Better Call Saul (Breaking Bad spin-off TV series)...

[MinionZombie]

So the first episode was on last night and the second is on tonight - thoughts? What are people making of it so far?

Be careful not to spoil things for folks who haven't watched yet (you can use the "Spoiler Tags" if you need them). :)

[EvilNed]

I heard it was good. I loved Breaking Bad, but in all cases I'd much rather have a sequel than a prequel. What happened to that donutshop he was gonna manage?

[MinionZombie]

The first episode opens with a sequel element, so I'd assume there'll be other such segments during the season.

I've seen the first two episodes now and I'm really digging it - the second in particular really brings back that vibe Breaking Bad displayed so often where it could have horrific moments and then move into genuinely hilarious moments within the same episode.

They've also done a great job of making sure that Saul - or "Jimmy McGill" as he's actually known here at the moment - works as a central character (rather than a supporting one like in BB). You can sympathise with him and be on his side, but he's also got that sparkle of Saul. Obviously, being a prequel, we're on a journey towards Saul Goodman - but a significant proportion of that character is already there in Jimmy McGill. Odenkirk is absolutely rocking it, too. Likewise, great writing and direction!

[ProfessorChaos]

really pleased thus far. had a few reservations at first, but that opening of the very first episode put almost all worries at ease. i read that they are planning a five or six season story, taking the action right up to the time when saul meets walt and jesse after badger's arrest.

i remember watching bob odenkirk on mr. show back in the late 90's and there are so many little bits of dialogue and expressions he uses in better call saul that sound/look like something from mr. show. odenkirik has really developed some serious acting chops and honed his craft over the years, he was a great bit of comic relief in breaking bad, really did well on fargo, and is now the lead on his own show. it's funny, i almost want to say i'm proud of him, like he's a close friend or something.

[shootemindehead]

Aye. It's decent. The last episode (4) was the first truly great episode, though.

It still seems like a show in search of a story however.

[MinionZombie]

Aye. It's decent. The last episode (4) was the first truly great episode, though.

It still seems like a show in search of a story however.

I think we're in 'establishing/set up' mode at the moment. Taking the character from one place and working him towards a more familiar place, in order to make sure he's the sort of character you can get behind for the duration. As a side character it's one thing, but the exact same character from the get-go? Gilligan and Gould were saying how they wanted to meet him at a time when you can see glimpses of what he becomes, but he's not there yet, so we sympathise with him and like him - not just as a bit of comedic relief, but as a lead.

If Walter White had been like what he became in season 5, but in episode 1x01, I don't think it would have caught on with people. You've got to drip-feed the change from a place where the audience are willing to hop on and then make us complicit in the change. Even right up to the last episode of BB there will still tons of people who completely sympathised with everything Walter White did and excused all the bad things - and if he'd not been a sympathetic character at the beginning, that relationship with the audience wouldn't have endured.

So I think there's a similar thing going on here with Jimmy McGill/Saul Goodman ... and the first season is usually about finding and establishing a foundation anyway, and in the looming shadow of Breaking Bad, too.

I'm loving BCS thus far - I'd very much welcome a 5/6 season arc that leads up to Breaking Bad. :)

Hopefully they include a few more cold opens like they did in the first episode.

[bassman]

I've just finished the first season so spoilers ahead...


This obviously isn't a clone of Breaking Breaking Bad. While there will eventually no doubt be plots involving crime, Saul offers a little something different: insight into everyone's favorite douchebag lawyer!

Fans knew Odenkirk from Mr Show, and its astounding how far he's come as a dramatic actor. Saul no doubt has its laughs but most importantly makes you understand and care for Jimmy McGill. By the end of the first season you see a great portion of his transformation to Saul and it leaves you wanting more. Not the name, mind you, just the character.

And let's not forget the great Jonathan Banks as Mike Ermantraght. He shares basically half the season with Saul and is equally as riveting.

As a massive fan of Breaking Bad, I couldn't be happier and cannot wait for further seasons. 10/10

[MinionZombie]

Glad you dug it, Sir ... although considering how big a fan of Breaking Bad you are, I'm surprised you didn't watch this when it first aired.

