I give up. The world is doomed.

[EvilNed]

Some christians are the f*cking dumbest people to ever have walked this planet. F*ck some of them. I hope some of them rot. I just had a discussion with two christians. We discussed several topics. First, I pointed out that the bible isn't really a reliable source. Infact it's constantly contradicting itself and tells of ludicrious and fantastic tales. They said that this was because it was written by man. I then said, why are you following the word of man? They said they weren't, they were following the word of God. I wondered what part of the bible that was, and they said everything in it. I wondered if this included the passages about killing disobedient children and stoning people who work on sundays. They said no, that is the old testament and Jesus refuted that. I said that he did not, and there are infact passages in the New Testament where he says that the Old Testament (called "The law") should be obeyed and never altered. He states this several times. I then said that you should stone kids and people who work on sundays, and I wondered why they did not. One of them said: Because we're not perfect, but Jesus died for our sins. Just listen to that. What a f*cking retarded answer is that? To add insult to injury, the other guy slapped the first guy on the back saying "That is a great answer, that showed him!" (or something to that effect) yet without realizing that his answer had not really dealt with anything I had asked! It was just a way for them to quickly get out of a theological discussion they couldn't handle. Now one of them said that you needed faith to believe in the Bible, and equated it to Evolution or Gravity and that these things were not proven EITHER, and thus he held the events in the bible with the same credibility as Gravity and evolution. I then said that there is stone hard proof of micro-evolution going on, and it is irrefuteable and that gravity is no longer a theory, it's a law (I believe, at least, I kinda made that up). This caused them to change subject and say that even Darwin was a christian. I said nope, he wasn't. And it's true he wasn't. One of them said he recanted on his deathbed, and I told him that that was a lie invented by the church at that time, and that the only person with Darwin on his deathbed refuted that he had said this. Some of you may also know that in his letters, Darwin calls himself agnostic and I pointed this out. Now THEY attacked ME, saying that his daughters testimony was unreliable and that someone like me who couldn't accept the word of the bible was a hypocrite for believing in her but not the bible. What the hell? Yet another completley retarded turn! How can you compare The Bible, which is full of tales and prophecies, with a simple statement made by Darwin's daughter that he did not turn to christianity on his deathbed! Which is also SUPPORTED by his letters! But at this time I gave up, just saying that they were some of the most ignorant and dumbest people I had ever had the pleasure of meeting. JESUS, I hope you had a miserable time on that cross because of the pain you caused me today, you son of a bitch!

[AcesandEights]

***EDITED for happiness*** I understand where you're coming from Ned. I really do, but not a god (<---wow, almost typoed that word for good...Freudian slip, ftw!) way to start a productive thread (though I sympathize with your need to vent).

[coma]

Here's an idea, as per that sort of conversation Dont Bother. If someone has determined they already know the answer a true dialouge is impossible regardless of what position or point of view one may have

[EvilNed]

I edited the opening line so that it at least does not include all christians...

[bassman]

Dude.....while I understand where you're coming from, all the hatred isn't really necessary. Not here, anyway. In some way, you seem to have not done any better than they did. You had your point of view, they had theirs, and none of you could just accept that and go about your ways? Why try so hard to change someone's opinion? Agree to Disagree. Don't go straight for the throat.

[AcesandEights]

Agree to Disagree. Don't go straight for the throat. Exactly, man. Ned, you represent the Red Menace...be sneaky & nefarious about your ways and means for chrissakes! Save the shoe-beating for Capitalism! PS--Edited out my quote.

[coma]

A response like this may be nice for once "While I see the point with your argument regarding inconsistencies my religion is based on faith and to maintain that faith I have to dismiss the inconsistencies. The Bible was written by God and translated by Man and thats where the inconsistencies come from" But dont hold your breath.

[AcesandEights]

A response like this may be nice for once "While I see the point with your argument regarding inconsistencies my religion is based on faith and to maintain that faith I have to dismiss the inconsistencies. The Bible was written by God and translated by Man and thats where the inconsistencies come from" Well, that would seem to be a Christ-like response...

[Yojimbo]

Thank you EvilNed. I couldn't say it better myself. I have never run across a group more intolerant of opposing viewpoint -- with perhaps the exception of the die hard jihadists -- than Christians. My only suggestion is that you not let it get to you. Easier said than done, to be sure, since logic frequently does not come into play with ture believers. It has been pointed out to me-- by born again christains no less -- that a lot of their belief system has to be do with the "mystery of faith" What exactly that means, however, I would venture to guess has a lot to do with the individual you are speaking with. I myself have read the bible, and this is something that I cannot say all Christians can state as a matter of fact. There is a lot of contradictory stuff inside of there, a lot of exciting stories, and a lot of sex and violence. Some of the stuff (Song of Solomon comes to mind) would probably be banned by christian censors if given the chance. There are some good concepts and good philosophy and some that clearly do not make any sense. I suspect it would be such with nearly any religion one chose to scrutinize. You will never "win" a debate with a true believer. It would be better to adopt a Buddhist point of view: The only way to win that argument is not to participate in the argument in the first place. You will never change the mind of a true believer and the "mystery of faith" operates in a realm outside of logic.

[AcesandEights]

I have never run across a group more intolerant of opposing viewpoint -- with perhaps the exception of the die hard jihadists -- than Christians. Dude, to be fair--at least in my experience--there are die-hard, close-minded people in all religions/creeds/belief structures. It's just that the larger and more institutionalized it gets, the more self-reinforcing it becomes and then it can get widespread and turn into a tidal wave of blind zeal just like any other mob-mentality.

[MissJacksonCA]

I almost never say this Ned... okay okay I'll be honest for a sec... I've never said this ... there, there... it's all going to be okay ... you'll live...

[Yojimbo]

Dude, to be fair--at least in my experience--there are die-hard, close-minded people in all religions/creeds/belief structures. It's just that the larger and more institutionalized it gets, the more self-reinforcing it becomes and then it can get widespread and turn into a tidal wave of blind zeal just like any other mob-mentality. Aces, you raise a very true and valid point in that there are close minded die hards everywhere, not just with Christians and Muslims, and as it the case with true believers most are very loud and spew their rhetoric tirelessly. The size of the organization, it is true, can sometimes determine the size of their trumpet, which in turn determines how loud a noise they can make. In this regard, I am singling out the Christians and the Muslims because they are more prominent and in this way easier to single out than other groups, (It is hard to miss such a large-ass target) and maybe unfairly so. Therefore, maybe a diehard Christian is no more intolerant than a diehard Wiccan. Let's face it, die-hards are annoying all around. When religion becomes involved-- regardless of what religion they represent-- they can be even more annoying. And intolerance of other's beliefs just magnifies the entire annoyance factor.

[Maitreya]

[Yojimbo]

Sadly, that is pretty much the argument that a lot of Christians give in support of the claims against evolution. Another one I like is "Were you there?" when any reference to dinosaurs is made.

[mista_mo]

so anouther anti christiananity thread eh?