TWD 7x16 "The First Day of the Rest of Your Life" episode discussion... **SPOILERS*

[Moon Knight]

I think they missed making an impact with the red shirt deaths. I felt nothing as Rick walked past random Alexandria residents whom I had no idea who they were. We are talking close combat with fully automatic machine guns. This takes me back to why I didn't like Richard and Ben dying in the same episode as the tool to convince Ezekiel to fight. This battle would have more meaning if Ben or Richard maybe throw in Tobin, Tara etc in the death count. The garbage kids may be incompetent but the fact that they all failed to kill an Alexandrian whom they had a gun to their back made for chicken shit writing. Just don't sit well with me. On to the chess piece. I assume Dwight left it for Daryl. It said "I didn't know". To what is he referring? That Negan was tipped off by garbage kids? I'm not confident on this and I missed Talking Dead. Yeah, that he didn't know about the betrayal. That was my only gripe. In the book, we had multiple deaths and someone extremely injured. The Saviors didn't even use the grenades. Only scenario I can think of is they are saving that for seasons 8 along with Negan's classic speech.

[shootemindehead]

An ok episode, but very, very, predictable. There were absolutely no surprises there, except for the tiger. But, I knew something was coming and they wouldn't have the balls to kill off Karl. ... and I want to see every one of the garbage pail kids tortured until they learn to speak English properly again.

[MinionZombie]

Did anyone else catch the reference to Escape From New York? And only one walker in the entire episode - I didn't even notice until it was pointed out on Talking Dead!

[Moon Knight]

Did anyone else catch the reference to Escape From New York? And only one walker in the entire episode - I didn't even notice until it was pointed out on Talking Dead! Nah, what was the reference? Only one walker haha that's cool. Sasha being that walker makes it even better.

[JDP]

Nah, what was the reference? Negan's machine gun.

[facestabber]

Negan's machine gun. Oh shit he did have that suppressed mac 11!!!! Can't go wrong with Snake Plisken.

[MinionZombie]

As for shooting accuracy, aside from the moment where you had three automatic weapons blitzing Negan's fleeing truck, it seemed fine to me. The Saviours and The Scavengers suddenly find themselves on the back foot - Shiva jumps in and tears shit up - while Team Rick are ready to go and react immediately and start blasting. The Saviours and The Scavengers are suddenly being chased by three groups of people, all firing with purpose, so they end up fleeing in a panic - you're not going to be a marksman in that context - the best you'll be hoping for is effective cover while you make good your escape while trying to minimise casualties. There are several shots where The Hilltoppers and The Kingdomites are pressing forth confidently with a strong, firm line of automatic and pistol weapon fire - meanwhile the baddies are scattered all over the shop, trying to get a handle on the situation and stay alive in the process. A tiger leaps out of your peripheral vision and starts slaughtering people? You'd damn well be in a tizzy with that going on! Also note that Negan now knows that Maggie is alive: "The widow's alive! Guns-a-blazin'!" Nah, what was the reference?

[Moon Knight]

wow I didn't even notice Negan's gun lol wtf Snake is my boy too! As far as my gripe about the gunfire, I was addressing that we saw a lot of shooting and no one getting hit on screen aside from a few red shirts. I'm sure they could've killed someone like Francine or Scott. Not Tobin, though. I like him and hope he gets a bit more material next season. Same thing happneed during he prison attack. Not really a big deal though. Sasha's story and Maggie's speech was enough for me honestly. The Kingdom was just the icing on the cake. Also Rick echoing back his words to Negan from the season openener was great. This was more comic Rick than anything we've seen all season. Good stuff.

[shootemindehead]

I agree. It was a bit off, to say the least, that the rubbish people had every one in point blank sight, down a barrel, and nobody fired? What?

[Moon Knight]

I agree. It was a bit off, to say the least, that the rubbish people had every one in point blank sight, down a barrel, and nobody fired? What? One of my biggest gripes of the show. So much shit going on and no one dies. It's not like that in the book. The only thing I fear about the upcoming war in season 8. Gotta have more than one casualty in war; one that matters of course.

[JDP]

Another thing: doesn't anybody else find it a bit unsettling that Rick & company were preparing this massive attack against the Saviors without any regard for Eugene's safety? Keep in mind that until the Saviors showed up at Alexandria's gate in this episode no one knew what exactly was happening with Eugene and the Saviors. As far as everyone outside of the Savior compound was concerned, Eugene was a hostage, just like Daryl was. The Alexandrians stayed in line and did not provoke the Saviors as long as Daryl was being kept captive. Why didn't they do the same in Eugene's case?

