TWD 4x16 "A" episode discussion (Season 4 Finale) ... **SPOILERS WITHIN**

[MinionZombie]

Please keep all talk of episode 4x16 "A" specifically inside this thread.

If you have a theory for a following episode, please use the "spoiler tags" (visit the HPOTD FAQ to find out how to use them if you don't already know).

Similarly, if you're going to discuss plot points from the comic book, please use "spoiler tags" - not everyone is up-to-date on them, and some people don't read them at all.

Enjoy!


The Walking Dead Episode 416- A: “As multiple paths collide, Rick comes face to face with sheer brutality. Will he and the group have what it takes to survive?”

Written by: Scott M. Gimple & Angela Kang
Directed by: Michelle MacLaren

Michelle MacLaren has previously directed episodes 1x02 and 2x07. We all know who Gimple is, and Angela Kang has previously written 4x12, 4x02, 3x11, 3x05, 2x11, and 2x06.

[facestabber]

I can't wait for tonight. But once its here, then its gone till friggin October. The joys and pains of being a Walking Dead fan.

[Trencher]

I dont have time to post a long post but my guess is that Michonne dies, the hinting with Daryl is just a red herring.
Why do I think Michonne? Because the other black actor have been changed from somewhat realistic alholic character to an typical Hollywood wise and benevolent alcoholic which means he will get more time on the show which means that AMC will cut out one of the other black characters. Also another woman have been given the role of typical Hollywood action babe, using a sign post to cleave zombies just as efficiently as Michone ever did with her katana. Just another step down for the show as it slowly turns more and more into Hollywood bullshit.

[Harleydude666]

I dont have time to post a long post but my guess is that Michonne dies, the hinting with Daryl is just a red herring.
Why do I think Michonne? Because the other black actor have been changed from somewhat realistic alholic character to an typical Hollywood wise and benevolent alcoholic which means he will get more time on the show which means that AMC will cut out one of the other black characters. Also another woman have been given the role of typical Hollywood action babe, using a sign post to cleave zombies just as efficiently as Michone ever did with her katana. Just another step down for the show as it slowly turns more and more into Hollywood bullshit.

That was about the most preposterous combination of drivel I have ever read

[Trencher]

That was about the most preposterous combination of drivel I have ever read
That was the most unimaginative one line negative response I have gotten.

[Harleydude666]

That was the most unimaginative one line negative response I have gotten.

Trust me, read what you wrote, you deserve it

[Moon Knight]

Trust me, read what you wrote, you deserve it

Agreed. That post was horrendous.

[sandrock74]

Agreed. That post was horrendous.

I'm with the Moony one.

[AcesandEights]

Please, let's focus on tonight's episode and not bait or snipe.

I'm hoping to see some fireworks tonight...please no dud season finale, AMC!

[Trencher]

Trust me, read what you wrote, you deserve it

All I hear from you is crying and whining, tell me what you did not like about it please.

[Zombie Snack]

That was about the most preposterous combination of drivel I have ever read

LOL...That was written like a bowl of spaghetti.

[JonOfTheShred]

That's some cliffhanger they're leaving us on for 7 months. Fuuuuck. Most of the band is back together, but wonder where Tyrese, Carol and the baby are.

Nice throat bite.

[Staredge]

Decent episode.........SHITTY excuse for a season finale. WTF?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? Mediocre excuse for aid-season finale.

[bassman]

Great episode. Loved the ending.

It was also nice to see quite a few comic moments in there for the fans. I'm very pleased with the cliffhanger. Although I half expected them to throw in the "we are the walking dead!" line instead of the final closing line we did get.

[AcesandEights]

Well written, well acted and executed...except it needed to last longer and have some sort of payoff other than the neck bite and getting (most) of the gang together.

My only quibbles otherwise are the waste of throwing in the guy who got tore down (must have been hurt or exhausted) and the idea of 'herding' Rick &co. as far as they did throughout Terminus. It seemed kind of obvious and you would think it would have more likely bogged down into a attempt at a fire fight or a search of the second building they entered (that seemed less wide open and trap-like, as compared to the first freight house they entered).

Oh, well...roll on GoT.

[rongravy]

I watched it whilst finishing up cooking, and eating, spinach stuffed chicken breasts and stuff...
I enjoyed it, but I'm wondering if it was Beth being offered up for dinner.
I still need to rewatch this again tonight, but I'm also going to rewatch last week's. My kid said Carol and Tyreese hadn't made it to Terminus yet, so it's gotta be Beth.
Stick a fork in her, she's done...

[facestabber]

Hell of a season gents. And as always I thoroughly enjoy the commentary from this forum. Friggin October!!!!

[sandrock74]

We needed the reveal of...
Beth burgers
for all to add some punch to the end of the episode and increase the sense of overall danger and dread. As it stands right now, it doesn't seem like something inescapable to me. I mean, next time they open the train door, everyone should swarm it en masse. That would negate the threat of the snipers, who should be hesitant to open fire on their own people. It's obvious that they are wanted to be kept alive, so suddenly attacking with all 12 people would tip things into their favor. Besides that, still no sign of Carol and Tyreese, who we know are headed to Terminus, so, you know, potential reinforcements.

Tyreese could buddy up with the "Termites" (Andrew Linclon's description) as a handyman/carpenter who likes to use his hammer and Carol could become their gardener, planting pretty flowers for everyone to look at...

[facestabber]

My gut tells me tyrese and Carol observed this capture from the perimeter.

[AcesandEights]

My gut tells me tyrese and Carol observed this capture from the perimeter.
Probably a good even money bet, I'd guess.

[Moon Knight]

Much better than last years finale and intense as hell. I'll offer up my thoughts tomorrow. Still need to take it all in. The ending was great but damn what a tease, I knew it!

Great seeing Hershel again. He'll be missed next season.

[ProfessorChaos]

We needed the reveal of...
Beth burgers
for all to add some punch to the end of the episode and increase the sense of overall danger and dread.

totally agree. seems they spent too much time on flashbacks, and i get what they were trying to do there, but the finale just fell flat for me, like most of the last half of the season, truth be told. it was a decent episode, but really didn't deliver in the ways i hoped it would, and i guess the same could be said for the whole back half.....aside from "the grove", no episodes really left me on a high since they left the prison....and a couple had some really craptacular moments that had me rolling my eyes.

hate to toot my own horn, but i had a suspicion that nobody from the main group would end up biting the dust. nice to see most of the group reunited, and it will be interesting to see how they get out of the jam, but i think i'm going to go back to watching them all in one go at the end of the season rather than tuning in every week. watching this show on a week-to-week basis isn't really the best way to take it in, in my opinion.

a better finale than last season, but not as strong as the ending to seasons one or two in my book.

EDIT: and bravo to amc for some epic trolling of all their fans, first by vetoing the resounding "no" majority vote (something like 70% to 30% in favor of no) on their bullshit fan-romance crap, and even better, how about that marketing campaign for the so-called finale?

http://media.comicbook.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/maggie-terminus-the-walking-dead.jpg

EVERYBODY!!!!!!!!!

http://wwwwwwwww.at/trolls/i/src/13276396029.gif

at least there's still the telltale games series, which continues to impress on every episode....

[Trencher]

Yeeeahh! Michonne lives!
Good episode some hollywoody things but not too dire. I still have some small hope for Beth since I doubt that the hunters have the ability or courage to drive around in zombie country looking for people to pick up.

[Legion2213]

I enjoyed that a lot!

A new walker to marvel at (run over zombie)

Rick with probably the best kill of the season (throat bite)

Rick with most sustained brutal kill of the season (multiple frenzied shanking of child rapist guy)

Rick telling Daryl he was his brother seemed right and wasn't as corny as it should have been.

Cage full of human skeletons/butchered carcass's - Super awesome!

The group running past containers with people crying for help inside them - chilling

Beth still out there with creepy mortician person IMO. Probably chained up in his basement or something.

Expected Joe's gang to last into S5, totally wrong there, I'll kinda miss Joe, he was a good character.

Agree that Carol and Tyreese must have seen the abduction, otherwise, they are just walking into a trap themselves and it would be hard to engineer a believable escape for the group next season.

The whole episode really worked for me...now all I need is a time machine to fast forward to Season 5!

Edit: Daryl and Michonne really need to be packing some firearms for human encounters, they were horribly outgunned in that standoff, "D" with one chance to fire a bolt and "M" with no chance of taking anybody down at all, she offered no threat to those people, only Rick & Carl with any chance of defending the group there...they deffo need to be packing a sidearm next season.

