Oi camera nerds...

[MinionZombie]

(So that's all of us then, :p)

Heard about this yet?

http://red.com/

Basically, it's a digital camera meets the flexibility of Lego (or Mecano), a contact from the University of Worcester (who helps run their Film course) told me about it last night when we were discussing cameras and indie filmmaking at one of those media get togethers for Rural Media ... you know the sort, with lots of wine, cheesy nibbles and situated in a building with glass instead of walls. :D

Figured you lot would find it interesting ... but I'm still getting the DVX100BE, perhaps this will suit me in the near future...

[axlish]

Looks pretty cool!

So they are on the DVX100BE now? I plan to get one ASAP myself. Recently, Courtney Cox was in a film shot with the DVX called November. I can't wait to pick one up and start tinkering with it.

[MinionZombie]

So they are on the DVX100BE now?

How do you mean?

From what the girl from Worcester said it has come about from someone who is basically a well off tech nerd who wanted to put together his own camera, frustrated by the actions of the big players.

The Panasonic DVX100BE (the PAL version of their latest camera, hence the "E" ... but surely it should be "P" right? lol) though is where I'm going right now. This "Red" camera looks interesting, but it's something I wouldn't dive into now but possibly something for the future...

The DVX100B has been recommended to me time and again and I was talking about the DVX with the same girl and she was saying that when shooting something for a documentary she was doing they had two cameras, hers (forget the model/make) and a DVX100A and she said the picture quality blew her camera right out of the water, it was such a good picture...so I'm certainly looking forward to the DVX100B, which essentially amps everything up another notch.

Just waiting for the stock to come in, it's been a very popular camera, but the stock being sent my way from Panasonic has been retarded, not quite as retarded as only 100,000 P$3's to the UK, but still bloody frustrating. Fingers crossed though the stock will be in next week, which would mean very soon I'll have my mits on one of them beauties, it'll be the perfect thing to film an indie on ... which is the idea for next year, so fingers-bloody-crossed. :cool:

[axlish]

So the E just means the PAL version then, cool. Just making sure I wasn't eyeballing a model that is now out of date. Like you, I am getting into Videography, with film making on the side.

[MinionZombie]

Ah so have you got a DVX? Which model?

Yep, Nelson Six Productions is starting to get going, we've had a couple of things at this point, but it's all been at "mates rates" and as a proving ground for us, if you will. Hopefully we'll get some sh*t going soon though, we'll be doing the videography thing (weddings, corporates, music promos etc) as well as documentaries for the Sell Through market (specialist subjects such as trains, classic cars etc - my business partner has been making those for years now and has had his docs sold all over the world), so that's another avenue.

We're also working together on another major project, but it's a long term thing and we're just in the early stages of it. We've filmed a pilot for it, but we're looking to shoot another pilot for the project, so ideally we'd be after some funding and then we'd need to get a committee together to help us realise our creative vision (we're the creative types, business isn't our forte - don't worry, we won't "do a GAR" on that front, lol). But in terms of doing the second pilot/trial we're looking to get local filmmaking talent involved in our area from a nearby University, perhaps get them to make something new that isn't on their showreels.

I'd like to think I could provide some work experience and opportunities for people coming out of film school here in the UK, because I know first hand it's sh*t hard and I've basically had to go out and create my own stuff (I've had some work experience though), so basically I want to help out people who are struggling like I did/am. In fact, that's one of the aims of the long term project we're working on, but that's about all I'd like to share at the moment - vague I know, but it's a big old project.

[axlish]

I don't have the DVX yet. Soon... Plotting... Plotting... :mad: :evil: :evil: :mad:

Sounds like you have a lot on the horizon, congrats. Good luck what that, sounds like you are on a good track and making good connections. My father-in-law does wedding photography on the side, so I am just going to coat-tail onto him and get work that way at first, until I build up a small portfolio to bring to those wedding conventions, to fetch work. Depending on how much they want done, jobs can get up around $3,500, but most jobs are around $1,500 for the standard Wedding/Reception combo. I've been approached about doing a wedding on my current set up, which I won't do. It'd look like pixels holding hands in a dark reception hall. Yeah, I wants me a DVX :evil:

[MinionZombie]

Sounds like a plan there ax-man and indeed, if you can't get the job done right, then don't do it so best getting the DVX first and then rocking some sacks with your awesome visual quality.

Have a gander online and see what other services are offering and figure out ways to price your own offerings as well as see what wording they're using, you can also find ways to undercut them or provide something they're not offering. That's what we've done, but we're still working on the price list, what with so many balls in the air our time is a little mixed up and spread out you know.

