know what this show will become at all. Plenty of shows have some good pilots and go to shit quickly after.

Bear in mind this is a forum primarily about zombie movies, the majority opinion will be leaning purely because of the "ah man,how cool would a zombie tv series be?" idea actually happening.

[Tricky]

Personally I prefer the "virus" explanation over any of the other ridiculous ones that get banded about, like the supernatural or radiation from satellites etc. I know the dead coming back is ridiculous anyway when you put it in real terms, but it being a disease of some kind is the one that makes the most sense to me & is most deeply embedded in my mind when I watch zombie films. If I was to make a zombie story, I would have the cause of it starting from one of those balloons that the japanese tried to send over to the states towards the end of WW2, I'd have someone like a hiker in the modern day finding the remains of one of them in woodland or something, cracking it open not knowing what it was, and becoming infected by a virus that the notorious "unit 731" had created, thats how I would start the infection in my story :)


If the bombs had been used in conjunction with biological weapons developed by Unit 731 then they might have been somewhat more effective, but that's assuming they would land somewhere near or in a city and not out in a forest or desert where no one might pass for quite some time.



From this article http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/balloon.html

And dont be nicking any of my ideas y'all :shifty::p

[Wyldwraith]

To be fair,
We must acknowledge that, beyond anything to do with zombies, the current wasteland that is TV programming gives ANYTHING which is new and possessed of a "fresh/novel feeling" an immediate positive bias in that fresh/novel program's favor. Give you a non-zombie example. When Dr. Who was at long last revived, there was a HUGE polarization which had fans of the original who wanted to see their beloved Telly Prog remade/continued plot-wise, individuals interested in a rather retro program remake in general, and individuals with no prior Dr. Who or even sci-fi experience in general who just find themselves liking the new Dr. Who, versus all those Purist Classic Fans who decried the remake's very existence before they even saw its 1st episode. Ultimately, the weakness in the then-current BBC lineup helped the show.

In the same way that discerning viewers who are sick to death of CSI/Law & Order Versions 9.0, all the OTHER cop/investigator/forensics-related mystery solving shows, nigh-endless Pseudo-Reality TV, and various comedies of the obscure reference variety or idiot-humor subset, could very well be giving the TWD even more of a positive glow than its already well-crafted nature deserves.

Ultimately however, good is good and crap is crap. I enjoyed TWD's pilot more than ANY OTHER series premier I've seen in the last several years. Unless the quality takes a sudden and major nosedive in the next few episodes, I anticipate nothing but good, better, awesome-type vibe for this series.

[kidgloves]

We'll have a good idea of where the shows going after 3 episodes. They are trying different styles for each episode. "Guts" is going to be action orientated and episode 3 will be more drama. People should at least give it 3 eps before we'll know how good it is.

[Danny]

We'll have a good idea of where the shows going after 3 episodes. They are trying different styles for each episode. "Guts" is going to be action orientated and episode 3 will be more drama. People should at least give it 3 eps before we'll know how good it is.

Yeah that's my rule of thumb. give it 3 episodes, you either cannot wait for the next episode at the end or dont care.

[triste realtà]

I went through the IMDB forum for TWD. Couldn't stay on there long because I was becoming infuriated with all the hate for the show.

A bunch of people are saying this show is "cliched" and "like every other zombie movie" ... :confused: maybe I'm just a fanboy, but they really pissed me off.



In conclusion, how can this be like something that it's nothing like?!?!

:mad::mad::mad:

You have to be kidding. I did the same thing yesterday and found 1 thread in 7 pages that said exactly what you just said it said. And then the OP disappeared for pages within that thread. I was a little pissed at all the sloppy praise and what would you do brain damage on display.


I don't know why everyone has a problem........


I think they got the title wrong. It should be called Captain Pubicbeard versus the Zombie Replicates.

