Its all a conspiracy against Christians...

[MissJacksonCA]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19806312/?GT1=10150

If the girl takes her ring off does that mean she'll lose her faith? I think not.

[RustyHicks]

It's all about control MissJackson.
Sad affairs, when you try to take someone's
faith or even try to dictate to them about
thier faith.
Power and control is what
people want and sometimes
will do anything to get it,
even try to destroy a persons faith.

[MissJacksonCA]

If someone can destroy your faith then perhaps you never had it or deserved it to begin with

[darth los]

If someone can destroy your faith then perhaps you never had it or deserved it to begin with

That's some true sh8t. wait a minute. We actually agree on something!?!

[mista_mo]

no it isn't, faith can be brought down an destroyed, it takes time if you are truly faithful but it happens. It doesn't mean that they were undeserving in anyway.

[Danny]

i agree with mo haveing your faith broken doesnt mean you "werent christian enough, omfg!", it's more likely a sign that you can seriously weigh your spiritual beliefs rather than just fall back on blind fanatiscism.
believeing in a any gods or just one god is a monumental part of someones core, you could have been taking to a catholic church by your parents and pray every sunday but that wouldnt mean that you 100% believed in the 'god' just that you were raised that way, i know a few people who were raised to believe somethign but then as they gre wolder changed there religion adn there beliefs, its all a matter of perspective.

[darth los]

no it isn't, faith can be brought down an destroyed, it takes time if you are truly faithful but it happens. It doesn't mean that they were undeserving in anyway.

I would be afraid if that wan't the case. A person who's mind can't be changed even though they have no proof of what they believe can be dangerous. Just take a look at our president.

[MissJacksonCA]

I just see it as one of those if you love something, let it go if it comes back its yours and if not it never was...

A person can't take your faith... they dont hold you at gunpoint and say give me your faith now or i'll shoot out your willy... a person may destroy what you believe in like say by telling you Santa isn't real... but that's not the same as your faith in a religon which is what this is about. If you're a religous person and lose your faith you never had it to begin with. Faith requires a strength that will stand the test of time that not all people have. Perhaps thats why the Jews are Gods chosen ones. They seem to be the most steadfast and determined faithful people on the planet. They have a strict belief system and stick to it. Some are religious cosmetically but for those who aren't i'm in awe of their adherence to their beliefs despite all. That is something they will be rewarded for even if they dont believe in Heaven or Hell.

[Dtothe3]

Looks like the school simply said it wasn't a symbol of faith. It's involved with an outside group encouraging abstinance (pity, she's kinda hot). The school makes allowances for religious symbols.

[Debbieangel]

i agree with mo haveing your faith broken doesnt mean you "werent christian enough, omfg!", it's more likely a sign that you can seriously weigh your spiritual beliefs rather than just fall back on blind fanatiscism.
believeing in a any gods or just one god is a monumental part of someones core, you could have been taking to a catholic church by your parents and pray every sunday but that wouldnt mean that you 100% believed in the 'god' just that you were raised that way, i know a few people who were raised to believe somethign but then as they gre wolder changed there religion adn there beliefs, its all a matter of perspective.

Yes, I agree with you and mo...this girl stood up for her beliefs and she even took it to court.
If we don't stand up for our rights don't you see little by little they are being taken away from us. This girl was proving a point it has nothing to do with taking that ring off her finger, she still has her faith. Faith is within us and it can be torn down after time, thats why you have to stay grounded in your faith whatever belief system you have.
Take it if a person tells you everday you are stupid after awhile you begin to believe it.Someone tearing you down like that does have a determental effect on a persons mind and spirit.
I think this girl should be praised for standing up for what she believes in...I am proud of her!!! God bless her!:)

[darth los]

Faith is not tangible. There are physical representations or embodiments that people use as spiritual aids such as rosary beads. However, if forced to part with them does that mean that it's all over? It shouldn't be a big deal because that's just a worldly item.

[MissJacksonCA]

i'm agreeing all over darth... you can take a ring, a rosary, a prayer shawl, a bible... that doesn't mean you've lost your faith because you dont have something to cling to. It simply means you've lost something that shows your faith or may be instrumental in practicing your faith but if you are indeed truly faithful then you will overcome... b'sides it wasn't a rosary or a bible... it was an ornamental ring

while its great she had a belief she was willing to stand up for this could all be a publicity stunt to raise awareness of faithful abstain programs like this girls parents began

[darth los]

i'm agreeing all over darth... you can take a ring, a rosary, a prayer shawl, a bible... that doesn't mean you've lost your faith because you dont have something to cling to. It simply means you've lost something that shows your faith or may be instrumental in practicing your faith but if you are indeed truly faithful then you will overcome... b'sides it wasn't a rosary or a bible... it was an ornamental ring

while its great she had a belief she was willing to stand up for this could all be a publicity stunt to raise awareness of faithful abstain programs like this girls parents began

As i always say everyone has an agenda and that could very well be the case.

