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Thread: Why Modern Movies Suck (Critical Drinker video series)

  1. #16
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    I was literally just coming here to post that video.

    Hopefully this nonsense will get more and more exposed, the predictable engineering of the 'news story' that is the making of the IP itself. It's incredible the studios and the media at large haven't figured this all out yet, that they haven't noticed the repeating cycle - it's even more surprising considering how it was various portions of the media who were hysterically bashing Joker as some 'dangerous' movie (never mind that we've already been through the nonsense of 'media makes violence' in the past several decades - books, music, movies, games - and that it's always been found to be bullshit).

    Is it so hard to understand that fans want their beloved material treated with respect, crafted with actual skill, and not used as a puppet for the clunking fist of 'identity politics' in the shifting sands of the 'culture war'?

    Always bag to the well of ists and isms. Is that so, eh? Well explain the positive reaction (at least now that the show is being broadcast) to Lord Corlys Velaryon in House of the Dragon.

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    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
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  3. #18
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    heh, I was about to post this here. You beat me to it.

    Usually, any sort of "message" should either be through analogy or there to find if you want it. These days it's all about a sledgehammer on the nose, but it's interesting to see Hollywood starting to wake up to how 'heavy messaging' movies and shows are struggling to be profitable or are flat out box office bombs. You can't run a business on stuff like that.

    I mean, really, by way of example, who on earth really wants to see "our world" reflected in the fantasy lands of Middle Earth? Too often it seems to be about removing the property from its own context and then transplanting it into our literal real world context, and it just doesn't work.

    I don't think they really know what a "modern audience" actually is, either, much like they have no clue what a "strong female character" actually is.

    What they should be paying far more attention to, in terms of a "modern audience", should include things like viewing patterns, box office trends, how long it takes people to watch a new series (are they binge-viewing, are they spreading it but keeping a regular viewing pattern like one-episode-a-day, or are they trailing off and giving up and so on), which movies/series are most profitable in terms of budget outlay and profit intake, and what things are people talking about most (although that's not something to necessarily put a huge amount into as Andor is getting low chat but positive feedback from viewers - no doubt caused by how poor Obi-Wan Kenobi was and the damage it did to the brand).

    The industry seems to be somewhat out-of-touch with reality too often. Just look at how many streaming services there are. Here in the UK Paramount+ was recently introduced (with massive amounts of advertising money splashed on it) and yet there's not much on it really (a "mountain of entertainment"??? Come on, now), while Lionsgate+ (you wot?) has just been launched and there's even less on it (and nothing I've ever heard of or have any interest in seeing at all) - and this at a time when household budgets are tightening and only getting tighter, and when there's never been so much "content" (ugh, what a grotty term for creative endeavours) competing for eyeballs. Financially speaking, so many streaming services make no sense and are gobbling up money with no real return - why not just license your "content" off to big streamers and not have to invest huge amounts into an inferior streamer to a no doubt limited audience pool? Crazy stuff.

  4. #19
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    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
    -Carl Sagan

  5. #20
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    While I agree with a fair bit of what's being said there, I found it to be a bit too 'all or nothing' - e.g. men as either silent blocks of stone ("good") or babbling cry babies ("bad"), or writing off the Daniel Craig era of Bond because they dared to make the character more complex and conflicted and beaten up by the world that he inhabits and the job he does. There's a bit of a downward spiral of closed-loop thinking going on with certain movies (such as "No Time To Die") within some critical circles, and I don't believe it's particularly fair or broad minded.

    Now, yes, there are annoying styles of how men are written these days, but for instance, the 'constantly talking to fill silences' thing has sprung out of the Judd Apatow school of comedy where everyone's gotta be talkin' all the damn time, and it infects all characters, not just the male ones.

    Also, I think it's pretty narrow-minded or simply ignorant to suggest that men in general don't have deep emotions. In the past men weren't allowed to express emotions, so it was always suppressed (surely some cinematic moments of explosive emotion were reflecting that very constraint?). Now, do I also think that there has been a decided over-correction? Definitely, because there's no such thing as a gradual correction these days, flip-flopping with all the subtlety of the BBC during a crisis. However, just allowing male characters to have more emotions and explore their feelings isn't a bad thing. Has it been handled well in recent cinematic years? Not always, that's for sure, but there's also been some added complications to male characters that have provided a greater breadth of character development.

    After decades of Bond, to just do the exact same thing all over again - yet again - wouldn't have been all that great. The likes of Casino Royale and Skyfall really pack a wolloping punch, both in terms of traditional Bondian tropes, espionage, and action, but also in terms of the depth of the character. Sometimes I feel the folks slagging off No Time To Die have either not watched it at all, or half-watched it once and then formed their opinions based on the reaction from their personal echo chamber, or indeed, they're so caught up in the politics of identity themselves, that they're seeing about as clearly as the biggest proponents of extreme identity politics (ironically enough).

