TWD 7x01 "The Day Will Come When You Won't" episode discussion... **SPOILERS WITHIN*

[Neil]

Please keep all talk of this episode specifically inside this thread. If you have a theory for a following episode, please use the "spoiler tags" (visit the HPOTD FAQ to find out how to use them if you don't already know). Similarly, if you're going to discuss plot points from the comic book, please use "spoiler tags" - not everyone is up-to-date on them, and some people don't read them at all. Enjoy! Directed by: Greg Nicotero Written by: Scott M. Gimple And off we go again

[facestabber]

Sundays are great again. Cant wait.

[kidgloves]

This is being aired at 2.30am this morning on Fox in the UK and Ireland straight after the US.

[AcesandEights]

Wow, Mary Sues never die, they just fade into boring.

[Wyldwraith]

Wow, Yeah that does it for me. I think I'm just gonna keep tabs on the show via Wiki plot synopsis until this arc is done. The mustache-twirling was too much for me. Rick would've died, but he easily could've killed Neegan seven distinct times I counted. The whole "Grab the axe" and Rick gets held off by getting an assault rifle pulled on him one-handed was cringe-worthy. For once the accusations my words are completely negative are right. I'm disgusted. I really, truly, completely am. I'll be back when the word Neegan has disappeared from being commonly referenced. Take care all. That was heartbreaking for me, and it shredded the last of my tolerance. Peace

[rongravy]

Dang, Glen's eyeball hanging out. I knew he was going to get it, because Negan mentioned killing everyone who was left earlier in the episode. I took it to mean he offed more than just Eugene. I enjoyed it. .

[Harleydude666]

Wow, Yeah that does it for me. I think I'm just gonna keep tabs on the show via Wiki plot synopsis until this arc is done. The mustache-twirling was too much for me. Rick would've died, but he easily could've killed Neegan seven distinct times I counted. The whole "Grab the axe" and Rick gets held off by getting an assault rifle pulled on him one-handed was cringe-worthy. For once the accusations my words are completely negative are right. I'm disgusted. I really, truly, completely am. I'll be back when the word Neegan has disappeared from being commonly referenced. Take care all. That was heartbreaking for me, and it shredded the last of my tolerance. Peace Give me a break dude, who are you kidding, you're not going anywhere, nice try. Anyway it's fiction, get over it, I've seen so much worse. This episode broke new ground but unfortunately for TWD it can never be topped. It's almost as if they brought a top notch movie director in to direct this episode. It just felt too different than anything TWD has done

[babomb]

unfortunately for TWD it can never be topped. It's almost as if they brought a top notch movie director in to direct this episode. It just felt too different than anything TWD has done I agree. I enjoyed it but it did feel a little bit over the top at times. They risk killing it if they plan to try to keep outdoing themselves. Talking dead also had a really strange vibe to it. The way the cast came out in weird outfits, and the whole "live" event thing. Personally I would've just preferred it to be like every other season, without the grandstanding that started with last seasons finale.

[Wyldwraith]