[Trin]

I think Darabont just didn't want to overspend minutes of him searching for gas, I think he wanted us to believe he's been searching for gasoline all along up until that point. And as far as gas being readily available. I'm not buying that point or argument. Imagine the panic, imagine the disorder, imagine the chaos. Even though there was no place to escape, people trying to survive would have brought the one commodity along with them......gas. Extra gas. Just take a look at all those cars attempting to escape out of the city.
The same panic, disorder, and chaos is why there is still gas available. People were leaving in a hurry. They didn't drain every source of gas as they fled.

Think about all the sources of gas out there. The cars in garages. The cars on car dealers lots. Any abandoned refill trucks. Any storage facilities (there is one less than 5 miles from my house that can fulfill the entire city's gas needs for a month). The hospital generator, since we know it still had lights on. Heck the cars sitting waiting at the filling station got there somehow. They didn't ALL run out of gas just as they pulled up.

I agree that Darabont didn't want to spend time on it, and I agree that he tried to portray the situation that Grimes simply ran out. I just think it is sloppy storytelling and too pivotal. The lack of radio as he got near Atlanta kept him from receiving the transmission from the RV clan. The horse ended up getting him trapped.

I would've bought it more had he been shown for 10 seconds draining the last of his array of 5 gallon containers. But we saw him with, what was it, a tiny 1 gallon container at best? Or if there was some greater urgency to get to Atlanta that kept him from being methodical in his search.

[clanglee]

I dunno man. . . did you see the size of the camp outside that gas station where he killed the little girl zombie? it looks like a hundred people all ran out of gas at or near that station and got stuck and couldn't go on. that would indicate that gas was just plain out at stations and in cars. . .he might be able to finds SOME cars here and there, but altogether it would be a mostly fruitless and time consuming effort to keep searching for the dregs of gas left. That's also why the horse choice works for me. He was in a great hurry to get to Atlanta and find out if his family was ok. . . and the horse meant he didn't have to stop for a while. maybe a bit slower, but maybe he was only like 30 miles out of ATL at that point and just needed the last leg. . . .I dunno. . .a lot of maybes. . but I bought it, and I'm usually pretty picky. . . .

[ProfessorChaos]

Or if there was some greater urgency to get to Atlanta that kept him from being methodical in his search.

not to sound like too much of a smart-ass, but aside from the obvious that his wife and kid were out there without him in the middle of the zombie apocalypse?

and seriously, this gas-situation is such a non-issue. maybe darabont decided it was implied that he'd already exhausted a few options and simply was tired of fucking around with trying to siphon gas...

[shootemindehead]

About this petrol business...

Didn't Rick already run out of petrol on a stretch of road and had to start walking? That's NOT a great situation to be in, especially when zombies don't tire and you can only outrun them for a little while and it's an even shorter amount of time in the Atlanta heat, carrying a bag full of guns.

The horse won't run out of fuel, it's speedy enough to put distance between you and the dead and it'll handle cross country better than any car.

The horse makes perfect sense, so can we drop all the silly talk? :bored:

Thanks. :D

[AcesandEights]

The horse won't run out of fuel, it's speedy enough to put distance between you and the dead and it'll handle cross country better than any car.

The horse makes perfect sense, so can we drop all the silly talk? :bored:


I considered it dropped a while ago:) I completely agree with you.

[darth los]

A car won't get scared when confronted with a handful of zombies.

If said zombies do make it to you a car will serve as a temporary barrier until you get your bearings and formulate a plan.

A car doesn't get hungry or tired. Or toss you off into a horde for that matter.

A car can run a hundred of those sun a bitches over. A horse cannot.


The only drawback is finding fuel, yes. However a living beast needs fuel too, it's called food and water and one that big needs alot of it.

Oh and a car doesn't need to rest or sleep.

:cool:

[BillyRay]

On that note, why didn't Rick just drive the tank out of there?

[Mitchified]

I'm guessing that Rick's training as a small-town police officer didn't really include how to drive a tank. Clearly an oversight on the criminal justice system's part.

[AcesandEights]

Uh, clearly Rick should have taken a gyrocopter, a flamethrower and a vorpal glaive +5. :whatever:

Seems like there are enough reasons that make sense within the context of the story for Rick's choice to be believable enough.

