Red Dead Redemption 2 (video game)

[bassman]

http://www.rockstargames.com/reddeadredemption2/

It's felt like an eternity waiting for official word on this! The original is likely my favorite game of all time, so to say I'm excited would be an understatement...

[shootemindehead]

+1

Surprised that RDR never appeared on the PC though.

[AcesandEights]

So psyched for this!

In the meantime, I can't wait to dive back in to the game by way of backwards compatible niceness.

[shootemindehead]

So psyched for this!

In the meantime, I can't wait to dive back in to the game by way of backwards compatible niceness.

That should be an actual term.

:lol:

[kidgloves]

After RDR1 and GTA on next gen I am super stoked for this. Always have been and will be in to Westerns.

[MinionZombie]

Very welcome news, so it is. The teaser trailer looks great - RDR was visually stunning (sometimes I'd just sit in front of a wide open vista and watch the sun rise/set), and this new one looks even more gorgeous. Hopefully there'll still be plenty to do throughout the landscape with a few towns that are fairly built up to add a bit of variety.

I absolutely loved RDR. There was something quite special about being able to swagger into a town and have a showdown with some scumbag, play a few rounds of poker, gun down a couple of ne'er-do-wells, and ride off into the sunset for more adventures. :)

Some people are pondering if there'll be seven characters to choose from (akin to GTA V's three characters you could switch between), but might that be too many? Three was plenty, but I would welcome a female character to play as for some added variety, some sort of Calamity Jane type maybe.

[Neil]

Not so important news - New trailer

Important news - PC version confirmed :)

http://www.pcgamer.com/red-dead-redemption-2-has-a-new-trailer/

[MinionZombie]

It was strange how they never put out a PC version, wasn't it? GTA IV got one (albeit a somewhat dodgy port to begin with, IIRC), and if I recall L.A. Noire and Max Payne 3 both got PC ports along with, naturally, GTA V. RDR was hugely successful ... perhaps Rockstar simply didn't have the resources for it? Hmmm ... glad I had a 360, as I played it on there. It was a great game and I'm properly looking forward to RDR2. The world looks absolutely stunning (as did RDR). With the previous game I'd just go and hang out on my horse at a vantage point and watch the gorgeous world pass by as the sun rose or set. Gorgeous, so it was. The design was spectacular.

[ProfessorChaos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaW0tYpxyp0

looks stunning! can't wait to mount up and just explore the wilderness...and maybe do some nefarious shit along the way.

[MinionZombie]

Looks gorgeous, doesn't it?

Did anyone else catch a familiar face in the trailer? John Marston - evidently just after he'd received the wounds that gave him his iconic scarring to the right side of his face (they've just been stitched up in the trailer). Although it seems that you're probably playing as someone else ... but I wonder if there'll be 'character switching' like in GTA V.

Likewise, I can't wait to go exploring. I remember with the previous game just marvelling at the open world Rockstar had created, enjoying the sunset/rise etc. Now it's going to be even more lush and vibrant. Damn, Rockstar really do craft some wonderfully immersive games! :thumbsup:

[bassman]

Two days ago I bought the Xbox version of the first game just so I can play it on my nephews Xbox one in preparation for the release of RDR2. Looks fantastic! I need.

[MinionZombie]

JUJ5PDuRRFs

Some interesting tidbits about things Rockstar are doing to finesse the feel of immersion of open world gaming - to make it feel like the NPCs have lives independent of you, the player, and are not just there to benefit you and nothing else.

I love it how Rockstar really think about how to achieve greater and more immersive things with their games ... but hopefully we won't have to wait five ruddy years between RDR2 and their next game! :eek:

This game has been in the works for 8 years, as well! :stunned:

[bassman]

Just heard that RDR2 is now available for preorder. There’s also news that PS4 editions of the game will have exclusives available before Xbox One.

https://kotaku.com/red-dead-redemption-2-will-have-some-sort-of-timed-play-1826536689

[MinionZombie]

Gameplay Trailer :)

Dw_oH5oiUSE

That open world looks absolutely gorgeous! I can forsee a lot of time spent just admiring the landscape, watching the sun rise and set and such. I hope the movement and shooting mechanics are improved, as I did feel that in recent Rockstar games they were trying to get a bit too 'realistic' with the movements, but that'd prove difficult to control - the number of times I struggled to get through a door in Red Dead Redemption, for instance, was silly, as John Marston has this weird turning circle that was kinda limited and imprecise. Similarly, GTA V occasionally felt a bit imprecise or lacking in a certain smoothness and freedom when it came to gunplay, as if you were battling with the combination of the movement mechanics and the shooting mechanics.

It wasn't a huge thing, in fact it was rather subtle in its effects and wouldn't always occur, but when it did it was frustrating. Meanwhile some other games of a similar nature - such as Mafia III - would have less 'realistic' movement (in terms of the character's precise musculature), but the gamer controlling the in-game character felt so much smoother and more free, so you could run from cover, slide across a car bonnet, blast a few enemies, and then dart to another bit of cover before vaulting over a fence and making your escape. That sheer fluidity has somewhat evaded Rockstar because of their overt commitment to realism, but just a little temperance on that front would help make things slicker ... so I hope the mechanics of actually controlling your in-game character feels more slick and free that recent Rockstar games.

Anyway, I'm really excited to play this - not long now!!! :hyper:

[Neil]

It is looking epic isn't it.

Still no news on a PC version :(

[MinionZombie]

It is looking epic isn't it.

Still no news on a PC version :(

I'd be surprised if they didn't put it out on PC, but it might come out a bit later than the console version, as was the case with the likes with various GTA games. They never did a PC port of RDR, did they? I guess too much time had passed and their resources were better suited on other projects, but this time I'd imagine they will, but will announce it in due course.

I really enjoy these early glimpses at a new Rockstar game. Gets me so revved up to explore their new world, although hopefully it won't take five ruddy years before we get the next Rockstar game (they didn't half drain every drop of blood from GTA Online and 'shark cards' :rolleyes: )

[kidgloves]

Oh my


https://youtu.be/hE4Yyjnpcig

[MinionZombie]

I can't wait to go exploring in RDR2 and just stumble across random events. Those can be some of the most entertaining aspects of a Rockstar game, these little weird tales scattered about the game world, you know?

I saw another video from IGN about 'your most important questions answered' or whatever, but most of them were shite questions ("Is dead eye in the game?" ... ffs :rolleyes: ) - but one interesting tidbit was that your character's facial hair will grow as the day/night cycle moves onwards, so if you don't shave you'll end up with a big old beard (if you like) and you can choose how to shave your character as well (so you can go full mutton chops, if you like, for example).

I wonder what the "go to jail" penalty is - like, do you lose weapons, money, how long are you in there etc? Cool that you sometimes get busted out, will that happen all the time, or just some of the time? If only some of the time, how do you get out? Some of these things get brought up but these games journalists seem to just stop asking questions and leave something half-explained.

Anyway ... RDR2 ... can't wait!!! :hyper:

[MinionZombie]

Some tidbits about little details in the game are coming forward from IGN as a result of their play sessions, things like:

Mud - lots of interactive mud. Seems you and your horse get quite dirty during gameplay, so you'll need to take care of your ride by cleaning it/riding it in the rain/taking it through a river to wash it off. Likewise you'll be able to clean off in various ways.

Horse details - apparently there are testicle physics. :lol: So in addition to realistic swaying they'll also shrink up in cold weather! :lol::lol: Also, your horse will go #1 and #2 when it feels like it. :lol::lol::lol:

First Person Mode - seems Rockstar have developed the FPS mode from the ground up and it works better than in GTA V (plus you'll have to option to turn off 'head bobbing'). I think I'll probably give it a try out of curiosity when roaming around, but I prefer 3rd person for a Rockstar game.

[Neil]

Some tidbits about little details in the game are coming forward from IGN as a result of their play sessions, things like:

Mud - lots of interactive mud. Seems you and your horse get quite dirty during gameplay, so you'll need to take care of your ride by cleaning it/riding it in the rain/taking it through a river to wash it off. Likewise you'll be able to clean off in various ways.

Horse details - apparently there are testicle physics. :lol: So in addition to realistic swaying they'll also shrink up in cold weather! :lol::lol: Also, your horse will go #1 and #2 when it feels like it. :lol::lol::lol:

First Person Mode - seems Rockstar have developed the FPS mode from the ground up and it works better than in GTA V (plus you'll have to option to turn off 'head bobbing'). I think I'll probably give it a try out of curiosity when roaming around, but I prefer 3rd person for a Rockstar game.

God I hope this even just partly lives up to the hype!

[MinionZombie]

lb-tlY6ytk8

The new official gameplay video is out! :)

[kidgloves]

So purty.
Can't wait to play this on the X

[Neil]

So purty.
Can't wait to play this on the X

Can't wait to play this on the PC - DOH!

[shootemindehead]

Can't wait to play this on the PC - DOH!

I read a wee while ago that the reason RDR was never put out on PC was because the code was a shambles, with bits and pieces scattered all over the place and with zero data control due to very poor project management.

Hopefully, they learned from their screw ups and managed everything better this time and release RDR2 to the master race?

Anyway there is an PS emulator for the PC in the works and it seems that RDR is getting developed on it But, the frame rate is complete shit at the moment. So, eventually we may be able to play the original RDR on a computer one day.

[MinionZombie]

Those transitions from cutscene to action are slick. :cool:

So many cool details - like the realistic trail in the snow, and man, those vistas ... gorgeous! RDR had beautiful visual design and this is a few leaps on from that. The optional FPS mode looked not bad, certainly better than the tacked-on one in GTA V.

Looking forward to doing some heists in the old west. Hopefully character management won't be too burdonsome (e.g. eating food, washing). I remember how in GTA V always having to buy yet another ruddy bullet proof vest (because they got rinsed so quickly and you couldn't pick up replacement parts 'in the field'), which was a pain in the arse, so hopefully managing your dude in RDR2 won't get too over-the-top ... that's about my only concern, really, but hopefully with playtesting etc they'll balance it correctly.

[Neil]

I read a wee while ago that the reason RDR was never put out on PC was because the code was a shambles, with bits and pieces scattered all over the place and with zero data control due to very poor project management.

Hopefully, they learned from their screw ups and managed everything better this time and release RDR2 to the master race?

Anyway there is an PS emulator for the PC in the works and it seems that RDR is getting developed on it But, the frame rate is complete shit at the moment. So, eventually we may be able to play the original RDR on a computer one day.

The fact GTA V came out on PC should mean RDR2 will too IMHO!

Question is when...

[MinionZombie]

The fact GTA V came out on PC should mean RDR2 will too IMHO!

Question is when...

I would be surprised if RDR2 didn't come out on PC, especially after so many complaints about how RDR1 never came out on PC. GTA V did well on PC, and it'd make sense for Rockstar to have thought about that for RDR2 from early on. The release will be staggered, no doubt, but that was always the case ... the likes of Vice City and San Andreas came out on PC six months after their console debut dates.

I reckon in the next few months we'll hear something more solid about it, and a PC release of RDR2 inside a year.

[shootemindehead]

The fact GTA V came out on PC should mean RDR2 will too IMHO!

Question is when...

As far as I know, Rockstar have only kept two titles from a PC release, RDR being one of them.

