Kaufmanns money

[Rottedfreak]

It's occurred to me, how exactly could kaufmann gain power on the city? he had the rich living the high life and the poor in the slums but why would they maintain that way of life and what possible purpose could it serve?

[Scousezombie]

This is an interesting point.

It's not clear exactly how the new society in the Green functions, and we only see small glimpses of it.

Kaufmann apparently hired the people necessary to turn the city into a safe haven in the beginning, including the security personnel who (I presume) now keep order within the city and help to cement his control over it. Kaufmann appears to be in the effective position of a dictator, although one may wonder why his subordinates continue to follow his orders (obviously Cholo has this thought during the film!)

Maintaining class divisions certainly serves a purpose as far as the upper class are concerned, as they wont be forced to venture into the dangerous outer world to scavenge to make a living for as long as people are preapred to do the job for them in return for a share of their wealth. The lower classes really have nowhere to go and no means of advancement, trapped between the inaccessible rich sector and the hungry dead outside.

Cholo's disillusion is sparked by the lack of social mobility in the new world, perhaps Riley's also since he was also refused access to the rich zone, hence his desire to opt out of human society altogether and head off to where there are no people.

The question of why the old divisions between rich and poor have any meaning in the Land universe is a difficult one (the issue of of whether and why money still has value has been debated in detail in the other active thread regarding Land), it's never made clear what the rich classes within the Green actually do for a living and how they contribute to the new society.

In theory the scavengers could be the new upper class, having access to all of the resources of the old world if they are prepared to risk life and limb to acquire them.

[deadpunk]

I think the purpose of the noticeable Social Divisions was an attempt by GAR to mirror the evolution of the Living Dead. As the LD begin to 'grow' and evolve, we can see that the living have regressed into what could only be considered a Midevial heirarchy type society.

Clearly, the scavangers are the only folk that would qualify as middle class, and they are few and far between. The rest of the society has been broken into two groups: Rich and Poor. The line is very clear, with no room for grey area.

It's a very subtle ironic statement, but one that is there none the less. The dead are beginning to build a society, as ours falls apart...

As for how Kaufmann came into power..well, in that situation, someone would. Typically, we can see that Kaufmann used money and strongarm tactics to wrestle his way into a position of total authority. It was basically a well hidden dictatorship, disguised as a business. To me, it was reminiscent of the world of Shadowrun, where the world is run not by governments, but by corporations. Kaufmann gave the weak elite what they wanted; a comfortable existence where others faced the risks they knew they could not. The allure of such a promise would no doubt create many a blind eye to anything else he was doing.

[Cereval]

It's occurred to me, how exactly could kaufmann gain power on the city? he had the rich living the high life and the poor in the slums but why would they maintain that way of life and what possible purpose could it serve?

Seemed a bit weird to me too ... like how, in the midst of things, could he "pay for the soldiers and their training" ... seems like the apocalypse would be the last time to organize something like this. :rockbrow:

[erisi236]

perhaps right at the very begining, Kaufman hired out a bunch of renegade army guys to guard his stuff for fear of looters and whatnot, and that statered the ball rolling.

[ZombieFood]

My theory on this is that Kaufmann was some sort of prior military member. He used hsi knowledge of military strategy to secure the Green. Once that was done, he needed to get new people to his little safe haven (which probably wouldn't take much at this point. But he still needed to get them. Hence, Dead Reconning.) He needed new people for their skills, manual labor, etc.

So now we have people coming in. Some will have skills, some won't. These skills are valuable, so they cannot just be thrown away (over the fence, as it were) so they must be paid for in some manner. They currency the skills are paid for in dollars. The higher in demand the skill, the higher the dollar value for that skill. Soon we have seperation of classes; rich and poor.

And it begins again...

I don't think it serves a purpose per se, just the way things tend to end up....

[Tullaryx]

Kaufman may just be one of a small group of people who rule over the pockets of Fiddler Green-type fortresses scattered around the US. I think this also answers part of the question some had about the film: why the importance of money in a world that really relied on a barter system.

