fast zombies

[ngm231]

ok. when the infection first starts the first zombies ya know k they would be slow cause they were dead for while. but the people who die from the zombies who are only dead for about 5 min wouldnt they come back to fast because their joints are not stiff? just a question ive had for a while.

[capncnut]

That could be true NG.

Saying that, look at how fast the cemetary zombie is in Night. He was almost jogging after Barbara. Not only that but she was in a car for the first 30 seconds of the chase and he still caught up.

As for the running zombies, they are not true zombies in my eyes (no arguments people, I'm just being purist) as they were kinda born out of 28 Days Later which was not a zombie flick. I think all the running takes the creepiness (and character) out of the creature. It's that element that made Michael Myers so scary I think, the fact that he never ran but was always right behind you.

Apparently the new Day has jumping zombies that can leap 20 foot through people's bedroom windows. No stiff joints on those f**kers! :lol:

[ngm231]

the whole fast slow thing is gonna be incorperated in my movie

[Philly_SWAT]

Excellent points Capn. I would say this about ngm231 initial comments....if the dead actually could come to life, maybe the "freshly dead" could move faster that those that were dead longer. But as far as we know, the dead can not actually come to life. In GAR's dead movies, there is no specific cause given for why they do rise, and given that, we can not know how the dead may or may not move speed-wise, given we do not know the ramifications of whatever it is that made them come back to life in the first place. In the GAR universe, zombies can not run. The cemetary zombie does move kind of fast, but that was more due to it being GARs first film, and having no "rulebook" at that time. Also, as he was keeping up with the car, it was not running. Barbera did not have the keys, she just put it in neutral, and the ground there is not very hilly initially from where she was parked, therefore it would not be hard to keep up while having a slow pace. The slope increases later, and Barbera can not control the car and it crashes into a tree.

As far as jumping zombies and running zombies, whether you like them or not is a personal preference. I dont happen to like them. But in the universe of the stories in which they are contained, they can run and jump as fast as the story-teller dictates. They are not part of the GAR universe, and that is the universe that I prefer.

[Mutineer]

In my Zombie world ...

the fresher, the faster

the older, the slower

[Excessium]

Actually, it sets in upon death. That is one of the reasons why i think Dawn '04 is just a bad story. And the whole "runners then as time passes they slow down" concept is pretty much wrong as far as anatomy goes. The whole undead premise is silly in its self as well, so I guess you can make them do whatever you like. But I'm just saying, as far as rigor mortis: it sets in upon death. Romero was wrong about the way it works.
I got this off an medical encyclopedia:

rigor mortis


(rĭ´gr môr´tĭs) , rigidity of the body that occurs after death. The onset may vary from about 10 min to several hours or more after death, depending on the condition of the body at death and on factors in the atmosphere, particularly temperature. Rigor mortis affects the facial musculature first and then spreads to other parts of the body. It is caused by chemical changes in the muscle tissue. The state of rigor usually lasts about 24 hours or until muscle decomposition takes place by acid formation.

So you see, they should start off really slow, then go balls out running. =)
But then if you have your zombies decomposing at a natural state, then due to muscle decomposition they should never really sprint at full human speed.
Thats what I think anyhow. :D

[ngm231]

i dont mean running exactly i mean like they dont walk as slow as the romero zombies.

[EvilNed]

Zombies ran long before 28 Days Later. Nightmare City from 1980? Not true zombies, but they're still "dead" and mutated.

Then Return of the Living Dead in 1985.

[Excessium]

My favorite zombies are the ones from Resident Evil 1&2. I know alot of people didn't like the movies, I hate RE 2, but they had good zombies for the most part...yeah, the graveyard scene in RE 2 was cheesy. :(
Overall, they moved well. They kept the stiffness, and still moved faster then .1 mph. If you can ever stomach the features for RE2, they have segment on how they implemented the zombies movement. I think those zombies are the perfect zombies. They don't run, but they don't move slow enough to let you think the characters have nothing to fear-like NotLD remake, where Babs just walks by all of them in the end.

RE zombies are the "balanced" zombies now. Faster then GAR's zombies, slower then Dawn 04's zombie, they can be set up to persuit their victims like Micheal Myers.

[Philly_SWAT]

They don't run, but they don't move slow enough to let you think the characters have nothing to fear-like NotLD remake, where Babs just walks by all of them in the end.
To me, the very thing to fear is the fact that they move so slow, yet they always seem to get you in the end. It is easier to avoid and be aware of an obvious threat than one that is less obvious. You end up dead either way, but it is easier to spot, and therefore avoid, a fast moving zombie.

[Excessium]

The reason why most of the zombies in GAR's movie ever ate was due to Man Vs. Man conflict. GAR's zombies were really never the antagonist, they were always used as a sort of prop. So because of that, his zombies were never a threat to get you on their own, they need help. :D
The faster zombies put a very short clock on characters in a film. The "clock" serves to add tension and suspense on a per zombie encounter. The only reason why I don't like runners is because, while I CAN imagine the dead coming back(for some insane reason), I can't fathom the thought of a decomposing body's ability to sprint at human speed.

I won't go into Lands zombies...I just don't have the hand speed or accuracy of the butcher zombie atm to chop off someone's hand, while the arm is in motion throwing a grenade. :clown:

[HLS]

Well I think the first few hours of death they would be slow or non moving due to rigor mortis which starts within a few minutes to a few hours after death depending on the environment the body is in. Generally 35 to 40 hours after death the muscles relax again then the zombies should be able to move fast. When the bodys decay more they will start to slow down again. That is the way I see it if by any chance a zombie plaque would be real.
So due to the rigor mortis process I think the zombies should be easy to eliminate before they become a real threat. But that is just my opinion.

[Danny]

They don't run, but they don't move slow enough to let you think the characters have nothing to fear-like NotLD remake, where Babs just walks by all of them in the end.



yeah that bugged the hell outta me, they spend the whole film i the house when they could have just left?, weak ending man, that totally let it down.

[Deadman_Deluxe]

Zombies ran long before 28 Days Later. Nightmare City from 1980? Not true zombies, but they're still "dead" and mutated.

Then Return of the Living Dead in 1985.

No zombies in 28 DAYS LATER, only "infected" people who were still alive and breathing. No zombies in NIGHTMARE CITY either, just some mutants who were "a bit like zombies" ... and ROTLD was a "spoof" horror/comedy where the zombies could run, talk, tell jokes and prefered to eat brains rather than flesh.

Not a single zombie flesheater in sight.

[EvilNed]

No zombies in 28 DAYS LATER, only "infected" people who were still alive and breathing. No zombies in NIGHTMARE CITY either, just some mutants who were "a bit like zombies" ... and ROTLD was a "spoof" horror/comedy where the zombies could run, talk, tell jokes and prefered to eat brains rather than flesh.

Not a single zombie flesheater in sight.

Even though none of them had zombies, they were still zombiefilms. Especially Nightmare City, where the mutans need to drink fresh blood of their victims.

[Huescacho]

Hellow. I'm from Spain. My english isn't perfec (I'm sorry). I'm a new member in this post... When I saw to the zombies running, I thought that they afraid me more, because the old zombies, was very slow, and we could run away easily, whit this new type, it's more difficult!!!.

[capncnut]

Welcome Huescacho, great to see a new face on the board. Don't worry about the english, it is fine. :)

[DEAD BEAT]

i always have and always will find romero's zombies the best mainly because the more lifeless animation the scarier it is!

when a dead human being returns to life i would imagine that the brain is rottening along with the rest of the body and what was cool about romero's is that some zombies could barely comprehend how to walk,which is how it should be.

the fact that the new zombies scream like faggots just makes the film appear phonier that it already is,plus it takes so much focus and concentration for a real human to run especially for a long period of time,i dont believe a zombie can keep up that sort of brain function!:cool:

[Chakobsa]

Hellow. I'm from Spain. My english isn't perfec (I'm sorry). I'm a new member in this post... When I saw to the zombies running, I thought that they afraid me more, because the old zombies, was very slow, and we could run away easily, whit this new type, it's more difficult!!!.


I think that Svengoolie has probably said all that you can say on this topic.
There are sound physiological reasons why the runners are scary, human beings and probably most other animals experience something called pain, yeah, I know it's not very nice but it stops us from damaging ourselves too badly.
Lack of pain due to nerve damage is what leads to the disfiguring injuries you see in those unfortunate enough to suffer from Hansons disease (leprosy).
The musculature (sp?) of the human body is very powerful, remember, our design is best suited to chasing down game in Africa.Our genes know that the creatures that carry them have to be strong and smart but not reckless.
Pain tells us to stop before we damage the body. The dead don't care, they'll keep going 'till your barricade fails or you machete their heads off or they eat you.
Shamblers are scary 'cause in the event of an outbreak human folly and our crowded planet would equal a dismal future for any survivors. Slow and steady wins the race.
I think that the aggregate damage to the race would be the same, though with runners the eventual prevailing condition of zombie domination of most of the earth would occur a wee bit faster.
Btw, I prefer shamblers.:D


Rigor mortis usually starts at around three to four hours after death and is generally gone after thirty six hours, it's due to the breakdown of a chemical
called ATP, interestingly this is the chemical that facilitates the transfer of energy between cells to allow for muscle contraction and therefore movement. Maybe whatever causes the dead to rise inhibits the breakdown of this chemical.
The fact that the onset of rigor can be affected by temperature may have contributed to the belief in vampires. Imagine that after a death in the village
the body of the deceased doesn't stiffen as normal...
As to the bleeding etc, you're right; they shouldn't, but then we are talking about horror
movies so some licence is to be expected. Maybe whatever revives them etc, etc.
At the end of the day; yes it's just fantasy horror and it doesn't have to have rigorous internal consistency, but it's FUN to speculate.
BTW, some of the info above is from wikipedia and some is my own.
Welcome, Huescacho. Hope you find these old posts of mine helpful.:)

[Huescacho]

Welcome Huescacho, great to see a new face on the board. Don't worry about the english, it is fine. :)

I thank you the welcome!. I like this board. George A. Romero is the master!.


Welcome, Huescacho. Hope you find these old posts of mine helpful.:)

Thank you, Chakobsa. Your posts are very interesting. I agree with you. It's fantasy, but afraid!.

[bassman]

Hellow. I'm from Spain. My english isn't perfec (I'm sorry). I'm a new member in this post... When I saw to the zombies running, I thought that they afraid me more, because the old zombies, was very slow, and we could run away easily, whit this new type, it's more difficult!!!.

As said before, welcome to HPotD.

I can see why you would find the running zombies more frightening and definitely harder to get away from, but to me, that's not Romero was going for with his zombies. Romero's zombies are easy to get away from and take care of, but the real horror is that the humans can't do it. Instead of banding together and working as a whole, we begin to turn our weapons on each other rather than the problem at hand. Also, the slow zombies aren't too easy to get away from in a large group.:eek:

I find Romero's films and zombies to be a more traditional horror that everyone can relate to and see themselves becoming rather than the new-age horror movies that are just "RUN, RUN, RUN, SCREAM, SCREAM, SCREAM" over two hours.

That's the way I see it, anyway.

[Danny]

the thing i dont get is ,people allway give scientific reasons about zombies running, and rigormortis and whatnot but they never get the key point, the dead dont rise from the grave to begin with, if the impossible happens there it is not impossible for a corpse to run, rather that than hissing like the creatures from jurassic park or mean girls;)

[Huescacho]

Certainly... It's a good idea. If the impossible, happens, something can happen, no?. The most danger moment, I think that is the first hours... There is a lot of disorder and unkownledge, but when the people is ready, I don't think that the zombies can survive a lot of time. A lot of people, on the roofs, firing their weapons, became devastating!.