[Zombie Snack]

Great episode to end by far my favorite season to date.

[MinionZombie]

My gut tells me tyrese and Carol observed this capture from the perimeter.

Yeah, with all that gunfire, I'd imagine Ty & Carol & Judith rocked up just as the fire fight started - so it makes it seem obvious the place isn't safe, so they do a look over the place, and perhaps see their team getting captured - and where they've been put ... how they stage a rescue, only they know, but I can't wait to see!


Great episode to end by far my favorite season to date.

Yep, this has been an excellent season and the most consistent of all of them. Well done Gimple & Co! :cool:

Hell of a wait, but I'm glad our group is (almost entirely) joined up once more ... even if it is in dire circumstances.

Tense as hell episode in general. I'm glad they didn't do anything bold-but-stupid like kill off Rick ... but I was getting nervous with moments like him showing Carl how to trap rabbits.

The attack of Joe's gang was gripping as well - and oof, the threat over Carl was scary as all get out. That said:

Comics reference:
When that happened in the comic, Carl was - and still is - much younger than his TV show counterpart, and it went a little bit further and was really disturbing.

Rick unleashed the beast, but who could blame him?

I liked the flashbacks to the early days of the prison - the contrast between setting up their home and losing it, putting down your arms to grow food and lead in a different way and then having to go ballistic on a despicable gang of thugs, the stark contrast in Carl versus Patrick (adept gun cleaning versus the joy of Lego) etc ... the latter also ties in with Carl & Michonne's conversation, which was a nice way to tie her experience with what Rick had just done, and why they went to the places they did, but how they can still come back, but what I also thought was chilling was Carl confessing to "thoughts" ... very vague at this point, but that's interesting food for thought for season 5 perhaps. A young boy going through puberty - hormones all over the shop, trying to figure out the world, trying to survive in the apocalypse ... that's gotta throw up some dark thoughts ... the things you could do and most likely get away with ... disturbing stuff to consider.

So it wasn't some big grand finale - we had the 'big bang' in the mid-season finale ... this is more leaving us with lots to look forward to in season five, and really, many season finales go that way - they goad us with something to wait for, so fair enough. I thought it worked very well thematically, too, for the reasons laid out above.

[bassman]

I loved the forshadowing of what happens at Terminus with Rick's rabbit trap. He basically describes the ending of the episode right there. Also, in a blink and you'll miss it sort of way, as the group is being chased and "shot at" through the Terminus complex, you can see A's painted on every door they go through. So if they were lead to train car A, it makes you wonder what's going on in train car B?

Someone also mentioned to me(I missed it), that apparently you can hear a slight hint of The Governor's theme during Rick's final line and the light coming through the train door casts a shadow onto Rick's face that looks just like an eye patch. I haven't gone back to check this myself, but thought it was interesting if true.

[facestabber]

Minion, it took you longer than usual to respond, I was getting worried.

Season 4 has been a great ride. The evolution of Rick Grimes has been drastic. From the guy in season 1 that goes back to the park to mercy kill bicycle zombie to a man who bites another mans throat out. Completely justified might I add. Makes me wonder if Shane would finally approve of Rick. Shane understood earlier on about the level of ruthless a person needs. Cant say I agreed with Shane's approach often but I think Rick has evolved to what Shane was wishing/hoping he would. Its a shame to because the thought of this Rick teamed up with Shane would be a damn dangerous duo. Well as long as Lori wasnt around as a distraction.

As mentioned above and repeated by many here including myself. Michonne's Katana and Daryl's crossbow are useless against armed men. I realize they are trademarks of the character but I hope it comes to an end. Well Michonne's Katana is easy enough to carry while toting a firearm of some sort. And it is very useful to dispatch Walkers without using all to rare bullets. But the crossbow needs to end if Daryl wants to contribute out on the road. Certified Daryl Dixon fan here but I hope the crossbow is confiscated and smashed by the termites and Daryl picks up an AK after slaughtering those sick fuckers.

Michonne. She is now human. I think she needed to tell someone about Andre's death to help herself heal just as much as Carl needed to hear the story. Andre's fate was unneccessary and avoidable. As a parent I can see giving up. We finally can see where her hesitation and silence was rooted. Took me awhile to like her in season 3 but I dont wish to see her die. She is as tough as any guy there. I love the way Danai plays her.

[AcesandEights]

Someone also mentioned to me(I missed it), that apparently you can hear a slight hint of The Governor's theme during Rick's final line and the light coming through the train door casts a shadow onto Rick's face that looks just like an eye patch. I haven't gone back to check this myself, but thought it was interesting if true.

Reaaaally!? That'd be a cool touch.

Now that's worth a second viewing to verify. Thanks for the tip off, Bassman.

[MinionZombie]

I loved the forshadowing of what happens at Terminus with Rick's rabbit trap. He basically describes the ending of the episode right there. Also, in a blink and you'll miss it sort of way, as the group is being chased and "shot at" through the Terminus complex, you can see A's painted on every door they go through. So if they were lead to train car A, it makes you wonder what's going on in train car B?

Someone also mentioned to me(I missed it), that apparently you can hear a slight hint of The Governor's theme during Rick's final line and the light coming through the train door casts a shadow onto Rick's face that looks just like an eye patch. I haven't gone back to check this myself, but thought it was interesting if true.

1) In the chaos of being shot at you'd not have time to figure out you were being forced in a particular direction, necessarily, and just want to get the hell out of there, but I did notice the letter "A" written along their 'path' ... I hadn't thought of the foreshadowing with the rabbit trap, so good catch on that! I love the amount of foreshadowing going on in this season - it shows they've thought long and hard, across the entire season, about this story and have drip-fed little glimpses and hints of things to come.

2) It must be a sort of remix of The Governor's theme, but yeah, listening closely, I can sense the vibe of it seeping through. Whether it was intentional or not, I'm not sure, but Rick's right eye is definitely hidden in shadow ... so yeah, it could very well be intentional (not seen Talking Dead yet, so maybe they say on there).


Minion, it took you longer than usual to respond, I was getting worried.

As mentioned above and repeated by many here including myself. Michonne's Katana and Daryl's crossbow are useless against armed men. I realize they are trademarks of the character but I hope it comes to an end. Well Michonne's Katana is easy enough to carry while toting a firearm of some sort. And it is very useful to dispatch Walkers without using all to rare bullets. But the crossbow needs to end if Daryl wants to contribute out on the road. Certified Daryl Dixon fan here but I hope the crossbow is confiscated and smashed by the termites and Daryl picks up an AK after slaughtering those sick fuckers.

hehe ... I was out shopping for a new suit (a friend's wedding is coming up soon and I need a new one) ... didn't have the right size combo in stock though, so will have to try another outlet.

Yeah, their weapons are iconic to the characters, and I understand people having their signature weapons that they're comfortable with, but they do need to give Daryl and Michonne a good backup for these sorts of scenarios - perhaps this will be a learning experience for them?

...

As for Beth ... I'm not so convinced she's been taken by the 'Terminites' (haha, I love that name for them) ... the car she was driven away in had a cross on the rear window, so I'm thinking it's someone entirely different ... some sort of religious nutjob ... maybe someone who turns out to be okay, but whose M.O. isn't exactly sane.

Yeah - the squashed walker was awesome too. I love that they're still finding cool and unique zombie scenarios for these walkers. There's a little story to them, as well as a sweet-arse bit of effects work on show. :cool:

...

TWD 4x16 Memes:
http://deadshed.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/rippin-throats-edition-walking-dead.html

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-00i3y05fAQA/Uzm3mYkQ_hI/AAAAAAAAC3w/1oVVkD9nRCA/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Damn_You_Robert_Kir kman_Cliffhanger_4x16_DeadShed.jpg

Tagged the others so that they don't force everyone to do a lot of additional scrolling.



http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-uf9QhhpAYW4/Uzm3li0lQJI/AAAAAAAAC3c/uLfx3DHhx18/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Bloody_Rick_That_Fe eling_Another_Season_TWD_Over_4x16_DeadShed.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-qyDjFrvJlRs/Uzm3o9dFHaI/AAAAAAAAC4M/HkQgp8u4OPA/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Rick_MacGruber_Thro at_Rip_Bite_Joe_4x16_DeadShed.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/--diVDiXWPyU/Uzm3oFCaYRI/AAAAAAAAC4E/2UlVzXrkrnU/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Rick_Hershel_Farm_L and_Play_Lego_4x16_DeadShed.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3Q8T6d8yRug/Uzm3mXqoGEI/AAAAAAAAC38/TVENRi1TSIo/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Judith_Rambo_Rescue _4x16_DeadShed.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nwic9ZRKkl0/Uzm5mM5NbGI/AAAAAAAAC4g/vQzbdH6uF20/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Rick_Pretty_Stupid_ Find_Out_Season_5_Troll_Face_4x16_B_DeadShed.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-CRavEtzY6nI/Uzm3neMITPI/AAAAAAAAC34/X0nosRIDjX0/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Patrick_Apocalypse_ Never_Too_Old_Play_Lego_4x16_DeadShed.jpg



:)

[JDFP]

Gotta comment on it since I haven't seen anyone else mention it - and the inner-nerd inside of me is loving it.

