FEAR The Walking Dead - Season 4 discussion...

[MinionZombie]

Live figures for episode 4x10 saw a tiny dip down to 1.86m.

[Buzzbomb]

4x10 was another rather lame episode... I'm not sure that it's the number of episodes per season that's the problem though. It seems like the writing/ideas aren't up to scratch. From the youtube clips of 4x11 the next episode looks like it will be better (but then it can't get much worse). Series 5 has been announced... so we'll see.

[MinionZombie]

Series 5 has been announced... so we'll see. Oh, really? Huh... Yes, one part of it is the individuals stories and characters (some are stronger and some are weaker), but another part is definitely too many episodes (which all in-turn require stories to tell). With fewer episodes there'd be less need for filler or dragging out certain subplots. Will they do a time rewind to see what other folks were doing during the storm? Because if that's it just done and dusted then wtf was all the promo stuff about making such a fuss about the storm ... surely we'll see what the likes of Morgan and Dorie got up to during the storm. - - - Updated - - - 4x11 "The Code" Directed by: Tara Nicole Weyr Written by: Andrew Chambliss & Alex Delyle Hopefully this week will be better than last week, eh?

[Moon Knight]

The classic TWD storytelling has come to FTWD. Yay.

[JDP]

The level of patience/tolerance for complete a-holes that totally deserve to die in this show has reached very unrealistic levels. First the regular group, including Alicia, somehow have managed to forgive Charlie for all the rotten things she's done, and for which even she admits that she deserves to die. Now Morgan also mysteriously tolerates the total a-holeness of these three new characters who left him stranded, hands tied behind his back, and surrounded on all sides by zombies. I say: BULLSHIT! In reality anyone who would survive that would have beaten the living crap to death out of all three for putting him into such a deadly situation and then leaving him to his fate.

[MinionZombie]

Yeah, Morgan was pushing it a bit in this episode, but he wasn't fully trusting - e.g. his misdirections to the truckers. Now, as for the truckers themselves, they're not villains but they're selfish and without a better purpose. We do see Morgan bring their better side out of them, so ultimately there's a point to Morgan's way and that's the key thing - it's Morgan's way. You don't have to agree with it, but it's his way. Now, it may very well scupper him one day, but we'll just have to wait and see. Anyway, this episode was much more interesting - rather than the old rope of 'spooky abandoned house with some zombies in it' from last episode (a conceit that's positively old hat in the TWD universe now), we got a more mysterious set-up with this 'take what you need' truck. There was more to discover and layers to peel back, and Lennie James can support an entire episode on his back.

[Moon Knight]

The cinematography for “Close your Eyes” was really good. And for people who still want Charlie dead after that episode I don’t know what to say. Going by that logic, everyone in TWD should be dead. Last episode was ok. I really hate when they do strings of bottle episodes like this, screams of Scott Gimple. I dig Aaron Stanford and seeing him in TWD is pretty cool. I just find it ridiculous for such a small group they still have to split them all up. Amazing.

[JDP]

The cinematography for “Close your Eyes” was really good. And for people who still want Charlie dead after that episode I don’t know what to say. Going by that logic, everyone in TWD should be dead. I'm calling BS on that comparison. The good guys in TWD did nothing comparable to Charlie's treachery. And she knows very well that she totally deserves to pay for what she did. She has no choice now but to admit it. Her "Vulture" pals are gone, she has no one left to run to and protect her. She's at the mercy of the very people she totally cooperated to screw up.

[MinionZombie]

I just find it ridiculous for such a small group they still have to split them all up. Amazing. While it can inspire some other stories to come forth, and let you focus on certain elements from time-to-time, having a string of them does indeed frustrate. You can't have everyone all clubbing in in TWD because the cast is too large for that (and too large generally), but FearTWD does, as you say, have a pretty small cast. Last week's episode simply couldn't sustain a two-hander between Alicia and Charlie, even if it did have some good scenes during it, but it felt like a B-plot over-inflated to fill an entire damn episode.