[MinionZombie]

Apparently the story campaign is 60 hours long. It was 65 hours, but they trimmed out a subplot involved a second love interest for the main character. They took that out likely for streamlining purposes so you can focus on the main love interest that'll be in the game.

I've also heard that you have to keep your weapons up-to-snuff via maintenance. Hopefully, as I've said before, these 'character management' aspects (like washing and eating) won't become a chore (I quickly got sick to death of having to keep buying bullet proof vests in GTA V only for them to get shredded in seconds). Weapons can also be modified both functionally and cosmetically, and the more you use a weapon the more proficient your character gets with that particular weapon.

[MinionZombie]

IGN REVIEW - 10/10 "Masterpiece"

yoFvVAMcwOE

*edit*

And a few tips for gameplay...

3ajKFg0HRU0

[Neil]

Now... WHEN IS THIS OUT ON THE PC!??!?!?

[MinionZombie]

Okay, so I've played a few hours so far and have got into the free roaming (the first 3 to 4 hours are linear as you're introduced to some base mechanics and story and characters). The amount of detail is extraordinary and once again the art direction is fantastic. There's some nice dialogue, too, with a subtle wit underlying it.

I do have one gripe - there's a barrage of instructions and controls to learn from the get-go that it's a bit overwhelming. Now, it takes a while to 'get into' every game and its mechanics/controls, but I think they needed to ease you in a smidge more but also streamline a few things here and there. It comes down to the 'management' side of things with supplies for you, your horse, and the whole damn camp (to which you must contribute - so a few supplies or doing some chores like chopping wood will keep you in their good graces) ... but, for instance, my horse is dirty and I need to brush it - but I don't have a brush. So I went to the general store expecting to buy one there, but there is no brush to buy rather surprisingly! I'll have to run it through a river and clean it off that way, but sometimes you're not near a body of water, you know?

But that's really my own gripe and compared to the sheer scale of awesomeness, it's not a biggy, but it's still something that I'm surprised play testers didn't pick up on and suggest a bit of streamlining. Even very small and subtle things like the 'learn more about this thing you just did' menu - you can't one-button your way back to the game, you have to press "B" for "Back" like 4 or 5 times, retracing through the menu tree, before you return to the game (unlike with the map - two button pushes to get in, one button push to get out).

Oh, and I seem to be confused over the cinematic camera - I thought you could just press "A" and you could 'watch a journey with your controller down', but everytime I try to do that the horse just slows down and stops of its own volition, so I don't know what's going on there. Similarly, there have been times when I've been prompted to "RT to Aim" (when Aim is Left Trigger) ... this is one of those 'getting used to the control scheme' snaffus, because it must be a gentle half-press or tap to do so, as I accidentally shot a guard I was bargaining with (I had to kill him in the end "I thought we had a deal!" he yelped). Left Button unholsters/holsters your weapon, then it's Left Trigger for Aim (because when holstered Left Trigger gives you contextual chat with the NPCs - greet/antagonise/threaten/bargain/etc).

So it does feel as if there's too many commands, not enough buttons at times.

Now - back to the good stuff (of which there is a bounty). The weaving of cinematic moments into the actual gameplay works wonderfully. Long gone are the days when you'd come out of a conspicuous cinematic sequence and be facing the wrong damn way getting shot in the back (as in other games I've played, at least). Now it flows smoothly.

Random events are interesting - when one of our gang (a lady of ill repute) needed assistance with a rowdy customer, I had to go to Room 2B, but figured I'd just have a look at the other doors - I busted into 2A and a man was taking a dump in the commode. He panicked and screamed for me to get out, grumbling about no sense of privacy. :lol::lol:

One annoying one saw me attempt to help a man being menaced by two O'Driscoll scumbags. I punched them both out but I must have interceded too slow as the man I sought to help was dead. I looted the bodies (always loot the bodies for free stuff like supplies and money and ammo) but accidentally picked up the poor victim - which a bystander saw and thought I'd murdered the man! WTF?!?!?! Off he runs, so I chase him to try and intimidate him, but he hoofs it into the bank and as he's telling a guard I accidentally punch the guard out and get a bounty on my head. So I had to spunk $40 up the wall to clear my name at the local post office! Grrrr!

Top Tip - at Arthur's bed area in the camp, make sure you assign winter clothing to your horse (so when you return to a cold area you can change clothes into something more suitable and not freeze to death).

It's still all very new and fresh, of course, so there's a lot still to get into and understand and feel comfortable with (muscle memory, understanding the navigation of menus and sub-menus, getting used to the myriad food/drink/tonics/potions for you and your horse and how to access them etc).

[shootemindehead]

Neil's going to hate you.

[bassman]

I agree with pretty much all of that. I also don’t seem to be connecting with the Arthur character as much as I had for John in the first game, but that could change as the story goes.

[MinionZombie]

Starting to get the hang of the controls a little bit more, but there's still a lot of detail to get into. I discovered that you get a horse brush through a mission (where you are introduced to the stables mechanic - buying, selling, and storing horses), so that's one mystery solved.

The health and stamina meters are a smidge confusing. You've got an outer line as well as an inner core, and I don't really understand why or what for, and I assume it's bad to have a red core even though you've got a full white line, but I don't know why. Seems needlessly complex.

Another thing that doesn't help when learning the ropes is NPCs talking extensively while you're trying to read the instructions in the top left!!! Again, this is a minor gripe, but damn, weren't the people designing these moments thinking about that stuff? Did no play tester pipe up and say "hey, maybe pausing the action - or at least having NPCs shut the fudge up - while the instructions are on screen, would be a good idea?"

I took Arthur to the hotel and had a bath for 50 cents, and then for another 50 cents you can have a lady come in and wash you - and fun detail is being able to chit chat with her (or you can say no talking). Another random encounter of sorts was me entering a room in which a cowboy was about to entertain a lady, I excused myself, but then went in again to mess with him, at which point he stormed out after me and started a fight - he lost. :lol:

Apparently if you get drunk there are some funny interactions to be had in the saloons, so I must try that out, and I've read that if Arthur hasn't slept in a while he'll appear somewhat tired and groggy - slumped shoulders and such.

I know what you mean about Arthur, at this stage anyway, because he doesn't quite have a clear outlook yet. John Marston (good to see him back in this game in a younger incarnation) had a clear want and need - he wanted to just step away from the life and be with his family, but he needed to help the government track down the remaining gang members in order to do it. With Arthur it's not quite clear yet what he wants and needs.

That said, the various personalities in the camp add a sense of community that you don't usually get in these games, a little family of sorts, so that's nice. Subtle details, like when you first go to the town of Valentine and take the ladies along with you - they're singing in the back of the cart, but one of them gets the lyrics wrong and they all break up giggling - little moments like that add so much life into the world, you know?

Another nice aspect is team work - if you're accompanied during a mission you can choose to take the lead or delegate tasks to the tagalong NPCs.

- - - Updated - - -

Continuing to find my feet with the game.

There are some quite cinematic moments that spring up on you, for instance - in an early mission centering around the gang member Micah:

You go to an idylic town and end up having to busy Micah out of jail - you shoot your way through the town, but in-so doing you incur a wanted level in that county (if you go back to the town within a certain time you'll get in trouble, but also if you stay within the red borders of the county you'll suddenly find yourself shooting back at bounty hunters at random times (this happened to me on my way across the border).

Anyway, prior to that me and Micah head out of town and loose the law from the town. As we're having a conversation, in which Micah is talking about not returning to Dutch and the camp just yet because he's been a "bad boy", it was now night time and a storm was brewing - big streaks of lightning way off in the distance. Very moody.


Another early mission, this time involving gang member Lenny, was hilarious:

To cheer him up I take him to town for a drink - or several - and we end up getting absolutely hammered. Hijinks ensue which had me chuckling away. Barging in on a courtesan riding cowboy atop a, well, cowboy, was a surprise ... as was the impromptu moment of Can-Can dancing.

You also see the big burly man you beat to a pulp in the previous encounter in that very saloon. I think you're supposed to keep "greeting" him as I didn't check that box on the mission debrief - the mission 'challenges' part, I mean. Anyway, that was a fun mission.


There's some surprising moments of moral quandary, too. One side quest involves you acting as the muscle for one of your gang's money lending side business - so you have to go and shake people down for the money they owe. Now, while one guy might be an asshole you don't mind chasing down, another guy couldn't speak English and was pleading with me as he didn't have the money. He consented to me taking valuables from the house, but was guarding a particular drawer - it had a gold wedding ring inside - now, I'd already found some silver earrings elsewhere so the debt was recouped, but I opted not to take the ring as I felt sorry for the guy.

Another random encounter involved lawmen taking a prisoner to jail in a horse-drawn prison cart, but he was pleading with me ... I wasn't sure what to do, could it be something more sinister? So I murdered the lawmen (negative impact to my reputation meter), but freed the prisoner who turned out to, yes, be a thief, but he alerts me to the house robbery mechanic ... so I wonder if that mechanic might not have been unlocked if I'd just let him go ... hmmm. Ironically I got a good impact on my rep meter from freeing him, lol!

Speaking of rep - top tip: be cordial with people all over the place. Some nice "greet" chit-chat actually ups your rep. I'm on the high end of the grey area, right now. Better rep gives you discounts and such, I think, and less trouble.

It's also wise to check various rooms inside buildings to find little bits and pieces, health tonics and the like, maybe some money or collectibles.

Another nifty detail I liked was a simple thing, but one which I've wanted to see fully implemented for a long time - the ability to see through windows (i.e. from outside to inside or vice versa). Indoors feels more connected with outdoors as a result.

[bassman]

Has there been any talk from Rockstar about doing another Undead Nightmare? While playing just now I was thinking that they could do some interesting survival things with this new scavaging and management system.

[MinionZombie]

Really enjoying the game and I've settled into the controls fairly well now, so I'm more at ease with the game.

There's so many groovy little details here and there. One example would be this - I was tasked with hijacking a cart of fuel oil and stashing it by a burned out cabin. I noticed the cabin had a ladder going down into a cellar, so went down and raided it - and by complete chance I noticed a small mark on one of the wooden shelves - an arrow - so I followed it to the other side of the cellar (near the ladder) and found in the wall a hidden stash with like $50 inside IIRC. Such a neat little detail that you could so easily miss, but if you happen upon it there's a little reward - fantastic.

The camp has turned out to be a great addition as you really get to know all the different characters (as long as you talk to them, of course!). Upgrading the camp itself doesn't have as many visual changes as I would have liked, but it's still good to feel like you're helping provide for the group (and that they, too, chip into the pot!) I rescued one of our gang and that night at camp there was a big shindig, so you go around drinking and singing and dancing with the camp folks, then dawn comes up and people are hungover and sleepy hehe. I then spent the rest of the following day debriefing from the night before, hehe.

It's also nice to see John Marston, Abigail, and their boy Jack as members of the gang as you get much more of a sense of their relationship, at least at this point about 12 years prior to RDR, anyway. In fact it's nice to just wander around and talk to the likes of Mary-Beth and Karen and Uncle and so on, just to see what's going on with them. There's lots of little mini subplots going on with interpersonal things that are really nice touches.


Has there been any talk from Rockstar about doing another Undead Nightmare? While playing just now I was thinking that they could do some interesting survival things with this new scavaging and management system.