Anyone else notice that Mary is played by Tasha Yar / Sela (Denise Crosby) from Star Trek The Next Generation?

I'm hoping she'll have a greater role in the next season as she's a fine actress and I'd love to see her really have an opportunity to shine on the show before Rick no doubt finally finds a way to blow her head off (not a spoiler, just speculation on my behalf). Would absolutely love to see her become a "regular" character on the show and see what all she'd bring to the series!

1313

j.p.

[facestabber]

Gotta comment on it since I haven't seen anyone else mention it - and the inner-nerd inside of me is loving it.

Anyone else notice that Mary is played by Tasha Yar / Sela (Denise Crosby) from Star Trek The Next Generation?

I'm hoping she'll have a greater role in the next season as she's a fine actress and I'd love to see her really have an opportunity to shine on the show before Rick no doubt finally finds a way to blow her head off (not a spoiler, just speculation on my behalf). Would absolutely love to see her become a "regular" character on the show and see what all she'd bring to the series!

1313

j.p.

Did you not watch last weeks episode when she was introduced? People immediately mentioned her stardom. No disrespect to any fandom but I can't wait till Mary and everyone else at Terminus is annihilated. Violently.

[JDFP]

Did you not watch last weeks episode when she was introduced? People immediately mentioned her stardom. No disrespect to any fandom but I can't wait till Mary and everyone else at Terminus is annihilated. Violently.

Well shit no, that would have required that I read last week's thread which I woefully did not. I don't stop by HPotD as much as I used to anymore. I should come by more often.

I left a Olde English sitting on a table here in the forums a couple years ago - anyone seen it? Room temperature doesn't bother me, it's a sin to let a good beer go to waste.


j.p.

[AcesandEights]

Hey, J.P.! How you been, man?




I left a Olde English sitting on a table here in the forums a couple years ago - anyone seen it?
Neil's still here. :D

[Moon Knight]

The flashbacks really worked for me during this finale; almost sad and touching at the same time. Discovering how and Rick became a farmer and how much influence Hershel really had on Rick. Watching Patrick build Legos compared and mirrored to Carl build back a gun was brilliant. The way they transitioned into the present was really well done.

Guess I was wrong about Joe but dammit he was a cool character. I really liked Joe's group as they added something pretty unique to the show; interesting rules and great street smarts in this zombie apocalypse considering they were the only ones to stay far away from Terminus.

Rick's brutality was great and him calling Daryl his brother was even better. Glad Rick gutted that bastard like he did. "He's mine."

The foreshadowing this season has been marvelous. Tons of cool Easter eggs and many of the classic moments beautifully translated onto the screen.

I kinda agree AMC trolled the shit out I everybody with that misleading tagline and promotion. However, even though no one actually died on our side, I just loved the ending. Pretty amazing even though we got a PG version of one of Rick's classic lines.

The tension was great and the show presented us with a very different type of season finale and I'm ok with that. Everyone thought the producers were gonna try and be bold by killing Daryl or even Rick himself; but it appears we got a totally different set of balls and I think it's awesome.

[Publius]

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-00i3y05fAQA/Uzm3mYkQ_hI/AAAAAAAAC3w/1oVVkD9nRCA/s1600/The_Walking_Dead_Season_4_Meme_Damn_You_Robert_Kir kman_Cliffhanger_4x16_DeadShed.jpg


Cliffhanger! Chosen because it co-starred Michael Rooker, of course! ;)

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I don't stop by HPotD as much as I used to anymore. I should come by more often.


Yes you should. Good to see you, JP.

- - - Updated - - -



Neil's still here. :D
Well played, sir.

[MinionZombie]

Cliffhanger! Chosen because it co-starred Michael Rooker, of course! ;)

A nice easter egg to go along with it, aye. :cool:

Just thinking about it - another similarity to The Governor for Rick - TG bit off two of Merle's fingers, turned to camera and spat them out ... Rick bit Joe's throat, turned to camera and spat the gore out.

I'm thinking there's gonna be some dark shit bubbling up to the surface for the likes of Rick and Carl in season 5.

*EDIT*

What did people think of the creepy room with all the names on the floor and candles etc? Do you think those were people they've lost - family members etc - like it's a shrine? Or, is it a weird shrine to the people they've eaten? Thoughts?

I wonder if we'll get a look inside those containers and find people with limbs cut off and the wounds sewn up ... kinda like in "The Road" ... *little bit of sick came up just then*

[bassman]

I kinda agree AMC trolled the shit out I everybody with that misleading tagline and promotion. However, even though no one actually died on our side, I just loved the ending. Pretty amazing even though we got a PG version of one of Rick's classic lines.

They said on Talking Dead that they actually filmed the "R-rated" version of the line but decided not to use it. I don't see why not? Breaking Bad dropped one or two f-bombs a season. Of course the sound would've dropped out when he said it during the prime time premiere(like they did on BB), but it would've been heard in all it's glory on blu ray...



What did people think of the creepy room with all the names on the floor and candles etc? Do you think those were people they've lost - family members etc - like it's a shrine? Or, is it a weird shrine to the people they've eaten? Thoughts?

With the candles and personal items scattered about, I was thinking it was a shrine to the people they had "sacrificed". Maybe they're not exactly happy about what they're doing, but have gone to that extreme because of "never again"(painted on walls)?



I wonder if we'll get a look inside those containers and find people with limbs cut off and the wounds sewn up ... kinda like in "The Road" ... *little bit of sick came up just then*

I must've missed it, but I've had others tell me that when the group is being herded through Terminus, they pass by another train car and you can hear a woman screaming "help us!". Not sure if it was train car B or something else. I need to watch the episode again to try and catch these little details I must've missed in the excitement.

[shootemindehead]

...the finale just fell flat for me

Yeh, me too. I wasn't that impressed with it. It needed to be a double episode.


and bravo to amc...by vetoing the resounding "no" majority vote (something like 70% to 30% in favor of no) on their [B]bullshit fan-romance crap[/B


Wha choo talkin bout Willis????

- - - Updated - - -


Gotta comment on it since I haven't seen anyone else mention it - and the inner-nerd inside of me is loving it.

Anyone else notice that Mary is played by Tasha Yar / Sela (Denise Crosby) from Star Trek The Next Generation?

Yeh, way ahead of ya.

http://forum.homepageofthedead.com/showthread.php?t=22178&page=3&p=305118&viewfull=1#post305118

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I really like Joe; such a cool character.


I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.


He doesn't seem as phony as The Governor did.


http://www.seabythecity.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/told-ya.jpg

[Moon Knight]

Yeh, me too. I wasn't that impressed with it. It needed to be a double episode.



Wha choo talkin bout Willis????

- - - Updated - - -



Yeh, way ahead of ya.

http://forum.homepageofthedead.com/showthread.php?t=22178&page=3&p=305118&viewfull=1#post305118

- - - Updated - - -

http://www.seabythecity.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/told-ya.jpg

You, sir, were right. Anyone who would let another man sexually assault another human bieng; especially a child, deserved what he got. Still, Joe was an interesting character.