[BillyRay]

I'm guessing that Rick's training as a small-town police officer didn't really include how to drive a tank. Clearly an oversight on the criminal justice system's part.

Yeah, you'd think all small-town police would be trained in this sort of thing - War on "Terrists" and all that...

[Ghost Of War]

Uh, clearly Rick should have taken a gyrocopter, a flamethrower and a vorpal glaive +5. :whatever:

Seems like there are enough reasons that make sense within the context of the story for Rick's choice to be believable enough.

Bingo. It's all in the context.

[Tricky]

I'm guessing that Rick's training as a small-town police officer didn't really include how to drive a tank. Clearly an oversight on the criminal justice system's part.

To be fair he had all the time in the world to figure out how to start it & move it though, cant be all that hard! After all if you go to one of those military adventure parks they let civvies drive tanks around after about 20 minutes showing them the controls

[Thorn]

I do not have a problem with him riding a horse really, it is not my first choice in his situation but we have to make some assumptions and suspend our believe a bit.

1) I assume he was looking for gas for a long time and having trouble
2) I believe he was having trouble at points navigating due to cars and debris in the road like corpses, fallen branches, other cars, and so on.
3) He is a sensible guy, he might say to himself “Horses eat grass and hay not gas… plenty of grass and hay along the way” “Horses are smaller and more mobile, it would be easy to dodge in and out of congestion and such” “Horses jump I might even be able to leap over obstacles”
In the comic I always felt as if the idea was just to portray him in a cowboy hat on a horse for the iconic imagery. A sheriff riding off to restore order to his life, his town, the world. I think they liked that sort of visual and the feelings it would stir up.

I am glad it was not changed for the show. I am a comic guy as you may remember and with that “crowd” you find it is easy to let things go or suspend disbelief even more so than with movie guys. This was not a problem for the readers then really, and it is not a problem for me now. You take it for what it is worth, you might even snicker at it and that is cool. It evokes some reaction from you, as long as you get the original intent of the writer even if you don’t dig it at least you can get a clear picture of HIS intent.

[darth los]

Hey, that suspend your belief thing might be worth a try. :p

:cool:

[bassman]

I can't believe nobody has brought up the fence climbers in episode 2....

That kinda irked me. Especially when you consider a scene that took place before it near the start of the episode...

[DEAD BEAT]

Grimes decision to use the horse, and why everyone thinks this show is overrated.

First, he's out of gas, he's exhausted all options. He see's the horse, has some experience with the horse, maybe a little rusty, but nonetheless comfortable. Complain all you want about the way Darabont set up the mob zombie scene, but Grimes reacted like a normal human being under duress. He was over-come with a horde. Yes he was warned by the black guy that in groups they are dangerous, but he only had experience with a walker here and there. As far as he was concerned there were human beings in Atlanta. I don't care how much training he had as an officer, this was a new world that he in a coma when it went down. This was a threat that was a greater force. What was he supposed to to, pull off the 200 plus walkers one at a time off the horse while he was surrounded. No! He did what any normal being who loves animals would do, try the best he can to survive a swarm that had blanketed him and the horse in seconds. No way no how, this was as realistic as it gets for a human being. I think most of you were expecting Rambo to save the day, no way, Darabont know what works.

And as far as being overrated, can't see that either. Just thank your lucky stars that Darabont is presenting us a world with the general rules with something extra and with great character driven development and horror. Thank your lucky stars this is not based on "Return of the Living Dead" or something worse. Darabont is giving us something we waited our whole lives for on American television that we will probably never get again. We are lucky that this genre is finally presented with some respect, and it's because of Kirkman and Darabont. Thanks guys. I see nothing overrated at all.
Just my thoughts......

Im with ya on this buddy! Shit what else would we have if Darabont didn't come along....FREAKIN' JACK SHIT!"

We gave plenty of time for Romero or anyone else to jazz us up.......so for now im with TWD! ;)

Only one thing that got me is that we learned in GAR'S zombie world is that the dead have no taste for animals...