No talk as yet as far as I know. They're probably focusing on the online aspect right now before it launches in a few weeks, and then after that there'll surely be the PC port to think about - but maybe connected with that, or at least after it maybe?

[kidgloves]

Fantastic game. 31 hours clocked already.
On the auto travel cinematic A button thing, it works outside of a mission journey. I guess they want your attention on missions as a lot of the narrative is imparted that way

[MinionZombie]

Fantastic game. 31 hours clocked already.
On the auto travel cinematic A button thing, it works outside of a mission journey. I guess they want your attention on missions as a lot of the narrative is imparted that way

Ohhhhhh... - it was set up a bit confusingly in the opening hours of the game, so I didn't get that it was only for 'non-mission' moments. I tried that out and sure enough.

I've now entered Chapter 3. Just when I was needing a change of scenery, bam, I get one, and it's cool to see the subtle changes in the environment. I'm now further south on the map - so it's a mix of lush green and dark dirts, but also swirling winds of dust, and southern hicks and all sorts. Suffice it to say, I'm thoroughly into this game now, including the character of Arthur Morgan who is becoming a bit more fleshed-out now ... but he has to be somewhat withdrawn as you, as the player, needs to insert yourself into that role as well. There needs to be room to let the player fill Arthur's boots as well, but with various missions along the way so far we've been picking away at that aspect nicely.

I also like how you can return to locations and more events will transpire. For example, there's a cabin north of Strawberry that is one of the home robbery scenarios, but I went there alone and there's this cranky old bag of a woman who thinks I'm there to deliver stolen goods - but I'm not. Behind her back I steal a bunch of stuff and get a new shotgun down in the cellar. She gets pissed off and I let her ride away on her donkey to 'get her boys'. A while later I returned to the location and voices were coming from inside - her sons had arrived - I go to the door, get knocked back, and it's into Dead Eye mode. I slaughter the entire family of thieves and loot the place once again.

Similarly, there's a house being built a little south west of Valentine. Three beats of that story involve defending the place, then picking up some wood for the place (you can go get the wood yourself from the lumber mill - another location with multiple events - and pay $75 for the wood), then you return once more and get your share of the sale ($150). These things make the world breathe and feel more real, as if it's living while you're not watching, you know?

I've only had a handful of 'spell breaking', as-it-were, such as the repetition of an event outside of Strawberry where some traveller has got himself lost and I need to lead him back to Strawberry. He mentions some mystery regarding the mayor's wife, but I've not figured out anything about that subplot yet. Not sure how that plays out or when, or how to initiate it.

[MinionZombie]

Wow ... so I'm about 100 hours deep now and I've just completed Chapter 6...

CHAPTER 6 ENDING TALK - SPOILERS AHEAD!
Holy moly ... I'd grown so attached to Arthur Morgan, but at least I got the High Honour Good ending where he dies looking at the sunrise.

Now, apparently you do eventually get 'your' stuff back at some point during the two Epilogues - so all your/Arthur's collectibles and weapons and such can be reclaimed - but it's a little gutwrenching when you take over as John ... ... but in some ways it's kind of like a precursor to RDR1 and it's like a bonus game, a game-after-the-game, more story left to tell.

Another thing that really got me was the death of my horse in the climactic moments just before you flee up that rocky mountain. I'd had that horse throughout the entire game, so when he's actually shot and dies - and when Arthur lovingly whispers "thank you" into his ear - man ... the first course in a major feels meal that was to come!

The way Rockstar have managed to get the player to be emotionally invested in the various members of the Van Der Linde gang is incredible. If you spend the time with them in camp, talking to them, sitting around the campfire, paying attention to the story missions etc, you really get hooked in.

The main thing missing in RDR1 was a sense of context - you were tasked with tracking down the remaining members of the gang (or the bad ones at least), but you didn't really have the backstory to get invested in ... however, RDR2 provides that context and backstory in spades. It's an epic, a masterpiece, and it breathes new life into the story of RDR1, injecting so much tragedy and betrayal into the events of the 2010 game.

[Neil]

Sorry... Can we close this thread.... Until it's out on PC? ;)

[shootemindehead]

It's gas...

Every time I see and update to this thread that has Neil on it, I know there's a 90% chance that it will have the letters P and C in it. :D

[MinionZombie]

The insane amount of detail in this game is ... well ... insane. There's a whole bunch that I've found and seen along the way - but it feels like I've only scratched the surface. I've seen videos online showing little things like a ghost train and a 'vampire' in Saint Denis.

Hell, even when shopkeepers reference recent events - or recognise you (sometimes commenting on your changing appearance) - adds to the immersion! The amount of thought Rockstar has put into this game is mind boggling, no wonder if took 7 years to make - but it was well worth the time, that's for sure!


Sorry... Can we close this thread.... Until it's out on PC? ;)

Tough titties. Don't like it? Don't clicky. :D

Seriously, though, when you do get to play it I think you'll have a lot of fun.


It's gas...

Every time I see and update to this thread that has Neil on it, I know there's a 90% chance that it will have the letters P and C in it. :D

:lol::lol::lol:

[kidgloves]

This game is a masterpiece.
A piece of multimedia art.
I kid you not.

[MinionZombie]

This game is a masterpiece.
A piece of multimedia art.
I kid you not.

Damn straight. It deserves to win all the awards.

How far through the story are you? Use "spoiler tags" on here.

I finished Epilogue II - and therefore the entire story mode - the other day. So far I've pumped about 120 hours into this game and there's still areas of the map I've not been to yet. I think I've pretty much done all the strangers and I certainly did all the side missions and story missions, so now it's about exploration and just enjoying the world, mopping up any bounties or stagecoach tip-offs and such.

I'm using some video guides to track down certain details or achievements, such as the one for visiting the graves of every one of your fallen comrades - even including the two who die at the very beginning/just before the game gets going.

Anyway, masterful storytelling and characterisation in this game. I found myself really attached to the characters and it works wonderfully well if you put the time in to talk to everyone in the camp and notice those little details along the way, but even then there'll be little details you might miss (two of the folks in the camp were having a fling and I never knew about it - I only found out when browsing through YouTube videos and saw it play out there, haha!)

Sometimes it's nice to go into first person mode during a conversation with someone - there's all these nice little details in their facial expressions that you don't get so much in third person (although, clearly, third person is the way to go generally). But in those still, quiet moments, I just realised the other day that it's nice to sit and talk with a character in 1st person mode.

Now ... off to find more of these bizarre little hidden details! :cool:

[kidgloves]

I got to chapter 4 then started again and it played out differently 2nd time around. Strangers, missions etc spawn in different places, at different times in different order. It's mind blowing the way it's structured. I go off on huge tangents of fishing, hunting, searching for treasure etc. Stumbled upon a random gold mine the other day just by being curious and paying attention to a cables direction. I'm not reading tips or following guides just free roam. I'm 152 hours on the clock so far. Im on Chapter 4 which is how far I got first time around. I'm already looking forward to starting again.
This is going to be a 100% completion game for me. Gold medals. 1000 gamer points.
I'm probably going to go through it in first person only as well.
Then there's online.
Oh my.
Life is great

- - - Updated - - -

RDR1 remaster coming as DLC?

https://www.fraghero.com/red-dead-glitch-hinting-red-dead-redemption-remaster-dlc/

[MinionZombie]

Why did you stop at Chapter 4 and restart the game? :confused:

And where's this gold mine? :shifty:

As for that link ... nah ... that video looks fake or the "come on now" is just an NPC. While RDR1 was great, there were some bits that were a bit iffy or slowed things down too much, so I'm not sure about playing it all over again (I already played it twice, hehe). But considering how RDR1 ended, I don't fancy going through the bummer of it all again. :D

It is interesting how RDR2 benefits RDR1, though. People you first met in the previous game now take on new shades in RDR2. I'd actually forgotten a lot about RDR1, so I was discovering things all over again, or certain characters who will become enemies in RDR1 I was just viewing as camp mates with nothing outside of RDR2 colouring my interactions with them, which was cool.

[Neil]

God I hate you lot...

Hopefully on PC next year!

[MinionZombie]

Easily the best game of this current generation, and quite possibly Rockstar's best game yet.

The amount of detail is stunning. Sometimes with open world games you kind of run out of stuff to do, or things to see/hear in the world itself - not so with RDR2 - it feels more like a case of you'll never find/see/hear every single thing, so the open world feels incredibly rich.

Just when I thought I'd run out of Strangers, I found two more last night!

[kidgloves]

I restarted cause I went passed a part of the story where I was distracted and it made a decision for me that I wouldn't have made. Didn't have other saves. Be interesting when I get to that part again to see how it plays out this time.
The gold mine is northwest of Strawberry. It's a cave where you had to duel with a bounty early on. Just look around. It looks collapsed but isn't. Easily missed.

Just buy an Xbox One X Neil. You've already got the telly. The X version is borderline gaming pc standard. The weather effects, lighting etc make the environment seem alive.

[kidgloves]

Now confirmed on pc Neil

https://www.pcgamer.com/why-you-should-be-excited-about-red-dead-redemption-2-on-pc/

[MinionZombie]

PC trailer:

SXvQ1nK4oxk

[Neil]

Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes!

I hope they've done a good conversion and got rid of the selection wheel etc for the PC.

[kidgloves]

Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes!

I hope they've done a good conversion and got rid of the selection wheel etc for the PC.

Well?!!!!!

[Neil]

Well?!!!!!

LOL! Not got it yet :)

[MinionZombie]

LOL! Not got it yet :)

Crack on, boah, it's a wonderful game.

_qbP9i1bECo

I've been wanting to go back and replay some of the missions, but haven't done so yet. Still, though, I got 130 hours out of my playthrough and 90% completion (100% story completion).

[Neil]

Just too expensive for me at the moment (on Steam)... Waiting for it to drop...

[shootemindehead]

Got this on a Steam deal.

Played through the first one again for the first time since it came out. Still a good game, but one with zero challenge in it really. And it lacks the laughs and outright silliness that GTA brings to the table.

Anyway, RDR2 is a beast to try and run. I have a decent rig, but a fairly old graphics card. It's handled everything else I've thrown at it with relative ease, but RDR2 just laughed and said "you're not running this in 1080p". But even at 720p, the game looks pretty good. Can't see any jaggies and I get a constant 40fps with no stutters, so it's all good.

But, I think you'd need a graphics card with around 8GB VRAM on board if you want to get the absolute best out of how RDR2 looks. So, it might be time for old Tony to start looking around for a new card.

Honestly can't say I'm too impressed with the gameplay so far, But I am only about 30 minutes in. I'm sure things will pick up once it gets going.

[Tricky]

Got this on a Steam deal.

Played through the first one again for the first time since it came out. Still a good game, but one with zero challenge in it really. And it lacks the laughs and outright silliness that GTA brings to the table.

Anyway, RDR2 is a beast to try and run. I have a decent rig, but a fairly old graphics card. It's handled everything else I've thrown at it with relative ease, but RDR2 just laughed and said "you're not running this in 1080p". But even at 720p, the game looks pretty good. Can't see any jaggies and I get a constant 40fps with no stutters, so it's all good.

But, I think you'd need a graphics card with around 8GB VRAM on board if you want to get the absolute best out of how RDR2 looks. So, it might be time for old Tony to start looking around for a new card.