[ProfessorChaos]

@ shootem:

over here in the states, during commercial breaks they had this fucking stupid series of commercials aimed at all the "2-screen experience" tools who can't put down their laptops and tablets during the show. the adverts featured a guy and a girl, and they had several of them, covering their first date (TWD-viewing date at one of their apartments, of course), going to TWD-themed parties together, dressed up as walkers, pictures of them with hearts drawn on it saying "just like glenn and maggie"etc......corny shit, a love-fest between two TWD uber-fans, you get the idea.......

anyhow, the last commercial before the midseason finale showed the guy getting down on one knee and bringing out a severed hand prop with a ring on it and proposing to the girl. it then told fans to go online and vote in the poll as to whether she would say yes or no. just to be the jerk than i am, i decided to get online and vote "no", and apparently a lot of other folks thought it was a lame idea, too, as the voting was almost 70% no, 30% yes. they said they would reveal the answer during the season finale.

well, during the "finale", they showed a commercial with the uber-fan doofus guy sitting around moping in his apartment (wearing his walking dead shirt, no doubt), and he's got his tablet out, and all his social media buddies are messaging him, telling him all this crap about how it's her loss, forget her, etc. out of nowhere, he hears the theme music from TWD, then he looks outside and the chick is outside, doing her best john cusack in "say anything" moment, complete with trench coat even, with her tablet blaring the music with a message wrote on the screen: "i should have said YES". the couple then reconcile and he puts his arm around her and they begin to walk back inside, presumably to masturbate together while watching their favorite show.

just kinda irks me that even though the vast majority of voters showed how silly polls and shit like this can be, amc flipped the script and had them live happily ever after, to go on and reproduce and make little uber-fans who are going to be even more enthusiastic about this show than MZ is.;)

as for the episode, i think this would have been a great one to have right before the finale. the finale could have been more action-oriented and shocking by having rick's group finding out beth was being served for dinner, then planning to escape, barely making it out, but not before losing a couple of regulars in the process, then re-grouping outside of terminus and rick then saying something along the lines of the terminus folks fucking with the wrong people. that would have been a much more satisfying finale, in my opinion.

[MinionZombie]

I must've missed it, but I've had others tell me that when the group is being herded through Terminus, they pass by another train car and you can hear a woman screaming "help us!". Not sure if it was train car B or something else. I need to watch the episode again to try and catch these little details I must've missed in the excitement.

Yeah, the voices came from a shipping container. The group heard the voices, but couldn't do anything about it in the chaos ... so I'd imagine they'll open them up sometime in season 5 and we'll see what nastiness is hiding behind there.

Grim stuff.

The "Terminites" are just too damn lazy to do their own shopping. :p

Prof - I just don't think Beth is at Terminus. The car in which she was spirited away had a big cross on the rear window, so I'm assuming it's someone entirely different that's got her. Besides, at that point, there was still a fair distance to go to get to Terminus, and those Terminites don't seem too keen on anything other than home delivery. :D

[Legion2213]

They said on Talking Dead that they actually filmed the "R-rated" version of the line but decided not to use it. I don't see why not? Breaking Bad dropped one or two f-bombs a season. Of course the sound would've dropped out when he said it during the prime time premiere(like they did on BB), but it would've been heard in all it's glory on blu ray...



With the candles and personal items scattered about, I was thinking it was a shrine to the people they had "sacrificed". Maybe they're not exactly happy about what they're doing, but have gone to that extreme because of "never again"(painted on walls)?



I must've missed it, but I've had others tell me that when the group is being herded through Terminus, they pass by another train car and you can hear a woman screaming "help us!". Not sure if it was train car B or something else. I need to watch the episode again to try and catch these little details I must've missed in the excitement.

Pretty sure the screams came from the big shipping containers they ran past...looks like Terminus is well stocked for winter! :eek:

And yes, the shrine room was intriguing, I'm not sure they would dedicate such a space to cattle/livestock though, and they claim to have been there since the outbreak, so plenty of time to lose a few dozen of their own people.

[shootemindehead]

You, sir, were right. Anyone who would let another man sexually assault another human bieng; especially a child, deserved what he got. Still, Joe was an interesting character.

Aye, he was that. It's kind of a pity he had to get throat surgery though. He would have made a great bad guy for next season. They may have missed a trick there.

- - - Updated - - -


@ shootem:

over here in the states, during commercial breaks they had this fucking stupid series of commercials aimed at all the "2-screen experience" tools who can't put down their laptops and tablets during the show. the adverts featured a guy and a girl, and they had several of them, covering their first date (TWD-viewing date at one of their apartments, of course), going to TWD-themed parties together, dressed up as walkers, pictures of them with hearts drawn on it saying "just like glenn and maggie"etc......corny shit, a love-fest between two TWD uber-fans, you get the idea.......

anyhow, the last commercial before the midseason finale showed the guy getting down on one knee and bringing out a severed hand prop with a ring on it and proposing to the girl. it then told fans to go online and vote in the poll as to whether she would say yes or no. just to be the jerk than i am, i decided to get online and vote "no", and apparently a lot of other folks thought it was a lame idea, too, as the voting was almost 70% no, 30% yes. they said they would reveal the answer during the season finale.

well, during the "finale", they showed a commercial with the uber-fan doofus guy sitting around moping in his apartment (wearing his walking dead shirt, no doubt), and he's got his tablet out, and all his social media buddies are messaging him, telling him all this crap about how it's her loss, forget her, etc. out of nowhere, he hears the theme music from TWD, then he looks outside and the chick is outside, doing her best john cusack in "say anything" moment, complete with trench coat even, with her tablet blaring the music with a message wrote on the screen: "i should have said YES". the couple then reconcile and he puts his arm around her and they begin to walk back inside, presumably to masturbate together while watching their favorite show.

just kinda irks me that even though the vast majority of voters showed how silly polls and shit like this can be, amc flipped the script and had them live happily ever after, to go on and reproduce and make little uber-fans who are going to be even more enthusiastic about this show than MZ is.;)

There's just no emoticon for how shite that is.


as for the episode, i think this would have been a great one to have right before the finale. the finale could have been more action-oriented and shocking by having rick's group finding out beth was being served for dinner, then planning to escape, barely making it out, but not before losing a couple of regulars in the process, then re-grouping outside of terminus and rick then saying something along the lines of the terminus folks fucking with the wrong people. that would have been a much more satisfying finale, in my opinion.

Agree completely. It's like the writers ran out of paper.

Anyway, it'll be back on in October. In my experience, the older I'm getting the quicker time is flying by, so, it'll be here before I know it.

[DayoftheZ]

Hi folks first post.

I thought it was a satisfying end to series 4 but with one minor issue. I liked the flash backs to happier times at the prison but there was slightly too many for my taste. I loved the part when Rick was spotting belongings from Glen, Maggie and the others in the possession of the Fine Young Cannibals. The whole scene with Joe vs Rick was fantastic and the instant mini-evolution of Rick should give some major forward motion for future episodes and seasons. He knows what type of person he needs to be to keep Carl alive and he isn't afraid to step across boundaries that in series one and two he would have frowned at. I would love to see how he would deal with Randall now.

One thing I did notice with this episode is just how much is cut in the UK version. For the first time I watched US pace because I suspected spoilers would be all over social media and I noticed some pretty key parts missing from the UK version that really add to the episode. The walker victim who Carl tried to save had his face removed in the US version which was cut, and there was additional stuff in the Rick vs Hunters scene, particularly the attempted assault on Carl.

I just wonder what else has been taken out in four series prior.

[Trancelikestate]

Has anyone ever seen "The First Power"? It's a Lou Diamond-Philipps flick about a killer who posses people and continues killing. Not all the great but my bro and I loved it as kids. Anyhow, Joe plays the killer Patrick Channing. My bro and I have always liked him and even my bro said "I wish Joe would stick around." Though I knew he wouldn't. Forgive me if that was pointed out. Like JP I've not been reading every thread.

Ruthless as Rick may have become he still isn't as ruthless as he needs to be. What I mean by that is after he grabs the kid with Hershel's watch he waits to long to shoot him. I'd give you one chance to answer and when I don't like it... POP! Sure that may have left him a bit exposed but it would show you mean business. Ahhh. Lets all just go on a binder till October haha.

[Moon Knight]

Hi folks first post.

I thought it was a satisfying end to series 4 but with one minor issue. I liked the flash backs to happier times at the prison but there was slightly too many for my taste. I loved the part when Rick was spotting belongings from Glen, Maggie and the others in the possession of the Fine Young Cannibals. The whole scene with Joe vs Rick was fantastic and the instant mini-evolution of Rick should give some major forward motion for future episodes and seasons. He knows what type of person he needs to be to keep Carl alive and he isn't afraid to step across boundaries that in series one and two he would have frowned at. I would love to see how he would deal with Randall now.