One interesting thing though. There are many instances where catholics and christians are abused and ridiculed and everyone is okay with it. However, try that with jews or muslims and there's an international uproar. christianity and catholicism definitely don't get the reverence they deserve as one 2 of the world's great major religions.

[MissJacksonCA]

Well you'll have to forgive me personally if I have a hard time respecting some religons who protect their church leaders who are committing crimes...

[darth los]

Well you'll have to forgive me personally if I have a hard time respecting Catholics when their chuch leaders are busy molesting children and everyone else is busy protecting them... a grand assumption the scale of which we will never know because the church is a protected place ...

But muslims murder in the name of god in some sick perversion of their faith, yet no one dares even print a cartoon of their prophet muhammed for fear of worldwide reprocussions. Meanwhile you can catch jesus on the next episode of south park.

[MissJacksonCA]

lol everyone ends up on southpark sooner or later...

[mista_mo]

muslims are horrid examples of what faith is. They use it as an excuse to murder those they deem the infidel, or even their own.

by muslims, i mean the kidn we seem to see alot...They perverse what islam actually is about.

It's disgusting.

And back to the christian thing:
The bible is Gods word, and as such is a central part of the christian faith. It was written by God through men and is one of the most important things to a christian. It brigns us up when we need it, it helps push us in the right direction, and it helps to strengthen our resolve. Even thinking of taking that away from them is riddick, as missjack seems to enjoy saying.

They may be wordly items, but they are representative of God himself, and as such are very important to us. A virginity ring is a symbol of a pact that person has made with God to remain pure, and yes, it is a worldy item created by the hands of men, but it is a symbol of what God wants for us.

[MissJacksonCA]

but the act of taking it away does not dissolve your faith in god or the pact you've made with him... and its simply not being worn at school... it can be worn any other time she pleases...

[darth los]

lol everyone ends up on southpark sooner or later...

If they had any cojones they would put muhammed in an episode and see what happens. They won't do that though because they're afraid of what might happen.

[MissJacksonCA]

that sounds like a dare to me harry

[Khardis]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19806312/?GT1=10150

If the girl takes her ring off does that mean she'll lose her faith? I think not.

Ah so you agree that Muslim women should be forced to remove thier cultural and religious garb as well then right? right?...


If someone can destroy your faith then perhaps you never had it or deserved it to begin with

Fortunately not everyone believes in the watered down version of faith that you do. In some cultures not wearing a certain item or doing a certain ritual condemns you for all time.Who are you to judge that as wrong?


but the act of taking it away does not dissolve your faith in god or the pact you've made with him... and its simply not being worn at school... it can be worn any other time she pleases...

You may no longer speak against Christians ever again on tis subject, I am not taking away or destroying your belief in hating Christians etc, I am just trying to let you know that its not allowed, you're still free though, youre free to think what you wish in the privacy of your own home. But when you go outside, keep your thoughts chained up. Good for them, then its good for you.

[MissJacksonCA]

The muslim girl who wanted to wear her muslim gown was perfectly fine not wearing it at school until 2002 so that in itself would suggest to me and any other person capable of reading that it wasn't that important to begin with. Only when she wanted to wear a different Muslim garb was she told no. Muslims who want to preserve their identity and values can freely do so ...outside of school and if they dont care for a schools policy they're free to change schools. Not being able to wear something is not going to take your faith away its simply going to prohibit you from advertising your religous beliefs. Big woo.

If you want to manifest your religon go for it. School isn't the place for you to do so it is a learning institution. Far as i'm concerned all public schools and private as well should follow a uniform code and have a behavioral conduct code to go with it and any students violating either should be booted.

And if you're party to certain cultures that condemn any behavior or clothing banned in other regions may I suggest you find a swift trip back home if you dont like your acceptance where ever you have gone. All places have different ways of behaving and dressing... a decorum you must maintain in order to be welcome... school is one of those places and if you dont like the rules find a school where you can do as you please.

[Dtothe3]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19806312/?GT1=10150

If the girl takes her ring off does that mean she'll lose her faith? I think not.


Ah so you agree that Muslim women should be forced to remove their cultural and religious garb as well then right? right?...

Kardis, if you had made a point of reading the link, then you'd know that the school has policies regarding religious symbols, and one that attempts to treat each group equally. Here's a statement from the girl over it;

“I believe that the judge’s decision will mean that slowly, over time, people such as school governors, employers, political organizations and others will be allowed to stop Christians from publicly expressing and practicing their faith.”