Honestly can't say I'm too impressed with the gameplay so far, But I am only about 30 minutes in. I'm sure things will pick up once it gets going.

I'd definitely say stick with it. I enjoyed the whole thing but I know a lot of people complained that the start was slow while you're stuck out in the snow. Once you reach Valentine and can really start exploring the world and doing all the hunting, fishing, meeting various characters and getting involved in the side quests etc it gets really good. I played it on PS4 and it looked amazing on that so can imagine on a high end rig it will look stunning. I do have a high end PC myself although my graphics card is four years old now so thinking of ordering a RTX2080 to replace my GTX1080 as I'm starting to see lots of talk of ray tracing etc in newer games.

[ProfessorChaos]

I only sank a few hours into this before putting it in the back burner to try and clear out some of my backlog of games. honestly it just didn't really grab my attention like the first one did. I'm looking forward to getting around to it one of these days but I'm not really in any hurry.

[MinionZombie]

RDR2 starts off slow - it's about 4 hours of gameplay before it starts getting underway, really. It spends that time introducing the main mechanics and the characters - then it starts broadening out a great deal. There's a boatload of different controls to learn in the game (on my first few hours with the game it was a bit of a chore trying to remember them all, but then muscle memory kicks in).

I got absolutely sucked into the game once it opened up. Got wrapped up in the characters, the story, the game world, exploring and so on - just like I had done with RDR1, but moreso. On my original playthrough of the game I clocked in about 120 hours. Then I returned to it earlier this year for just a bit of playing around and got about another 30 hours out of it (I had intended to replay certain missions, but got caught up in just exploring again and doing little collectible missions that I'd not really done before, hunting legendary animals, or just playing cards etc) - when I came back to it I discovered a photo mode had been added, so I spent a fair bit of time just enjoying that and getting arty.

I've still got it installed so will likely return to it at some point - although right now I've got other things in line (I just started Yakuza 0 yesterday, and then I also bought DiRT Rally 2.0 GotY Edition in a sale at 60% off).

[shootemindehead]

I'd definitely say stick with it. I enjoyed the whole thing but I know a lot of people complained that the start was slow while you're stuck out in the snow. Once you reach Valentine and can really start exploring the world and doing all the hunting, fishing, meeting various characters and getting involved in the side quests etc it gets really good. I played it on PS4 and it looked amazing on that so can imagine on a high end rig it will look stunning. I do have a high end PC myself although my graphics card is four years old now so thinking of ordering a RTX2080 to replace my GTX1080 as I'm starting to see lots of talk of ray tracing etc in newer games.

Oh I'll sticking with it Tricky, no bloody fear. I spose I was just expecting to put it on last night and have a mosy around the map, just to check things out. A bit you can in the first game. But that's not possible because it's like Vladivostok outside.

My GPU is my bottleneck as well.

[Neil]

Waiting for a sensible price on PC...

[kidgloves]

Free with Xbox game pass now. Not on PC though

[shootemindehead]

So, what is it about this game?

I just cannot seem to get into it. I feel like Rockstar was trying to make it a sim of sorts and forgot the "fun" elements that make their games great craic to play. The controls are clunky as hell too.

I've gone through the starter section and I'm at the horseshoe camp, or whatever it's called, and have been on a wander a few times. But it all feels like activities rather than gameplay so far. Plus, I know the game has been lauded for its visuals, but TBH, I find it a bit of a bloom filled mess most of the time. Everything is so SOFT. I've been messing around with the settings, but I cannot seem to get a sweet spot. FPS is fine. It's just the look of it that's bugging me at the moment.

Hoping it improves a bit.

[ProfessorChaos]

i'm kind of in the same boat. i just can't seem to put more than an hour or two into this game without getting bored to tears. i'm still at the horseshoe camp as well. my backlog of games is so big, i keep thinking my time would be better spent trying to knock out some shorter games rather than getting into a daunting one like rdr2.

I keep reading about how great the story is and how it's such a phenomenal experience but I guess i've not got to that point yet.

[MinionZombie]

The game definitely takes some getting in to - but one you get into it, you're into it. The opening few hours are quite gradually-paced, but soon enough things begin opening up more and more and you'll find yourself getting into the usual Rockstar japes (albeit in the western world - so it was never going to be like GTA V).

I do agree that the controls are troublesome - there's just so many of them that it really did take me several hours before I had them figured out, far longer than most other games. And the buttons have different operations for different contexts, too, so it's like layers of things.

There are certainly some 'sim like' things that don't really add much to the game, except some busy work (i.e. cleaning your gun) and I didn't get any additional immersion from that - about the only thing that added was a way to admire my weapon customisation.

RDR2 is a game you've got to stick with, you can't just hop in and out for an hour or two every couple of months. You've got to invest yourself in it and allow yourself to be immersed - then it works. GTA V, by comparison, lends itself much more to 'walk in, fuck shit up, walk out' type gameplay, whereas RDR was never that in the first place.

[shootemindehead]

Played a few more hours and I'm about 20% into the game, which is a considerable amount, and I'm still waiting for things to really kick off.

There are some funny bits here and there, but it really lacks the all out stupid nonsense that a GTA game has. But, in fairness, so did 'Red Dead Redemption' (what a dumb name for a game). It all ends up being just ok at the moment, which is very, very, far from the knock your socks off experience I was led to believe (and I was even tempering that expectation).

Staying out of the way of the law is a tough prospect too. Nearly everyone is a wanker. Go too close to someone in town and you'll end up in a gunfight, which brings the law down on you only. I managed to "acquire" a $60 bounty for just being bumped into and having to shoot my way out of some shithole. I then needed to spend a few hours collecting animal pelts to pay of the bounty, which was "fun" I suppose. But, yeh, controls are all levels of WTF. I was trying to track an animal and trying to remember what buttons to press, but ended up pulling my gun and shooting a guy, who was then subsequently found by someone else and then I was wanted for murder. :mad:

I'll finish it out, but to say that the first 20% of the game has been unsatisfactory would be an understatement. Glad I waited for a Steam sale.

[Neil]

The game definitely takes some getting in to - but one you get into it, you're into it. The opening few hours are quite gradually-paced, but soon enough things begin opening up more and more and you'll find yourself getting into the usual Rockstar japes (albeit in the western world - so it was never going to be like GTA V).

I do agree that the controls are troublesome - there's just so many of them that it really did take me several hours before I had them figured out, far longer than most other games. And the buttons have different operations for different contexts, too, so it's like layers of things.

There are certainly some 'sim like' things that don't really add much to the game, except some busy work (i.e. cleaning your gun) and I didn't get any additional immersion from that - about the only thing that added was a way to admire my weapon customisation.

RDR2 is a game you've got to stick with, you can't just hop in and out for an hour or two every couple of months. You've got to invest yourself in it and allow yourself to be immersed - then it works. GTA V, by comparison, lends itself much more to 'walk in, fuck shit up, walk out' type gameplay, whereas RDR was never that in the first place.

With the amount of time I have available now limited, and my patience generally reduced, I'm concerned now how much I'll get out of RDR2.

Note: I gave up early on GTA V...

[MinionZombie]

Yeah, it's probably not the right game for someone with limited game playing time...

Shoot - I got into some accidental shootouts at times. I ended up, somehow or other, in a disagreement out in the sticks with some disagreeable sort and I ended up killing him ... a witness saw me and I couldn't run up to them in time to bully them into staying quiet, so I shot them ... which was witnessed by another person in the other direction I'd just come from ... ... suffice it to say, there were about five bodies scattered around with me looting their corpses. :elol:

[shootemindehead]

So, I played this all day yesterday (which is testament to it of sorts, I spose) and it does get better. What helps it is it's total commitment to detail. While the gameplay has been a less than stellar experience, the world of RDR2 is absolutely sublime. Just wandering around the map is it's own joy. It's even better now that I turned off the volumetric effects and that hideous bloom has gone away. I can actually see the feckin detail now. :lol: and it is a lovely looking game for sure. I thought the original was great (albeit with console limitations), but on a PC is where something like this shines. Plus, I haven't seen any real FPS hits yet and my comp is about 6 years old.

I moseyed into Valentine and saw that the saloon I fucked up ages ago was repaired and back open for business. So I popped in there for a bit and ended up staying all (game) day playing poker, which is actually a challenge now (unlike in RDR 1). When is left the game, it was night time and the town looked fantastic. It was a nice clear night and everyone was getting langered. It was gas. I also got a train to St. Denis, which was an eye opener, cos I didn't think I could travel over the borders. But it seems that only Blackwater is in lockdown. So, the map has just got larger in a good way.

I'm over a quarter of the way through the game, though, and little of consequence has happened yet, so I'm still hoping for that to pick up. So far, though, detail wise the game is a winner. One of the nicest I have ever played. It's just the gameplay that's lacking.

[MinionZombie]

Now you're starting to get it, shoot - nice. :)

That wandering around aspect really makes this game sing. Early this year I went back to it, intending to replay some/all of the missions, but instead I had to get my head around the controls again - so just focused on wandering about looking for secret places and encounters etc, did a couple of bounties ... and then I just ended up continuing to do that for, literally, another 30-50 hours worth of gameplay! I was going around collecting cigarette cards and finding rock carvings and such, things I hadn't been all that arsed with (unless I stumbled across them) during my original play through. I think I've got like 95% completion now. Don't reckon I'll do that last five percent as it's really farty stuff - epic fetch quests for flower breeds and shit.

But yeah, those times just wandering about the map, taking a trip to Strawberry, say, and admiring the beauty of the place ... playing some poker or 21 ... going for a roam through the landscape ... encountering dangerous folks and gunning 'em down. Good times. :D

[Neil]

I believe they wanted this level of depth in Cyberpunk 2077, but didn't manged it...

MrUJJgppMn4

[shootemindehead]

Now you're starting to get it, shoot - nice. :)

That wandering around aspect really makes this game sing. Early this year I went back to it, intending to replay some/all of the missions, but instead I had to get my head around the controls again - so just focused on wandering about looking for secret places and encounters etc, did a couple of bounties ... and then I just ended up continuing to do that for, literally, another 30-50 hours worth of gameplay! I was going around collecting cigarette cards and finding rock carvings and such, things I hadn't been all that arsed with (unless I stumbled across them) during my original play through. I think I've got like 95% completion now. Don't reckon I'll do that last five percent as it's really farty stuff - epic fetch quests for flower breeds and shit.

But yeah, those times just wandering about the map, taking a trip to Strawberry, say, and admiring the beauty of the place ... playing some poker or 21 ... going for a roam through the landscape ... encountering dangerous folks and gunning 'em down. Good times. :D

Well, I "get it". There just isn't much of a game involved, which is its biggest drawback unfortunately.

The attention to detail is spectacular and it's impossible to be too critical of it. You could sit in St. Denis and just watch the NPC's come and go for hours and the sheer amount of chatter that goes on is staggering. There must have been hundreds of hours of yap recorded for that. I stopped in Rhodes for ages and just listened to all the guff and it was gas. I've also download a mod that allows you to change the passage of time, so 1 minute is 1 minute in real life is you wish. I set it 30 secs=1 min and I still spent hours just bumming around the place. I usually do stuff during the day and then head back to the camp at night. I haven't figured out fast travel yet, but I'm in no hurry to either as the map really isn't that big that you can't just horse it to anywhere.