[JDP]

Yeah, Morgan was pushing it a bit in this episode, but he wasn't fully trusting - e.g. his misdirections to the truckers. Now, as for the truckers themselves, they're not villains but they're selfish and without a better purpose. We do see Morgan bring their better side out of them, so ultimately there's a point to Morgan's way and that's the key thing - it's Morgan's way. You don't have to agree with it, but it's his way. Now, it may very well scupper him one day, but we'll just have to wait and see. Morgan is weird, but his patience/tolerance for total a-holes also has a limit, like everyone else's. I just don't buy it that anyone would be so casually forgiving to let these three ungrateful, dishonest, selfish, cruel bastards off the hook so easily. At least a major beating the living crap out of all three of them is in due order for the truly low and dangerous stunt they pulled on him. He could easily have gotten killed there with his hands tied and no weapon to fight with. Not "funny" or "amusing" at all if you happen to be in a position like Morgan's.

[Moon Knight]

I'm calling BS on that comparison. The good guys in TWD did nothing comparable to Charlie's treachery. And she knows very well that she totally deserves to pay for what she did. She has no choice now but to admit it. Her "Vulture" pals are gone, she has no one left to run to and protect her. She's at the mercy of the very people she totally cooperated to screw up. Please. Rick and group killed a bunch of guys in their sleep haha. Not to mention Nick just finished killing Mel’s brother before he was shot; someone who was just happening to be protecting Charlie at the time. No one is innocent. Ask Alicia why she had to kill someone back at the hotel. Nick also killed Troy’s father haha. I’m not saying what she did was right, but what she did was no worse than anything Alicia or Nick during the ZA.

[JDP]

Please. Rick and group killed a bunch of guys in their sleep haha. Not to mention Nick just finished killing Mel’s brother before he was shot; someone who was just happening to be protecting Charlie at the time. No one is innocent. Ask Alicia why she had to kill someone back at the hotel. Nick also killed Troy’s father haha. I’m not saying what she did was right, but what she did was no worse than anything Alicia or Nick during the ZA. But there is one key difference between all the cases you are referring to and what Charlie did: Rick & company and Madison & company killed those people because they were plainly trouble-makers who were screwing up other people's lives in the first place. Charlie, on the other hand, fully cooperated in screwing up other people's lives who weren't bothering anyone. In fact, quite the opposite: Madison was very kind to take her in and even invite all her "Vulture" pals in as well (which they refused, so that they could easily pick up the spoils after they finished undermining Madison's group efforts to keep the stadium functioning as a sanctuary for survivors.) Charlie and her peeps are truly a despicable bunch who lived up to their nickname and who totally deserve to die.

[MinionZombie]

And Charlie is clearly so full of remorse that she wants to commit suicide, so it's not like she's some devil child cackling behind people's backs. She found herself in a situation that she couldn't really extricate herself from where she was helping immoral people - who had done right by her and protected her during the ZA, a hellish and lawless place to be and an exceptionally dangerous one for a young girl to find herself in - and she recognised too late her mistake, then tried to double down once her protecter was murdered by Nick. Yeah, the dude deserved it, but from Charlie's perspective this was the man who saved her, protected her, and put a safe roof over her head and kept her fed and watered. Charlie was indeed involved in a situation that was unjustified, no doubt, but she's also recognised the damage she has helped cause. When faced with the opportunity to kill Charlie - a child, let's not forget - Alicia couldn't do it. She'd been to a very dark place where she had almost lost everything about herself, but had come back. If Alicia killed Charlie then she'd be a monster like any other monster in the ZA. Alicia chose not to because of the lessons of her mother. 'Deserved' or not, killing Charlie would still be the murder of a child, and there's some lines many folks would never cross even in the ZA. The likes of John Dorie is a bystander in all of it, so he just sees a child on the wrong path and in danger. As for Morgan, different people have different moral codes, and Morgan in particular has a very different moral code to so many people in the ZA. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't, but just because he doesn't toe your particular zombie apocalypse moral line, doesn't mean he's wrong. He's done things I heartily disagree with as well as things I heartily agree with. He's walking a more complex and difficult path. The easy and lazy route is to just go around murdering or thieving or being a turncoat (e.g. the beer maker), but you wouldn't be achieving your full potential that way ... plus the thrust of both shows now is about rebuilding society, and that takes selfless acts of kindness and difficult choices. The ZA would screw up pretty much everyone in some way or another, but there's opportunity to reverse the rot and rediscover your better qualities - this is exactly what Morgan is looking to achieve not only with himself but with those he meets. It's at the core of his character.