Does that sound like she wrote that over her faith, or as a jumped up chance to publicise "The Ring Thing"?


If someone can destroy your faith then perhaps you never had it or deserved it to begin with


Fortunately not everyone believes in the watered down version of faith that you do. In some cultures not wearing a certain item or doing a certain ritual condemns you for all time.Who are you to judge that as wrong?

This point was also raised (and shot down) in the article. Here's another quote;

"Lawyers for the school denied discrimination and said the purity ring breached its rules on wearing jewelry.

They said allowances were made for Muslim and Sikh pupils only for items integral to their religious beliefs and that, for the same reason, crucifixes were also allowed. But it argued that the purity ring was not an integral part of the Christian faith."

Here's another quote on the actual group theirselves;

Playfoot’s parents are key members of the British arm of the American chastity campaign group the Silver Ring Thing, a religious group which urges abstinence among young people.

Those who sign up wear a ring on the third finger of the left hand. It is inscribed with “Thess. 4:3-4,” a reference to a Biblical passage from Thessalonians which reads: “God wants you to be holy, so you should keep clear of all sexual sin.”

Tie this all together and it looks like they took an opportunity to heighten awareness of the groups activities. Also, pray tell where it states in the bible where it says "Wear a silver ring on your third finger or go to hell". If the parents wished for her to be educated in a full on religious environment, then I'm sure they could find one. It'd be private, but that's the price you pay.



but the act of taking it away does not dissolve your faith in god or the pact you've made with him... and its simply not being worn at school... it can be worn any other time she pleases...


You may no longer speak against Christians ever again on this subject, I am not taking away or destroying your belief in hating Christians etc, I am just trying to let you know that its not allowed, you're still free though, youre free to think what you wish in the privacy of your own home. But when you go outside, keep your thoughts chained up. Good for them, then its good for you.

I don't think she hates Christians so much as believes a uniform policy is the best approach. The simple fact is, that if you're beliefs are more important then you're schooling, then it's time to go join the Amish people.

The simple fact is, if you go to school, then the only ring you will have on at all times is you're ass ring. The rules on rings have been around for as long as I spent in school, and I'm sure they will be there for a while longer.

The belief is allowed, but jewellery for the sake of it isn't. If you wear a crucifix (as I'm sure she does), then it all comes under the same roof anyway.

[darth los]

Hold on, who the hell are MISS JANET AND MISS JACKIE !?! :lol: :p

[MissJacksonCA]

pssssssssst... dont rag on the new guy... he seems okay... :confused:

[Khardis]

Kardis, if you had made a point of reading the link, then you'd know that the school has policies regarding religious symbols, and one that attempts to treat each group equally. Here's a statement from the girl over it;

“I believe that the judge’s decision will mean that slowly, over time, people such as school governors, employers, political organizations and others will be allowed to stop Christians from publicly expressing and practicing their faith.”

Does that sound like she wrote that over her faith, or as a jumped up chance to publicise "The Ring Thing"?





This point was also raised (and shot down) in the article. Here's another quote;

"Lawyers for the school denied discrimination and said the purity ring breached its rules on wearing jewelry.

They said allowances were made for Muslim and Sikh pupils only for items integral to their religious beliefs and that, for the same reason, crucifixes were also allowed. But it argued that the purity ring was not an integral part of the Christian faith."

Here's another quote on the actual group theirselves;

Playfoot’s parents are key members of the British arm of the American chastity campaign group the Silver Ring Thing, a religious group which urges abstinence among young people.

Those who sign up wear a ring on the third finger of the left hand. It is inscribed with “Thess. 4:3-4,” a reference to a Biblical passage from Thessalonians which reads: “God wants you to be holy, so you should keep clear of all sexual sin.”

Tie this all together and it looks like they took an opportunity to heighten awareness of the groups activities. Also, pray tell where it states in the bible where it says "Wear a silver ring on your third finger or go to hell". If the parents wished for her to be educated in a full on religious environment, then I'm sure they could find one. It'd be private, but that's the price you pay.





I don't think she hates Christians so much as believes a uniform policy is the best approach. The simple fact is, that if you're beliefs are more important then you're schooling, then it's time to go join the Amish people.

The simple fact is, if you go to school, then the only ring you will have on at all times is you're ass ring. The rules on rings have been around for as long as I spent in school, and I'm sure they will be there for a while longer.

The belief is allowed, but jewellery for the sake of it isn't. If you wear a crucifix (as I'm sure she does), then it all comes under the same roof anyway.

