Religion/Occultism/Mysticism, etc.

[Jeffery]

I'm a LaVeyan Satanist & have been ever since I realized after reading the Satanic Bible by Anton Szandor LaVey I was a born Satanist & lived the philosophy long before ever picking up any of his work. To give a brief synopsis on what LaVeyan (Modern) Satanism is... LaVeyan Satanism was founded in 1966 by Anton LaVey. Its teachings are based on individualism, self-indulgence, and "eye for an eye" morality, drawing influences from the rituals and ceremonies of occultist Aleister Crowley, and the philosophies of Friedrich Nietzsche and Ayn Rand. Employing Crowley's terminology, its adherents define Satanism as a "Left-Hand Path" religion and philosophy, rejecting traditional "Right-Hand Path" religions such as Christianity for their perceived denial of life and emphasis on guilt and abstinence. Unlike Theistic Satanism, LaVeyan Satanism does not involve worship of any deity, but rather uses "Satan" as a symbol of carnality and earthly values, of man's inherent nature. Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanism Growing up I took a stance & was very anti-drug, very right-wing, but loved metal, horror, the macabre, the taboo & unconventional side of life. I was an outcast from the start! I was always interested in the occult & Left-Hand Path so-to-speak. I prided myself on intelligence, when most my age didn't give a shit. I was the kid who listened to Black Metal & loved splatter/gore flicks, but would never smoke a joint & couldn't wait to vote a Republican into office. When I was about 14/15 I finally got my hands on Anton LaVey's Satanic Bible. When reading it, it felt like I was looking into a mirror. This was it! This was how I had been living all of my life, I just had no idea there was an actual philosophy/religion based on it! From that moment on I had declared myself a LaVeyan Satanist. I enjoy reading on magic/magick too, along with rites & rituals from other Left-Hand Path religions & the works of Aleister Crowley too, even though I find the man's actions deplorable. A lot of what he stood for, I stand for myself, though not the Anarchist, self-destructive bullshit he preached, even though he didn't see it this way. I like to think one can find something in almost every religion to benefit one's life. However, I feel religion can also be something very destructive too, if one allows it to be. I personally don't buy into actual magic/magick, I believe in mind over matter & making shit happen for yourself, but find it extremely interesting to read about. Feel free to share your thoughts on this, or your own on your own personal religion/philosophy, etc. I'm sure I'll find a lot here who are merely atheist/agnostic. That's fine! What works for one person doesn't always work for the next. I myself am an atheist too, I just find life to be filled with wonderful things to indulge in, so long as it's not self-destructive, because self-preservation is the highest law!

[krakenslayer]

LaVeyan Satanism = Neitzche for dummies EDIT: Hope I didn't offend you with that. I didn't mean it that way. It's just that I read the Satanic Bible some years ago and it was JUST like reading Neitztche with added spells

[Mike70]

i have zero belief in religion, the occult, mysticism, or spiritualism of any kind. logic, reason and the physical sciences, particularly the math based sciences of physics, chemistry, and astronomy, tell us all we need to know about how the world works. i see no reason to engage in wishful thinking and imaginary friends. mathematics has one tremendous advantage over any religious or occult practice - it shows us what unassailable truth really is and the truths that it reveals apply to everyone, no matter what their personal "belief system" is. 2+2=4. the square root of 16 is 4. things fall toward the center of the earth at the rate of 9.78 meters per second/per second. these things are provable truth. religion cannot offer anything close to this certainty.

[Kaos]

So what do you think about the Temple of Set, Jeff?

[Jeffery]

So what do you think about the Temple of Set, Jeff? The fact that they claim be the world's leading left-hand path religious organization is complete & utter nonesense.

[Kaos]

They do seem a bit more organized than the other splinter fragments of the CoS. But you are right in that how would you measure that specific claim? Welcome to the board.

[Jeffery]

They do seem a bit more organized than the other splinter fragments of the CoS. But you are right in that how would you measure that specific claim? Welcome to the board. Indeed. I actually don't belong to the CoS. I don't really find a need to join. I just apply the philosophy because, well I pretty much already was long before reading the Satanic Bible.