Guess ill check off yet another thing Darabont stole can you say Return of the Living Dead? lmao

[shootemindehead]

...I am a comic guy...

I feckin knew it!

http://www.mun.ca/sgs/blog/wp-content/uploads/the-comic-book-guy-pondering.gif

[MikePizzoff]

I'm guessing that Rick's training as a small-town police officer didn't really include how to drive a tank. Clearly an oversight on the criminal justice system's part.

I have a feeling you may rapidly become of my favorite posters.

[kidgloves]

To be fair he had all the time in the world to figure out how to start it & move it though, cant be all that hard! After all if you go to one of those military adventure parks they let civvies drive tanks around after about 20 minutes showing them the controls

The tank had stopped for a reason. What about maintenance? Maybe it had locked up. And dont these things have more than 1 crew. There has to be more than jumping in the seat and pumping the gas.

[Gryphon]

I can't believe nobody has brought up the fence climbers in episode 2....

That kinda irked me. Especially when you consider a scene that took place before it near the start of the episode...

Maybe the fence climber was fresher than the other one? :shifty:

[shootemindehead]

The tank had stopped for a reason. What about maintenance? Maybe it had locked up. And dont these things have more than 1 crew. There has to be more than jumping in the seat and pumping the gas.

Crew of 5 usually (4 in an Abrams). 1 driver.

Not as easy to drive as some might think either. There are a number of gears (forward and back) that need manual shifting and constant attention. It's not like hopping into your comfortable automatic drive Prius. Plus, there's no stearing wheel. Tanks are steared by another set of gears, that basically stop either the left or right drive sprocket. This will allow the tank to "turn".

Without basic training, the average Atlanta cop wouldn't have the first clue.

Also, tanks are notorious for breaking down at the slightest excuse. I'd say this particular tank had trouble and was overwhelmed. If it could go, it would have gone...I assume.

[Trencher]

I like that some zombies are smarter than others, one of them outside the store had a rock, one climbed a fence and one unsuccessfully tried to climb a ladder.
I imagine that the zombies brains are like all their other body parts, some zombies are more damaged than others. The thing that I disliked in land of the dead was that certain zombies thought and reasoned and worse had feelings other than hunger. Also the capacity to learn was also quite stupid.

[darth los]

Agreed. There's a big difference between remembering things from their former lives and learning/evolving.

:cool:

[AcesandEights]

Agreed. There's a big difference between remembering things from their former lives and learning/evolving.

:cool:

Amen! If I come back from the dead a shambling corpse and somehow finally figure out how to get advanced trig--shoot me! ;)

[living_dead_grl]

I agree with you JoeHarley....first off, the horse was spooked if not from the SMELL than from coming around the corner to about 200+ people standing there...the only thing I would've done was shot the horse and then ran like hell lol...anyways....I wouldn't change a thing about the show so far and love it a lot! It is a new concept (so i believe) showing a show like this on tv as a season...I love it and HATE that I have to wait until Sun to watch it!

[bassman]

I like that some zombies are smarter than others, one of them outside the store had a rock, one climbed a fence and one unsuccessfully tried to climb a ladder.


As I mentioned earlier, it seemed shady to me that one or two were able to climb the shakey fence with ease, but none could make it up the stable ladder. Nothing major, just something that I noticed immediately.

And the few zombies with bricks reminded me of hinzman. I was quickly reminded of Darabont's "Night is the bible" comments.

As for "learning" zombies....Darabont has admitted in the past to liking Day as well. I don't know the comics, but maybe theres a possibility of a Bub-like situation appearing further down the line?

[Mitchified]

In the comics there isn't any real variation between the zombies with the exception of the freshly dead being faster than those that have been dead for a while. It would be a huge deviation to have a semi-intelligent zombie wandering around.

This isn't to say that they won't do it, though, because the zombies are already more advanced than the original Kirkman material (climbing fences and bashing things with rocks, for example). I'm just waiting for the horse to reanimate so that we can have cowboy zombies.

