TWD 7x16 "The First Day of the Rest of Your Life" episode discussion... **SPOILERS*

[Neil]

When did Eugene find the time to sneak around Savior HQ and bend all the iron sights on their firearms? LOL! I thought I was watching an episode of the A-Team given all the pi$$ poor shooting. And a bullet proof super intelligent tiger who knows exactly who is good/bad is always handy to have. I must admit I've found this season to be a tad mediocre all too often...

[MinionZombie]

I'm not entirely seeing the gripe with the gun accuracy during the climactic fight - we lost a major character on the show in this episode, so you don't want to rob that death of its power and toss it away. Toss in too many deaths and it becomes a factory of throwaway kills. A bunch of Scavengers and Saviours got gunned down, Michonne was severely beaten during her fight, and a couple of Alexandrians got wounded (in addition to the odd (literal in one case) red shirt or two from Alexandria). Also, as I said before, Team Rick (with the surprise help of The Hilltop and The Kingdom) had the Saviours and the Scavengers totally on the back foot. All they could do was lay down cover fire for their frantic escape. Not the circumstances for crack shots, really, is it? ... The season overall? It's certainly been quite messy and up-and-down. There's been some fantastic episodes and some all-time greats (7x01 is one of the very best episodes of the show ever, and 7x13 - Bury Me Here - was the second-best of the entire season) ... but there's also been some sore low points (7x06 - Oceanside - being the main one, and 7x10 - the introduction of The Scavengers - the other as a close second on those stakes). There's been a few episodes affected by scrappy plotting, or certain subplots not playing out in a particularly joined-up manner (as if the writers weren't talking to each other effectively enough to make everything link up correctly across the entire season), or character motivations/decisions feeling unclear/unconvincing at times. There's lessons to be learned from Season 7, and the team have learned from past mistakes before, so I'm hopeful for Season 8 - but they absolutely do need to get their heads down and tidy up the mistakes they've made with this season and consolidate the successes they've achieved with this season as well.

[facestabber]

I'm not entirely seeing the gripe with the gun accuracy during the climactic fight - we lost a major character on the show in this episode, so you don't want to rob that death of its power and toss it away. Toss in too many deaths and it becomes a factory of throwaway kills. A bunch of Scavengers and Saviours got gunned down, Michonne was severely beaten during her fight, and a couple of Alexandrians got wounded (in addition to the odd (literal in one case) red shirt or two from Alexandria). Also, as I said before, Team Rick (with the surprise help of The Hilltop and The Kingdom) had the Saviours and the Scavengers totally on the back foot. All they could do was lay down cover fire for their frantic escape. Not the circumstances for crack shots, really, is it? ... The season overall? It's certainly been quite messy and up-and-down. There's been some fantastic episodes and some all-time greats (7x01 is one of the very best episodes of the show ever, and 7x13 - Bury Me Here - was the second-best of the entire season) ... but there's also been some sore low points (7x06 - Oceanside - being the main one, and 7x10 - the introduction of The Scavengers - the other as a close second on those stakes). There's been a few episodes affected by scrappy plotting, or certain subplots not playing out in a particularly joined-up manner (as if the writers weren't talking to each other effectively enough to make everything link up correctly across the entire season), or character motivations/decisions feeling unclear/unconvincing at times. There's lessons to be learned from Season 7, and the team have learned from past mistakes before, so I'm hopeful for Season 8 - but they absolutely do need to get their heads down and tidy up the mistakes they've made with this season and consolidate the successes they've achieved with this season as well. Either the Saviors are a competent or formidable opponent or they are not. I was terrified of them 6-16. Organized, crafty and battle ready. But now they are just back ground fodder. But the biggest gripe people have is the garbage folks have TF at such a disadvantage and only Rosita gets winged? A couple pounds of pressure on a trigger and there should have been some serious casualties. It's not realistic at all. Carl's John wick move was nice and I'd agree he caught two right off the bat. I understand what you are saying about losing impact of Sasha's death. You are right it would. That's 3 A list cast members in 1 season. But the Alexandrians and GPK had no cover when gun fire erupted. At the close ranges you are talking a bloodbath. Years into the ZA a person doesn't have to be a marksman in that scenario to be effective. I don't think it's even lazy writing. I think TPTB don't have an expert on weapons handling and gun fighting to advise them. And if they do the person is incompetent or the director ignores him. I can even forgive them having everyone firing full auto because it makes for cooler tv. But without ammo strapped to your person that's a dangerous way to spend bullets. But like I said that one slides for me.