One thing I did notice with this episode is just how much is cut in the UK version. For the first time I watched US pace because I suspected spoilers would be all over social media and I noticed some pretty key parts missing from the UK version that really add to the episode. The walker victim who Carl tried to save had his face removed in the US version which was cut, and there was additional stuff in the Rick vs Hunters scene, particularly the attempted assault on Carl.

I just wonder what else has been taken out in four series prior.

Welcome aboard.

- - - Updated - - -


Has anyone ever seen "The First Power"? It's a Lou Diamond-Philipps flick about a killer who posses people and continues killing. Not all the great but my bro and I loved it as kids. Anyhow, Joe plays the killer Patrick Channing. My bro and I have always liked him and even my bro said "I wish Joe would stick around." Though I knew he wouldn't. Forgive me if that was pointed out. Like JP I've not been reading every thread.

Ruthless as Rick may have become he still isn't as ruthless as he needs to be. What I mean by that is after he grabs the kid with Hershel's watch he waits to long to shoot him. I'd give you one chance to answer and when I don't like it... POP! Sure that may have left him a bit exposed but it would show you mean business. Ahhh. Lets all just go on a binder till October haha.

Yeah, Jeff Kober is great. He really made Joe a great character.

[facestabber]

Has anyone ever seen "The First Power"? It's a Lou Diamond-Philipps flick about a killer who posses people and continues killing. Not all the great but my bro and I loved it as kids. Anyhow, Joe plays the killer Patrick Channing. My bro and I have always liked him and even my bro said "I wish Joe would stick around." Though I knew he wouldn't. Forgive me if that was pointed out. Like JP I've not been reading every thread.

Ruthless as Rick may have become he still isn't as ruthless as he needs to be. What I mean by that is after he grabs the kid with Hershel's watch he waits to long to shoot him. I'd give you one chance to answer and when I don't like it... POP! Sure that may have left him a bit exposed but it would show you mean business. Ahhh. Lets all just go on a binder till October haha.

Thank god someone knew that movie, "the first power". I couldn't remember the title but that performance by Kober creeped me out.

Rick needed to use the guy as cover. I'd assume that's why he didn't shoot right away. Let's face it, if Rick splattered the dudes brain he would have died a half second later.

[AcesandEights]

Has anyone ever seen "The First Power"? It's a Lou Diamond-Philipps...
Wow, TLS...you just gave me a free trip back in time for a moment there. I hadn't thought about that film in awhile. I wonder if it's on Netflix.

- - - Updated - - -


Hi folks first post.
Welcome, DotZ!


One thing I did notice with this episode is just how much is cut in the UK version. For the first time I watched US pace because I suspected spoilers would be all over social media and I noticed some pretty key parts missing from the UK version that really add to the episode. The walker victim who Carl tried to save had his face removed in the US version which was cut, and there was additional stuff in the Rick vs Hunters scene, particularly the attempted assault on Carl.

I just wonder what else has been taken out in four series prior.
I was totally unaware of this (or have completely forgotten because I'm getting old). Maybe our UK friends here can clue us in.

[DayoftheZ]

Welcome, DotZ!


I was totally unaware of this (or have completely forgotten because I'm getting old). Maybe our UK friends here can clue us in.

Thanks to all for the welcome. Aces, I know there were some cuts in the first series but I hadn't kept track of any since.

Edit:- I am just watching the repeat now and its on an hour later and all the cut bits are back in it, how bizarre!! I always watch it at nine so wonder if they have cut stuff out before?

These are the parts cut from last nights 9pm version.

From this episode its quite apparent were the cuts are to me because it feels a little disjointed. For example the stranger getting taken down by walkers had his face pretty graphically removed but in our UK version its cut and Rick, Michonne and Carl look shocked but we didn't really get to see why. The next scene I noticed was when Joe's henchman was inning down Carl he turned him and started taking his own belt off, that was fully cut (now I can live without that if I am honest because its maybe a step too far) but it did leave it a little open to interpretation what the henchman's intentions were. After that there was a couple of seconds cut from Rick revenge attach on said henchman which made Carl's horrified / relieved / grateful look more powerful.

I'm sure over the four series there were countless cuts.

[Doc]

as for the episode, i think this would have been a great one to have right before the finale. the finale could have been more action-oriented and shocking by having rick's group finding out beth was being served for dinner,


I'm actually very glad that didn't happened! Season 3 had a bunch of telegraphed deaths that this is one aspect of Season 4 that really impressed me. The last two seasons had the shitty habit of killing off any one who gained any ounce of depth and killed them off after five minutes of knowing them. I feared that this would happened to Beth Especially, after having an entire episode dedicated to her in 'Still'. I really thought that it was going to be a prelude to Beth's death, but thankfully the writers of this season have done everything they could to refute all the mishaps of the Mazzara era of Walking Dead.

[MoonSylver]

Yeah, "First Power" one of the things I always think of when I think of Kober, though the guy has played the heavy in a ton of stuff. Oddly enough I had just seen him earlier in the day in the Vin Disel flick "A Man Apart" (& commented on his numerous appearances), when he turned up later in the night for the first time on TWD. That's when I knew we'd see that character again. ;)

Shame they didn't keep him around. He would've made a good ongoing heavy. Sort of a more brutal & less refined Governor. I loved the melt down he started having when Darryl "lied"...the guys whole concept of "rules" was facinating in a twisted way. :)

[facestabber]

Welcome DayoftheZ. This is a great forum with some intelligent minds.

Speaking of which where the hell is Wylde?

[AcesandEights]

Speaking of which where the hell is Wylde?

Good question....We need some Wyldness in this thread, stat!

[zombieparanoia]

I thought it was a good episode overall, I thought the part where rick snaps was good, that they did recon on terminus was good, the flashbacks were good for exposition. There were only a couple things I didn't like.

Why is it that characters in the show always seem to get "shocked" by acts of violence? Carls reaction to Rick saving him from getting ass raped seemed like Loris reaction to Rick saying he killed Shane(because she told him to) I mean, Carl flat out executed a kid not so far back, his dad going crazytown bananapants on a guy trying to rape his son seems pretty justified.

So they recon the place but didn't see any gunmen on the roofs but when they get herded out form the courtyard there are at least half a dozen men with guns in place including out by the train yard where they came in and clearly had a view of the roofs from?

Where did all the gunmen outside the fence come from? That's where the group came in from and they clearly didn't see anyone out there, not even uber tracker Daryl noticed anyone.

When they were getting herded, they kept going "oh, they shut the door, guess we can't go that way now." Why not kick a door in? Or shoot through the door, you know theres someone on the other side.

[Moon Knight]

Carl was almost raped. I think him being in shock is quite justified.

[shootemindehead]

And his dad just ripped some guys throat out...




...with his face.


Even I was a bit shocked.

[zombieparanoia]

Ok, if you're saying the shock was from the attempted rape, sure, I can buy that. I thought they were selling more as a reaction to how his dad saved basically everyone. because that to me is ludicrous. "Oh hey, I know those guys were going to rape and murder all of us, but did you have to be so mean?" :duh:

I just don't buy that. Not in a post apocalyptic world where you've seen and done the things these people have. Not even in the real world. Imagine you're sitting at home, a group of thugs busts in and threatens to rape and kill basically your whole family. Suddenly, your dad proceeds to use swift and blinding violence to stop them. Are you going to not talk to him? Sulk? be all "I can't believe you just did that, that was horrible of you"?

Because if you would, maybe you should have just seen how it would have played out with the other guys.

[DayoftheZ]

I just don't buy that. Not in a post apocalyptic world where you've seen and done the things these people have. Not even in the real world. Imagine you're sitting at home, a group of thugs busts in and threatens to rape and kill basically your whole family. Suddenly, your dad proceeds to use swift and blinding violence to stop them. Are you going to not talk to him? Sulk? be all "I can't believe you just did that, that was horrible of you"?

Because if you would, maybe you should have just seen how it would have played out with the other guys.

I’m not sure it was just shocked, in the comic during the same scene Carl basically had a “you deserved that” look. In this episode Carl looked shocked at first but then I read it as him being glad to see the potential rapist get what he deserved. I thought the expression on his face changed very slightly during the scene. Also if he was just shocked wouldn’t he have turned his face away from what was happening like even Daryl did?

Just my take, though maybe I am reading way too much into it!!!:D

[Neil]

I watched it whilst finishing up cooking, and eating, spinach stuffed chicken breasts and stuff...
I enjoyed it, but I'm wondering if it was Beth being offered up for dinner.
I still need to rewatch this again tonight, but I'm also going to rewatch last week's. My kid said Carol and Tyreese hadn't made it to Terminus yet, so it's gotta be Beth.
Stick a fork in her, she's done...

