Dawn Topic #201087

[Andy]

I have to admit i dont hold dawn in such high regard as some of the guys on here, its probably my least favourite of the original trilogy lagging way behind night and day.. Anyway ive just completed my second read through of the book and just wanted to add a note on here saying the book is awesome, its way better than the movie and gives alot more light to each characters personality and really makes you consider the whole situation their in, little things like the dynamic between roger and peter, the relationship between peter and steven, the state of steven and frans relationship.

Another point i dont think i ever considered or heard argued on here is that the stairway is the only way to the hideaway, and peter and steven build a fake wall to hide the stairway so how do they get upstairs?

The maintenance duct? all is well good but how does fran, in her heavilly pregnant state, get through?

[EvilNed]

To be honest I'm with you on this one, and I'm pretty sure bassman agrees with me on this:

Dawn is definetly my least favorite on the OT. It's just too cheesy and too corny to give it that extra power. Neither Day or Night are corny in the way Dawn is. And they're much better off for it.

That said, Dawn is a terrific film. I can't help but think Goblin had a hand in that tho... :p

[bassman]

Yesir. Dawn doesn't hold up too well. Although Night is probably my least favorite of the three. Nothing wrong with the movie itself, I just got so burned out on it that I can't watch it anymore. Not for a while, anyway.

As for the pregnancy/air duct thing - Maybe she could fit through it at the start, but at the last few months she had to stay up in the apartment? It's been a while since I've seen it, but I can't recall her wandering through the mall while REALLY pregnant.

Besides....if she really needed out she could just do a steady walk into their flimsy wall and it would fall over like a stack of children's blocks. :p

[Trin]

I love Dawn. It is in a constant shove match with Day for my favorite.

I'm pretty sure we've hashed this out amidst other Dawn nitpick threads.

The fake wall was placed in the mall proper to mask the door to the concrete hallway. There was only one way up to the apartment from the concrete hallway, but no one ever said there was only one way into the concrete hallway. Given that the boiler room and maintenance rooms were all back there I have to assume there were exits into stores and other places. Probably less obvious and better locking.

Even if that were not the case I don't think the ducts would be required. We see them with a rope ladder hanging in the hallway. Assumedly that would lead over the wall to another rode ladder or a regular ladder on the other side with a short hop through the ceiling.

I need to get a copy of the book. Used to have it. Don't any longer. Not sure I ever read it.

[bassman]

The fake wall was placed in the mall proper to mask the door to the concrete hallway. There was only one way up to the apartment from the concrete hallway, but no one ever said there was only one way into the concrete hallway. Given that the boiler room and maintenance rooms were all back there I have to assume there were exits into stores and other places. Probably less obvious and better locking.


While I agree that in reality there would most likely be several entrances to that hallway and those utility rooms, Peter's line of "we don't want them to know that hallway even exists" points to the fact that they wanted us to believe it was the only way in.

And even with the rope ladder just outside the fake wall, Fran would have a hell of a time getting through that small hole and duct while 6-9 months pregnant.

[blind2d]

Which is why she had to stay upstairs when the bikers arrived... but still, getting onto the roof and operating a helicopter would suck...
Shoot, I just realized! Fran's baby is probably not going to be healthy when it's born! She smokes, drinks, operates heavy machinery, engages in physical activity and has sex! All while pregnant! Damn... that kid's going to be messed-up, I am not afraid to tell you...

[Wrong Number]

If you are healthy and in reasonable shape you should be able to do most normal activities up until the last week or two. So, going up and down a ladder while not comfortable, could be done if needed.

WN

[bassman]

The ladder isn't so much the problem. The problem is the size of the air duct.

[BillyRay]

The ladder isn't so much the problem. The problem is the size of the air duct.

That's what she .......no, no, can't, WON'T say it...

[EvilNed]

... Said. :D

[bassman]

That's what she .......no, no, can't, WON'T say it...

:lol: I actually changed my post to avoid that. It was originally "the problem is the size of the shaft". True story.

[Mike70]

Yesir. Dawn doesn't hold up too well. Although Night is probably my least favorite of the three. Nothing wrong with the movie itself, I just got so burned out on it that I can't watch it anymore. Not for a while, anyway.

As for the pregnancy/air duct thing - Maybe she could fit through it at the start, but at the last few months she had to stay up in the apartment? It's been a while since I've seen it, but I can't recall her wandering through the mall while REALLY pregnant.

Besides....if she really needed out she could just do a steady walk into their flimsy wall and it would fall over like a stack of children's blocks. :p


word. dawn has not kept its freshness at all. i recently gave it a watch after a long hiatus. it did nothing to change my opinion. it is clunky, clumsy, and amateurish. great story but wretched execution. as for night 68, i'm not such a fan of that anymore either.

having said that, day is still one of my fav horror films ever.

[Trin]

The ladder isn't so much the problem. The problem is the size of the air duct.
The problem is that the MEN built a wall between the pregnant woman and the free shopping!! And you guys think this had anything to do with zombies or looters. They were just tired of carying stuff up to the apartment that she picked out.

But seriously, Peter's comment about them not wanting anyone to even know that stairwell exists may simply imply that the doorway was the only obvious entry to the concrete hallway. Or the only entry that didn't require getting inside the store gates first. They were really just protecting against a mad dash looter, not a thorough search. Given the impracticalities of walling themselves off from the supplies it is hard to swallow that it's the ONLY (non-ductwork) passage up or down.

However, I would entertain the notion that GAR never thought through the impracticalities of there only being one entrance and that entrance being something they'd wall off. Okay, maybe that's more plausible than I thought.

[hadrian0117]

...Shoot, I just realized! Fran's baby is probably not going to be healthy when it's born! She smokes, drinks, operates heavy machinery, engages in physical activity and has sex! All while pregnant! Damn... that kid's going to be messed-up, I am not afraid to tell you...

Don't forget all the stress Fran's under (what with civilization collapses and being confront by living corpses who's sole desire is to eat her on a daily basis). She has alot of other stuff on her mind. Fran always struct be as very nihilistic. She can't bring herself to abort, but probally wouldn't be all that upset by a miscarriage. Correct me if I'm wrong, but were there any scenes of her actually preparing for the birth or even looking through the maternity section in the department store? I don't remember any.

And don't forget this was the '70s. Attitudes were a bit different then. My mom had my older brother a few years before the film was made and her doctor told her not to try and quit smoking while she was pregnant because the stress would do more harm that good. As far as booze was concerned all she was told not to drink on an empty stomach.

[bassman]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but were there any scenes of her actually preparing for the birth or even looking through the maternity section in the department store? I don't remember any.


Don't quote me on it, but I believe there are some scenes of her looking at baby clothes and items in the extended cut. It's been a long time since I've seen that cut, so I could be wrong.

[Yojimbo]

I do recall scenes from the Cannes Cut that show Fran looking at pregnancy related books. I also recall a shot I'd her sitting on a bench in front of a maternity store looking wistful, but not sure which cut that was from.

I do know that in the novelization there is some internal dialogue for Fran where she references her chain smoking in the hideout - something about howshe was worried about how all the stress was affecting her baby, but that the world was so uncertain that she didn't feel like limiting her smoking habit.

Though it has been a while since I read the novelization, I also recall statements made about how the managed to bring ip a fake fireplace and other large items of furniture and crap before they completed the wall, which to me implies that there were not any other truly viable ways of getting into the corridor to the hideout other than the walled off entrance.