I'm not given to simple QQ-ing of the moment, I mean what I said. Neegan reminds me of Dick Dastardly. All that was missing was Muttley snicker-wheezing. Kinda bummed the season finale of The Strain is next week. Least it hasn't done so well their writers have fallen into Can Do No Wrong Mode. The Zombie Apocalypse would be a horribly shitty place to live. I have a hard time anyone who'd seen light at the end of the tunnel, only to be suddenly thrust into abject slavery would be so in love with breathing they'd put up with it. I mean for God's sake, the scene from the next episode has Neegan himself knocking on Alexandria's gate with his lame-ass bat. Shoot the fucker and let the Saviors self-destruct fighting over whose in charge (which, in reality is EXACTLY what would happen if Neegan went poof. The Saviors aren't a company of elite black ops guys.) It felt like the showrunners were sorry they were on basic cable, because they so clearly wanted to have Neegan pumping his bare cock in between quips and mindless savagery. My one bit of cockles-warming satisfaction is that the critics are eviscerating the show for killing Glenn off after the fake Glenn death of the previous season, and doing it with zero dignity. I'd like to see the show drop a hair short of cancellation. Something to throw a scare into the showrunner and writers. The whole thing would've had me giggling it was so over the top, if it wasn't so damned sad. I have the same problem the show is demonstrating in some flawed RPGs I've played. The ones where every bit of new content you explore has the difficulty of the monsters perfectly rising to meet your level increase, so you never have the sense of making any progress. Frankly the Governor blasting the hell out of the Prison played the overwhelming ruin brought on by invading psychos card. Alexandria is a better setup, so of course lets bring in an antagonist of unbelievably implausible might, and then...Just to make sure they go right over the top, let's have the leader of said overwhelming force be a hardon-stroking sadist with the mentality of a six year old that likes to pull the wings off flies...because of COURSE *THIS* is JUST the kind of guy to gain the unwavering loyalty of hundreds of devoted psychopaths. I've seen much worse myself. That's the problem. I didn't want to see TWD go down the Direct-to-DVD sewer. Since I've been apprised Neegan's a long-running villain, I am over it. There are actual forms of entertainment to be indulged in unless/until TWD gets its head out of its ass. Like I said, The Strain is rocking it. Game of Thrones is finally getting really serious. I've got no beef if others find Neegan's antics entertaining. It's your Sunday night hour, after all. Personally, I got enough of Neegan in high school. I locked mine in a dumpster in late April Florida sunlight with a wasp's nest...and to top off my crime, managed to net HIM a felony conviction and myself a pat on the back from the police and I have the court documents to prove it. I know real viciousness. I went to a high school that had paramedics called to rush the victims of the football team's varsity members about two or three times a month, with said victims facing suspensions when they got back for supposedly starting fights with said psycho jocks. Trust me, real sadism doesn't come with giggling quips. It comes with flat dead eyes, from people externalizing their own pain and thereby trying to diminish it by foisting it off on others. I say Neegan is so over the top there's no horror in what he does. Just the splatter of urine and feces on what at its high point was dystopian art. Your mileage may, as always, vary.

[DayoftheZ]

Never fails to amaze me how after watching an episode in which I spent most of my time on the edge of my seat or punching the air in celebration I come on here and people are moaning about ‘another poor episode’. I think I can count the number or ‘poor episodes’ on one hand and to be fair it is in my opinion a long time since there has been one. In fact I saw people giving FTWD better write ups than the main show and I gave up on that one in season 2A. This weeks was exactly what I want in an episode of The Walking Dead, it was first and foremost as tense as hell and the payoff was off the charts. I was a bit sad that Abe’s death lost some of its magic because Glenn’s was way more brutal. This is the point in the comic books where I started to lose interest in the story but In the TV show I couldn’t be anymore exited to see where we go. TV Negan is way more believable and much cooler than the comic book, and his sense of power over Rick is intriguing. I hope we don’t lose Daryl in the mix as without Glenn, Abe and Daryl realistically Team Rick and Hilltop have zero chance of beating Negan.

[Moon Knight]

People on here just love bashing the show no matter what. That was a poor episode? Ok, just stay away it's not hard. This dude Wyld is on another level he takes it way too serious. Goodbye, dude. Anyways, great emotional roller coaster. Andrew Lincoln deserves an award already. I'll have more to say tomorrow. Peace.

[DayoftheZ]

People on here just love bashing the show no matter what. That was a poor episode? Ok, just stay away it's not hard. This dude Wyld is on another level he takes it way too serious. Goodbye, dude. I know. Sometimes I think back to Maggie when they first storm the prison and she says with a broad smile “you see that!!” I wonder if some of the posters on here would respond to her “yes it was rubbish, you could have put on a pair of gloves first or at the very least had a health and safety meeting” The zombie apocalypse is not real like, people in the zombie apocalypse do not play by the same rules as us, and in a Zombie apocalypse all of the decisions in this episode seem plausible. If this was Fear the Walking Dead, Rick would have fallen from that bridge been covered in the walker’s guts and walked back to the RV. Also Just reading reviews of the episode and I spotted this little fact which I thought was pretty nice. ………………………..“The title is a callback to the Season One finale, wherein Edwin Jenner answered Rick's insistence that he was "grateful" to the CDC scientist for helping him survive by saying … well, y'know. So this is apparently that day, when Rick will wish that Jenner had just kept him and his friends locked inside a building that was rigged to explode”…………………..