But, while there's plenty of "stuff" to do, there's no gameplay or challenge to it and that's the problem I am having with RDR2. There's tons of "content" that you can, literally, spend hours doing or watching. But you'll walk away without having played a game.

[MinionZombie]

Well, I "get it". There just isn't much of a game involved, which is its biggest drawback unfortunately.

The attention to detail is spectacular and it's impossible to be too critical of it. You could sit in St. Denis and just watch the NPC's come and go for hours and the sheer amount of chatter that goes on is staggering. There must have been hundreds of hours of yap recorded for that. I stopped in Rhodes for ages and just listened to all the guff and it was gas. I've also download a mod that allows you to change the passage of time, so 1 minute is 1 minute in real life is you wish. I set it 30 secs=1 min and I still spent hours just bumming around the place. I usually do stuff during the day and then head back to the camp at night. I haven't figured out fast travel yet, but I'm in no hurry to either as the map really isn't that big that you can't just horse it to anywhere.

But, while there's plenty of "stuff" to do, there's no gameplay or challenge to it and that's the problem I am having with RDR2. There's tons of "content" that you can, literally, spend hours doing or watching. But you'll walk away without having played a game.

Fast Travel - it's an upgrade for your camp. Once you've unlocked that ability, one of the things you can do is unlock fast travel. The rest of the camp upgrades are mostly cosmetic IIRC and were underwhelming, but fast travel was definitely useful. You can also get a stage coach to act like a taxi - interact with it and choose where you wanna go for a price. Fast Travel points are generally limited to towns and settlements or railway stations, so you have to horse about still.

I don't really understand what you mean by it not being a "game". I was always engaged with it, I wasn't just watching a movie go by ... it's not like playing Yakuza 0 (which is one I'm still part-way through) where the cut scenes go on for feckin' ages, sometimes so long the controller switches off to save power! Sometimes when playing that game I do come away thinking 'how much did I actually just play during that hour?' ... RDR2, on the other hand, I was always actively playing it. So I don't get what you mean. :confused:

[shootemindehead]

Fast Travel - it's an upgrade for your camp. Once you've unlocked that ability, one of the things you can do is unlock fast travel. The rest of the camp upgrades are mostly cosmetic IIRC and were underwhelming, but fast travel was definitely useful. You can also get a stage coach to act like a taxi - interact with it and choose where you wanna go for a price. Fast Travel points are generally limited to towns and settlements or railway stations, so you have to horse about still.

Sure. I've played the first one. But you used to be able to just FT from your own campfire. In any case, I'm not too pushed about it. You can get from one end of the map to the other pretty quickly.


I don't really understand what you mean by it not being a "game". I was always engaged with it, I wasn't just watching a movie go by ... it's not like playing Yakuza 0 (which is one I'm still part-way through) where the cut scenes go on for feckin' ages, sometimes so long the controller switches off to save power! Sometimes when playing that game I do come away thinking 'how much did I actually just play during that hour?' ... RDR2, on the other hand, I was always actively playing it. So I don't get what you mean. :confused:

Well, there's just no challenge I suppose. It feels very passive at times. There's so little to the actual missions that I ended up just farting around the map. But, as I said, there wasn't much of a challenge in RDR either, nor in any other GTA type of thing and I've been playing them since it was a top down pixel game in the 90's. I suppose I'm just a bit jaded with the whole GTA type "game". They have their fun, in that they are experienced. But, I don't feel like I played an actual game in the same way as something like Total War, or Shadow Tactics, where I have to think about what I'm doing or where I'm going next.

That Yakuza thing sounds like something to be missed though. Long cut scenes is something I've long since tired of.

[MinionZombie]

Well, there's just no challenge I suppose. It feels very passive at times. There's so little to the actual missions that I ended up just farting around the map. But, as I said, there wasn't much of a challenge in RDR either, nor in any other GTA type of thing and I've been playing them since it was a top down pixel game in the 90's. I suppose I'm just a bit jaded with the whole GTA type "game". They have their fun, in that they are experienced. But, I don't feel like I played an actual game in the same way as something like Total War, or Shadow Tactics, where I have to think about what I'm doing or where I'm going next.

That Yakuza thing sounds like something to be missed though. Long cut scenes is something I've long since tired of.

Ah, so you find it too easy? I don't mind that, I'm not exactly a skilled game player, although I do wonder why these open world games don't have difficulty settings that could just tweak certain statistical things - how much damage you deal, how much damage the NPCs dish out, how effective health items are etc - so that it can be tweaked to each individual player. I utterly despise having to do things again and again in games - I remember getting frustratingly stuck at several points during Saints Row 2, and then it was just no fun any more until I finally, after so many attempts, managed to squeak past the bit that was holding me up. There was no sense of satisfaction, for me, from that, so I do prefer to be able to just play the damn game and enjoy the gameplay and the world and so on - but there should be options for players to change to suit themselves.

It's like "Control" - I really enjoyed that game, as I'm a big fan of Remedy, but I was so annoyed that they didn't include an "Easy" mode, because some of the side-bosses were so friggin' hard that I just had to avoid those side missions entirely, and one particular boss was such a massive pain in the balls that I was fuming when the same damn one turned up again in a side mission! Why not just include an "Easy" mode for those who want to choose it? They did the same thing with Alan Wake (a game I adore). Not everyone has an awful lot of skill at playing games, but they want to enjoy the gameplay, the characters, the story, the setting etc.

Give the player options to suit their abilities and style of play. Can't be that hard, can it?!

As for "Yakuza 0" - I am enjoying it, having sunk more than 40 hours into it so far, but it does frequently sink into annoyingly long cut scenes at times. Even interacting with the world around you there's so much 'nothing' dialogue filling up the space when you talk to folks - the writers really needed to edit it down, 'cos I'm finding myself just mashing the "A" button more and more, skim-reading the dialogue as there's so much of it ... but I want to understand the story so I sit through these exceedingly long cutscenes. When I'm just able to go around the game and play as I want, enjoying the open world, it is quite a lot of fun (if a bit repetitive at times). I've been dipping in and out of it.

Right now I've just started playing Doom Eternal ... ... not a fan of this new 'different kills to pick up different items: health/ammo/armour' bullshit ... ... needlessly complicates a winning formula. They should have a 'play it like Doom 2016' mode. I mean, christ, I'm on the easiest setting and I've been close to death numerous times, always running out of friggin' ammo - that's not fun. I wanna rage about, tooled up, killin' some demons. I don't see why they needed to piss about with the formula like they have. Still, early days on it at the moment (I'm only on level two), and I am getting entertainment out of it ... just less than I would have otherwise.

- - - Updated - - -

uE9lhFQlsPg

[shootemindehead]

Ah, so you find it too easy? I don't mind that, I'm not exactly a skilled game player, although I do wonder why these open world games don't have difficulty settings that could just tweak certain statistical things - how much damage you deal, how much damage the NPCs dish out, how effective health items are etc - so that it can be tweaked to each individual player. I utterly despise having to do things again and again in games - I remember getting frustratingly stuck at several points during Saints Row 2, and then it was just no fun any more until I finally, after so many attempts, managed to squeak past the bit that was holding me up. There was no sense of satisfaction, for me, from that, so I do prefer to be able to just play the damn game and enjoy the gameplay and the world and so on - but there should be options for players to change to suit themselves.

Umm..mildly unrewarding, rather than easy? I think it's very pedestrian? It's a game that I'll walk through from beginning to end without too much of a sweat, if you know what I mean. That doesn't mean that I think it's awful, however, and I have already sunk 60+hours into it over the Christmas holidays, mainly cos I've had bugger all else to do. So, in that respect it was worth the money I paid for it.

As for difficulty, most of the time that just means "more" and "harder to to kill" in video games which is the cheap way out. Things just become more annoying and not more difficult in a logical manner. So players get "stuck" as you say, which isn't the answer to the issue. These days gameplay is probably the most difficult thing to get right in any computer game and 'Red Dead Redemption 2' is no exception. It's entertaining though, and stuffed with detail - a lot of which many players won't even see. And there is activity galore, as I've already said. I spent 3 hours yesterday shooting birds for their feathers to improve my arrows. My wife thinks I'm mad.


Give the player options to suit their abilities and style of play. Can't be that hard, can it?!

It's more difficult than you might think, Mini, and most of the time it constitutes merely using more bullets to kill something rather than making the AI smarter or allowing the player to use their own smarts.


Right now I've just started playing Doom Eternal ... ... not a fan of this new 'different kills to pick up different items: health/ammo/armour' bullshit ... ... needlessly complicates a winning formula. They should have a 'play it like Doom 2016' mode. I mean, christ, I'm on the easiest setting and I've been close to death numerous times, always running out of friggin' ammo - that's not fun. I wanna rage about, tooled up, killin' some demons. I don't see why they needed to piss about with the formula like they have. Still, early days on it at the moment (I'm only on level two), and I am getting entertainment out of it ... just less than I would have otherwise.

Haven't played a Doom game in about 15 years, so I don't know what they're like now. But I kinda "grew out" of FPS games. However, I'd like to see a situation whereby if you have to husband your ammo so rigorously, then enemies should be easier to kill (headshots) or, at least, able to get around by stealth. That requires true open ended gameplay though and that's not easy to do. Especially in a game that's on the rails like 'Doom' where everything is essentially pew pew.


I think the most enjoyment I have ever got out of a game (in modern times anyway) has been 'DayZ', despite all of its many flaws. It's been the game where I have had the most tense moments I have ever experienced in a computer game and there are moments of "achievement" too, like just staying alive for month :lol: . It can be incredibly frustrating at times as well and some of the mechanics are just silly. It can also get a bit boring even. But, there is nothing like it that I have played. Single player or multiplayer.

[MinionZombie]

I know what you mean about trying to vary the gameplay or make it more interesting. Open world games do tend to resort to 'go here and kill everyone' or 'go here, get this, bring it back' missions.

You can make those good, by making the mission a good spectacle, but the actual requirements of the mission can be very simple (the 'go here and kill everyone' thing). Missions where you don't need to kill folks, but need to do some other requirements can make things more interesting, especially if they build to a bigger mission (the heists in GTA V added a frisson of something a bit more complicated, with options to approach loud or quiet ... even if you'll inevitably get into a big shoot out in the end anyway).

I think it'd be nice to interact more with the world around you in order to achieve some specific results - to affect the world around you (e.g. in GTA V you had the stock market, but it didn't really make any sense at all and had bugger all effect on the world around it, or the world had bugger all effect on the stocks). To be able to manipulate how the NPCs think ... a game like RDR could have had a whole section where it's kind of like Yojimbo/Fistful of Dollars, and you could choose how you wanted to play people off against each other by picking from a selection of options.

Of course, that does mean working in various paths, but it would lead to replayability as well. I do like that Rockstar finally added in the option to replay specific missions from the menu a while back, rather than having to do the whole thing again.

