The Mandalorian (TV series)

[ProfessorChaos]

okay, well, i'm not trying to derail this with politics, but while we're on the topic of "FUCK DISNEY, DISNEY+, AND THEIR MONOPOLIZING BULLSHIT", i saw this redlettermedia video this morning and thought this would be a great place to share this. it runs a little long, but it's totally hilarious and worth watching if you're as jaded with hollywood as i am: was that as good for you as it was for me?

[MinionZombie]

There certainly is an issue with Disney being too big (I wasn't at all excited for the Disney/Fox merger because of that very reason), although I don't criticise them for obviously wanting to join The Mandalorian with their new streaming service ... but I won't be subscribing. There's far too many streaming services and this rush by seemingly every platform to have their own subscription service is ludicrous and will fall flat on its arse as the market will dictate, and it will dictate "we ain't paying for all this shit" (especially in addition to cable packages). All these services you've never heard of won't last, or may get swallowed up by bigger fish (thus expanding other services' catalogues). If you don't have the content, people aren't going to cough up - look at Starz. Barely any programming people want, and the stuff that people did want (e.g. Ash vs Evil Dead) people would often sign up for a free trial, binge all ten episodes, and skedaddle. There's also the issue of - there simply isn't enough time to watch all this stuff, nor the inclination to do so, and there's all kinds of different tastes. It's understandable why Disney is doing one, because they own so much damn stuff (far too much stuff), so there'll be a wealth of material, but other services will struggle to prove their necessity. We've seen Internet streaming websites crumble before (e.g. Crackle), so this "streaming war" is just going to prove that not every damn channel needs their own subscription service. It's a piss take and will be shown up as much because the market simply will not support it. Disney+ will likely do just fine, but a lot of others will trip over and land face first in a face full of "fuck no".

[Neil]

Some early reviews sound positive...

[Neil]

Now the first episode it out, people generally seem positive(ish) about out...

[MinionZombie]

Now the first episode it out, people generally seem positive(ish) about out... Ooh, thanks for the reminder. I must have a shufty.

[shootemindehead]

Now the first episode it out, people generally seem positive(ish) about out... It's not bad. A relatively decent start that's easily superior to what Disney has provided with "their" Star Wars already. 'Rogue One' being an exception, of course. Straight off the bat, it stomps all over 'The Force Awakens', 'Solo' and the awful 'The Last Jedi'. But, they're all really, really, low bars, so there's no great victory there. If there's any issues, it's that it's too short at 30 something minutes, the music isn't hitting the spot and the blue fish alien guy at the beginning is terrible.

[MinionZombie]

I watched the first episode last night and quite enjoyed it. The blue fish type guy at the beginning did indeed seem a bit off in terms of the execution, and evidently it's playing things quite mysteriously, but as the episode got going I warmed up to it more. The climax was good. I also really dug how the bounty droid was (mostly) done practically. There were a couple of slightly iffy CGI effects in there, but overall it looked good. And Werner Herzog, for goodness sake! Awesome! It was also good to see that the main character, while adept at the beginning, did have some areas where he wasn't so skilled-up (i.e. riding those blerg things). Hopefully we'll continue to see a mix, so there is some continued peril (the battle towards the end had him fighting hard, too). The second episode is out now. Will have a shufty and see how it goes. - - - Updated - - - Okay, saw the second episode - I dig it. The main action set piece early on was good fun, having that classic-feeling Star Wars vibe of old school serials and derring-do with a little sprinkling of physical humour dusted on top. I'm quite looking forward to seeing the next episode.

[shootemindehead]

Yeh, I've been pleasantly surprised by it. Not too sure if I like the idea of   baby yoda though, if that's who it is. But, it certainly has an original Star Wars vibe to it and on that basis, it's getting a thumbs up from me so far. It's way too bloody short though. I hear S2 is already a go'er. One thing, is that the show has an actual story, which is woefully absent in Disney's sequel trilogy and the main character has his arse handed to him as well on occasion, which is great to see, after the laughable why Rey was written. Hopefully they can keep it up and not shit the bed. It seems to be getting a lot of good will at the moment, so I'd say Jon Favreau is breathing a sigh of relief.