[Tricky]

Got to admit the poor shooting did bother me a bit perhaps because of my military experience, in the British army we are always told about conserving ammo, deliberate rates of fire and aimed shots. We only fire on full auto in the close quarters phase of a section attack or with support weapons, and to be fair it doesn't even take a massive amount of practice to become competent at hitting targets. Still love the show but things like that do detract from it a bit, kind of like Hershel's unlimited ammo shotgun in the season 2 finale. Also Rick was shot through the abdomen by the chief scavenger, but it barely seemed to bother him and it would appear there was no internal injuries from it!

[MinionZombie]

Of course, if things were done on screen as they would be done in real life it'd look a bit dull. Now, something like John Wick makes pretty efficient use of ammunition look exciting because of all the intricate and over-the-top 'gun-fu' choreography. However, the gleeful abandon would be lost in 7x16's finale without the full auto fire. It's kind of like how in Fast & Furious 5 the director told his stunt drivers to make the cars skid as they were doing that segment where they all try to get around a mocked up garage to avoid being spotted on the security cameras. In reality it's much faster to do it without all the tail out skiddy stuff, but on camera it looks ruddy boring and without the in-person thrill of it you absolutely need to up the ante to inspire a thrill in your viewers, who are all sat on their arses at home.

[Tricky]

I think our Alexandrian friends need to find some kind of military weapons dump and get themselves a .50 cal HMG in the new series, look at the quick job John Rambo made of the Burmese army with one!

[Moon Knight]

"You smell that Simon, that's the smell of shit!" Negan had some great lines in this one haha. Rick and Rosita were the only survivors to take bullets. I don't count the red shirts. Aside from FTWD jacking the famous Holly comic scene causing Sasha's death to feel a bit flat, I really did love everything in this episode.

[DayoftheZ]

On to the chess piece. I assume Dwight left it for Daryl. It said "I didn't know". To what is he referring? That Negan was tipped off by garbage kids? I'm not confident on this and I missed Talking Dead. I today rewatched the episode where Daryl first met Dwight before we knew who he was. Daryl stole the same chess piece from him in this episode as revenge for him stealing his crossbow. Dwight explained that his grandfather had taught him how to carve. So subtle I doubt anybody caught it!!!

[JDP]

I today rewatched the episode where Daryl first met Dwight before we knew who he was. Daryl stole the same chess piece from him in this episode as revenge for him stealing his crossbow. Dwight explained that his grandfather had taught him how to carve. So subtle I doubt anybody caught it!!! What I think will probably never be explained is why Dwight and his wife absurdly went back to the Saviors when they could easily have gone anywhere out of Negan's reach, including taking Daryl's generous offer for them to come to Alexandria with him (at that time the Saviors didn't even know about the existence of Alexandria, so it was a safe haven from them.) Without any logical explanation given for such a strange decision (Dwight knew well about the severe punishment that Negan would give him if he came back after deserting), it makes these two characters look basically like clueless individuals who are quite incapable of reaching the best decisions even when it comes to their very own lives.

[DayoftheZ]

What I think will probably never be explained is why Dwight and his wife absurdly went back to the Saviors when they could easily have gone anywhere out of Negan's reach, including taking Daryl's generous offer for them to come to Alexandria with him (at that time the Saviors didn't even know about the existence of Alexandria, so it was a safe haven from them.) Without any logical explanation given for such a strange decision (Dwight knew well about the severe punishment that Negan would give him if he came back after deserting), it makes these two characters look basically like clueless individuals who are quite incapable of reaching the best decisions even when it comes to their very own lives. As you say a crazy decision, especially as at that point Dwight seemed to be quite grounded. I think the rational is that he felt the best way to make sure his white lived was to take a knee again. As we know his sister in law bit the dust days after escaping the sanctuary, we have to assume it made him realise he couldn't keep Sherry safe alone. Maybe he didn't rate Daryl, based upon the fact he stole his crossbow, not once but twice. He probably didn't see, Daryl and his group as safe from Negan

[JDP]

As you say a crazy decision, especially as at that point Dwight seemed to be quite grounded. I think the rational is that he felt the best way to make sure his white lived was to take a knee again. As we know his sister in law bit the dust days after escaping the sanctuary, we have to assume it made him realise he couldn't keep Sherry safe alone. Maybe he didn't rate Daryl, based upon the fact he stole his crossbow, not once but twice. He probably didn't see, Daryl and his group as safe from Negan I have a lot of problems believing the explanation about Dwight either not trusting or not considering Daryl a worthy ally. In fact, if it wasn't for Daryl all of them would have been either dead or captured by the Saviors. Their best bet at that point was to take Daryl's offer and go back to Alexandria with him. It sure beats the heck of having to humiliatingly surrender your wife to your "boss" and then on top of that have half of your face burnt with a hot iron!

[Moon Knight]

I like how they keep using the little carved soldiers to keep connecting Daryl and Dwight.