There's lots of other folks being held. You heard them calling from other containers...

- - - Updated - - -


Thanks to all for the welcome. Aces, I know there were some cuts in the first series but I hadn't kept track of any since.

Edit:- I am just watching the repeat now and its on an hour later and all the cut bits are back in it, how bizarre!! I always watch it at nine so wonder if they have cut stuff out before?

These are the parts cut from last nights 9pm version.

From this episode its quite apparent were the cuts are to me because it feels a little disjointed. For example the stranger getting taken down by walkers had his face pretty graphically removed but in our UK version its cut and Rick, Michonne and Carl look shocked but we didn't really get to see why. The next scene I noticed was when Joe's henchman was inning down Carl he turned him and started taking his own belt off, that was fully cut (now I can live without that if I am honest because its maybe a step too far) but it did leave it a little open to interpretation what the henchman's intentions were. After that there was a couple of seconds cut from Rick revenge attach on said henchman which made Carl's horrified / relieved / grateful look more powerful.

I'm sure over the four series there were countless cuts.

So the earlier version was cut? OMG that's annoying as that's the one I've been recording/watching!

[DayoftheZ]

So the earlier version was cut? OMG that's annoying as that's the one I've been recording/watching!

I don’t know if it has been the case for previous episodes but this one most certainly was. I sat and fast forwarded through both and there were defiantly the cuts that I described above. When they are repeated I am going to re-record them and skip through to see if I have missed anything else watching the 9pm one.

[MinionZombie]

So the earlier version was cut? OMG that's annoying as that's the one I've been recording/watching!

Grrr! I've been stacking them up at the 9pm slot on my Sky+ so I can rewatch them later! Does anyone know when they'll re-show the back-half of season 4 at a 10pm time slot?


I don’t know if it has been the case for previous episodes but this one most certainly was. I sat and fast forwarded through both and there were defiantly the cuts that I described above. When they are repeated I am going to re-record them and skip through to see if I have missed anything else watching the 9pm one.

There were some cuts to season one on DVD/Blu-Ray for the UK release, but that was by accident.

Every episode except for the back half of season 4 has aired at 10pm and uncut on FX/Fox UK (on a Friday, too) ... these last eight episodes however, have been at a new time of 9pm on Mondays. I had wondered if, at 9pm (the beginning of the "watershed") that there might be cuts to violence (in the UK The Walking Dead is rated 18 due to violence and gore ... meanwhile it's rated 14 in America!), and by the sounds of it - there we go.

FFS!

At least they're showing it uncut at 10pm by the sounds of it, so they must be replacing that particular slot with the uncut version on their "Fox+1" channel ... but why not just show the thing at 10pm and leave it uncut, rather than show it butchered only to show it uncut straight after?! :mad:

*EDIT*

Yeah, just checked for myself on 4x16 - the walker chewing out the guy's eye is completely missing. The cut is slickly made in that particular instance, but I can imagine there'll be some evident cuts throughout the rest of the episodes aired at 9pm.

Only repeats of 4x16 over the next week, so I'll have to keep an eye out for repeats of 4x09 through 4x16 at 10pm or later. No way am I re-watching the episodes in some stupid censored form.

Finally Fox UK gets around to showing the episodes the following day (that original five day wait was ridiculous for 1x01 through 4x08), but they butcher them for a 9pm slot. Just show them first and uncut at 10pm ffs! And of course, they're not going to tell anyone they're cutting them as people won't like that - well then don't cut them and just show them at 10pm first! /nerdrage

[Neil]

Finally Fox UK gets around to showing the episodes the following day (that original five day wait was ridiculous for 1x01 through 4x08), but they butcher them for a 9pm slot. Just show them first and uncut at 10pm ffs! And of course, they're not going to tell anyone they're cutting them as people won't like that - well then don't cut them and just show them at 10pm first! /nerdrage

Especially when there's not a single mention of cuts being made, and an alternative showing being available which isn't cut.

[DayoftheZ]

There were some cuts to season one on DVD/Blu-Ray for the UK release, but that was by accident.

So did they ever get put back in MZ?



Yeah, just checked for myself on 4x16 - the walker chewing out the guy's eye is completely missing. The cut is slickly made in that particular instance, but I can imagine there'll be some evident cuts throughout the rest of the episodes aired at 9pm.

It was a decent cut but having seen the full cut it is quite noticeable and Carl’s reaction seems a little off. For those that haven’t seen it you have to because it is one of the better “walker on human kills” across all four series. The episode is much stronger for having it in.

Finally Fox UK gets around to showing the episodes the following day (that original five day wait was ridiculous for 1x01 through 4x08), but they butcher them for a 9pm slot. Just show them first and uncut at 10pm ffs! And of course, they're not going to tell anyone they're cutting them as people won't like that - well then don't cut them and just show them at 10pm first! /nerdrage

Strange isn’t it. I mean the main reason I signed up was because I had searched the net to see if it had been spotted by anybody else with no success. I wouldn’t have seen it either if I hadn’t watched the UK version earlier that day. Like you I will have to look out for the repeats to see what else I have missed. At least I have been able to point it out to you all so you can all catch the uncut version.

Reply in quote.

[ProfessorChaos]

anybody else think that the dude who got his face chewed could have got away? dude had about a ten-foot wide hole to run through in the crowd of walkers, but chose to stand there screaming and dancing around like a total jackass.

kinda makes you wonder how he survived almost two years or however long it's been into the walker outbreak....or if he was just thrown into the script to satisfy the gore-porn crowd who bitch if there's not enough walker action each week.

[Neil]

anybody else think that the dude who got his face chewed could have got away? dude had about a ten-foot wide hole to run through in the crowd of walkers, but chose to stand there screaming and dancing around like a total jackass.
He reminds me of the guy who Peter shoots on the way out of the Mall in Dawn of the Dead. If you look you can see zombies approaching in from the sides and the rear - none from the front. Yet this is the only direction he's machine gunning :)

[AcesandEights]

anybody else think that the dude who got his face chewed could have got away? dude had about a ten-foot wide hole to run through in the crowd of walkers, but chose to stand there screaming and dancing around like a total jackass.

Yes, I mentioned on the bottom of page 1 that I assumed he had been hurt or was exhausted and that he was a waste of resources as he seemed just tacked on to the script to throw in some gore.

[ProfessorChaos]

^

must've missed that one doug, sorry. there was quite a flurry of activity in this thread within an hour or two after the credits rolled. i just brought it up because they were discussing how some of the gore from that particular bit was cut during the uk broadcast.

and neil, yes, it is a very similar situation i suppose. that dude had a gun at least, he could have just offed himself rather than get bit. i think that's what i'd do in a no-way-out situation like that. the dude in TWD had a clear path of escape, though, and instead just made a silly little "nowhere to go" type dance....kinda takes you out of the moment. i think they could have framed that shot in a way that made it much more believable.

[MinionZombie]

DayoftheZ:

The accidental cuts to Season One, on the UK release, as far as I'm aware have never been restored. For that reason, plus the fact that a special edition was only released in America with a bunch of awesome extras, I imported season one from America.

Now - I looked at my stacked-up episodes on my Sky+ closer and, weirdly, only 4x16 was recorded in a 9pm slot - all of the other seven episodes were recorded at 10pm - so those other seven should, in sound theory at least, be unscathed. I'm not positive, but that would be my assumption. I'm re-recording 4x16 tomorrow morning at 1am (i.e. "tonight" so-to-speak ... 'Thursday 1am') - it's repeated throughout the week in post-10pm slots, so all of those should be uncut.

I hadn't particularly paid attention to when the episodes were airing (i.e. 9pm or 10pm), so got a bit confused, but the info on the Sky+ says 4x09 through 4x15 were all recorded in the 10pm slot ... so I reckon those were untouched.

But that raises a question - why was 4x16 - the season finale - aired cut at 9pm rather than the usual 10pm slot? Were they trying out something new to see if they could get more people watching? But who the hell wants to watch a censored version of TWD anyway?

So - re-record 4x16 and I think we'll be sorted ... unless you're aware of any other cuts to 4x09 through 4x15, DayoftheZ?

Either way, I'm glad you signed on to HPOTD to raise this issue.