[MinionZombie]

Yeh, I've been pleasantly surprised by it. Not too sure if I like the idea of   baby yoda though, if that's who it is. But, it certainly has an original Star Wars vibe to it and on that basis, it's getting a thumbs up from me so far. It's way too bloody short though. I hear S2 is already a go'er. One thing, is that the show has an actual story, which is woefully absent in Disney's sequel trilogy and the main character has his arse handed to him as well on occasion, which is great to see, after the laughable why Rey was written. Hopefully they can keep it up and not shit the bed. It seems to be getting a lot of good will at the moment, so I'd say Jon Favreau is breathing a sigh of relief.   Is it a baby Yoda, though? At least a baby one of his species, anyway, although what his species is remains a complete mystery. After all, Yoda's 'force ghost' turned up in Episode 8, which takes place after this show. Aye, 'Mando' is getting a good mix of arse kicking moments as well as arse kicked moments, so he actually has to fight and suffers bad luck, as well. Rey was too capable in Episode 7, but I will say that in Ep8 they did give her a bit more of a challenge, but she has felt a bit 'overpowered' (e.g. just hopping into The Millennium Falcon and pretty much rocking it from the get-go having never flown in one!) ... now, Luke, on the other hand, had to put in some graft to become who he was. Rey deserves more of a struggle to better suit her character There's a good balance of tone in this show, too. There's some humour, some action, the heroics and tribulations of a 'shoot first' rogue - I'm digging it. Would it be fair to say that you're enjoying it more because it's an entirely new set of characters, so the show can just be itself and not have to endure the titanic fan expectations that are attached to the sequel trilogy?

[shootemindehead]

Rey is a ridiculous character. She's a poorly written wish fulfilment that's great at everything straight out of the box making it impossible to give a crap about what happens to her. Also, there's just no story in the sequels. It's all just a poor riff on what has come before. Rubbish stuff altogether. Finn isn't much better. A supposed 20 year veteran stormtrooper who becomes a buffoon twenty minutes after defecting from his first engagement. What the hell was he doing for twenty years? They're absolutely wretched and they don't make a lick of sense, even in the fantasy they're involved in. Almost impossible to believe how badly Disney buggered Star Wars up. In any case, that's not to say that this Mandalorian guy is a highly complex, richly rounded, character either. But, even in the hour of screen time we've seen him for, he's had more to offer and his story has been far more engrossing. I actually want to know where this thing is going, whereas I couldn't give a toss what happens to Rey or the other non-entities in the movies. As to the humour, it's been pretty good. Although, I'd be one to say that humour can be left out almost entirely from most dramas and it generally won't be missed. It's usually a terrible idea to try and get a laugh where no laugh is needed and far too often it's studio mandated and carried out by someone who isn't funny. Rian Johnson should take note at how a subtle line like the Jawas telling the Mandalorian that he speaks Jawa like a Wookie is much, much, funnier than an awkward 'Hardware Wars' reference or a "your mum" joke. The gargantuan tonal shifts of 'The Last Jedi' was one of the worst sins of that film. I'm enjoying it so far, because it has the feel of Star Wars and doesn't come across as a phony reproduction of it, like the sequels have been. It has struck the right balance of familiar surroundings and acceptable fan service in a way that has eluded Disney so far with this franchise. And yes, these "new set of characters" have been more appealing than than the cyphers that have littered the sequel trilogy. +Werner Herzog FTW <- I'm still laughing at that. As far as...   who the Yoda baby is, I don't know. But, there are fan rumours (of course) that this baby is a clone of Yoda. Honestly, I have no idea. But, I would MUCH rather that it not be. Star Wars really needs to move away from hanging it's coat on past characters and often ruining them in the process. If the clone theory is correct, it'll require some epic level writing to pull it off successfully.

[MinionZombie]

Was/is Finn a 20 year veteran, though? He's not old enough. I seem to recall he was pretty much a newbie, right? He hadn't really seen much combat when we're first introduced to him? His storyline in Ep8 was utterly pointless though, quite literally, as nothing he and Rose did had any impact upon how things shaked out. The right type of humour is the key thing, but I feel a little dusting of humour is always necessary. It always irks me when I see a drama that is absolutely devoid of a single smile or sarcastic comment or a little bit of something. Even in the darkest of times humans find something to gain a bit of levity, so humour is always important IMHO, but yes, how that is deployed is always key. Aye, thus far 'Mando' doesn't have a huge amount of character story, so I'd like to get a bit more of that in due time, but hopefully we will and I assume we will. However, we've also had some characterisation of him through his actions. I'm presuming we'll never see his face (Pedro Pascal does the voice, but it seems to be two performers doing the actual physical embodiment of the character).

[shootemindehead]

Was/is Finn a 20 year veteran, though? He's not old enough. I seem to recall he was pretty much a newbie, right? He hadn't really seen much combat when we're first introduced to him? His storyline in Ep8 was utterly pointless though, quite literally, as nothing he and Rose did had any impact upon how things shaked out. They're supposed to be taken from birth (a really stupid idea in the first place) and trained constantly in this nouveau Stormtrooper Corps. So, Finn has been part of the First Order for about 20 years or so. Which makes his freak out look all the more ridiculous and his subsequent reduction to a comedy black sidekick trope even more lamentable. Finn's apparent age means that the First ORder have been knocking around for about 2 decades or more, which begs the question just what was the New Republic doing all that time. It's just all round awful writing. The right type of humour is the key thing, but I feel a little dusting of humour is always necessary. It always irks me when I see a drama that is absolutely devoid of a single smile or sarcastic comment or a little bit of something. Even in the darkest of times humans find something to gain a bit of levity, so humour is always important IMHO, but yes, how that is deployed is always key. A little can be ok. But, it has to be funny and feel natural, which none of the so called humour in Disney's prequels has achieved. It all feels forced (pardon the pun) and studio mandated. A kind of "we need a laugh here..." order from up on high. Far, far too many directors and writers just aren't funny and their artificially injected comedy usually falls flat. So, it's normally better just to avoid it. The main problem here, though, is that these franchise offerings are producer driven exercises and they have waaaay too much say in how these films are mad, despite having little creative chops a lot of the time. But they are in a position whereby they can dictate terms to yes men directors, who are often completely without any vision of their own. Humour, though, is the absolute hardest thing to get right in any movie and it's almost impossible to make it universal, which is quite often why Hollywood "humor" crashes badly over this side of the pond and films that do relatively well in America are greeted with a silence over here. But any film maker that can get a 90 minute comedy film to work for most of its running time has my salute. Next after that is horror, but even with that genre, there's a gulf of difficult involved. Humour is much, much, harder to do. Aye, thus far 'Mando' doesn't have a huge amount of character story, so I'd like to get a bit more of that in due time, but hopefully we will and I assume we will. However, we've also had some characterisation of him through his actions. I'm presuming we'll never see his face (Pedro Pascal does the voice, but it seems to be two performers doing the actual physical embodiment of the character). SPOILERS AHEAD!!! The helmet will come off in time I reckon. I can't see them doing a Judge Dredd on this. That won't bother me TBH. There's nothing that says that Mandalorian warriors absolutely never take off their armour. In any case, in the hour we've seen of this show, we know he was a "foundling" by his tribe, his folks are probably brown bread and he's had to take up a dodgy and unglamorous profession to make a living. A living he's good at and is known for by certain people. We know he has a certain amount of honour because if how he interacts with people that help him. But we also know that he's no angel, because he has no problem murdering Jawas in the blink of an eye.

[MinionZombie]

Yeah, but Jawas are thieving wee bastards, anyway, so sod 'em. There's maybe the odd bit of humour in the new films that doesn't quite work, but over-the-piece I've not had too much of an issue - and considering some of the humour in the original trilogy, it doesn't feel out of place to me. Ooh - another thing I like about this show is how this 'baby Yoda' (or whomever it might be) is mostly practical, by the looks of it. Not a load of over-animated CGI nonsense, and there's that subtle aspect of "this thing physically exists" really helps (e.g. the blanket moving in response to its hands/arms). There's a little touch of humour and even cuteness there, but it's not overplayed at all and is perfectly judged in the moment. I also like that, particularly with 'Mando', that you can sense the cogs in his brain going round but also his heart strings getting plucked - this is a bounty, but it's also a baby, who just so happens to be 50 years old. You can see through subtle little moments that there's a kinship brewing and even a sense of care ... I'm even getting a sniff of Shogun Assassin about them, which is cool. I also dig how they use artwork for each episode as the backing for the main credits - a nice touch that highlights some more of the artistry behind all this.

