Video - Decomposition of a pig

[Neil]

Look how quick decomposition takes place in this video (of a baby pig)...

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[Andy]

Now we know what neil does in his spare time :confused:

[capncnut]

BACON SARNIES!!!


Now we know what neil does in his spare time :confused:
What? Watches piggy snuff? :lol:

[Neil]

It's amazing how fast it kicks in!

[MinionZombie]

So now we all know Neil is a serial killer ... *steps away slowly, reaches for a bat with a nail in it or something* ... I wouldn't wanna own that clock after all that crap going down...or away, rather. :eek:

Seen the one of the fox? That's well sped up, the eye exploding outwards is proper gross ... why do I watch these things?

*walks away, shaking head, disappointed in himself* :D

[bassman]

:|

For some reason all I can think of is the Diner scene in Pulp Fiction.:rockbrow:

Man...that was quite disturbing..

[MikePizzoff]

It's kind of gross how all of the bugs inside of it make it looks like it's mouth is talking for quite sometime. Then it looks like a rat backing it's way out of the mouth once extreme decomposition kicks in.

[Neil]

I suppose the thing of interest - given the genre of this forum - is that the infection would HAVE TO slow down decomposition (like I suggested in 'The Midas Touch'), else the creatures would rot away quickly!

[Terran]

Actually while watching this I thought how slow it happened.....

To an extent it depends on "perception".....but to avoid that "conversation retarder" I feel I need to clarify....

Slowly:
One could accelerate this decomposition to a large if not huge degree if there were more open avenues....If you watch the video you can see how to gut swells while the various bacteria colonizes, this happens almost painfully slowly since the tissue is still intact and "nutrient" flow is relatively restricted...You kind of watch it instinctively waiting for something to burst....

Anyone can notice when the decomposition accelerates rapidly....When tissue tears around the mouth you can see the obvious aggressive digestion of the tissue....it pulsates with activity.....(you can see this again with more intensity when the gut area finally gets an opening and the quickness of everything….It all just dissolves into a maggot jelly)

When there is an open cavity that has open access to the "air".....whenever these avenues make themselves available you can see how the flesh rapidly dissolves away via time-lapse.....


With that understanding its easy to envision a butchered animal or half eaten organism being especially susceptible to "decay"...but more appropriately its not “decay”, its a feeding....the flies and larva would literally devour a huge portion of the animal within the first 24 hours....as long as the flesh is "dead"....

Okay….prep yourself for zombie science nerd out……

!!!Disclaimer Zombie Nerd Out!!!

So in regards to Neils last statement he is completely correct.....
For "zombies" to last any extended period of time there would have to be some sort of activity occurring cellularly,

but part of what still makes "zombies" appealing is that there are many various mechanisms that could make this aspect completely plausible...fiction is most great when its founded in something possible...(even if improbable)...
There are just so many different things that could delay the "natural rapid decay".....

More physical: is the amount of exposed tissue....(effects things on many levels)

Most fundamental is the fly lifecycle.....any variable that would disrupt that would significantly slow the decay...The larva eat dead flesh voraciously...(you can extend this to many levels....what attracts the flies?...what makes the larva feed on this decaying material rather than living material?...etc).... This means you could delay consumption decay drastically on many levels by just addressing the base issue of why organisms view this flesh as food…..theres so many ways to do this….


And then you can think about it metabolically, the response to decay....



Hmmm crap!!!…..I was about to dive into various nerdisms regarding zombies…..but preemptively I realized that so much revolves around how the story teller initially defines the nature of the “zombies“…..

Imagine that I couldve gone into more pointless, factless, zombie rule related rambling

Example…28 days later describes their scenario as some sort of super aggressive disease…like a super rabies or something…It has a particular describable pathenogenesis .so within this fiction the disease has its negative effect….the infected eventually die of dehydration…or other various mortal type death causes…..this fiction “solved” the problem by making the “zombies” not dead….the were living humans infected with a condition that made them acquire seemingly unhuman like characteristics….but still plausible….

Romero Dead Movies….. (still my favorite)….He chose to address the problem in the lightest way possible….the “zombies” are clinically dead in most of the ways we use to describe death…. The kicker is…there is still some sort of brain activity occurring….brain activity that is reflective of the person that existed before “infection“…..Additionally there appears to be some sort of phenomenon retarding the multiple processes of natural decay…I think this is what makes this portrayal most appealing….a healthy dose of describable rules with the addition of unknowns that make the problem additionally perplexing…..

Also I feel that this scenario is more realistic in its outlandishness….