Then again, a binge watch can be a lovely way to watch a show. There were a few times when the week wait between episodes was a bit of a pain in the arse, hehe.

Likewise, I'm really looking forward to Season 2. :cool:

[bassman]

^ yeah I kinda got fed up with paying insane bills every month for satellite/cable service, so that partially explains my delay with Saul and the back half of TWD season 5. No need for the TV service now that I can stream showbox on my tvs, though! Gotta love the internet....

Like you hinted at, I'm actually glad I waited to watch Saul in one large chunk. Given that nearly every episode ends with a "cliffhanger", I would've hated waiting week-to-week.

[MinionZombie]

Given that nearly every episode ends with a "cliffhanger", I would've hated waiting week-to-week.

I imagine it also gave it a really good sense of momentum.

Perhaps AMC could have aired the episodes of the first season in lots of two back-to-back. IIRC the first two episodes were close together (one night after the other), but after that it was the usual week-to-week. It wouldn't make sense for every single season, but perhaps just for the first season to really try and hook folks in more vigorously.

Anyway, whichever way you slice the viewing experience, it was a damn good bit of telly and I'm decidedly looking forward to Season 2! :thumbsup:

[bassman]

Season three teaser: https://youtu.be/e_3WzxpdUc0

Yeah!!!

[ProfessorChaos]

i wonder if BCS will be available for viewing on any streaming services immediately. got rid of directv a few months ago and probably won't ever pay those sort of ridiculous prices again for the few shows i actually care to watch.

either way, i'm pumped. i would imagine we'll have a premiere date set in the coming weeks. iirc, last season began in february...

[MinionZombie]

Stoked for this. BCS has been one of those little gems that is becoming one of my favourite shows.

At times in the first two seasons they were going a bit slow (particularly in season one), but it felt like there was a fair bit more oomph throughout season 2, so hopefully season 3 continues to boost things forward, and by the looks of it the tie-ins to Breaking Bad will be growing. :)

[bassman]

So far season three has been quite tense with only two episodes in. Also some great throw backs to Breaking Bad, but they don't feel forced, it actually makes sense for the direction the story is taking.

Also, Jimmy's brother Chuck is a douchebag. :lol:

[MinionZombie]

I was meaning to dig up this thread and chime in.

I've thoroughly enjoyed the first two episodes of BCS Season 3, it's great to have the show back. The show feels like it's really comfortable in its own skin now, if that makes sense. As you say, quite tense, and it's cool to see the pulling in of Breaking Bad elements into the story. The methodical way Mike works out a problem is fascinating to watch, too. Everybody involved in the show is doing a great job, and I'm excited to see how the rest of the season plays out.

I would hope that we get a bit more of the 'black and white post-Saul' stuff, particularly after the development in this season's opener. I don't want to have to wait for 4x01 to find out what happens next in that side story. Loved how you know who kind of seeped out of the background during episode two - and suddenly, there they were. :cool:

[sandorg]

Love it but do we really need that talk show afterward to discuss BCS? :barf:

[JDP]

Love it but do we really need that talk show afterward to discuss BCS? :barf:

They only do it for the season premiere and finale episodes, not for every episode. BCS is not as popular as AMC's zombie shows, so it does not pay to make a talk show for it.

[ProfessorChaos]

yeah, love how quickly things are moving along already in season 3. unlike a certain sacred amc show, they don't fuck around with a handful of unnecessary filler episodes to milk the hell out of the storyline and work in as many tie-in products and commercials, they just keep putting pieces in place to move the plot along.

it's great to see old faces from breaking bad show up, whether it be a new receptionist for jimmy and kim, or one of fring's many business associates. really interested to see what becomes and jimmy and kim, how things end up between them, and how it affects the man who becomes saul.

and, like mz, i think we need some resolution about gene from cinnabon and what the future has in store for him.

[MinionZombie]

To be fair, BCS and TWD are based in different storytelling styles - their origins, too, are different, with TWD the show being birthed from TWD the comic.

