TWD 5x05 "Self Help" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN*

[MinionZombie]

If only he'd had that party up front, and put the business in back. Reverse mullets save lives. I'd imagine he's alive, but effed up for now. The good stuff was negated by some of the 'night' scenes where they were so dark I might as well have been listening to the radio, (a niggle in some of the other episodes this season as well). PS: What did Eugene say about the priest after the crash? I've listened to it a few times & can't make it out. 1) Yeah, the night scenes are ridiculously dark. I'm glad they're not lit up like christmas trees, but they've gone too far and it's really hard to make anything out! Hopefully they notch the brightness up a smidge ... keep it murky, but at least make it visible. 2) Eugene was also thinking about how the Priest had this secret but wasn't kicked out of the group, they kept him around ... although, to be fair, they left soon after his secret was revealed ... but Team Rick did show Gabriel mercy. They didn't kill him, they didn't throw him out etc. If a hose can kill the dead so easily why not simply use water pistols That scene annoyed me... How did it actually kill them? Fire hose - like those used in riot control, they can knock a man down quite easily because of the water pressure. The walkers are already known to be mushier than normal humans, so the pressure was able to obliterate their rotting flesh and blast off a few heads. Also, IIRC, some of the walkers were still moving on the ground a bit, so not every single one of them had been snuffed out - we just didn't go through the motions of seeing them stab some heads. The scene had already climaxed ... talk about moist though! Why were they so scared of him though? Couldn't work that out... They were scared of him because of what he'd done - he'd murdered three or four guys with his bare hands (and some canned goods) - and they'd seen/heard it. This man, their husband/father, comes back (after they've experienced a horrific ordeal where their friendly neighbours turned into gang rapists) and he's covered in blood. Abraham has an anger problem and he unleashed the monster inside, plus his family have never seen him in combat mode, so it's a big shock to them - and if their previously benign neighbours can suddenly turn into vicious rapists, then what might Abraham be capable of in this awful new world? Obviously it was a terrible decision, but I can't imagine Abe's wife and kids had had survivalist training, so they obviously made a poor choice based on fear and shock.

[DayoftheZ]

They were scared of him because of what he'd done - he'd murdered three or four guys with his bare hands (and some canned goods) - and they'd seen/heard it. This man, their husband/father, comes back (after they've experienced a horrific ordeal where their friendly neighbours turned into gang rapists) and he's covered in blood. Abraham has an anger problem and he unleashed the monster inside, plus his family have never seen him in combat mode, so it's a big shock to them - and if their previously benign neighbours can suddenly turn into vicious rapists, then what might Abraham be capable of in this awful new world? Obviously it was a terrible decision, but I can't imagine Abe's wife and kids had had survivalist training, so they obviously made a poor choice based on fear and shock. Was that explained on screen? I knew from the source material but don’t remember it actually being said on screen, I just filled the gaps in. It was good to see Abe go all badass on them.

[shootemindehead]

Yeh, I thought Abe's back story wasn't handled particularly well to be honest.

[AcesandEights]

Good episode! Two questions... 1) RE Abraham , who were the woman and two kids suppose to be? Did I miss a clue/hint? 2) If a hose can kill the dead so easily why not simply use water pistols That scene annoyed me... How did it actually kill them? Neil, you trollin'?

[Legion2213]

Good episode! Two questions... 1) RE Abraham , who were the woman and two kids suppose to be? Did I miss a clue/hint? 2) If a hose can kill the dead so easily why not simply use water pistols That scene annoyed me... How did it actually kill them? They've all been looted obviously...DUH!!!

[MinionZombie]

Was that explained on screen? I knew from the source material but don’t remember it actually being said on screen, I just filled the gaps in. It was good to see Abe go all badass on them. They don't explicitly say "the woman and kids are Abraham's" (although Cudlitz confirmed it on Talking Dead) ... however the little boy clearly looks like Abraham's son, and the relationship is implicit and assumed. I think they did it right ... I hate it when you watch a movie or TV show and one character calls another character "sis" ... nobody ever says that in real life and it's so clunky, likewise whenever someone says "I'm your sister/brother and..." - again, nobody effin' says that in real life. Much better to assume a familial relationship from pretty clear visual clues.

[Neil]

Fire hose - like those used in riot control, they can knock a man down quite easily because of the water pressure. The walkers are already known to be mushier than normal humans, so the pressure was able to obliterate their rotting flesh and blast off a few heads. Also, IIRC, some of the walkers were still moving on the ground a bit, so not every single one of them had been snuffed out - we just didn't go through the motions of seeing them stab some heads. The scene had already climaxed ... talk about moist though! They all (most) seemed to have their heads if you ask me... And the scene just didn't seem to suggest brain damaging water to me...

[Moon Knight]

They don't explicitly say "the woman and kids are Abraham's" (although Cudlitz confirmed it on Talking Dead) ... however the little boy clearly looks like Abraham's son, and the relationship is implicit and assumed. I think they did it right ... I hate it when you watch a movie or TV show and one character calls another character "sis" ... nobody ever says that in real life and it's so clunky, likewise whenever someone says "I'm your sister/brother and..." - again, nobody effin' says that in real life. Much better to assume a familial relationship from pretty clear visual clues. Exactly. In the comics the story was told not shown, so we had a clearer idea. This was easy to put two and two together.

[rongravy]

Yeah, I was not a fan of the water hose zombie massacre. If they had that kind of consistency, everything they bumped into would take a chunk out of them. By now there'd probably be nothing left... I got over it, though. The rest of the episode was pretty decent. Eugene, the looky loo...

[Publius]

They don't explicitly say "the woman and kids are Abraham's" (although Cudlitz confirmed it on Talking Dead) ... however the little boy clearly looks like Abraham's son, and the relationship is implicit and assumed. I think they did it right ... I hate it when you watch a movie or TV show and one character calls another character "sis" ... nobody ever says that in real life and it's so clunky, likewise whenever someone says "I'm your sister/brother and..." - again, nobody effin' says that in real life. Much better to assume a familial relationship from pretty clear visual clues. Agree. They didn't communicate the specific details (and I haven't read that far into the comics) but it was pretty clear that the woman and children were his family, he killed those guys because they had somehow attacked or threatened his family, and his family was freaked out because of the brutality displayed that they had never seen before, the shock of the sight of him standing in front of them covered with blood and gore.

[shootemindehead]

Re: the water canon... There's actually a hell of a lot of power that comes out of those things and they can easily knock a fully grown man off of his feet, cause internal injuries and break bones too. Although I did think that that scene was a little goofy tbh.

[Legion2213]

I suppose the water canon attack can be justified in the sense that walkers have no awareness of danger/self preservation...simply falling heavily without any attempt to brace themselves or break their fall and smashing their skulls on the concrete could render most of them dead/damaged enough to immobilise them (especially as they seem to have really weak skulls in TWD universe). I mean, if Eugene turns out to have been killed by his own uncontrolled fall (his head making a sickening sound when it hit the floor) I could readily believe it, so no reason not to believe that weaker/rotten skulled walkers would also have their brains mashed by such impacts.

[MinionZombie]

They all (most) seemed to have their heads if you ask me... And the scene just didn't seem to suggest brain damaging water to me... To be fair they can't fire off a fire hose at full-force into their stunt performers as it would blow them out of their shoes, and it'd cause serious damage whenever it hit the stunt guys in the face (they had protective masks on and the water was reduced to a safe pressure) ... you can kind of tell that the pressure of the hose water isn't up to what they're pretending it is, but I'd rather they get the shots in-camera and just tweak them with CGI to show the head smashing and spurts of blood from blasted chunks of walker flesh. They're decaying corpses, so their consistency isn't going to be the same as living people.

[facestabber]

To be fair they can't fire off a fire hose at full-force into their stunt performers as it would blow them out of their shoes, and it'd cause serious damage whenever it hit the stunt guys in the face (they had protective masks on and the water was reduced to a safe pressure) ... you can kind of tell that the pressure of the hose water isn't up to what they're pretending it is, but I'd rather they get the shots in-camera and just tweak them with CGI to show the head smashing and spurts of blood from blasted chunks of walker flesh. They're decaying corpses, so their consistency isn't going to be the same as living people. Yes sir. I've had the opportunity to control a fire hose and from that end, its power was impressive. I can understand the scene with the pressure ripping off rotting flesh. I think if the show would have had the survivors finishing the knocked over Walkers off would have helped those that didn't like it. I noticed the Walkers still squirming on the ground and was happy the show writers did that. The decayed Walkers got torn apart, the others didn't. But I still ain't down with the skull stabbing, despite my user name

[Staredge]

2) If a hose can kill the dead so easily why not simply use water pistols That scene annoyed me... How did it actually kill them? plausible.jpg It's already been said, but those deck guns are serious business. At full pressure from that range? I suspect it would cause some damage on healthy tissue, much less on the dead. Having said that................ they don't work when the engine isn't running.