    Now, is there also truth in how men are increasingly being portrayed negatively? Absolutely. I've seen plenty of adverts on telly that show the men as bumbling fools fucking something up or being silly or idiotic etc, and there's been an awful lot of presentations of men in mainstream films that, if they had been applied as such to female characters, they would (justifiably) be hammered for being misogynistic - so why not for being misandrist? The example of Janine Melnitz vs the exasperatingly stupid Kevin from GB2016 is a perfect summation, in many ways.

    There is a problem in cinema and TV in recent years of a decline in male heroes and role models, with too many 'positive males' in movies and shows actually being nothing to aspire to at all. How refreshing it was to see Maverick back in the new Top Gun movie, and that style of character, just goes to show how the zeitgeist has shifted poorly - but at the same time, the Maverick we get in TG2 is much deeper as a character by comparison to the first movie ... ... in fact, upon recently re-watching Top Gun, Maverick is a bit of a fucking cocky prick, always grinning and skirt-chasing, while Ice Man is quite sensibly concerned with things like safety and the cost to the taxpayer (not risking their machinery), rather than the bastard he's often been considered to be. Top Gun is a bloody good like of 80s cinema, no doubt, but I think TG2 is the superior movie, not just in terms of story and character depth but also in terms of action and how it was shot.

    Is there also a problem with how women are written? Oh, yeah, that's a big YES on that one - just as Emily Blunt was pointing out. Female characters have too often been reduced to half-assed male clones in many ways, their femininity torn away from them, reduced to being smug, arrogant, actively horrible and spiteful arseholes with no moral compass, characters who can never do wrong and even when they do it's either ultimately the fault of a man (who's also usually white and also usually 'old') or it's okay because they suffered something so making extremely poor decisions or torturing a whole swathe of innocents (*cough* WandaVision *cough*) is totally fine.

    The idea of a complex character seems to have gone missing to most of cinema and TV lately, be they male or female. The best female characters in the past have always been complex, had emotion, balanced their femininity with their needs & wants, saw them overcome hurdles, learn from mistakes, and struggle towards a hard-won but entirely justified win.

    People can and do get on board with that and have done so for generations. Now the template seems to be one-note arseholes or morons, or thinly-veiled fan fiction and self-inserts ... with a franchise-destroying, fan-hating cherry on top.

    Gosh, I wonder why such projects continually fail to make money?

  6. #21
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    Basically agree; It's a very extreme view displayed in the piece, but it is reflective of a negative trend/agenda.
    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
    -Carl Sagan

  7. #22
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    It's that whole "Woke!" thingy, it's killing us manly men, what no other archvillain or deadly creature/monster/machine could ever do.

  8. #23
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    Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there--on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam. [click for more]
    -Carl Sagan

  9. #24
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    With the great female characters of movie history "strong" meant "complex" ... the writers of today, or the ones who aren't worth a damn at least, think "strong" means "like so totally awesome at punching and brilliant at everything else as well, death to the patriarchy *insert garbled noises of self-righteous indignation*"

    The former you can completely invest in, the latter is boring as fuck self-inhalation of one's own farts.

    I will say, because I'm not sure how the use of it in this video is intended, but Atomic Blonde was awesome and handled an arse-kicking female spy quite well. Theron is 5ft10, so she's not some totty wee thing running around like a squirrel, and you can see the fight training she did for the movie working well. She also uses the environment around her to get an advantage (e.g. a garden hose, or a stairwell), and you can see the physical effects of the fights she gets into - she, much like her enemies, gets the proverbial beaten out of her throughout the movie. It works on-screen and sells it ... unlike, say, Birds of Prey for the most part.

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  11. #26
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    I totally agree with your take on modern movies. It's like they've lost their soul, you know? Everything feels so cookie-cutter, like they're more concerned with ticking boxes than telling a damn good story. And don't even get me started on the whole identity politics mess – it's like they're using our beloved characters as pawns in some bigger game.
    But hey, amidst all this chaos, there's still some cool, good stuff in the movies if you know where to look. Personally, I've been diving into some indie flicks lately, and let me tell you, they're like a breath of fresh air compared to the big-budget blockbusters.
    Last edited by Tuqueakin; 19-Feb-2024 at 12:39 PM. Reason: idk

  12. #27
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    agree with all of that

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuqueakin View Post
    I recommend watching The Departed. It’s a fantastic film with a great cast, including Leonardo DiCaprio and Jack Nicholson. The story is about an undercover cop and a mole trying to expose each other, and it’s packed with tension. I think you’d really enjoy it if you liked The Godfather. It’s available for free on 123movie, which I’ve used before. Another good crime series to try is Breaking Bad. It’s not a movie, but it’s one of the best series ever made. The show is about a high school teacher who turns to making drugs, and it gets really intense. It’s five seasons long, but every episode keeps you hooked.
    If you’re in the mood for something more modern, try Sicario. It’s a bit dark and focuses on the drug war in Mexico. It’s full of suspense and has an excellent performance by Emily Blunt.
    Last edited by ronan4; 2 Weeks Ago at 10:25 AM. Reason: xxx

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