I think I had a dream about getting a DVX the other week, I was so chuffed in the dream and then I woke up to the crushing reality that is life without a DVX100B... :lol: At least I woke up this morning with wood like normal, ha!

Prices here for weddings vary greatly, £600 for bare-bones crap-fest and £1000 for a solid piece with plenty of bells and whistles. But damn, some of the optional extras I've seen on some websites, bloody hell, RIP OFF CENTRAL, I mean serious rip offs - so that's what we're looking to avoid so we can make ourselves look much better.

I'm hoping there might be an opportunity down the line to do a training video for the police or something (again, partner has already done a series for one Constabulary) ... a good one obviously, if I could film police storming a house and shooting guns and driving fast that would be hella fun ... but that's not likely, we can hope though, haha.

Indeed, lots of plates spinning ... shame none of them aren't garnished with money salads though. :lol: Ah well, if it means I'm rolling in it by the time I'm 30 then I don't mind...suffer first, pleasure later - that's the preferred balance.

[DjfunkmasterG]

The DVX100 is an awesome Camera. I have the first one. Plain old DVX-100 and I love it.


As far as this RED ONE... Without seeing video footage I wouldn't drop $17,500 on a camera without seeing some video from it. I would need to see a demo disc and read tons more about it.

[MinionZombie]

Bloody hell! I hadn't bothered to look for prices for it, but cripes, that's a bit bloody pricey ... somehow I think the pro-sumer and professional camera developers (Sony, Panasonic et al) won't be wiggling in their corporate seats just yet ... mind you, if it's a rockhard camera with excellent results like it says, it could be something you might see filmmakers like Rodriguez using...

[DjfunkmasterG]

Yep, $17,500


Sorry, but no way would I pay that, nor could I afford to on an untested, and un-proven camera. A few still photos ain't jack. When i see some footage shot with it... Raw footage not processed and color corrected etc etc then I could see maybe considering signing my life away for it.

[Kaos]

Yep, $17,500


Sorry, but no way would I pay that, nor could I afford to on an untested, and un-proven camera. A few still photos ain't jack. When i see some footage shot with it... Raw footage not processed and color corrected etc etc then I could see maybe considering signing my life away for it.


I am not sure, but I think that is for the camera only. I think lenses are extra.

[DjfunkmasterG]

I am not sure, but I think that is for the camera only. I think lenses are extra.


yep the Lens is $5K

so before you could film s ingle thing you are out $22K almost $23K

Sorry, thanks but no thanks.

[MinionZombie]

Then it's settled ... DVX100's (all series) ... hooooooooooooooo!!!! :cool:

CHAAAAARRRRRRGGGE!!!!

[DjfunkmasterG]

another camera you can't knock is the Canon XL2. Another Standard definition MiniDV camera capable of doing 24 frames per second, not too mention it has a native 16:9 CCD chipset where the DVX100 has a 4:3 native chipset. In order to get 16:9 out a DVX100 you need to buy the $800 16:9 Anamorphic adapter lens.

[7feet]

If I have the money, I am definite buying a Red. It's developed by Jim Jannard, the guy who started the Oakley (sunglass) company, and he's a camera head as well as well as a good industrial designer. 4K resolution (which, if you have the money, is the best res that you can scan 35mm film at for visual FX work), holy bloody sh*t. $17.5K may seem like a lot, but when the next closest comparable bit (say the camera the shot Superman Returns on - Cinealta, I think) is a few hundred thou, man. I wasn't at IBC, but what I've heard is that it looks absolutely sick, Super 35 res with no grain or artifacts. Too clean for a lot of cinemaphotographers, their used to working with grain and noise.

Okay, it's not an option for the no budget film maker. but thinking small never got you anywhere and I'm maybe (really maybe, but I'm hoping) getting 350 grand to make a film. At that point, thst camera become THE option. I don't have the money for it now, but I was seriously thinking about plunkung the grand down on option to get in the queue when they're available.

Standard is supposed to be PL mount, standard 35mm cine lenses, but you could certainly get an adapter (or hack the lense mount, although I think they're supposed to have inerchangable mounts) and throw a lens off a 355mm still camera on there. There are reasons why 35mm cine primes cost a shi*tpile, but I'd sacrifice the mad glass against the resolution, no doubt. A $200 used Nikon lense is still pretty damn good.

[DjfunkmasterG]

If you have a budget of $350K sure you can afford to buy one. However, for us guys making films in the range of $100 - $10,000.00 You can't drop that kinda of cash on it. I am sure the camera will be sweet, but still without footage to see who would plop down that kind of scratch?