Breaking Bad & Better Call Saul both tend towards more deliberate pacing in a meticulous manner, with a more focused story on a handful of characters - whereas TWD is an increasingly broad cast of characters (too many at the moment, so hopefully a bunch of extraneous characters will get dispensed in the coming war) in a much broader story which leans towards epic action and spectacle. In Breaking Bad a mid-season cliffhanger can be someone sitting on a toilet reading a handwritten inscription inside a book that has particular meaning, while in TWD a mid-season cliffhanger can be a massive swarm of the undead invading Alexandria and chowing down on people ... so they're two very different stories and ways of pacing things.

I do greatly appreciate the amount of time that the writers (Gilligan, Gould, & Co) put in to making sure their episodes have air tight logic (something which TWD needs to buck up its ideas on, to be honest). It's one of the things I most enjoy about BB and BCS - e.g. Mike trying to find a tracker in his car, and all the logical and meticulous steps he takes afterwards in episode 2 to get some new info. :)

I love BB, BCS, and TWD. I'm glad to see that BCS Season 3 is now injecting some more propulsion into the story (something which was a bit lacking in Season 1, it must be said) after Season 2 gradually turned up the dial. TWD does need to regain control over itself - logic (plotting, story, and character decisions) needs a good boost, consistency in the writing (at times TWD Season 7 felt like some of the writers were in an entirely different room to the rest of the writers) could use some work to get everyone on the same page, and better pacing/structuring in general.

Hmmm ... this post has kind of become a BB/BCS/TWD mini critique. :lol:

[kidgloves]

Is anyone else finding the constant use of montages a bit tedious.? Yes, its part of BB, but they're way overused in this.

Chucks a right tosser. Horrible human being.

[MinionZombie]

Is anyone else finding the constant use of montages a bit tedious.? Yes, its part of BB, but they're way overused in this.

Chucks a right tosser. Horrible human being.

Never had a problem with the montages, but didn't notice them being "constant" either, so...

Chuck ... yeah, the more they peel the layers on him the nastier he gets in some ways. It's an interesting one because Jimmy's done plenty of things to earn a bad reputation with his brother, but at the same time Chuck preaches about wanting to do what's 'right' to 'help' Jimmy, but his motives aren't that pure. He wants to get Jimmy's license to practice law taken away - the one thing that Jimmy earned through legitimate hard work which elevated him out of the gutter of "Slippin' Jimmy". Sure, it wasn't on the same level as Chuck and not from as prestigious a place, and his methods aren't always by the book or inhabit a bit of a grey area, but he knows his stuff quite well and genuinely cares about his clients (most of the time). He worked for that case with the old folks' home and then it was taken away from him by a bigger entity, and so the one thing that made him a better person (for now, pre-Breaking Bad, at least) Chuck wants to take away.

And then, at the same time, Jimmy's done some really shitty things to Chuck - so they've both wronged each other, although I'd say the balance of abuse tips more towards Chuck as the older brother. They make a fascinating pair of characters.

I like the little details or quirks they put into the show - like the nerdy guy with the lairy car. :D

[ProfessorChaos]

anyone still watching this? this show had me hooked pretty much from the start but i'm amazed by how well the story has unfolded. really looking forward to seeing the last 6 episodes and seeing what becomes of the characters still standing that aren't around during the breaking bad timeline and find out what becomes of jimmy/saul/gene after he relocates to nebraska.

[MinionZombie]

Aye, still watching and still loving it.

It can occasionally get a little long-winded at times, as if it's showing off a bit during scenes like the cold opens, showing so much of whatever process is going on, but other than that I've got nothing to gripe about. Richly drawn and complex characters who are well written and well performed, plus the style and substance of Breaking Bad in its making. What's not to love?

Hopefully Kim survives, but I'd imagine the events of the mid-season break will drive a wedge. Even though Kim has bent various rules along the way, she'd never stick around with someone like Saul Goodman for very long once he really gets up and running.

[ProfessorChaos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ze5Ias6dUE

saw this the other day and was blown away. it would be awesome if they had the budget to make this happen for the whole series.