the nature of evil...

[Yojimbo]

Awesome thread, Scipio, one fantastic read!

[Mike70]

Awesome thread, Scipio, one fantastic read! well it is about to go the way of the dodo. so get your posts in now. i have just realized what a wheel spinner this particular issue is. this is almost akin to a religion thread, we can bitch and argue about it for 10 pages and nothing would come of it.

[Yojimbo]

I believe that while no-one emerges from the womb thinking "I can't wait till I grow up so I can get cannibalisin'", some people are born with a predisposition towards evil, sort of like some people are born with certain talents or weaknesses that can be nurtured or suppressed in the right environment. Agreed!

[Trencher]

I hope this thread dont get closed as I think it is interesting to see what people think of the issue.

[clanglee]

you guys are missing the point entirely. some actions like murder or rape are not relative, cultures aside. this is a gigantic waste of time and finger energy, we can go round and round like this forever. i see absolutely no reason for this thread to continue. But in some cultures, Rape is perfectly ok, as long as certain strictures are maintained. Same with murder. . it's called war or battle.

[Yojimbo]

well it is about to go the way of the dodo. so get your posts in now. i have just realized what a wheel spinner this particular issue is. Yeah, doing my best to compose my thoughts on this issue into something worth contributing, but I fear that if I do not do it soon I am going to miss my window of opportunity. Though I have always been impressed by the caliber of the posts here at HPOTD, I know that arguments of opinions can inflame passions and result in a lot of sniping and posturing. It is sad when it breaks down during interesting discussions since I think that many of you have very interesting things to say.

[Andy]

Closed at the thread authors request.

[Kaos]

Re-opened per author's request as well as others. Keep it civil guys.

[Mike70]

OK folks i have been asked to let this back out into the sun. so here you go.

[clanglee]

Thanks Scip. I really liked this thread. If it turns into a flame war. . I'll be the first to support its closing. My main thing is that, yes, I have certain things that I personally consider to be evil, but I can also stand back and see that it is a subjective concept that is seen differently through the eyes of the beholder. The nature of evil is one of my favorite socialogical and philosophical concepts.

[Khardis]

you guys are missing the point entirely. some actions like murder or rape are not relative, cultures aside. this is a gigantic waste of time and finger energy, we can go round and round like this forever. i see absolutely no reason for this thread to continue. So because you dont want to accept the fact that evil IS subjective and moral codes ARE relevant to who holds them you think the thread shouldn't continue? Why how evil of you.

[Yojimbo]

Thanks Scip. I really liked this thread. If it turns into a flame war. . I'll be the first to support its closing. My main thing is that, yes, I have certain things that I personally consider to be evil, but I can also stand back and see that it is a subjective concept that is seen differently through the eyes of the beholder. The nature of evil is one of my favorite socialogical and philosophical concepts. Scipio does raise an interesting point about things that are percieved as universally evil. Not being up on sociology and human studies, I am wondering if there are things that are cross culturally consistently considered as evil. For instance, one would think that there would be a cross cultural taboo about eating human flesh, but then there are some societies where this is an acceptable ritual. Same thing with incest, murder, rape. One would think that there should be some concept that is universally considered as evil, but for the life of me everytime I think about something that I think would fit that description, I remember hearing about some society or culture where it is considered to be acceptable practice. So help me out folks, there must be something that is universally viewed as evil. If we cannot find at least one, then maybe the whole concept of evil is indeed a subjective one.

[Mike70]

So because you dont want to accept the fact that evil IS subjective and moral codes ARE relevant to who holds them you think the thread shouldn't continue? Why how evil of you. no not really. sorry if i don't think murdering another person who isn't trying to kill you is subjective. it is wrong. period. regardless of cultural outlook. this might be considered my "opinion" but in my mind it is an absolute. this is giving me a headache. you simply don't understand and based on many of your other comments on here, you never will. why are you so incapable of respecting the ideas/opinions of others? what is this burning need you have to prove everyone wrong? does anyone else want to share their own thoughts on evil or are we just going to go round and round in a big circle jerk until the inevitable crash?

[clanglee]

As long as we don't get personal. (looks at Khardis) we should be fine. sorry if i don't think murdering another person who isn't trying to kill you is subjective. it is wrong. period. regardless of cultural outlook. this might be considered my "opinion" but in my mind it is an absolute. ? I agree. To you and I both, And hopefully everyone on this thread, Murder is wrong. But murder can also be circumstantial. There may be a reason for one man to attack and kill someone that would be perfectly acceptable to his fellow people. The Yanamamo for example are prone to horrible violence against each other for very little reason at all. This is accepted among the tribe as usual and it even helps keep other crimes down to a minimum for fear of deadly reprisal. It's a touchy grey place. The concept of evil that we first worlders accept is a largely civilized and modern one. . that doesn't brook much interpertation.

[Khardis]

no not really. sorry if i don't think murdering another person who isn't trying to kill you is subjective. it is wrong. period. regardless of cultural outlook. this might be considered my "opinion" but in my mind it is an absolute. this is giving me a headache. you simply don't understand and based on many of your other comments on here, you never will. why are you so incapable of respecting the ideas/opinions of others? what is this burning need you have to prove everyone wrong? does anyone else want to share their own thoughts on evil or are we just going to go round and round in a big circle jerk until the inevitable crash? Oh Scip, i fully understand that in your mind it is an absolute. That doesn't make it a fact though. It IS subjective, murder to you might be manslaughter to another and might be good to even another. I understand that to YOU its evil, ok, to me too killing someone who isn't trying to harm you is wrong, but that doesn't mean our subjective position on said killing is set in stone fact. It just isn't. Can you even admit that?