[MinionZombie]

Indeed, you've got to know your limits and work within them to the best of your ability. As you know I make "literally-no-budget" films and will soon (hopefully!) be upgrading to that mythical DVX100B, by using inheritence money from last year. If it wasn't for that money, I'd have no chance of getting it.

I agree with making a good product, but the "think big" thing is lost on some people and they go far beyond their means and make the process a living hell for themselves, I'm all for K.I.S.S. ... as well as keeping it quality.

And yeah, if you've got $350,000 to drop on a film then it's well within your means (I too would still prefer some evidence though), but not many of us are being blessed as such ... well, good luck with the $350k film though :cool: ... hmm, I'm going to go watch my Monday morning downloads. :D

[LD-50]

The Red team has made some exciting promises regarding specs, but keep in mind guys, this is still basically a concept camera, all advertised specs are subject to change. The $17,000 price tag is body only, and the design for that is even in a state of flux, so that is essentailly the price for the sensor. Someone mentioned using still lenses, which might be good enough for shooting 1080, but definitely not 4k. Speaking of 4k, can you say 300 mb/second. That's what you're going to need. A shooting ratio of 5:1, which is unheard of in the indie video world, that works out to 5 tb/hour. Anyone want a crack at posting that in their bedroom ? There was a lot of talk earlier about 11 or even 15 stops of lattitude, which the company has recently tried to distance itself from. There is clearly a lot of developlment left to do on this camera, but if they can deliver most of what they are promising it will be quite impressive. But it would make more sense as a rental for indie features. Ownership is well within the budget of many indie's, but the support network needed (theoretically)to use this camera to it's fullest potential is not. Many people who buy this camera may not realize this until it's too late, and may end up shooting 1080 on a $20,000 dollar camera, advertising on craigslist for a focus puller willing to work for the "opportunity".

[DjfunkmasterG]

The Red team has made some exciting promises regarding specs, but keep in mind guys, this is still basically a concept camera, all advertised specs are subject to change. The $17,000 price tag is body only, and the design for that is even in a state of flux, so that is essentailly the price for the sensor. Someone mentioned using still lenses, which might be good enough for shooting 1080, but definitely not 4k. Speaking of 4k, can you say 300 mb/second. That's what you're going to need. A shooting ratio of 5:1, which is unheard of in the indie video world, that works out to 5 tb/hour. Anyone want a crack at posting that in their bedroom ? There was a lot of talk earlier about 11 or even 15 stops of lattitude, which the company has recently tried to distance itself from. There is clearly a lot of developlment left to do on this camera, but if they can deliver most of what they are promising it will be quite impressive. But it would make more sense as a rental for indie features. Ownership is well within the budget of many indie's, but the support network needed (theoretically)to use this camera to it's fullest potential is not. Many people who buy this camera may not realize this until it's too late, and may end up shooting 1080 on a $20,000 dollar camera, advertising on craigslist for a focus puller willing to work for the "opportunity".

See guys LD-50 knows his stuff. This is why we need him him fulltime in this forum to help us get our gear together for shooting good projects.

[MinionZombie]

The guy is a god among camera tech guys, I'm tellin' ya ... hey Dj, have you noticed any weird glows, possibly with a kind of angelic "ahhhh-ahhh-ahhhhhhhhhhh" audio floating around him? :D

Seriously, to the people who aren't aware of LD's top notch know-how, pay attention to his noggin talk. :thumbsup: :cool:

[DjfunkmasterG]

The guy is a god among camera tech guys, I'm tellin' ya ... hey Dj, have you noticed any weird glows, possibly with a kind of angelic "ahhhh-ahhh-ahhhhhhhhhhh" audio floating around him? :D

Seriously, to the people who aren't aware of LD's top notch know-how, pay attention to his noggin talk. :thumbsup: :cool:


And anyone doubting his cinematography skills check out the trailers for DEADLANDS. :D

[Fulcifan91]

(shameless plug) Or Eating Habits!

http://www.spaghettiindustries.com/eatinghabits

:lol:

[7feet]

Hey, guys, I wasn't saying, I had that kinda money, it's still pretty preliminary negotiations with the Exec producer of the last feature I did FX for. But I can hope, it's not total fantasyland. It's much more likely that I'd really be working in the same budget ranges as everybody else here. I cut my teeth on no and low budget films, and know what you can produce with pocket change and a bunch of dedication. The biggest budget film I've worked on was still only around 2 1/2 mil, which is still nothing by industry standards. Ya work with what ya got. The script I was talking about I couldn't even think of shooting for under 150K and get what I want, but there are plenty of much smaller scale stuff I'd like to do

Just a little techno-lust, if the camera is what they say it'll be, should be a damn nice thing for the price. That's all. And I was awake for about 60 hours when I posted that, so a little slack, eh?