Running zombies like seen in the remake is just complete ridiculousness using its surrounding logic….With various issues surrounding decay…metabolism…and starting tissues…. theres no reason why the Dawn remake zombies would have the capabilities to sprint that way they do…..(28 Days later at least had a logic behind their fast “zombies”)…..I mean even the “undead” are subject to thermodynamics….if you couldn’t generate the power to sprint fast in life you definitely should not be able to in Romero zombie death….and if they could somehow generate this sort of energy there should be some sort of accelerated decrepitude (like 28 days)….


Now Im not as militant as Romero…..I don’t think zombies have to move slow for dramatic effect….nor do I think that they have to move fast for scare value….I think that we lost something….zombies could be so much scarier if they were realistic….

This is my vision….mostly Romero inspired but taken further “realistically”
“zombies” are “dead” clinically speaking….their heart has stopped….they are no longer pumping blood nor using their lungs for their primary purpose….
There is still cellular activity occurring through various neurological pathways and thus various tissue systems remain active and under neurological control. These pathways however are scaleably degenerative as nutrient deficiencies accumulate and play a larger role. This means the “fresher” the zombie the faster and more limber they are…..but this means that even in the best circumstances the “zombie” can only react and move on the equivalent that they were still their human self but very very drunk….This isn’t as “unscary” as it might appear…imagine yourself very drunk….you can really put some speed behind yourself but are lacking some coordinating behavior….but in the “zombie” mindset where one doesn’t think about sacrificing their body this speed and determination I feel can be more scary than the mindless sprinting invincible meat machines…….




Clip Responce

Like I briefly mentioned earlier...I was actually surprised how slow it happened....And also Like I said earlier I think its clear that this is largely due to the preperation of the "subject"....I dont mean to get technical....but wheres the control?....stick a pin sized hole in the belly of the pig before this "experiment" start and I bet the pig would decay twice as fast.......not to mention humidity.....heat......air flow...and any of the other numerous potential factors....


Still its always neat to watch timedelay photography....since I was in highschool I wanted to animate myself from day to day....like each day would be a frame.....but Im too lazy....and the results would just be too depressing....but by the time I was 75(if I made it that long) the result would be impressive....Like I tried this exercise several times ....but the longest I ever went consquetively was close to a month.....I tried to rationalize.....maybe once a month would be intersting enough to animate....but that much time spread out was too hard to stay on top of....

[Neil]

Actually while watching this I thought how slow it happened.....
Really? I thought it was amazingly quick! Within hours it is alread clearly starting to decompose. Within 3-4 days it's basically gone!



Romero - Additionally there appears to be some sort of phenomenon retarding the multiple processes of natural decay…

Now, was this ever suggested in Romero films? Or indeed any film?

I've always thought that zombie films skirted around the fact that corpses would be a puddle of goo & bones after a few months, hence me suggesting in one of my pieces of fiction, the 'virus' had a side effect of slowing the decomposition process (for some reason)...

[Terran]

Really? I thought it was amazingly quick! Within hours it is alread clearly starting to decompose. Within 3-4 days it's basically gone!

Thats why I started with that
"To an extent it depends on "perception"....." phrase....I dunno, watching it in time lapse I couldnt help thinking about how it could have been sped up...we had to wait all that time for the gas to build up to rupture the gut just so the flies could have access to that tissue....and you can see how fast things accelerate once that opens up....

Similarily you can see the same thing in the mouth, which happened before the gut.....see how maggots seem to appear suddenly, and burst in "blooms" taking tissue with them....You might also notice how these bursts appear to occur in layers.....Its like once a layer is breached the maggots quickly devour the flesh on that availible layer....(same reason why maggots are used surgically essentially).....

I mean in this video we dont know much about the death of the pig....how did it die and where is its open orifices....I know its nitpicking but when I think of someone thinking " Wow its amazing how fast decay happens"....I cant help but think ...."Well if you had the same pig and put an inch long cut from its sternum towards teh stomach this pig would be gone twice as quickly under the same circumstances".....


Errrmm.....I just realized that my thought process may appear sick.....

In addition to my "sick" thought process I should also add.....this decay can only be considered "fast" given the constants of this setup....

whatever average temperature this decay occured over....

Animals that has access to the material...(from the video it just seems like bacteria and "some" species of fly [difference species do have different consumption rates])....

You could even adjust rates based on the diet of the organism before death. Contents of the stomach could alter times significantly given the scenario.....




Now, was this ever suggested in Romero films? Or indeed any film?

I've always thought that zombie films skirted around the fact that corpses would be a puddle of goo & bones after a few months, hence me suggesting in one of my pieces of fiction, the 'virus' had a side effect of slowing the decomposition process (for some reason)...

My memory may be failing.....I thought they mentioned the slow decay in some extent in Dawn.....and if not Dawn I thought they most definitely mentioned this in Day......I couldve swore they mentioned it in Day.... Im looking....I delayed this post for a while looking for it.....still looking....



LOOKING UP:.....