I still think having scaled difficulty - damage dealt and taken, amount of ammo picked up, how reactive and aggressive enemies are etc - could be factored into a game like RDR2 relatively simply, for those who want that, or indeed, to make them a bit easier for those who don't have the player skill for it. I circle back to my previous point about Alan Wake and Control not having an "easy" mode, it was just "normal" and up. Very silly, made no sense to me at all, even moreso with Control as they simply didn't have a reasonable excuse for that and many more people got pissed off with sudden spikes in difficulty with Control, even in "normal" difficulty.

[shootemindehead]

I know what you mean about trying to vary the gameplay or make it more interesting. Open world games do tend to resort to 'go here and kill everyone' or 'go here, get this, bring it back' missions.

You can make those good, by making the mission a good spectacle, but the actual requirements of the mission can be very simple (the 'go here and kill everyone' thing). Missions where you don't need to kill folks, but need to do some other requirements can make things more interesting, especially if they build to a bigger mission (the heists in GTA V added a frisson of something a bit more complicated, with options to approach loud or quiet ... even if you'll inevitably get into a big shoot out in the end anyway).

There was a great game out about 20 years ago called 'Hidden and Dangerous' where you played as a squad of Commandos or SAS. Basically you had to infiltrate some German strong hold to fuck things up in some way. But getting seen meant everything got much, much harder and the mission became extremely difficult to pull off without casualties or failure and once your squad members were dead, they were dead. It could also impact future missions. If Jimmy is using a suppressed weapon and gets nabbed by Gerrie, you get it in the next couple of missions. You had to actually think about what your were doing and what the next move would be. But it wasn't on the rails. There were numerous ways you could complete a mission. I'd really like to see more games of that type made.

Unfortunately, "kill everyone" seems to be the default for video games just as much today as it was when 'Space Invaders' was made.


I think it'd be nice to interact more with the world around you in order to achieve some specific results - to affect the world around you (e.g. in GTA V you had the stock market, but it didn't really make any sense at all and had bugger all effect on the world around it, or the world had bugger all effect on the stocks). To be able to manipulate how the NPCs think ... a game like RDR could have had a whole section where it's kind of like Yojimbo/Fistful of Dollars, and you could choose how you wanted to play people off against each other by picking from a selection of options.

I thought that this was going to be an option with the two plantation families near Rhodes. I haven't had too much interaction with them yet, but they seem to be right bunch of wankers. :lol:


Of course, that does mean working in various paths, but it would lead to replayability as well.

And this is the problem really. It requires a much deeper development time to design allowances for multiple play styles and furthermore, the time to QA each path would have to increase too. I used to work in QA and there was never enough time. Everything was dumped on you and you were always at the end of a deadline too. It's that type of approach QA that leads to the farcical nonsense we've seen in the likes of 'Cyberpunk 2077'. And with the depth and detail that goes into a modern video game, adding yet more dev process into the mix could mean that the average game would take 5 or 6 years to complete fully. RDR2 was over 7 years in the making and that was designed on top of the usual Rockstar type of GTA game that they've been doing for 2 decades mow.

[Tricky]

I did like the way you can go about different scenarios in RDR2 like the random encounter in Valentine where the prostitute has murdered a client at the saloon, and it can play out in a variety of different ways. You can help her dispose of the body like she asks you to, or you can run to the sheriffs office and report the crime instead, at which point you and the sheriff go back and arrest her and it turns out she's a serial killer and there's various lines of dialogue from both of them once she's been put in the cells. Later on you can then watch her hang, or if you feel guilty about that shoot the rope before she hangs and she runs off. It's all smoke and mirrors but it made the game feel more believable and like your choices matter. Another time I rescued a woman from a robbery out in the wilderness, and she asked me to take her back home. I wasn't that far away from something else I wanted to see so thought it wouldn't make a difference if I went there first, so I set off in that direction with her on the back of the horse and it wasn't long before she started panicking about where I was taking her so she jumped off the horse and ran away screaming something about me being dodgy.

[MinionZombie]

Ah, yes, the killer prostituate of Valentine ... I helped her with the body (tossing it to the pigs so they could eat the evidence). I fell for her story, haha!

I saw a video of how it plays out alternatively with the hanging. Just a small bit of variation there, but as you say, it really does give some life to the world you're in while not getting so complicated for the folks making the game.

I loved all the random little moments you could stumble across, or certain characters - like the wounded civil war veteran - or, in a house on the edge of Valentine, at night, you might find a couple of guys peeping through a window. You walk up, they run off, you peep inside - and catch (IIRC) some bare-ass dude getting spanked by a woman. :lol:

I also liked how...

BIG STORY SPOILER!!!
After you take over as John and meet some of these random encounter people again (but for the first time as John), they'll all actually reference the demise of Arthur Morgan. You can feel the passage of time, feel the echoes of past actions and so forth. Initially I even wanted John to be wearing Arthur's hat, but it felt kinda wrong, so I made sure John looked like John did in RDR1.

[shootemindehead]

I didn't get to meet her. But I did find a mutilated body under a rail bridge and an Ozymandia's quote scrawled on rockface. That was just outside of Valentine. Haven't seen much more of that yet.

[MinionZombie]

I didn't get to meet her. But I did find a mutilated body under a rail bridge and an Ozymandia's quote scrawled on rockface. That was just outside of Valentine. Haven't seen much more of that yet.

Ah, yes, that's a separate subplot kind of a thing - there are several 'murder sites' around the map that you will come across, and once you have been to them all, IIRC, you put the clues together somehow and then you find the location of the killer who you can then confront.

I didn't bother with actually pieceing it together or finding all the locations by accident, I just used a video online to go everywhere, get the info, and then go to the killer's lair, haha.

[shootemindehead]

So after 100+ hours the game has become fucked.

I can't progress the Blessed are the peacemakers mission, where you, Micah and Dutch go to meet Colm O'Driscoll and you get caught and tied up. So, you're upside down and you have to swing to reach an object that will cut you free. But if I hit A or D, Arthur drops to the ground and the game crashes. If I use an XBOX 360 Dpad, he drops to the ground and the mission can't be finished.

Serious, I'm ready to start flipping tables.

Anyone experienced this and is there a workaround?

[Neil]

So after 100+ hours the game has become fucked.

I can't progress the Blessed are the peacemakers mission, where you, Micah and Dutch go to meet Colm O'Driscoll and you get caught and tied up. So, you're upside down and you have to swing to reach an object that will cut you free. But if I hit A or D, Arthur drops to the ground and the game crashes. If I use an XBOX 360 Dpad, he drops to the ground and the mission can't be finished.

Serious, I'm ready to start flipping tables.

Anyone experienced this and is there a workaround?

That sounds bad, especially given the game has been out ages for this sort of issues to have been resolved?

[MinionZombie]

So after 100+ hours the game has become fucked.

I can't progress the Blessed are the peacemakers mission, where you, Micah and Dutch go to meet Colm O'Driscoll and you get caught and tied up. So, you're upside down and you have to swing to reach an object that will cut you free. But if I hit A or D, Arthur drops to the ground and the game crashes. If I use an XBOX 360 Dpad, he drops to the ground and the mission can't be finished.

Serious, I'm ready to start flipping tables.

Anyone experienced this and is there a workaround?

I've never heard of that particular thing - are you running the game with all updates installed? Are there are any recent bug reports regarding it? Have you tried doing that mission over again? Rather than using the D-Pad on a controller, how about the left movement stick?

[shootemindehead]

That sounds bad, especially given the game has been out ages for this sort of issues to have been resolved?


I've never heard of that particular thing - are you running the game with all updates installed? Are there are any recent bug reports regarding it? Have you tried doing that mission over again? Rather than using the D-Pad on a controller, how about the left movement stick?

So, after a lot of buggering around, I found out that the my save had become corrupted because of a mod I was using (so duh on me), so I nuked that bleeder and I could swing for the metal file and cut myself loose.

I feel like this guy...

BWRGE21DH54

[shootemindehead]

So, I'm coming to the end of this now, with a couple of missions to go before it's over and while I still think my initial criticisms are valid, it's certainly been a great ride, pardon the pun. It's such a fantastically realised game and there's a lot to enjoy in it, despite the "unsatisfactory" characteristic of a lot of the missions. Plus, with over 150 hours of play time involved, you certainly get your money's worth, that's for sure. The detail is incredible and sometimes, you just find yourself looking at things happening around you. The sound design is an absolute triumph too. I haven't heard a better and more convincing use of audio in a game, definitely not for some time anyway, and the voice acting is top notch. The story is pretty great, too, in spite of it being a prequel and would actually make for a decent movie if handled right. And Molly's correct, Dutch Van Der Linde IS a bastard. :lol:

My biggest issue is with the perfunctory "go here, do this" nature of the mission game play though. But that may be down to me being just a bit jaded with Rockstar's shtick maybe. I mean nothing has changed in their GTA style games since GTA III and that was 20 years ago. But, despite that, it was still a fantastic piece of entertainment, once you're beyond the first few hours of tutorial stuff in the snow and you get used to the clunky controls.

Strangely enough, in spite of my mild dissatisfaction with the game's mission structure and quality, I want to dive back into GTA V again as it's been a few years. I might see if that's available for cheap in Steam. I have it there on the playstation, but I can't be arsed digging it out. Shit, I might even have a punt on San Andreas cos that was gas.

All in all, RDR2 was pretty great all round and I'm kinda a little bummed out that it's drawing to close now. But these things all have to come to an end. I can, however, see myself returning to this in a few years time, when I have forgotten most of it. :lol:

[MinionZombie]

When you say you're drawing to an end, do you mean in Chapter 6, or the Epilogue?

[shootemindehead]

The last couple of missions for Arthur. I know there's a bit of John in the Epilogue. Don't know how much though.

[MinionZombie]

The last couple of missions for Arthur. I know there's a bit of John in the Epilogue. Don't know how much though.

The epilogue is a decent amount. It starts out slow, a bit of a breather, but you soon get all your stuff back.

[shootemindehead]

Can you do Arthur's side missions once he's brown bread and you're playing as John?

[MinionZombie]

Can you do Arthur's side missions once he's brown bread and you're playing as John?

Yeah, any side encounters and the like carry over, even collectible thingies - the dialogue even changes/references accordingly where applicable.

[shootemindehead]

Right so. There's a few things left to do then.

I'm onto John now.

[shootemindehead]

So...I finally completed this. The Epilogue is nearly a whole game itself. :lol:

Anyway, RDR2 will probably go down as one of the greats for me. But primarily for its story, atmosphere and attention to detail (all of which were fantastic) over the actual gameplay, which was pretty rudimentary. It's a massive game, though, and anyone with an actual life will find it difficult to experience everything that it has to offer. I've managed to rack up over 200 hours in it and if COVID wasn't happening, I'd imagine I'd still only be about half way through it at the moment. I still have a lot of the challenges to complete and stuff like bounty hunting, but the story's over. I might pop in to fart about with those at some point.

Right now, I'm looking for something else. Think I might have a punt on Hell Let Loose.

[Neil]

So...I finally completed this. The Epilogue is nearly a whole game itself. :lol:

Anyway, RDR2 will probably go down as one of the greats for me. But primarily for its story, atmosphere and attention to detail (all of which were fantastic) over the actual gameplay, which was pretty rudimentary. It's a massive game, though, and anyone with an actual life will find it difficult to experience everything that it has to offer. I've managed to rack up over 200 hours in it and if COVID wasn't happening, I'd imagine I'd still only be about half way through it at the moment. I still have a lot of the challenges to complete and stuff like bounty hunting, but the story's over. I might pop in to fart about with those at some point.