[MinionZombie]

lol ... ease off the knee-stroking and salavating there :lol: ... I know what you mean with techno-lust, when I started looking for a pro camera recently I saw one straight away and was all bonered up for up and then Dj and LD breathed some reality into my sails and now I'm set on the DVX100BE ... stock is apparently assuredly coming THIS WEEK ... I canny wait captain, I doonay have the powerrrr!!! (I actually had a DVX dream the other week :|:eek:)

Geez, 60 hours? Damn ... not even Jack Bauer manages that! :D

[LD-50]

It's natural to want to work with cutting edge technology, and to want the newest shiniest thing, but also remember a camera can't shoot a film for you. Just as important, in fact more important, is knowing the craft. Knowing how to properly light and cover a scene, and how to construct a visual narrative will make your film look good. You could shoot on a Genesis, and without these essential elements of cinema, it's still going to look amateurish.

[MinionZombie]

Never have truer words been spoken LD ... see people, this guy's got his noggin' on straight.

Indeed, it's like when people insist on making a really long film because "that's how films should be", but it'd just be better to keep is short and sweet. For instance, ever see "City of Rott"? Now, there's something which would have made a really nice 30 minute short film, but it went on and on for 76 minutes (and the credits took the credits joke too far in my opinion, hehe).

Like you said, know your craft (this is one of the reasons I don't like these film courses here in the UK - some of the courses I mean - that just boot you out onto the street with some equipment and say "go film something"). There's a guy I know (an asshole incidentally) who went to one of these courses, and they're just running around with a camera making each other laugh. Now you might learn some stuff in the process, but it's not taken seriously and quite frankly it's like taking a High School course and making you pay twenty plus grand for the privilege.

And with that in mind (knowing your craft), experimentation is a great way to learn on your own and try out the technical skills, and of course - knowing how to write is extremely important. You can be all flash with the technical stuff, but if you can't make a decent story then it's all a waste in the end.

And of course, learning is a process that's never finished...so when you meet someone who's so arrogant to claim they know how to do everything without actually doing much, you just wanna slap some reality into them.

I'm gonna stop ranting now, lol...a good piece of kit in the right hands (or at least hands totally up for learning how to do stuff right) is worth a lot in the end...

[LouCipherr]

MZ - does this mean you're gonna be filming "I Am Zombie Man 2" on the DVX100? w00t!!! (did I just say that outloud? d'oh!)

[DjfunkmasterG]

MZ - does this mean you're gonna be filming "I Am Zombie Man 2" on the DVX100? w00t!!! (did I just say that outloud? d'oh!)

No no No... he has to do Ask a Zombie or the Zombie Man Xmas Special. :D

[MinionZombie]

lol, I've got followers!! :D:cool:

Yes indeed Lou, the next Zombie Man outing (which I'll just refer to easily as "IAZM2" for now) will be filmed on the Panasonic DVX100B *creams-self a little*, so I'll join you in a celebratory "woot".

And like Dj was saying, it is going to be a mix of 'ask zombie man' and 'zombie man's xmas message' ... at least that's the plan now, but I'll most definately be getting you lot (when the time comes) to hit me up with questions to refer to Zombie Man himself...

See, I'm so rich and famous now that I'm getting my fans to write my work for me! :D Next thing I'll do is bring out an endless slew of almost identical special editions and box sets. :lol:

Speaking of the DVX100B, I've got another short film idea for it ... but ... shock horror ... it isn't a comedy, and it isn't a horror! :eek: But IAZM2 is still the plan, filming between Xmas and New Year. :cool:

[DjfunkmasterG]

We demand a sequel... NOW! :D

Get that damn camera... and go do the "I am Zombie Man Halloween special" You could have running around the neighborhood trying to eat the little trick or treaters. :D

[MinionZombie]

I like that idea Dj, it'd work if:

1) Zombie Man was available
2) We were in America

:lol:

Halloween here is an utter joke, barely anything happens ... and Zombie Man is currently "doing the circuit" of festivals, shindigs and happening parties getting drunk and shot up on celebrity drugs, next thing you know he'll be on E! Entertainment Special or True Hollywood Story. :D

Fortunately he'll be back at Xmas to hand over the cash to his widow (dead people aren't allowed bank accounts as you know :p), so I'll get him then. :cool: