TWD 7x08 "Hearts Still Beating" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN*

[Moon Knight]

The ending was great. It's funny, looking around online most of the negativity from angered fans kind of died down once that scene came together. Worth it. With that said, I am not a fan of bottled episodes with the exception of "Clear" and "The Grove". They just did it way too much this first half and the ratings suffered for it. It wasn't the story that frustrated me, it was the pacing. We shouldn't have to wait weeks just to continue a story that was started episodes back. Let's hope the second half changes all that.

[MinionZombie]

Although with episodes like "Clear" and "The Grove", they actually had a lot of story in them ("The Grove" especially) - whereas, for example, 7x06 simply didn't have enough material for 49 minutes of programming. It desperately needed a second story to go along with it, and was all the more 'slow' in its pacing because it was coming on the back of a few other 'slower build up' episodes. I think we'll see much more momentum in 7B - the gang's back together and they've got some serious shit to be getting on with. I do think, though, that - possibly - any major confrontation could spill over across seasons ... just a theory, a thought, but it's possible.

[Moon Knight]

Another bottle episode that worked for me was "Self Help" as it moved and concluded the Abraham, Eugene, and Rosita storyline. Actually, I really did enjoy the Governor episodes a whole lot too. I think the main issue is the timing and the actual content. You're right, that episode was pretty flat and underwhelming as a whole. Not really needed as it was presented. I must also say, "Here's not Here" was also great but a victim of bad timing and placement as usual. I agree with your thoughts on the upcoming second half. I'm ready.

[facestabber]

The tara/heath episode was the boiling point for me. Those 2 characters are not interesting enough. Or rather do not deserve that much spotlight. Minion, regarding the passing of the .357 I read that as Daryl handing Ricks balls back. Like hey brother let's go do our thing. Regarding the key deliverer. Was Daryls cell door locked with a key? If so even more would I think it wasn't Jesus. Dwight would have a key though. And again why wouldn't Jesus just open the door and say let's go.

[Moon Knight]

The tara/heath episode was the boiling point for me. Those 2 characters are not interesting enough. Or rather do not deserve that much spotlight. Minion, regarding the passing of the .357 I read that as Daryl handing Ricks balls back. Like hey brother let's go do our thing. Regarding the key deliverer. Was Daryls cell door locked with a key? If so even more would I think it wasn't Jesus. Dwight would have a key though. And again why wouldn't Jesus just open the door and say let's go. I agree. Heath really wasn't in it much so I consider it more of a Tara episode. Bad choice and they knew it. Regarding the Cell- Darl's Cell door was left unlocked. I know Jesus is ninja-like, but if it was him that set all that up so quickly I can't buy it. Dwight makes most sense to me. I figured Jesus heard Fat Joey pleading with Daryl and that caught his attention; or perhaps he was already following Fat Joey. I'm sure we'll get a proper explanation.

[kidgloves]

I wouldn't be surprised if the "bottle" episodes were some sort of production programming cheat shot at the same time as the bigger episodes. These episodes seem to be poorly written, edited and shot by the "b" directors. Some of the character choices don't make sense either as if they were written out of sequence.

[Moon Knight]

I wouldn't be surprised if the "bottle" episodes were some sort of production programming cheat shot at the same time as the bigger episodes. These episodes seem to be poorly written, edited and shot by the "b" directors. Some of the character choices don't make sense either as if they were written out of sequence. I can see that.

[MinionZombie]