[JDFP]

All individuals adopt some form of faith in something... the Christian, the Atheist, the Agnostic... Capitalism and Communism are as much of a faith as Christianity and Buddhism. The difference is that one is based upon the notion of Supreme faith within God and the other Supreme faith within the Man. The atheistic scientist worships at the feet of men like Einstein and Tesla, the Christian at the prophesies of Peter, Paul, and the Buddhist the Bodhisattvas. As for me, in less than 100 years the religions of man, Communism mostly, and Capitalism to a degree, have managed to murder and destroy more cultures and people (at least 100 million within Communism) than in all the history of the world combined within the religions of God. You may see God in one way, and I see God in another, or some of us following a man-made faith not at all, but personally I'll stick with putting my faith in God over man any day of the week. But, that's just me. j.p.

[strayrider]

The atheistic scientist worships at the feet of men like Einstein and Tesla...I'll stick with putting my faith in God over man any day of the week. My wife's ex-father-in-law was a nuclear physicist who worked for Fermilab http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermilab. While he was still living (and she was still married his son) he shared with her his thoughts on God. One of his personal insights was that "When science fails, God will not." To Jeffery: The 9 Satanic Statements: # LaVeyan Satanist represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams! # LaVeyan Satanist represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit! # LaVeyan Satanist represents kindness to those who deserve it, instead of love wasted on ingrates! # LaVeyan Satanist represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek! # LaVeyan Satanist represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires (Liberals)! I would call these Conservative values. (I guess I'm (partially) a Satanist ). -stray-

[SymphonicX]

I've read the Satanic Bible...and I don't want to offend those who find meaning in it. But all I could see is it lets you be a complete c**t to everyone who annoys you. Hardly making the world a better place. And self indulgent belief systems just add to it. Sorry, not for me.

[Ghost Of War]

I have The Satanic Bible, and have read it maybe 3 times, and while I wouldn't consider myself to be a LaVeyan Satanist, I do find some of the philosophies in the book fascinating, and agree with many of them. I don't believe in any god whatsoever, in fact I find religion quite repulsive, but I do believe that there's another plain of consciousness that we "ascend" to eventually when the body dies, and I don't mean that in a spiritual way. I find things like this hard to express in words sometimes.

[Jeffery]

I've read the Satanic Bible...and I don't want to offend those who find meaning in it. But all I could see is it lets you be a complete c**t to everyone who annoys you. Hardly making the world a better place. And self indulgent belief systems just add to it. Sorry, not for me. No offense but if this is what you've gathered from it, you obviously aren't reading it for what it is & didn't pay much attention to its text. If people are kind/respectful to you, you should reciprocate. If someone is cruel to you & harms you in any way shape or form, you have the right to defend yourself & not turn the other cheek. This is mans natural/animalistic instinct/nature. If you feel like turning the other cheek & treating people only how you wish to be treated, be my guest. I for one prefer enjoying life & standing up for myself & not allowing others to impact my life in a negative way. What's wrong with indulging? It's good for the psyche & body. You obviously missed the part about self-preservation being the highest law & not allowing any indulgent act to become compulsive, because that is self-destructive behavior. At times the Satanic Bible is tongue-in-cheek. It's laced with wit & sarcasm at times too. It was not intended for everyone, nor is the philosophy. It's a religion for the elite & those who want to get the most out of life. ---------- Post added at 08:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 AM ---------- My wife's ex-father-in-law was a nuclear physicist who worked for Fermilab http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermilab. While he was still living (and she was still married his son) he shared with her his thoughts on God. One of his personal insights was that "When science fails, God will not." To Jeffery: The 9 Satanic Statements: # LaVeyan Satanist represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams! # LaVeyan Satanist represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit! # LaVeyan Satanist represents kindness to those who deserve it, instead of love wasted on ingrates! # LaVeyan Satanist represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek! # LaVeyan Satanist represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires (Liberals)! I would call these Conservative values. (I guess I'm (partially) a Satanist ). -stray- Like LaVey (as he states in the book Satan Speaks!), myself & many other members of the CoS, abortion is something else the philosophy/religion frowns upon & find deplorable. Again, responsibility to the responsible. I think most people would be shocked how many conservative values can be found within this specific religion.