[Neil]

This is being aired at 2.30am this morning on Fox in the UK and Ireland straight after the US. Yeh, I was awake about 3am in the morning, and couldn't sleep, was recording it, so got up and watched it Thought it was a pretty good episode, and the fact it seemed to pass by so quickly for me backs that up... Very very tense at times, and that final scene of the zombie chowing down on left over brain mush? Eeek! - - - Updated - - - Tell you what... I hope we get a Negan back story episode to find out what he was, and what made him become this!

[JDP]

Killing Negan at this point would be a big mistake. Sure, you could try to go "kamikaze" and take him out even if it means you will die too. Rick could have done this on several occasions while he was inside the RV with Negan, but he realized that this would only mean death for the rest of the captured group. And now Negan has taken Daryl as a hostage to make sure the Alexandrians remain "in line" and do as they are told. So, realistically speaking, the only tactic left for them if they don't want Daryl to be executed is to try to capture someone important among the ranks of the Saviors and then negotiate an exchange of hostages. Negan would be the most ideal target for capture. This guy so far seems exceedingly cocky and lets his guard down since he thinks that having hostages will prevent any retaliation. In the sneak-peeks of this season that we have seen so far, we see one scene where Negan is knocking on Alexandria's door in person. That would be a great opportunity to capture this dude. Set a trap when he comes in to collect his "tribute". Once he becomes a hostage himself, the Saviors are given the ultimatum of either cooperate and release Daryl or their leader dies (and he will die a horrible death, like being beaten to death with his very own bat, for poetic justice.)

[MinionZombie]