Even a society that relies heavily on a barter system would still need some sort of official currency to act as promissory notes. If there are still other bastions scattered around the country and they maintained contact with each other then it wouldn't be too farfetched to believe that money was still being used to prop up a basic type economy.

[axlish]

I'm thinking Kaufman was a bit of a motivator, and when panic broke, he was a calm voice of reason. He probably cooked up his plan quickly, and convinced some strong arm types to help him put his plan in action, with the promise of protection, a nice condo, food & water. As for the poor class, they were simply willing to participate so they could be offered shelter from the zombies. Besides, the higher ups of the lower class are in Kaufman's back pocket. He supplies them games and drugs to keep them busy, so they aren't really a threat anyway. As for the money, I have no idea what value that would hold in that world, if any. Even gold in that situation would be worthless. I'd trade a gold nugget for a ham sandwich in that situation.

[Tullaryx]

As for the money, I have no idea what value that would hold in that world, if any. Even gold in that situation would be worthless. I'd trade a gold nugget for a ham sandwich in that situation.

That's true, but human nature and greed being what they are it would be a hard habit to be rid off not to want money. Even Peter in Dawn thought that they may have a need for it some day.

[Mortis]

Yes, that's what I think, too. One of the reasons why I love the Dead flicks so much is because they offer so much more than zombies.


That's true, but human nature and greed being what they are it would be a hard habit to be rid off not to want money. Even Peter in Dawn thought that they may have a need for it some day.

[MinionZombie]

*groans*

Not this money 'thing' again ... *grumbles into a Budweiser* :| :barf:

Sorry, I'm grumpy at the moment...:dead:

[Mortis]

It's not our fault you have to suffer with a Bud. :D


*groans*

Not this money 'thing' again ... *grumbles into a Budweiser* :| :barf:

Sorry, I'm grumpy at the moment...:dead:

[axlish]

*grumbles into a Budweiser*

Again, Budweiser and the UK don't mix. Tear into a Bass at once young man, it'll put some hair on your chest ;)

[Guido]

During any panicked situation, people look for a leader. Kaufman probably played on their fear (and they had every right to be fearful). Look at all the dictators that gained power through fear...Hitler, Stalin, The Kwantung Army of Japan prior to WWII. Heck, even Bush reasons that everything he does is to protect us from terrorists...phone tapping/patriot act?? Kaufman's complete control and threat that without him, nobody would be safe is definitely a satirical point.

And look how it ended up...Kaufman=dead, everyone else was still ticking. didn't need him=don't need bush/controlling gov't?

Maybe i read into it too much.

[Rottedfreak]

You know what happened to the real government they went into bunkers, people cemented them in and burned down the whitehouse.
then the zombies lurked up behind them...

[MinionZombie]

Budweiser rocks, I refuse to let the Americans hog it all! :D

I tried something called "Budvar", which also had "Budweiser" on the label - but it definately wasn't my Bud...some rank p*ss from the Czech Republic I think ... tasted like week-warm Stella, *yuck*!

[Eyebiter]

*** SPOILERS for Lotd***


From a political perspective - Kaufmann is a metaphor for GW Bush as President of the USA. The idea that our leaders could care less about the plight of the individual citizen, and only look out for themselves.

Fiddler's Green is similar to the gated communities appearing across the USA, the idea that the rich want to insulate themselves away from the decaying world outside the walls.

Law and order is maintained by amusing the general population with bread, drink, and circus. Anyone who is a troublemaker is taken away by the security forces and either thrown into prison or simply disappeared. Thrown away like yesterdays trash.

It's one reason Land of the Dead tanked at the box office. Romero went overboard on the social commentary this time.

[Rottedfreak]

The reason it tanked is because everyone who wanted to see it went to see it. Standards for success are high and the Dead trilogy wasn't everyone's cup of tea.