[Sammich]

I am hoping that in a future episode that Big Daddy and his crew show up and teaches those survivors a lesson.

[Gemini]

As I mentioned earlier, it seemed shady to me that one or two were able to climb the shakey fence with ease, but none could make it up the stable ladder. Nothing major, just something that I noticed immediately.

And the few zombies with bricks reminded me of hinzman. I was quickly reminded of Darabont's "Night is the bible" comments.

As for "learning" zombies....Darabont has admitted in the past to liking Day as well. I don't know the comics, but maybe theres a possibility of a Bub-like situation appearing further down the line?

The zombies couldn't climb the ladder because there was a very dense cluster of them at the bottom, all pushing toward the ladder and crushing those in front. The fence zombies had more room. Also, if the Walking Dead were to overrun us they would have be somewhat nimble when driven to a frenzy over fresh meat.

[Mr_Shadow]

The only thing that bugged me about the zombie climbing the fence was it landed on its feet without a problem. I would of prefered it fall to the ground, then get up and chase them.

[bassman]

The zombies couldn't climb the ladder because there was a very dense cluster of them at the bottom, all pushing toward the ladder and crushing those in front. The fence zombies had more room. .

But if you remember, one zombie actually made it a few steps up the ladder but couldn't make the rest? I understand the clustering at the bottom, but if one can make it 5-6 steps up then he should be able to keep going. And that fence was completely shakey, yet they made it over that in a few seconds?

And as Mr Shadow mention....he landed on his feet with a spring in his step. I was at least expecting him to smack the ground and then get up....

[Mike70]

If I come back from the dead a shambling corpse and somehow finally figure out how to get advanced trig--shoot me! ;)

don't worry, we'll probably just you no matter what.:D

TWD is going to show some of the things that "land" blew its opportunity to. i was really hoping that with "land" we were finally going to get to see the world taken over by the dead and the struggle living humans are having to make it in that world. no, we saw a few minutes of a supply run and not much else. same in "day" we get a glimpse and a few references but not much else.

romero has tended to cut his characters off from the outside world. most of the story revolves around the interpersonal conflicts that arise from people being stuck together under stressful conditions. granted, the outside world always manages to kick in the door and make its presence felt at the end but that seems to be more a plot device than a serious exploration.

the characters in TWD are in right in the mix. there isn't much of a separation between the world of the zombie and that of the refugees. that makes it much more interesting, because not only do you have the interpersonal stuff going on, you have the very real chance of attack and gruesome death lurking literally around the next tree.

[bassman]

you have the very real chance of attack and gruesome death lurking literally around the next tree.

And these people bump uglies in the woods. :rolleyes:

[Trencher]

As I mentioned earlier, it seemed shady to me that one or two were able to climb the shakey fence with ease, but none could make it up the stable ladder. Nothing major, just something that I noticed immediately.

And the few zombies with bricks reminded me of hinzman. I was quickly reminded of Darabont's "Night is the bible" comments.

As for "learning" zombies....Darabont has admitted in the past to liking Day as well. I don't know the comics, but maybe theres a possibility of a Bub-like situation appearing further down the line? It looked like the zombie tried to climb the ladder but got pushed by the other zombies. I read the comics and all I will say is that I hope there will be no learning zombies.

The zombies couldn't climb the ladder because there was a very dense cluster of them at the bottom, all pushing toward the ladder and crushing those in front. The fence zombies had more room. Also, if the Walking Dead were to overrun us they would have be somewhat nimble when driven to a frenzy over fresh meat.
I agree.

[Mike70]

And these people bump uglies in the woods. :rolleyes:

if this is going to follow the comics, then they had best bump while the bumping is good.

[DEAD BEAT]

Crew of 5 usually (4 in an Abrams). 1 driver.

Not as easy to drive as some might think either. There are a number of gears (forward and back) that need manual shifting and constant attention. It's not like hopping into your comfortable automatic drive Prius. Plus, there's no stearing wheel. Tanks are steared by another set of gears, that basically stop either the left or right drive sprocket. This will allow the tank to "turn".

Without basic training, the average Atlanta cop wouldn't have the first clue.

Also, tanks are notorious for breaking down at the slightest excuse. I'd say this particular tank had trouble and was overwhelmed. If it could go, it would have gone...I assume.

you said Prius....lol

[Thorn]

I feckin knew it!

http://www.mun.ca/sgs/blog/wp-content/uploads/the-comic-book-guy-pondering.gif

I'm just big boned?

[Gryphon]

Agreed. There's a big difference between remembering things from their former lives and learning/evolving.

:cool:

Well, in a walking dead person, it's hard to observe what's actually going on inside the rotting meat between its ears. Perhaps a slow re-activation of memory is exactly what GAR was trying to show as 'evolving.' The dead woke up... motor skills, sensory input and hunger/instinct re-activated first, then over time, other bits of the brain wake up, and you have Bub, Big Daddy, and the Zombie Quartet crowded in a tiny gazebo. Doctor Logan made the observation in Day that decay was slowing down in the animated dead. Perhaps whatever makes the brain turn back on also somehow prevents the decay in the brains to such an extent than more and more re-activate as time goes on?

But anyway, that's in GAR's world. It remains to be seen if we'll have any noticably thinking Walkers in TWD.


The only thing that bugged me about the zombie climbing the fence was it landed on its feet without a problem. I would of prefered it fall to the ground, then get up and chase them.

Yeah, agreed. He should have flopped on his face, maybe left a nose behind, then got up agin ;)

[Wyldwraith]

To be fair,
David Dunwoody proved in Empire that it's possible to address the potential increase of zombie intelligence over time, AND at the same time explain the purpose for their need to feed on warm human flesh. He did this in a single novel, and had his premise and exposition done and out of the way early, so you could focus on the story & developing characters.

Yes, as a RULE zombie intelligence just wrecks zombie stories regardless of what medium they're produced in, but Empire (and the upcoming Empire 2) are the EXCEPTION THAT PROVES THE RULE. Just wanted that exception noted and done with before I wholeheartedly agreed with you that some of the zombies in TWD Ep. 2 were perhaps pushing beyond the outer limits of what they "should" be able to do.

Please though, enough with the "X stole Y from Z" statements. We all know the material, and we all realize that authors/scriptwriters/teleplay crafters and directors use a derivative plot device in their then-current work. This isn't college and it's certainly not a scholastic Board of Inquiry to charge someone with plagiarism, so I'm confident we can all expect that those who create material in our beloved zombie genre will abscond with plot material from earlier productions they found to possess value earlier in their lives.

[MoonSylver]

Please though, enough with the "X stole Y from Z" statements. We all know the material, and we all realize that authors/scriptwriters/teleplay crafters and directors use a derivative plot device in their then-current work. This isn't college and it's certainly not a scholastic Board of Inquiry to charge someone with plagiarism...

No, it's something MUCH, MUCH worse...

http://dvdmedia.ign.com/dvd/image/sttng_seasonone_01.jpg

:lol:

[Gryphon]

To be fair,
David Dunwoody proved in Empire that it's possible to address the potential increase of zombie intelligence over time, AND at the same time explain the purpose for their need to feed on warm human flesh. He did this in a single novel, and had his premise and exposition done and out of the way early, so you could focus on the story & developing characters.

Yes, as a RULE zombie intelligence just wrecks zombie stories regardless of what medium they're produced in, but Empire (and the upcoming Empire 2) are the EXCEPTION THAT PROVES THE RULE. Just wanted that exception noted and done with before I wholeheartedly agreed with you that some of the zombies in TWD Ep. 2 were perhaps pushing beyond the outer limits of what they "should" be able to do.

I need to read this Empire of which you speak....