Bugger - I forgot to put the thread up! Thanks for putting it up, Neil - and even more so for keeping up the style guide. ... WOW! That was an emotional wringer of an episode. My guess was correct - Abraham and Glenn - but even still, seeing it play out in live action was a gut punch. I do agree that Abraham's death was a little affected, but you do have to have escalation ... still awesome that he went out with one final Abrahamism. As soon as I saw Abraham square up to Negan in 6x16 I knew he was for the chop - Negan would see that as a clear and present threat and nip that in the bud sharpish. Seeing Glenn, with his eye all popped out, and struggling to call after Maggie was heartbreaking (compounded all the more with that dream-like shot of them all eating dinner together and playing happy families) ... jesus ... what a punch in the gut, but stunningly executed (no pun intended). Did anyone also notice towards the end the Saviour taking a photograph of Glenn's splattered head? Remember when Glenn was looking at similar photos when they raided that Saviour outpost? Now ... thinking about the cliffhanger of it all now ... yes, at the time it seriously pissed me off, and I did wonder how this episode was really going to play out, but looking at it objectively ... ... I can kind of see their point about it making more sense to do it this way. To be fair, it's not like they're the only show to have ever done a cliffhanger, and binge-watching culture's faults (aside from the fun of binge watching) are down to we the viewer in terms of impatient viewing ... ... structurally speaking this was definitely the right call. I was a bit peeved I didn't find out who got Lucille'd straight away, but seeing it all play out through Rick - at Negan's behest in order to recondition him into a subservient underling - made sense. The one thing that I wasn't expecting was the whole scene with the hatchet. The preview scene at NYCC (with Negan dragged Rick and his hatchet into the RV) made me think Negan was going to cut off one of Rick's hands - and then that didn't happen - and then, holy shit, I really believed he was going to make Rick do it ... but of course, that was the key thing to breaking Rick - Rick was going to do it. In that moment, the Ricktatorship was broken ... damn ... a hell of a moment. Bravo Nicotero & Co! Never fails to amaze me how after watching an episode in which I spent most of my time on the edge of my seat or punching the air in celebration I come on here and people are moaning about ‘another poor episode’. I think I can count the number or ‘poor episodes’ on one hand and to be fair it is in my opinion a long time since there has been one. In fact I saw people giving FTWD better write ups than the main show and I gave up on that one in season 2A. This weeks was exactly what I want in an episode of The Walking Dead, it was first and foremost as tense as hell and the payoff was off the charts. Agreed - that was a bloody good episode and a real bruiser, too. Sometimes I wonder if some folks are so against the show, why don't they just pack it in already? To me, at least, it seems like viewing it in such a way is just an exercise in seeking out disappointment. I seriously don't know what some people want, it baffles me ... to each their own. For me though? Loved it. I'm glad I managed to make it the six and a half months without it being spoiled, it was a risky move, but I'm not one for seeking out spoilers. I do wonder if maybe they could have split the deaths across two episodes, though - so have Abraham killed in 6x16, and then make people think that was it and then bam - 7x01 - Glenn gets it as well. However ... structuring it that way would also be a headache for 7x01's structure, so it's not so easy to move things around. These writers are professionals, this is their job, they know structure well and how to pace an episode - so even if it pissed me off at the time to have to wait so long, it's worked out in the end for me and all is forgiven on that front. Seeing 7x01 I'm convinced it was the right call, fan aggro aside, as it made much more sense for story structure and getting Season 7 off on the right foot - just like Negan said himself - a whole new story from this point on. People on here just love bashing the show no matter what. That was a poor episode? Ok, just stay away it's not hard. This dude Wyld is on another level he takes it way too serious. Goodbye, dude. Anyways, great emotional roller coaster. Andrew Lincoln deserves an award already. I'll have more to say tomorrow. Peace. Yeah, Lincoln nailed this. The interplay between Rick and Negan was excellent - it was all about Negan reconditioning Rick from a leader into a servant. Negan doesn't want to slaughter everyone, and he needs people who are strong enough, but he needs to break their will at the same time. He needs people to do his bidding and bring him food and supplies etc - killing everyone would be pointless - killing Abraham was tactical, killing Glenn was punishment for Daryl's pot shot (that's going to tear Daryl up inside - by lashing out, Daryl condemned Glenn to death ... it was a random selection, but the link to someone dying is still there). It's going to be fascinating to see how this plays out. I know. Sometimes I think back to Maggie when they first storm the prison and she says with a broad smile “you see that!!” I wonder if some of the posters on here would respond to her “yes it was rubbish, you could have put on a pair of gloves first or at the very least had a health and safety meeting” The zombie apocalypse is not real like, people in the zombie apocalypse do not play by the same rules as us, and in a Zombie apocalypse all of the decisions in this episode seem plausible. If this was Fear the Walking Dead, Rick would have fallen from that bridge been covered in the walker’s guts and walked back to the RV. Also Just reading reviews of the episode and I spotted this little fact which I thought was pretty nice. ………………………..“The title is a callback to the Season One finale, wherein Edwin Jenner answered Rick's insistence that he was "grateful" to the CDC scientist for helping him survive by saying … well, y'know. So this is apparently that day, when Rick will wish that Jenner had just kept him and his friends locked inside a building that was rigged to explode”………………….. Also - ooh, didn't notice the title before - fantastic call back! It makes the episode even more chilling than before! Yeh, I was awake about 3am in the morning, and couldn't sleep, was recording it, so got up and watched it Thought it was a pretty good episode, and the fact it seemed to pass by so quickly for me backs that up... Very very tense at times, and that final scene of the zombie chowing down on left over brain mush? Eeek! - - - Updated - - - Tell you what... I hope we get a Negan back story episode to find out what he was, and what made him become this! Yeah, the walker going for the remnants of brain matter was a gruesome touch ... a hell of a thing ... it'll be interesting to see how/if they provide Negan's backstory. There'll be a fine line to tread between mystique and explaining just enough to put a little more shading into him for detail. ... So, yeah, a big thumbs up from me ... ... I'll have to go off and have a ponder for more discussion points ... welcome back TWD, you heartbreakin' bastard!