Another bottle episode that worked for me was "Self Help" as it moved and concluded the Abraham, Eugene, and Rosita storyline. Actually, I really did enjoy the Governor episodes a whole lot too. I think the main issue is the timing and the actual content. You're right, that episode was pretty flat and underwhelming as a whole. Not really needed as it was presented. I must also say, "Here's not Here" was also great but a victim of bad timing and placement as usual. I agree with your thoughts on the upcoming second half. I'm ready. Yeah, "bottle" episodes aren't bad as such - it's the placement and frequency of them that was the issue with 7A - but as you say in the ones I've mentioned and you've mentioned (particularly in the case of "Here's Not Here"), there was some real story being chewed through, a lot of character stuff. The trouble with 7x06 was that it didn't offer up much in the way of story content. Heath has barely been in the show in general, and he was barely in that episode either. I like Tara, but she didn't have a huge amount to do in this episode despite being the protagonist - and giving us yet another community (having only just been introduced to Hilltop late last season and The Kingdom in 7x02) was a lot to swallow. Oceanside is an intriguing place, but I would have preferred that it would have been one of multiple plots being covered in a single episode, rather than the only plot. With "Here's Not Here" (6x04) it's an interesting case. It was part of the big tease over Glenn and The Dumpster (we didn't get an answer until 6x07 or 6x08 IIRC after his apparent death in 6x03), but on the other hand we'd not seen Morgan's backstory - which was worth telling - because the last time we'd seen him before Alexandria he was a murder mad nutjob, and now he was a zenned-out stick fighter. It needed to be longer to cool the audience off after the sheer intensity of 6x01 through 6x03, and it had to be long enough to make Morgan's personal transition from one point to another convincing. There's a lot of really good stuff in that episode and I dig it. Again, with "Self Help" you had a collection of major players - Glenn, Maggie, Abraham, Rosita, Eugene, and Tara. We got to know these newer characters a little deeper, we discovered the truth about Eugene's "mission", we started towards the desperate times that paid off handsomely in 5B, and we got some awesome sequences (the fire engine hose kills, the herd of walkers in the distance, and of course Eugene's predilection for voyeurism ). Minion, regarding the passing of the .357 I read that as Daryl handing Ricks balls back. Like hey brother let's go do our thing. In some ways that scene was quite bromantic, wasn't it? But yeah, that scene was really nice - brothers reunited, Rick re-armed (like a knight receiving his sword), and a coming together of the team who'd been so displaced and shellshocked by recent events. And I'm sure there'll be college lecturers who like to make anything mucky-minded (Disney films, the lot) who'll be talking about the 'phallic imagery of the Python - another name for a male member' etc etc etc.

[Moon Knight]

Rick definitely got his balls back. The last five minutes of this episode was a series highlight for me. Loved the music and the subtle looks everyone gave each other. No dialogue needed.

[MinionZombie]

Rick definitely got his balls back. The last five minutes of this episode was a series highlight for me. Loved the music and the subtle looks everyone gave each other. No dialogue needed. One of the benefits of having characters you've watching for years on end. You can say so much with just a look and some context to go on. It's great to have the regulars back together. I think part of the issue with 7A was introducing so many newbies (or relative newbies like Dwight and Sherri) - Oceanside in particular (which, apart from Tara and Heath, felt more like FTWD than TWD) - because you were missing your favourites. Now, though, I think we've pretty much got our communities established, we know some of these people a bit now (e.g. it was excellent that we got the full shake down on King Ezekiel in 7x02 with no farting about saving a reveal for later), so I'm reckoning 7B is going to feel more ... ... 'connected', for lack of a better word. ... Oh, and here's a video with theories about who the person in the boots could be - SOME COMICS SPOILERS FROM FUTURE PLOT LINES!!!

[Moon Knight]

I think the mysterious boots we've seen belong to a whole new character we haven't been introduced to yet. Everything this season so far as been pulled from the comics as far as main story beats go so I'm gonna assume they are gonna throw a monkey wrench into the mix to freshen things up a bit.

[Neil]

Enjoyable episode... Thing, is Negan, will get back, find Darryl is gone, and gome straight back out surely looking for him? So the scooby gang have surely just got hours available? And I foun the bullet in the bat a bit of an eye roll...

[MinionZombie]

And I found the bullet in the bat a bit of an eye roll... I was wondering how long it'd be until someone whinged about that. Shit luck on Rosita's part and good luck on Negan's. Stranger things have happened, albeit with scant odds (e.g. the two bullets that hit each other bang on during WWI and became intertwined - in Belgium IIRC, because I saw them on a school trip) - the most interesting bit about that moment, though, was Negan losing his temper over it. He's done terrible things and dished out awful violence in response to a show of strength (e.g. killing Glenn after Daryl punched him), but he was always pretty cool about the whole thing - he was in control - whereas Rosita's defiance (and the bullet lodging in his beloved Lucille) made him flip his lid. We've not seen that from Negan until now.

[JDP]

I was wondering how long it'd be until someone whinged about that. Shit luck on Rosita's part and good luck on Negan's. Stranger things have happened, albeit with scant odds (e.g. the two bullets that hit each other bang on during WWI and became intertwined - in Belgium IIRC, because I saw them on a school trip) - the most interesting bit about that moment, though, was Negan losing his temper over it. He's done terrible things and dished out awful violence in response to a show of strength (e.g. killing Glenn after Daryl punched him), but he was always pretty cool about the whole thing - he was in control - whereas Rosita's defiance (and the bullet lodging in his beloved Lucille) made him flip his lid. We've not seen that from Negan until now. Apparently Rosita has never seen the movie Silver Bullet and learnt from the potentially fatal mistake that could have happened. When fighting a "monster" it makes much more sense to make TWO bullets, not one, just in case something goes wrong. Had she had another bullet in that gun Negan's luck would have not saved him.

[Moon Knight]

Lucille eating the bullet was done better in the comics but hey, it gave Rosita something to do so I ain't saying anything haha. Also, Silver Bullet is awesome.