He reminds me of the guy who Peter shoots on the way out of the Mall in Dawn of the Dead. If you look you can see zombies approaching in from the sides and the rear - none from the front. Yet this is the only direction he's machine gunning :)

That bit always bugs me, but I kinda laugh at it too. I suppose practically speaking they couldn't have extras coming from that direction because:
1) They'd probably block the camera.
2) It'd be unsafe to have them that close to blank firing machine gun.
3) No cheap or effective CGI at the time.


Yes, I mentioned on the bottom of page 1 that I assumed he had been hurt or was exhausted and that he was a waste of resources as he seemed just tacked on to the script to throw in some gore.

I disagree. It was more than just gore, to me.

Carl goes running off like a bat out of hell when he hears the scream and Rick has to pull him back into hiding when he sees how swarmed the guy is. Carl wants to help the man, but he's too gung-ho to realise that the odds are totally against him and that, even if he did intervene, he'd be too late anyway (too many walkers, so they guy would get bitten anyway by at least one of them) ... Rick's take on it is that he sees they're seriously outnumbered and they just don't have enough time. It's a harsh choice to make, but it had to be that way - Carl hasn't learned that yet ... and it was important to see him watching this horrific act unfold and their part in it happening.

As for the man himself - even though he's lasting this long, we don't know his circumstances - he might have had a cosy old billet where he barely had to lift a finger when it came to the cut throat business of surviving the walkers etc. Think of the sheltered folks of Woodbury behind their walls and fences supping on refridgerated lemonade. Also, backed into a relative corner (not literally, necessarily) his mind might have finally snapped and he just got overwhelmed - and, importantly - wasn't thinking.

Similarly, Carl wasn't thinking too clearly either. The man's snap decision was to panic. Carl's snap decision was to help the man without assessing his chances of survival.

:)

[kidgloves]

Yep, its definitely been cut. What a crock

[DayoftheZ]

DayoftheZ:

But that raises a question - why was 4x16 - the season finale - aired cut at 9pm rather than the usual 10pm slot? Were they trying out something new to see if they could get more people watching? But who the hell wants to watch a censored version of TWD anyway?

So - re-record 4x16 and I think we'll be sorted ... unless you're aware of any other cuts to 4x09 through 4x15, DayoftheZ?

Either way, I'm glad you signed on to HPOTD to raise this issue.

4x9 to 4x15 were recorded at 9pm for me so sadly I need to make sure I fill those gaps in when they repeat. I re-recorded 4x16 minus the cuts last night so I am good on that one.

I didn't see the American pace version of those episodes so am not aware of any cuts, but it stands to reason that there must be based on this being cut. It seems to be mainly violence against humans being tampered with so there is plenty that could have been messed with.

I might just have to get round to buying the first four series on DVD.

[kidgloves]

AMC have released a photo of a deleted scene from the finale which puts a different spin on what some of us comic readers think Terminus is in relation to the human remains

Thoughts?

http://media.comicbook.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/The-Walking-Dead-Season-Four-Finale-Walkers-e1396280796155.jpg

[Moon Knight]

AMC have released a photo of a deleted scene from the finale which puts a different spin on what some of us comic readers think Terminus is in relation to the human remains

Thoughts?

http://media.comicbook.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/The-Walking-Dead-Season-Four-Finale-Walkers-e1396280796155.jpg


Hmmm, were they trying to imply that walkers ate the meat off them bones?

Edit: added the spoiler tags.

[MoonSylver]

anybody else think that the dude who got his face chewed could have got away? dude had about a ten-foot wide hole to run through in the crowd of walkers, but chose to stand there screaming and dancing around like a total jackass.

kinda makes you wonder how he survived almost two years or however long it's been into the walker outbreak....or if he was just thrown into the script to satisfy the gore-porn crowd who bitch if there's not enough walker action each week.

Yeah, that was my only gripe w/ the episode TBH. I'm usually pretty laid back on the nit pickery for the show. It is what it is & all, but that scene was pretty :rolleyes:. But, meh. One little faux pas now & again I can live with. :|

[Legion2213]

Yeah, that was my only gripe w/ the episode TBH. I'm usually pretty laid back on the nit pickery for the show. It is what it is & all, but that scene was pretty :rolleyes:. But, meh. One little faux pas now & again I can live with. :|

scene would have been better if it had just been played a bit differently...

group spot a capable looking guy taking out a dozen walkers with melee weapon, struggling a bit but seemingly holding his ground (maybe with a bit of heavy wrapping around his knee to explain how he got caught in the open by a group of biters), they are about to pitch in and help when another group of 20 or so walkers come surging from the bushes, guy is overwhelmed as the group are making their way towards him...

Play the rest of the scene as it was, guy goes under, a few walkers spot the group, the group takes off.

We still get our gore and sense of hoplessness or whatever.

[kidgloves]

Hmmm, were they trying to imply that walkers ate the meat off them bones?

Edit: added the spoiler tags.

It looks like the body parts have been cut up to feed the Walkers. Its been implied that Gareth & Co are more like a cult rather than cannibals. Im guessing they cut the scene to leave it more ambiguous. Give themselves more options

[Moon Knight]

It looks like the body parts have been cut up to feed the Walkers. Its been implied that Gareth & Co are more like a cult rather than cannibals. Im guessing they cut the scene to leave it more ambiguous. Give themselves more options

I like that idea. Makes sense considering how big a group the terminites are. Gareth is supposedly a remix of two comic characters; my thoughts? Chris/Gabriel.

[Publius]

What did people think of the creepy room with all the names on the floor and candles etc? Do you think those were people they've lost - family members etc - like it's a shrine? Or, is it a weird shrine to the people they've eaten? Thoughts?
I wondered where they get enough candles to keep that many burning at all times. :p

[Legion2213]

I wondered where they get enough candles to keep that many burning at all times. :p

Human fat...obviously... :D

[kidgloves]

Just a had a look at the 1am UK showing and the gore is intact so I think from now on I think it would be better to wait for the later broadcast

[facestabber]

I'm shocked the US allows more gore than what is allowed in UK.

[AcesandEights]

I'm shocked the US allows more gore than what is allowed in UK.

Americans are generally prudes, but prudes that are inured to blood, violence and gore.

Now if women's nipples popped up in TWD as often as the gore there'd be cuts, and then letter writing campaigns if nary a nip did slip.

[sandrock74]

In the U.S., blood and guts is fine. It the boobies and the butts that are strictly taboo!

[MinionZombie]

I'm shocked the US allows more gore than what is allowed in UK.


Americans are generally prudes, but prudes that are inured to blood, violence and gore.

Now if women's nipples popped up in TWD as often as the gore there'd be cuts, and then letter writing campaigns if nary a nip did slip.


In the U.S., blood and guts is fine. It the boobies and the butts that are strictly taboo!

In the UK, I feel our rating system is more balanced because of the 12A / 15 / 18 certificates ... rather than PG-13 and then a big old chasm of nothingness to an R rating.

When it comes to TV, in the UK we have what is called the "9 o'clock watershed". Before that point you can't swear or show violence or nudity - you can only mildly hint at that sort of stuff - but after 9pm things escalate quickly and within minutes, depending on the channel's own attitude and the context, you can be dropping F-bombs and flashing the flesh. Heck, I doubt the likes of BabeStation would last very long in America. :p

When it comes to TWD - that's usually shown in a 10pm slot, so it remains uncut - however 4x16 was shown in a 9pm slot. The cuts to violence are most likely to scenes where there's a real focus on the 'infliction of pain/violence' - e.g. the detail of the guy getting his eye chewed out. However, in a 10pm (or later) showing that's completely intact.

TWD is rated 14 on AMC, but here in the UK when it comes to DVD/Blu-Ray, it's rated 18 due to the 'focus' on violent acts and gore. Context is also a consideration - so Shaun of the Dead is partly a comedy and doesn't generally dwell on violence too much (or, rather, the agony of violence quite so much), so you can get away with the Rhodes-referencing death in Shaun, but the actual Rhodes death in Day of the Dead is still an 18.

However - language - not such a big deal over here. The C-Bomb can be dropped after 10pm on TV for anyone to see, and indeed, look at The World's End - with the right context and tone, the word was used several times in a 15 rated movie. Sex or nudity, also, isn't such a big deal either - yes, you occasionally get little tabloid panics now and then (e.g. when Queer As Folk first aired, or Footballer's Wives, which both had a reputation for being fairly graphic/in your face/honest/lurid/whatever) ... but on the other hand you can have experimental shows like, back in 2009, when they did a 'live nude modelling' art programme.