Brilliant, so now school administrators get to pick and choose which constitutes religious garb and just plain ole jewelry? Ding ding, mussies get to force thier women into head scarves and whatever, but these EVIL VILE WICKED IMPERIALIST CHRISTIAN BASTARD SUCKERS have their purity rings put on the ban list. Yeah real equal. Typical leftists hypocrisies. OF COURSE Muslims, Jews, and anyone non-Christian gets to wear something against the blanket policy. Just not those wicked christians who are ALWAYS bending and breaking the rules with their EVIL RINGS which are IN YOUR FACE!

If they can make allowances for Hijabs and Ceremonial daggers (aka long ass knives/weapons) then the little Christian girl should be allowed to wear her friggin ring. Maybe to some ignorant atheist it isn't a symbol of the persons religion, but to the girl it is, and they have NO RIGHT to ban it while allowing other people to wear their religious crap. They either allow jewelry and clothing against the ban list because its religious or cultural in nature or they don't. Not some for some and none for others, that is the essence of discrimination.

[flyboy]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19806312/?GT1=10150

If the girl takes her ring off does that mean she'll lose her faith? I think not.


i read this the other day, its bloody stupid. in my country a few months ago an asian girl WON her battle @ the court of human rights to wear her hijab,but a christian girl cant wear her ring? stoopid and wrong.:mad:

[MissJacksonCA]

Technically they're both very similar in that the ring symbolizes her commitment to her abstaining from sex and the hijab is used as a means of preventing sexual attention (it has many uses but that's the short of it).

[flyboy]

exactly.:|

[darth los]

There are many religious articles of clothing that are recognized by the gov't such as kufis and yarmakas. I guess her ring didn't make the cut.

[MissJacksonCA]

I really hope you're not equating her purity ring with a yamaka... god didn't hand eve a ring but perhaps mary could've used one

[darth los]

I really hope you're not equating her purity ring with a yamaka... god didn't hand eve a ring but perhaps mary could've used one

I've never heard of a purity ring myself. It sounds like something a group of people made up like a friendship bracelet or something. In any case the people who didn't want her o wear it thought pretty much the same thing. In any case it's no big deal. Even if you're totally naked and can't wear a yarmaka does that make you any less devout? So i gouess yoour less faithful in the shower when you don't have it on than any other time.

[Kaos]

Hmm, so if someone thinks that a strap-on dildo is a religious symbol then they should be allowed to wear it to school? I feel that a purity ring is not what one would normally consider an officially stamped icon of christianity (having been raised a christian as a child and surrounded by at least a nominally christian population), but by Khardis' definition of what should be allowed in school, anyone claiming to be a christian who believes that a strap-on dildo is a christian symbol should be allowed to wear one at all times during the school day. Who is to say it isn't? Certainly not school officials who also have a pretty good idea of what christian iconography is and is not seeing that they have been around christians all their life and actually live as subjects of a christian nation in the UK.:rolleyes:

[Khardis]

I really hope you're not equating her purity ring with a yamaka... god didn't hand eve a ring but perhaps mary could've used one

You're goddamned right I am. WHo are you to say what counts as a religious expression? God didnt hand Eve nothing, if you go that route, women arent allowed to talk to men unless allowed by the men, should walk behind men, and should not be allowed to vote or own property. We either allow all religious expression, or NONE. period. Until then its discrimination,


Hmm, so if someone thinks that a strap-on dildo is a religious symbol then they should be allowed to wear it to school? I feel that a purity ring is not what one would normally consider an officially stamped icon of christianity (having been raised a christian as a child and surrounded by at least a nominally christian population), but by Khardis' definition of what should be allowed in school, anyone claiming to be a christian who believes that a strap-on dildo is a christian symbol should be allowed to wear one at all times during the school day. Who is to say it isn't? Certainly not school officials who also have a pretty good idea of what christian iconography is and is not seeing that they have been around christians all their life and actually live as subjects of a christian nation in the UK.:rolleyes:

Yes because a dildo is the same exact thing as jewelry or clothing. Lets take YOUR argument to the extream. There is only 1 god the god of the Roman Catholic church, all jews and mussies will burn in hell for thier heathen religion and therefore thier yamukas and head scarves are not religious in nature they are just like rings and dildos. And therefore not allowed.

[Kaos]

Yes because a dildo is the same exact thing as jewelry or clothing.

As long as you agree that it is also christian iconography, I suppose you are correct. :)

BTW - if you are using heathen in its religious context then neither muslims or jews can be heathen.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=heathen

___________________________________________
Edit:

I have been advised that maybe one of our members is skirting the boundaries of our anti-religious flaming rules, and that it would be best to close the thread. <<<Coughardis>>><<<Cough>>> Sorry folks!