[shootemindehead]

There's maybe the odd bit of humour in the new films that doesn't quite work, but over-the-piece I've not had too much of an issue - and considering some of the humour in the original trilogy, it doesn't feel out of place to me. The humour in the original films is mainly derived from Harrison Ford's sarcastic remarks and his double act with Chewbacca. There's actually very little humour in them really. But it's certainly nothing like the humour in either the prequels or the sequels, which was more of a slapstick nature (hello Jar Jar) and joke setups (lightsaber tossing). It's apples and oranges. But, Solo's sarcasm works, the attempts at humour in the other trilogies doesn't. Not by a long shot. In the original Star Wars films, the humour is very subtle. In the other trilogies, it's far too on the nose. Ooh - another thing I like about this show is how this 'baby Yoda' (or whomever it might be) is mostly practical, by the looks of it. Is it? I can't say that I 100% sure to be honest. I also like that, particularly with 'Mando', that you can sense the cogs in his brain going round but also his heart strings getting plucked - this is a bounty, but it's also a baby, who just so happens to be 50 years old. You can see through subtle little moments that there's a kinship brewing and even a sense of care ... I'm even getting a sniff of Shogun Assassin about them, which is cool. Yeh. It's good story progression. He's now sort of indebted to his bounty, because it's a child and it has saved his life, which is going to cause conflict in future episodes. As I said, in about one hour of this thing we have more story than there is across two whole movies in Disney's sequel trilogy. To be honest, if there are going to be any more films in this franchise, I'd be giving them to Gareth Edwards and Jon Favreau and telling JJ and Rian to take a hike. At least the former two seem to get it.

[MinionZombie]

Is it? I can't say that I 100% sure to be honest. Yeh. It's good story progression. He's now sort of indebted to his bounty, because it's a child and it has saved his life, which is going to cause conflict in future episodes. As I said, in about one hour of this thing we have more story than there is across two whole movies in Disney's sequel trilogy. To be honest, if there are going to be any more films in this franchise, I'd be giving them to Gareth Edwards and Jon Favreau and telling JJ and Rian to take a hike. At least the former two seem to get it. 1) There'll be some CGI shots in there, no doubt, and the practical stuff with have some CGI help (e.g. removing puppeteers, rods/cables etc), but to me it mostly looks practical. If it's actually CGI then they've done a very good job to keep the animation of it limited and more realistic. I hate over-animated CGI. *goes a-Googlin'* https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/bab...og-1203406285/ “On the set, it looked absolutely convincing. It made you cry when you saw it,” Herzog told Variety at “The Mandalorian” fan premiere in Los Angeles. “I saw two technicians operating it remote[ly] — one was for the eyes and the mouth and the other was for other facial expressions. It’s a phenomenal technical achievement and beyond the technological achievement, it’s heartbreaking.” Yep - animatronic. The decision to commit to practical effects with an animatronic Baby Yoda was another big risk, but Favreau was ready to try something new. “‘Star Wars’ gives you the opportunity to tap into all these practical special effects. So there’s great puppetry, there’s great audio effects. I think with ‘Star Wars,’ there’s an acceptance of a certain look. And so I’m taking chances here that I wouldn’t take on a film that wasn’t this, but because the fans are already invested in those technologies. And then [we used] a lot of really cutting edge technologies, using game engine rendering and real-time rendering video wall set extension, using a lot of technology that we developed around ‘Lion King’ and ‘Jungle Book.'” 2) Ach, come on now. 3) Rogue One worked very well, and was helped by keeping it's link to the main films quite light. There's bits of links (e.g. Akbar, Leia) scattered about, and then a bigger link with Vader (who they actually made scary and intimidating again after the prequels shat all over him) and of course Tarkin, but it did benefit from predominantly being a new set of characters on a defined mission that is directly linked to the start of Ep4. There was a little bit of appropriate humour tossed in (the droid), some emotional impact (everyone fucking dies!), and it was well paced and had good spectacle (the tropical beach finale). I even liked that they didn't force a romance into Rogue One between the two leads - just that final look and a supportive holding of hands as they looked at their impending doom, knowing that they had succeeded in their task together. That was far more impactful and memorable.