No, it's something MUCH, MUCH worse...

http://dvdmedia.ign.com/dvd/image/sttng_seasonone_01.jpg

:lol:

Yay Q! :elol:

[Wyldwraith]

EVERY REAL zombie fan needs to read Empire,
It's such a departure from standard fare, but at the same time it's fundamentally in tune with everything about a great zombie apocalypse. Dunwoody actually dares to ::gasp:: COME UP WITH ANSWERS. Nothing new there, instead what's new is that HIS answers work. Dunno how to say that any better without ruining the beauty of apprehending the Horrifying Truth of the Empire-verse for yourself.

Do it. Can have it ordered and in your hands in 2-4 days from Permutated Press (sp?)

<--- Devoted Empire fan. Aka: The only zombie-related creative work to address zombie intelligence and actually get BETTER for including it (zombie intelligence) as a theme!

[Gryphon]

EVERY REAL zombie fan needs to read Empire,
It's such a departure from standard fare, but at the same time it's fundamentally in tune with everything about a great zombie apocalypse. Dunwoody actually dares to ::gasp:: COME UP WITH ANSWERS. Nothing new there, instead what's new is that HIS answers work. Dunno how to say that any better without ruining the beauty of apprehending the Horrifying Truth of the Empire-verse for yourself.

Do it. Can have it ordered and in your hands in 2-4 days from Permutated Press (sp?)

<--- Devoted Empire fan. Aka: The only zombie-related creative work to address zombie intelligence and actually get BETTER for including it (zombie intelligence) as a theme!

One Mail-order present at a time... still waiting for my Bub action figure to arrive... :elol: But I will definitely get and read it. Promise :evil:

[Wyldwraith]

Excellent,
Oh and BTW, the author is a good guy who actually has time for his fans. He's also posted on here in the HPOTD Fiction Forum, which is where I first met him and since exchanged a few emails with. Seems a devoted zombie fan and all-around cool guy. He's gonna sign my Empire and Empire 2 when I get my Empire 2 of course.

Edit/Additional Note: BTW, if you like Dunwoody's work I'm sure he'd appreciate an email to that effect, and by all means support this guy by giving Empire 2 a shot as well. No hardship, as Empire will, I have no doubt, leave you hungering to see what happens next for Adam.

Double Note: How do you access all the cool smileys?

[MoonSylver]

Double Note: How do you access all the cool smileys?

Double click on the the "reply" or "reply with quote" when you are going to post & it takes you straight to "advanced" OR if you click the "go advanced" in the regualar post & you'll see the menu of clickable smilies OR if you know the codes for them you can just type them in, For example: THIS : PLUS ) = :) THIS ; PLUS ) = ;). Some of them are a word surrounded by : on either side. So, laughing smiley is the word lol with : on either side = :lol: . If you click the clickable ones & then edit post for example you can see the codes for them. :D ( which is : plus D ) :lol:

[babomb]

I gotta throw my 2cents in here.
You guys are picking this to death!!!
I don't see how you can possibly enjoy anything looking at it so closely.
Like many others here I liked the books and the comics alot.
So the horse is a necessity in that regard, in my opinion anyway.
I can also see how someone would make that choice when you consider the situation.
From Ricks POV, he's caught in an emotional frenzy to find his family so he's not constantly doing the math on the trip ETA.
He finds a house with a truck, nobody there, no gas to be had.
So he's still on foot, but notices the horse.
It's really a no-brainer in that situation.

I actually liked the fact that they took down the horse and feasted on it.
Not for sadistic reasons but because you don't see animals being eaten like that in any other zombie flicks I've seen.
And it seems like a logical thing to have happen.
Why wouldn't they eat animal flesh?
They aren't cannibals, they're walking dead that feast on living flesh.
My question is would the animals get up and hunt living flesh too?
That would totally change the game.

[MoonSylver]

I gotta throw my 2cents in here.
You guys are picking this to death!!!
I don't see how you can possibly enjoy anything looking at it so closely..

Welcome! A lot of us are long term, hard core fans of the genre, so like any fan base who are passionate, we're very analytical & have devoted a lot (too much) thought to the subject. :)


Like many others here I liked the books and the comics alot.
So the horse is a necessity in that regard, in my opinion anyway.
I can also see how someone would make that choice when you consider the situation.
From Ricks POV, he's caught in an emotional frenzy to find his family so he's not constantly doing the math on the trip ETA.
He finds a house with a truck, nobody there, no gas to be had.
So he's still on foot, but notices the horse.
It's really a no-brainer in that situation.