[Brubaker]

the thing i dont get is ,people allway give scientific reasons about zombies running, and rigormortis and whatnot but they never get the key point, the dead dont rise from the grave to begin with, if the impossible happens there it is not impossible for a corpse to run, rather that than hissing like the creatures from jurassic park or mean girls;)

Fiction allows the impossible to happen. Like the third Jaws movie features a great white shark bigger than any that has ever been discovered in the "real" world, not to mention a shark that growls/roars like a lion (also never recorded in "real" life). Oh and this shark manages to make his way into what is essentially Sea World, which is conveniently connected to the salt water ocean. The fourth Jaws is also good. The shark follows members of a specific family (Brody) halfway around the world, as if he were psychic, including forays into and through water that real great whites can not survive in.

[DEAD BEAT]

the thing i dont get is ,people allway give scientific reasons about zombies running, and rigormortis and whatnot but they never get the key point, the dead dont rise from the grave to begin with, if the impossible happens there it is not impossible for a corpse to run, rather that than hissing like the creatures from jurassic park or mean girls;)

"what"!,you mean zombies arn't real"!!!

boy someone sure steared me wrong!
:eek:

[Chakobsa]

the thing i dont get is ,people allway give scientific reasons about zombies running, and rigormortis and whatnot but they never get the key point, the dead dont rise from the grave to begin with, if the impossible happens there it is not impossible for a corpse to run, rather that than hissing like the creatures from jurassic park or mean girls;)
Hellsing, read my post again, I cearly stated that it's part of the FUN to speculate:) . We're talking about fantasy horror films after all, and what is "the key point" that we're missing anyhow, that the dead don't actually rise to feast on the warm flesh of the living? Thanks for clearing that one up for me.:rolleyes: :D

[Chaos]

I always thought zombie mobility should be determined by tissue damage and the severity of rigor mortis.

A resurrected zombie with little or no tissue damage should move faster than one with half of his thigh chewed off.

[bassman]

I always thought zombie mobility should be determined by tissue damage and the severity of rigor mortis.

A resurrected zombie with little or no tissue damage should move faster than one with half of his thigh chewed off.

True. But when dealing with something Fictional like the walking dead, it's not necesarily a good idea to go into scientific reasoning, ya know? I mean....they're dead....they're people....they're walking. Why does it matter about deteriation, muscle loss and all that jazz?

Probably only "fanboys" like us folk here at HPotD think about stuff like that.:thumbsup:

[Huescacho]

Yes, in Spain the "normal people", call us frikies!. I think that it's funny talk about this things, but without loss the real live. I have a lot of dudes of that zombi crisis became sometimes... (I stay...).

[Danny]

..did something happen over there that didnt make it to the news?:shifty: :D

[Craig]

I like the idea that the book Plague of the Dead had, that the infected are alive, running about biting people and tearing the lving crap out of them, then, when they are die or are killed (by means other than the brain being destroyed) they come back as slow zombies.

But whatever, slow zombies, fast zombies, I'll normally take either.

[LoSTBoY]

IMO, the brain is the cause of the slow shamble as the motor functions have been minimised with everything else, therefore it doesn't depend on the freshness of the zombie but the capacity of the zombie's motor function.

I'm not sure about this, but if a zed is continually moving then rigor mortis would not set in as they are moving their limbs and keeping them loose.

Any medical doctors in the house? :)

[rawrOTD]

based on anatomy class, psychology class, and what ive learned from my mother being a nurse practitioner

the dead would not only not be able to run
but odds are they would never be able to walk upright due to not having the previous experience of walking
when they were human they knew how
theyd have to relearn it im guessing

so
lets just assume they retain that much skill from life

im assuming zombies are living off of the small inner core of the brain
its pretty reptile in there
im not sure but i think its called the limbic? either that or the limbic is the one that processes music and emotions



but
with that part of the brain (whatever its called) intact they can do all basic motor skills
however, the body begins to stiffen in rigor mortis only if the body is left in a single position for a length of time

assuming reanimation occurs within hours the zombies would have no problem with muscles or other systems being stiff
they cant run
but they can definately stumble towards you

sorry to add more medical slosh to this

but yeah, no trouble with the traditional romero shamble
at least not medically

it really boils dw o how they became a zombie?
bitten? how bad? where?
if they were eaten or torn to bits the mobility will go way down
if they died of some other cause it would effect it too

but maximum speed is romero style
im sure excited zombies would try to stumble faster
and prolly fall over or fall apart