[Harleydude666]

Another thing: doesn't anybody else find it a bit unsettling that Rick & company were preparing this massive attack against the Saviors without any regard for Eugene's safety? Keep in mind that until the Saviors showed up at Alexandria's gate in this episode no one knew what exactly was happening with Eugene and the Saviors. As far as everyone outside of the Savior compound was concerned, Eugene was a hostage, just like Daryl was. The Alexandrians stayed in line and did not provoke the Saviors as long as Daryl was being kept captive. Why didn't they do the same in Eugene's case? Why? Because no one really cared about that RETARD. They knew he would never physically fight back for anyone, they knew he had to be sacrificed for the greater good of the group. Come on, you really think Rick thought of Eugene as a great loss??? Haha no way

[facestabber]

Another thing: doesn't anybody else find it a bit unsettling that Rick & company were preparing this massive attack against the Saviors without any regard for Eugene's safety? Keep in mind that until the Saviors showed up at Alexandria's gate in this episode no one knew what exactly was happening with Eugene and the Saviors. As far as everyone outside of the Savior compound was concerned, Eugene was a hostage, just like Daryl was. The Alexandrians stayed in line and did not provoke the Saviors as long as Daryl was being kept captive. Why didn't they do the same in Eugene's case? I believe the contrast comes that at one point Rick and family were submissive and not ready to fight and at the other end they were. There was pain/sadness in Ricks face when he gave the order to Rosita. I know Rick respects Eugene as he told him he does. As soon as TF decided to fight it became an all in affair. There was no half in the fight and there will never be a point to call time out or call a truce. This is total victory or total loss when dealing with Negan and his Saviours. If Rick takes Negan at his word then he at minimum has to choose a Lucille victim. But even that is a mute point as they have already chosen to fight. This was one of those horrible decisions a leader has to make. Its not easy. Its down right painful but defeating the Saviors was the decision that ruled the day. For the record I like Eugene but I would have ordered the detonation. Also I believe I saw a John Wick reference. Done a little sloppy in this show but none the less I feel the inspiration came from Wick. - - - Updated - - - Why? Because no one really cared about that RETARD. They knew he would never physically fight back for anyone, they knew he had to be sacrificed for the greater good of the group. Come on, you really think Rick thought of Eugene as a great loss??? Haha no way Eugene survives different than the rest. He did fight in ASZ when the walls were breached by a horde of Walkers. And then there was the time he manned up and drove the RV as a diversion earning the respect of 2 of the top badass characters in Rick and Abe. I believe at that moment Eugene and the others believed there was a high probability of him not surviving the rv trip.

[JDP]

Why? Because no one really cared about that RETARD. They knew he would never physically fight back for anyone, they knew he had to be sacrificed for the greater good of the group. Come on, you really think Rick thought of Eugene as a great loss??? Haha no way I beg to differ. Rick knows that Eugene is a valuable member of the group in his own way. He is not much of a fighter, Eugene himself admits he is a coward, but he makes up for it as a handyman. He is good at fixing and improvising things. Negan has also seen Eugene's value, that's why he "stole" him from the Alexandrians in the first place. - - - Updated - - - I believe the contrast comes that at one point Rick and family were submissive and not ready to fight and at the other end they were. There was pain/sadness in Ricks face when he gave the order to Rosita. I know Rick respects Eugene as he told him he does. As soon as TF decided to fight it became an all in affair. There was no half in the fight and there will never be a point to call time out or call a truce. This is total victory or total loss when dealing with Negan and his Saviours. If Rick takes Negan at his word then he at minimum has to choose a Lucille victim. But even that is a mute point as they have already chosen to fight. This was one of those horrible decisions a leader has to make. Its not easy. Its down right painful but defeating the Saviors was the decision that ruled the day. For the record I like Eugene but I would have ordered the detonation. I would have expected Rick or any of the other Alexandrians to at least have brought up the issue of Eugene's safety first before launching a massive attack against the Saviors, but strangely enough it seems like no one even thought about it. When Glenn and Maggie were captured by the Governor and his people they did not openly go to war with Woodbury but first went on a rescue mission, and then, after having recovered them, went into an open war with the Governor. The obvious reason for this plan is because if your enemy has made hostages of some of your people you run the risk of them being executed or used as human shields if you try anything funny. Really, if I was Eugene and I became aware of this I would have found this deeply disturbing and would have no regrets now about having become part of team Negan.

[MinionZombie]

One of my biggest gripes of the show. So much shit going on and no one dies. It's not like that in the book. The only thing I fear about the upcoming war in season 8. Gotta have more than one casualty in war; one that matters of course. A whole bunch of Scavengers and Saviours bit the dust - sure, red shirts (in one case literally, for a random Alexandrian - he's wearing a red shirt, quite deliberately no doubt), but it's not like nobody died in that skirmish. You've got to give enough time to main/supporting character deaths so you don't swallow them up/distract from them. You could argue that T-Dog's death is ultimately overshadowed by the death of Lori in 3x04 ... although I thought that episode was pretty damn rad and I didn't see the second death coming at all when I first watched it. Sasha had been around since 3x08 - so we lost a long-time cast member this episode and it was right to focus on her story and demise in this episode. Throw in some red shirts (red shirts to us, but to the characters on the show they wouldn't be as dispensible). Big up for Tobin, too - I like that character and hope to see more of him.