I don't have a problem with the horse. I accept all of the reasoning that presumably led to it. But I came from the comic. I think (?) some of the folks that question it are being exposed to TWD for the first time through the series (?). Not that one justifies the other or anything, but I think it's just the POV.


I actually liked the fact that they took down the horse and feasted on it.
Not for sadistic reasons but because you don't see animals being eaten like that in any other zombie flicks I've seen.

Seen "Survival of the Dead" yet? :(


And it seems like a logical thing to have happen.
Why wouldn't they eat animal flesh?
They aren't cannibals, they're walking dead that feast on living flesh.
My question is would the animals get up and hunt living flesh too?
That would totally change the game.

Eh, I have mixed feelings on the subjet. In the GAR-verse the implication for years was that they ONLY sought out humans, which IMO made them SCARY. There's no hope of placating them with something else, THEY WANT TO EAT YOU AND ONLY YOU. Which is a disturbing implication IMO. WHY do they only want to eat humans? Is it by design? Whose?!? It leaves my disquieted just thinkiing about it. (Which is why I'm sad that this was included in GAR's newest :( )

Now, having said THAT, this ISN'T the GAR-verse. It's TWD. Just because Kirkman chose to hew close to NOTLD as the source, doesn't mean that certain rules may or may not be open to some interpretation. SO at the end of the day, this is a long way of saying that I don't have a problem with it per se. ;) As long as they're not Flying, Sparkling, Fire Breathing Zombies who Teleport & Shoot Laser Beams From Their Eyes. :lol:

And yeah, zombie animals WOULD be bad. :eek:

[babomb]

Welcome! A lot of us are long term, hard core fans of the genre, so like any fan base who are passionate, we're very analytical & have devoted a lot (too much) thought to the subject.
Thanks.
I'm a long time fan of the genre myself.
Goes back to "Return of the Living Dead" when I was a little kid.
Only part 1, although I do like pt-2 but only for the sake of nostalgia.
After that they suck.
Long time fan of Romero's films(Dawn Day and Diary anyway), Land was OK, but Survival of the Dead was crap I thought.
Like a zombie western(I hate westerns), I watched it but was just not into it so I don't even remember the horse part.
My favorite aspect of the zombie genre is the apocalyptic component.
I'm not a GAR purist though.
I first came to this board back in like 2003-2004 right before the Dawn remake came out and it was a bunch of people bitchin about "how dare they do a remake" and fighting about the "slow vs fast" zombies.
So I didn't even bother to register, just checked out the fiction section.
But I knew there would be some activity regarding TWD here, and some involved discussion.
I just think it's great to have an actual series about the undead!
And equally great that the original material isn't being totally butchered by the networks.

[kidgloves]

Thanks.
I'm a long time fan of the genre myself.
Goes back to "Return of the Living Dead" when I was a little kid.
Only part 1, although I do like pt-2 but only for the sake of nostalgia.
After that they suck.
Long time fan of Romero's films(Dawn Day and Diary anyway), Land was OK, but Survival of the Dead was crap I thought.
Like a zombie western(I hate westerns), I watched it but was just not into it so I don't even remember the horse part.
My favorite aspect of the zombie genre is the apocalyptic component.
I'm not a GAR purist though.
I first came to this board back in like 2003-2004 right before the Dawn remake came out and it was a bunch of people bitchin about "how dare they do a remake" and fighting about the "slow vs fast" zombies.
So I didn't even bother to register, just checked out the fiction section.
But I knew there would be some activity regarding TWD here, and some involved discussion.
I just think it's great to have an actual series about the undead!
And equally great that the original material isn't being totally butchered by the networks.

Welcome Babomb. Enjoy ya stay and you'll get used to the overanalysis. It's all harmless fun