Right now, I'm looking for something else. Think I might have a punt on Hell Let Loose.

"anyone with an actual life will find it difficult to experience everything that it has to offer" - This is my concern. I was also interested in getting Kingdom Come Deliverance, but I just don't think I could dedicate the time it...

"Right now, I'm looking for something else." - Cyberpunk once the bugs get sorted?

[MinionZombie]

The Epilogue was a good chunk of post-game stuff, wasn't it? It was nice because it felt like the world didn't just stop dead and cease existing, like it sometimes does in open world games once the main story is over. It kept going like a mini sequel.

I loved the mission where you build the house. The ideal way to lift the gamer's spirits.

Also ... Uncle's lumbaaaaaaaaago! :lol:

[Tricky]

Think I might have a punt on Hell Let Loose.

Not played that one but I've played a lot of Post Scriptum which is according to reviews the superior version of essentially the same game. Give that a look as well. It makes you play tactically and work together with your squad or vehicle crew, lone wolfing it just gets you killed very quickly which for me is much more fun than battlefield and CoD. The sound, explosion effects and vehicle/soldier models are excellent as well!

[shootemindehead]

"anyone with an actual life will find it difficult to experience everything that it has to offer" - This is my concern. I was also interested in getting Kingdom Come Deliverance, but I just don't think I could dedicate the time it...

Aye, COVID has left me with a good bit of spare time and work has been fairly light since before Christmas. Otherwise, I don't think I would have got as much out of RDR2. You can race through the story missions in about 40+ hours I reckon. But doing all the other stuff and just wandering about is where the best the game has to offer and missing out on that would result in a very shallow experience.


"Right now, I'm looking for something else." - Cyberpunk once the bugs get sorted?

I was excited about 'Cyberpunk 2077', Neil, just like everyone else. But after looking at how that actually turned out, I'm content to let that sit for a few years and then get it in a Steam sale for €15. There's no chance in me spending full price on it now. That's for sure. As much as I disliked Steam a few years ago, these days they have some really great deals on a regular basis.

I actually have 'Kingdom Come Deliverance' (why not just Kingdom Come?) in my Steam Library, believe it or not. But, like you, I'm sorta scared to go near it. :lol: I've heard that it's an absolute grinding life stealer. I will do it at one point. Probably when the wife divorces me and walks out. But right now, I'm not so sure.

At the moment, 'Hell Let Loose' has my eye. It coincides nicely with my second world war obsession and I hear that there's Russian Front maps in the works too. It's only online, though, so the risk is there that you'll meet gobshites. But from looking around, it seems to appeal to a more grown up crowd, which might have something to do with the period setting. At the moment it's €30, so I might wait and see if it'll cool it's jets a bit and drop a few quid.

SxEttyLFqgE

- - - Updated - - -


Not played that one but I've played a lot of Post Scriptum which is according to reviews the superior version of essentially the same game. Give that a look as well. It makes you play tactically and work together with your squad or vehicle crew, lone wolfing it just gets you killed very quickly which for me is much more fun than battlefield and CoD. The sound, explosion effects and vehicle/soldier models are excellent as well!

Yeh, I had my eye on that too Tricky. But I hear that the player base is quite small and getting smaller for some reason.

I have zero interest in the likes of Battlefield or CoD though. Tried them on a friend's machine and it was chaos. Loads of silly kids calling each other names and looking for kill counts. Just doesn't do anything for me.

- - - Updated - - -


The Epilogue was a good chunk of post-game stuff, wasn't it? It was nice because it felt like the world didn't just stop dead and cease existing, like it sometimes does in open world games once the main story is over. It kept going like a mini sequel.

I loved the mission where you build the house. The ideal way to lift the gamer's spirits.

Also ... Uncle's lumbaaaaaaaaago! :lol:

Feckin Uncle.

John gets lumbered with him and his "lumbago" for next few years, just because he bumped into him in St. Denis. :lol: Poor bleeder.

That's another good thing about RDR2 though. The characters are all very well done. There's actually characters that you really get to like, which is weird for NPCs. Charles was great. If RDR3 was about him, I'd be happy. And Hosea was brilliant too.

As for the Epilogue, I was wondering if you were going to get a chance to settle the score with that wanker, Micah. He was such a great baddie. Once Sadie rocked up to the ranch and said she was after him, I reckoned that was the end (the proper end) Then at the finale when you find Micah was hanging out with Dutch. My mouth hit the floor.

I'm kinda sorry that I replayed RDR1 before I started RDR2 now.

[MinionZombie]

Feckin Uncle.

John gets lumbered with him and his "lumbago" for next few years, just because he bumped into him in St. Denis. :lol: Poor bleeder.

That's another good thing about RDR2 though. The characters are all very well done. There's actually characters that you really get to like, which is weird for NPCs. Charles was great. If RDR3 was about him, I'd be happy. And Hosea was brilliant too.

As for the Epilogue, I was wondering if you were going to get a chance to settle the score with that wanker, Micah. He was such a great baddie. Once Sadie rocked up to the ranch and said she was after him, I reckoned that was the end (the proper end) Then at the finale when you find Micah was hanging out with Dutch. My mouth hit the floor.

I'm kinda sorry that I replayed RDR1 before I started RDR2 now.

Yeah, the characters were really good. Even little side things ... there was a bit with a guy who was living with his abusive father (you overhear this stuff), and you go to the place to rob it, but the robbery goes south when the old man catches you ... it's either a case of scram, or kill him, and I pulled the trigger - at which point the son begins weeping. If you go back there once some time has passed you'll find the son has turned into a drunk, filled with regrets over his poor relationship with his father. Either way I felt sorry for the guy ... ... then proceeded to rob him again. :elol:

Yeah, I liked Hosea (despite his loan shark operation). I stuck around for some campfire stories, but I was more interested in getting out into that open world and exploring, so when it gets to a point where there are no more campfire moments I missed it.

I even got to quite like some of the gang members who, as I was reminded, were folks you hunt down and kill as John in RDR1 - I'd forgotten which ones were to be hunted down in the previous game completely, and I felt some betrayal.

Micah ... what an arsehole. :lol:

END OF RDR2 CHAPTER 6 and RDR 1 ending spoilers:
I was genuinely moved by the ending of Arthur Morgan's story, and the building sense of regret that he had as the tuberculosis took hold. The lady in that little house near the waterfall, whose husband dies, and who you teach some basics like hunting for food - you got the sense that he could have found a wife one day, maybe even her, and had a quiet time for the remainder of his life, but his choices had soured any chance of that.

The choice of music - as Arthur heads towards the final confrontation, and then when he's watching the sunrise one last time - was perfection, too. I got chills. I was even gutted that my horse (who I named "Snowy") got killed as well. Having spent so much time playing as that character, it lingered with me for a few days, and I even resented playing as John again, lol ... but then I gradually got back into him as you basically put the finishing touches to the man you remember in RDR1 ... ... but then his fate in that game haunts you. Standing in the area beneath that tree overlooking the farm, where his and Abigail's graves will be, was a spooky experience.

[shootemindehead]

Yeah, the characters were really good. Even little side things ... there was a bit with a guy who was living with his abusive father (you overhear this stuff), and you go to the place to rob it, but the robbery goes south when the old man catches you ... it's either a case of scram, or kill him, and I pulled the trigger - at which point the son begins weeping. If you go back there once some time has passed you'll find the son has turned into a drunk, filled with regrets over his poor relationship with his father. Either way I felt sorry for the guy ... ... then proceeded to rob him again. :elol:

Didn't see that one.

Saw the gun shop owner that was keeping a boy locked up in his basement. Creepy stuff there. I let the kid go and left yer man in a heap crying. Went back to the shop much later and he was like "Oh Hi, you're back. I hope you're no going to try any more funny stuff".


Yeah, I liked Hosea (despite his loan shark operation). I stuck around for some campfire stories, but I was more interested in getting out into that open world and exploring, so when it gets to a point where there are no more campfire moments I missed it.

That was Strauss that was doing the loan shark stuff. Hosea was more about con tricks. and delivering wisdom about the folly of what the gang were doing.

END OF RDR2 CHAPTER 6 and RDR 1 ending spoilers:
I was genuinely moved by the ending of Arthur Morgan's story, and the building sense of regret that he had as the tuberculosis took hold. The lady in that little house near the waterfall, whose husband dies, and who you teach some basics like hunting for food - you got the sense that he could have found a wife one day, maybe even her, and had a quiet time for the remainder of his life, but his choices had soured any chance of that.

The choice of music - as Arthur heads towards the final confrontation, and then when he's watching the sunrise one last time - was perfection, too. I got chills. I was even gutted that my horse (who I named "Snowy") got killed as well. Having spent so much time playing as that character, it lingered with me for a few days, and I even resented playing as John again, lol ... but then I gradually got back into him as you basically put the finishing touches to the man you remember in RDR1 ... ... but then his fate in that game haunts you. Standing in the area beneath that tree overlooking the farm, where his and Abigail's graves will be, was a spooky experience.[/QUOTE]

Yeh, I got the sunrise ending too, which I think is the best you can hope for as Arthur.

I initially disliked the idea of playing as Arthur, but now I think Arthur > John.

It was strange seeing the farm come together. When the barn went up, I was like..."oh dear".

[MinionZombie]

Oh yeah, Strauss - I thought it sounded weird typing Hosea for that. Totally forgot about Strauss. Fuck that guy. :lol:

Yeah, the thing with the son and the old man in a cabin - it's down in the corner beneath where that burned down mansion is, by the water. It was one of the robbery tip-offs that occasionally came up during the game.

Another thing that was really creepy - wandering about in the swamps at night. Sometimes there'd be these crazy cannibal hicks who'd emerge as if from nowhere and come at you. Real creepy wandering around in the dark and fog and all of a sudden a gang of those freaks appear from hiding!

There's all sorts of little things you might miss along the way. It'd be a good idea to look at some YouTube videos of these sorts of things to find any you haven't found yourself.

So many nifty details throughout, some that even leave subtle marks on the world ... such as, a building in St. Denis that's getting constructed/renovated - you can choose to donate as Arthur, and once it's built his name will appear on a plaque of donors by the door.

[shootemindehead]

Yeah, the thing with the son and the old man in a cabin - it's down in the corner beneath where that burned down mansion is, by the water. It was one of the robbery tip-offs that occasionally came up during the game.

Ah yeh, the black lad that tries to stab you and his kid says he stashed the money in trunk. Did that one. I might go back with John and see what's what.


Another thing that was really creepy - wandering about in the swamps at night. Sometimes there'd be these crazy cannibal hicks who'd emerge as if from nowhere and come at you. Real creepy wandering around in the dark and fog and all of a sudden a gang of those freaks appear from hiding!

Yeh, there's odd stuff going on around there. I think there's a whole vampire cult affair happening near that place and I saw a clan meeting outside of Rhodes too, which was gas. Chucked a stick of dynamite at them.
[/QUOTE]

[MinionZombie]

Ah yeh, the black lad that tries to stab you and his kid says he stashed the money in trunk. Did that one. I might go back with John and see what's what.