I forget the name of it, but for a week on Channel 4 - at around about 1pm IIRC - they had nude models (boobs, butts, bush, and willies) stripping off to their birthday suits and posing for the camera so the viewer could join in with the artists on the show itself and draw the models themselves. I can't imagine that would have been on NBC or ABC or whatever at lunchtime! :lol:

So really, in the UK, TWD is only an 18 because of the gore and violence. If it wasn't for that it'd be a soft 15, possibly even a 12A for some episodes.

It is a bit weird that all manner of death and destruction doesn't bat an eyelid over there, but Janet Jackson's fleeting nipple causes mass hysteria. :confused:

Now - had TWD been a British production, that final line of 'They just screwed with the wrong people' would have absolutely been able to use the F-bomb. Likewise there'd be F-bombs littered throughout and the sexy bits would be a little more daring. Violence wise it'd be the same, and still aired from 10pm.

So - that 9pm showing - I'm thinking it was possibly a trial or a test for FoxUK to see if they could scare up even more viewers at 9pm, but really, come on, just show it at 10pm like normal and leave it uncut FFS.

[Neil]

When it comes to TWD - that's usually shown in a 10pm slot, so it remains uncut - however 4x16 was shown in a 9pm slot. The cuts to violence are most likely to scenes where there's a real focus on the 'infliction of pain/violence' - e.g. the detail of the guy getting his eye chewed out. However, in a 10pm (or later) showing that's completely intact.
The whole series had the 9pm option did it not? So the worry is every episode I watched had been cut in someway :(

Why they didn't simply state this prior to each episode and let the user know the uncut version was available an hour later I don't know :rolleyes:

[AcesandEights]

So the worry is every episode I watched had been cut in someway :(



Finally, a verifiable reason why every Brit's opinion on TWD is suspect! :D

[shootemindehead]

Why they didn't simply state this prior to each episode and let the user know...

Because they'd lose viewers.

Most people, when they hear that a film has been cut, just don't bother.

It used to make me form fists when I bought videos in the 90's and I'd get home to find out the bloody thing had been cut, without a single indication of such a fact on the cover.

It's remarkable that such things exist still to this day.

Thank god for the interwebs.

[MinionZombie]

The whole series had the 9pm option did it not? So the worry is every episode I watched had been cut in someway :(

Why they didn't simply state this prior to each episode and let the user know the uncut version was available an hour later I don't know :rolleyes:

Erm, well, according to my Sky+ planner I recorded the last eight episodes at 10pm except 4x16 which was recorded in the 9pm slot (I then re-recorded it at 1am t'other night). So, if shown at 10pm, they should be uncut.

Double checked and yeah, the first seven episodes were recording on Mondays at 10pm on Fox (not Fox+1 ... or whatever it's called), so those must surely have been left uncut.

4x16 definitely aired first of all at 9pm though and was cut. I'm wondering, as I've said, if it was an experiment by FoxUK to get even more viewers.

Also, yeah, as shoot said they'd never let anyone know that they'd cut it - people wouldn't watch it until a later slot. It is really annoying ... there should be some kind of message because, surely, you're showing something that doesn't represent the true version of the episode. I hope FoxUK are paying attention to this sort of talk and decide to shitcan the idea of cutting episodes just to air them a measily hour earlier (perhaps, possibly, probably, the cost for buying an advert slot is higher between 9 and 10, rather than 10 and 11?)

[Moon Knight]

Finally, a verifiable reason why every Brit's opinion on TWD is suspect! :D

That explains EVERYTHING! :p

[Publius]

In the U.S., blood and guts is fine. It the boobies and the butts that are strictly taboo!
Part of it is that the blood and guts are fake but the boobies and butts are real. Real blood and guts are just as taboo. Another part is that parents know their teens are more likely to, let's say, be tempted to act out in real life based on visions of boobies and butts versus visions of blood and guts.

[zombieparanoia]

Part of it is that the blood and guts are fake but the boobies and butts are real. Real blood and guts are just as taboo. Another part is that parents know their teens are more likely to, let's say, be tempted to act out in real life based on visions of boobies and butts versus visions of blood and guts.

As we can see by the low, low rates of assaults and homicides in the US. The US could use more acting out on boobs and butts and a little less acting out on blood and gore.

[Publius]

As we can see by the low, low rates of assaults and homicides in the US.

Much, much lower than the rate of sexual activity, I assure you. :)

[MoonSylver]

As we can see by the low, low rates of assaults and homicides in the US. The US could use more acting out on boobs and butts and a little less acting out on blood and gore.

Give me some boobs and butts and I'll be more than happy to act out on them. :D

[bassman]

It's funny how often this censorship thing pops up. Yes, the US allows violence and less nudity, and yes, the UK allows nudity and less violence. The beauty of it all is that it's 2014 and we can watch whatever the hell we want on the internet...

Anyway...I rarely watch the episodes a second time before the blu ray release, but I decided to give the finale another viewing. I really think the show is in great hands with Gimple. If they can keep him around, anyway. :lol:

While not terrible, I think the first half of the season he was trying to make up for some of Mazzara's Season Three mistakes, but the second half is great and the finale is phenomenal. Maybe not the same geek-out as the reveal of Michonne and the Prison in Season Two, but more of a an emotional character finale for Rick. I think it's just a wonderfully crafted episode and hope to see more like it in the next season.

It sucks to know that half of Season Five is already written and we have to wait until December to see it all....

[Neil]

It's funny how often this censorship thing pops up. Yes, the US allows violence and less nudity, and yes, the UK allows nudity and less violence.
Not entirely true - We're talking about a very gory show being shown at 9pm, hence why I suspect it was cut (in the UK). At 10pm it's shown unmolested.

[bassman]

Not entirely true - We're talking about a very gory show being shown at 9pm, hence why I suspect it was cut (in the UK). At 10pm it's shown unmolested.

Indeed, it depends on the hour. In general though, the US is okay with violence and less natural nudity and vice versa. I don't agree with it at all, but it's just the way our different regions deal with it....

[krisvds]

Finally caught up with you guys and watched the back half of the season in one go the other night.

Agree with bassman on this one: that finale is probably (one of ) the best TWD has ever been. In fact those final six episodes are better than most of what we got in the abysmal third season: characters continue to get better lines written for them, the direction and editing are way better, there are moments of intense suspense and dread (the first half of the finale). As ever the F/X were stellar.

But when the series gets silly it does so with a vengeance: Carl's monologue when Rick was out was beyond bad. Dear God that kid can do better than that. Still don't like the smell thing: Michone hiding amongst the zombies with her pets stretches plausibility into the plain stupid. Those folk songs montage bits really do not work. And what was that with the searching for a drink episode?

Still: the series has never been better: Rick hiding under the bed is about as tense as television gets, the crew were finally on the road (tracks) for a long period and some interesting questions were raised. The Carol arc especially was sad and powerful. The mystery surrounding Terminus was handled well. The zombies were more of a threat than they were in the past but the real enemy is mankind itself.

Bring on season 5.

[blind2d]

Finally caught up with you guys and watched the back half of the season in one go the other night.

Agree with bassman on this one: that finale is probably (one of ) the best TWD has ever been. In fact those final six episodes are better than most of what we got in the abysmal third season: characters continue to get better lines written for them, the direction and editing are way better, there are moments of intense suspense and dread (the first half of the finale). As ever the F/X were stellar.

But when the series gets silly it does so with a vengeance: Carl's monologue when Rick was out was beyond bad. Dear God that kid can do better than that. Still don't like the smell thing: Michone hiding amongst the zombies with her pets stretches plausibility into the plain stupid. Those folk songs montage bits really do not work. And what was that with the searching for a drink episode?

Still: the series has never been better: Rick hiding under the bed is about as tense as television gets, the crew were finally on the road (tracks) for a long period and some interesting questions were raised. The Carol arc especially was sad and powerful. The mystery surrounding Terminus was handled well. The zombies were more of a threat than they were in the past but the real enemy is mankind itself.

Bring on season 5.

I'm with you 100%! And tired, so I can't really say anything new or groundbreaking. But I DID see this episode and I DID love it to bits. Hopefully we see a cool ritual in that room at Terminus at some point soon. (Maybe I should read the comics...) Anyway, it's so crazy that this show is like the flipside of MLP:FiM. Like... Y'know? They're so similar and backwards to each other and opposite... Did I mention I was tired?