[JDP]

And Charlie is clearly so full of remorse that she wants to commit suicide, so it's not like she's some devil child cackling behind people's backs. She found herself in a situation that she couldn't really extricate herself from where she was helping immoral people - who had done right by her and protected her during the ZA, a hellish and lawless place to be and an exceptionally dangerous one for a young girl to find herself in - and she recognised too late her mistake, then tried to double down once her protecter was murdered by Nick. Yeah, the dude deserved it, but from Charlie's perspective this was the man who saved her, protected her, and put a safe roof over her head and kept her fed and watered. Charlie was indeed involved in a situation that was unjustified, no doubt, but she's also recognised the damage she has helped cause. When faced with the opportunity to kill Charlie - a child, let's not forget - Alicia couldn't do it. She'd been to a very dark place where she had almost lost everything about herself, but had come back. If Alicia killed Charlie then she'd be a monster like any other monster in the ZA. Alicia chose not to because of the lessons of her mother. 'Deserved' or not, killing Charlie would still be the murder of a child, and there's some lines many folks would never cross even in the ZA. The likes of John Dorie is a bystander in all of it, so he just sees a child on the wrong path and in danger. It's easy to tell why Charlie confesses she's guilty and is "full of remorse" for what she did: she has no choice now. Before the current situation, she could always run back to her "Vulture" gang and be protected and not have to answer to anyone for the vile underhanded stuff she was doing. And that's in fact what she did, not once but twice (first when the "Vultures" openly revealed themselves and their plans, and second right after killing Nick.) But now they are gone, they were wiped out (and deservedly so.) She's now at the mercy of the remaining members of the very group that she helped to screw up. As for Morgan, different people have different moral codes, and Morgan in particular has a very different moral code to so many people in the ZA. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't, but just because he doesn't toe your particular zombie apocalypse moral line, doesn't mean he's wrong. He's done things I heartily disagree with as well as things I heartily agree with. He's walking a more complex and difficult path. The easy and lazy route is to just go around murdering or thieving or being a turncoat (e.g. the beer maker), but you wouldn't be achieving your full potential that way ... plus the thrust of both shows now is about rebuilding society, and that takes selfless acts of kindness and difficult choices. The ZA would screw up pretty much everyone in some way or another, but there's opportunity to reverse the rot and rediscover your better qualities - this is exactly what Morgan is looking to achieve not only with himself but with those he meets. It's at the core of his character. We have seen Morgan go bonkers and mercilessly slaughter unpleasant characters before. I don't see why would it be different in this case, specially since he himself was the target of these 3 carefree bastards' potentially deadly little "prank".

[MinionZombie]

We have seen Morgan go bonkers and mercilessly slaughter unpleasant characters before. I don't see why would it be different in this case, specially since he himself was the target of these 3 carefree bastards' potentially deadly little "prank". He's not in "bonkers" mode now, though. He wavered a smidge at the bridge, fearing he'd only find his new friends dead or worse, but aside from that little wobble his head is screwed on straight - so slaughtering folks isn't in his approach now. He knows full well what relinquishing control of yourself over to the ZA does to a person, so he's now treading a path to fight against the side effects of the ZA itself.