Yeh, there's odd stuff going on around there. I think there's a whole vampire cult affair happening near that place and I saw a clan meeting outside of Rhodes too, which was gas. Chucked a stick of dynamite at them.


1) Did you kill the old man, or leave him be? Either way there'll likely be some development there.

2) There was one klan meeting I stumbled across near Rhodes where they bungled their attempt to set a cross on fire, IIRC, and only managed to set themselves on fire. I gunned down the stragglers amidst the chaos.

Did you find the lady locked in the outhouse near that mansion? If you go back years later she's still there ... kinda.

[Neil]

Here's my friend's comments on it after two hours:-


GTA on horses? Not really and perhaps a bit (in terms of engine – but you’d expect that). It’s much slower than GTA and, possibly, a bit boring for that.
It’s very pretty but a GPU hog – I can’t get better than about 45 fps.
It has an autosave function (much like GTA) and I’m not a big fan of that. Couple this with the slow pace and you have a game where you never want to go back to a checkpoint because you might have 10 minutes of slowly creeping through snow to do again – tedious.
The aim mechanic is a bit frustrating.
I prefer 1st person (which is possible in this game) but you kind of feel that you need to use 3rd person (particularly when on a horse).
Did I mention that it’s very pretty?
It doesn’t grab me at all, even by the end of my 110th minute I found that I was happy to switch off to experiment with Geforce experience optimal graphics settings but then I was not rushing to turn back on again. When I did, and the FPS wasn’t much better, I was content to end it for good and request a refund.

[shootemindehead]

1) Did you kill the old man, or leave him be? Either way there'll likely be some development there.

I'm not too sure if there's a way not to kill him? I tried knocking him out, but he ended up brown bread anyway.


Did you find the lady locked in the outhouse near that mansion? If you go back years later she's still there ... kinda.

No, never saw her.

[MinionZombie]

Here's my friend's comments on it after two hours:-


GTA on horses? Not really and perhaps a bit (in terms of engine – but you’d expect that). It’s much slower than GTA and, possibly, a bit boring for that.
It’s very pretty but a GPU hog – I can’t get better than about 45 fps.
It has an autosave function (much like GTA) and I’m not a big fan of that. Couple this with the slow pace and you have a game where you never want to go back to a checkpoint because you might have 10 minutes of slowly creeping through snow to do again – tedious.
The aim mechanic is a bit frustrating.
I prefer 1st person (which is possible in this game) but you kind of feel that you need to use 3rd person (particularly when on a horse).
Did I mention that it’s very pretty?
It doesn’t grab me at all, even by the end of my 110th minute I found that I was happy to switch off to experiment with Geforce experience optimal graphics settings but then I was not rushing to turn back on again. When I did, and the FPS wasn’t much better, I was content to end it for good and request a refund.


So, your chum couldn't be bothered to get past the prologue of the game and damned it on nothing more than that? The game has a slow start, no doubt, but those opening four hours of gameplay are all about setting up the characters and story as well as getting the player clued-up on the main mechanics and controls.

GTA, much like RDR, is supposed to be a 3rd person game, really. No amount of FPS style tinkering can make those games really work in first person.

And of course it's not like GTA in terms of pace. It's a western - with horses - not sports cars and rock music and explosions and machine guns and rocket launchers in the present day.

Fair play, it might not be to everyone's interests, but I think your friend has unfairly judged RDR2.

[Neil]

So, your chum couldn't be bothered to get past the prologue of the game and damned it on nothing more than that? The game has a slow start, no doubt, but those opening four hours of gameplay are all about setting up the characters and story as well as getting the player clued-up on the main mechanics and controls.

GTA, much like RDR, is supposed to be a 3rd person game, really. No amount of FPS style tinkering can make those games really work in first person.

And of course it's not like GTA in terms of pace. It's a western - with horses - not sports cars and rock music and explosions and machine guns and rocket launchers in the present day.

Fair play, it might not be to everyone's interests, but I think your friend has unfairly judged RDR2.

I think the issue is the 2hr game time refund policy of Steam. I guess that's why he based it on <120mins...

I had the impression it's a slow burner, especially at the start...

[shootemindehead]

There's 100's of hours in RDR2. Playing for just 2 is no way to gauge it properly.

The game, though, does suffer from an extremely lacklustre start, I will say, and it does take a good while to build up...ahem...steam.

[MinionZombie]

Yeah, definitely a slow start. It takes at least 4 hours before the world actually opens up for the player, which is a curious choice - but once you get there the world is pretty much your oyster.

[Neil]

I'll wait for it (RDR2) to drop down quite a bit in price incase I find it too large to commit time too... ie: I fancy Kingdom Come: Deliverance, but just fear it would be too much of a time undertaking, and too slow to appeal to me these days...

[Tricky]

I must be one of the few that enjoyed the opening to RDR2, rescuing John Marston in the snow, finding Sadie after the O'Driscolls killed her husband and the shoot out with the O'Driscolls at the abandoned mine, followed shortly by that wagon ride out of the snow to Horseshoe Overlook through the beautiful scenery as the weather improves and the gang see that first glimpse of the Indians from the reservation watching from the high ground, I thought it set the scene well.

[MinionZombie]

I must be one of the few that enjoyed the opening to RDR2, rescuing John Marston in the snow, finding Sadie after the O'Driscolls killed her husband and the shoot out with the O'Driscolls at the abandoned mine, followed shortly by that wagon ride out of the snow to Horseshoe Overlook through the beautiful scenery as the weather improves and the gang see that first glimpse of the Indians from the reservation watching from the high ground, I thought it set the scene well.

No doubt. While it was slow and gradual, and I was itching to just dive into the open world, I did enjoy the scene setting and those missions you mentioned as they were quite dramatic in the blizzard snow and, as you say, moving into the main map area was a lovely reveal of the world opening up.

I was just so eager to go exploring the world, that the initial restraints kind of irritated me to a degree, but you do have to get eased into the controls, for instance, because there's a bajillion of them!

[Neil]

Just imagine what RDR3 will be like :eek:

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[Neil]

OK... Finally bought it...

Just need to find time to play it now :)

[MinionZombie]

Finally! Well, kinda ... shall we check in again in five years to see if you've got past the first four hours? :lol:

The first four hours are pretty linear and limited, but after that setting up and getting to know the characters, you're unleashed on the open world and finally get to dig in.

[Neil]

Finally! Well, kinda ... shall we check in again in five years to see if you've got past the first four hours? :lol:

The first four hours are pretty linear and limited, but after that setting up and getting to know the characters, you're unleashed on the open world and finally get to dig in.
A friend of mine bought it (on Steam) and refunded it. Given you can only do that in the first 2hrs of gameplay, he must have been in the intro when he decided it wasn't for him :)

[MinionZombie]

A friend of mine bought it (on Steam) and refunded it. Given you can only do that in the first 2hrs of gameplay, he must have been in the intro when he decided it wasn't for him :)

And missed out on a great game. The first four hours are there to get you into the mechanics, the basis of the story, and get to know the characters. It's a bit annoying as you're so eager to get out there into the open world, but it's well worth it in the end. I pumped something like 200 hours into it IIRC. It was just nice to roam about the world, just seeing life going on, admiring the artistry of the design and so on.

[Neil]

And missed out on a great game. The first four hours are there to get you into the mechanics, the basis of the story, and get to know the characters. It's a bit annoying as you're so eager to get out there into the open world, but it's well worth it in the end. I pumped something like 200 hours into it IIRC. It was just nice to roam about the world, just seeing life going on, admiring the artistry of the design and so on.

Can you imagine what RDR3 will be like given the insane detail in RDR2? Imagine how good the horse balls physics will be!

Just need a zombie mod for RDR2 now :)

[Neil]

Confused! So thought I'd dedicate a couple of hours to it last night. Went through a character creation and tutorial which ended up with me then teaming up with other people online to steal horses? Is that an online version of the game? Given I'm not interested in that, should I even be doing that?

Is that required before going into the solo game?

[ProfessorChaos]

no, the online aspect is totally separate from the main game. there should be an option in the main menu to switch between the story and the online mode.

[Neil]

no, the online aspect is totally separate from the main game. there should be an option in the main menu to switch between the story and the online mode.

So the 4-5hr intro everyone has talking about has nothing to do with the 2hrs or so of the online game I've gone through so far? Grrr... :deadhorse:

[MinionZombie]

So the 4-5hr intro everyone has talking about has nothing to do with the 2hrs or so of the online game I've gone through so far? Grrr... :deadhorse:

No.

Red Dead Online is a separate mode entirely. You need to get your butt onto the single play story mode. You'll find yourself playing as Arthur Morgan.

[Neil]

No.

Red Dead Online is a separate mode entirely. You need to get your butt onto the single play story mode. You'll find yourself playing as Arthur Morgan.

:deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadh orse:

[MinionZombie]

Annoying, sure - but it's worth it.

Not sure how you confused the two modes, mind. ;)

Just thinking about it ... ... are RDR2 and RDR Online available to purchase as separate entities? I'm starting to think I saw them being sold separately on the Xbox store a while back. Have you definitely bought the full game, or have you accidentally only bought the online version (which doesn't include the single player)?

[Neil]

Annoying, sure - but it's worth it.

Not sure how you confused the two modes, mind. ;)

Just thinking about it ... ... are RDR2 and RDR Online available to purchase as separate entities? I'm starting to think I saw them being sold separately on the Xbox store a while back. Have you definitely bought the full game, or have you accidentally only bought the online version (which doesn't include the single player)?

I think I went to start a new game and it took me into "Online" by default, and I should have taken a skip option... I was just wary of skipping part of the very tutorial I was suppose to be taking :confused:

[MinionZombie]

I think I went to start a new game and it took me into "Online" by default, and I should have taken a skip option... I was just wary of skipping part of the very tutorial I was suppose to be taking :confused:

Hmmm ... that doesn't sound right at all.

To be fair, when I started RDR2 the online component hadn't been released yet, so there was only the single player - but I'd check again, if I were you, to see whether you've accidentally bought the 'online only' version which doesn't include the single player.

There's no 'skip' option for single player as far as I'm aware, and there's certainly no 'character creation' because you play as Arthur Morgan (you can customise him during the game - clothing, weapons, hair/beard).

[Neil]

OK... Playing as Arthur now... Walking through snow... Riding through snow... Walking through snow... :)

[MinionZombie]

OK... Playing as Arthur now... Walking through snow... Riding through snow... Walking through snow... :)

Right, good, you're on the right track again. :D

You'll find yourself for a brief spell in a snow-bound abandoned town, but then IIRC after a handful of small missions there you and your gang all move down into the main map.

There's a lot of controls and mechanics to learn (I think Rockstar made them too complex, to be honest), but you get into them eventually.

[Neil]

Right, good, you're on the right track again. :D

You'll find yourself for a brief spell in a snow-bound abandoned town, but then IIRC after a handful of small missions there you and your gang all move down into the main map.

There's a lot of controls and mechanics to learn (I think Rockstar made them too complex, to be honest), but you get into them eventually.

It's certainly working my graphics card. Sitting at around 35-60fps on the default settings the game adopted.

I was going to upgrade a while back to a 3070, but then CV19 hit, card supplies dried up and now they are super silly expensive being like 40-50% more now :(

[kidgloves]

An excellent game. Enjoy the experience