[krakenslayer]

All individuals adopt some form of faith in something... the Christian, the Atheist, the Agnostic... Capitalism and Communism are as much of a faith as Christianity and Buddhism. The difference is that one is based upon the notion of Supreme faith within God and the other Supreme faith within the Man. The atheistic scientist worships at the feet of men like Einstein and Tesla, the Christian at the prophesies of Peter, Paul, and the Buddhist the Bodhisattvas. j.p. I would disagree somewhat with that. Scientists don't really worship Einstein, etc, although popular science in the media can sometimes give that impression. Science does not refer to a faith, or even an agreed-upon body of knowledge, it is simply a method of inquiry. Science is basically about taking ideas (your own or others) and testing their accuracy by trying hard to prove them wrong - if it holds out, it's more likely to be correct. Science never assumes 100% certainly even when something has been "proven". Although scientists may make assumptions from time to time in order to open up a new line of inquiry, a good scientist would always highlight these limitations in their paper and urge caution regarding their conclusions because of this and their theories may not be fully accepted until further investigation is done. Scientists who prove their own theories wrong are still well-respected in the scientific community, for adding to knowledge by highlighting a possibly erroneous idea. Science isn't really a faith, it's just a method of inquiry that uses doubt to sort the wheat from the chaff I do agree with your overall point here though, apart from the science comment, but I would use the word philosophy rather than religion, but that's just semantics.

[Kaos]

I think most people would be shocked how many conservative values can be found within this specific religion. I think most people would be shocked at the number of police and military personnel who are members of Satanist orgs let alone those who just follow the practice.

[SymphonicX]

No offense but if this is what you've gathered from it, you obviously aren't reading it for what it is & didn't pay much attention to its text. If people are kind/respectful to you, you should reciprocate. If someone is cruel to you & harms you in any way shape or form, you have the right to defend yourself & not turn the other cheek. This is mans natural/animalistic instinct/nature. If you feel like turning the other cheek & treating people only how you wish to be treated, be my guest. I for one prefer enjoying life & standing up for myself & not allowing others to impact my life in a negative way. What's wrong with indulging? It's good for the psyche & body. You obviously missed the part about self-preservation being the highest law & not allowing any indulgent act to become compulsive, because that is self-destructive behavior. At times the Satanic Bible is tongue-in-cheek. It's laced with wit & sarcasm at times too. It was not intended for everyone, nor is the philosophy. It's a religion for the elite & those who want to get the most out of life. ---------- Post added at 08:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 AM ---------- Like LaVey (as he states in the book Satan Speaks!), myself & many other members of the CoS, abortion is something else the philosophy/religion frowns upon & find deplorable. Again, responsibility to the responsible. I think most people would be shocked how many conservative values can be found within this specific religion. Hey there Jeffery, thanks for your reply. And don't worry I rarely take offense to posts on a webboard I did read the text, admittedly I was 18 at the time - a decade later things have definitely changed in my life and of course my memory of the book has faded somewhat - however you've jogged certain memories in me and one of them was the line "if you're struck on the cheek, smite them in the face"...or something like that. It is deeply within my beliefs that this very notion of all things makes the Satanic bible a very destructive and selfish mantra to follow. Let's pretend we all live in a world full of self indulgent, spiteful people who aren't afraid to "smite the other cheek" and come back at people with full, harsh force just because they believe it's their right to do so. How much better is the world then? Surely, we've learnt to lead by example? And what example is set to people on the basis of that? Of course it's not always the correct thing to turn the other cheek - but "evil begets evil" - and simply believing that a vengeful thought process will get you out of trouble is unfortunately erroneous, I believe. This belief system is anti-human in every sense. It's not progressive or helpful or unifying to our species. It's a survival of the fittest idealogy that falls short of proclaiming that we should just kill each other to save the bother of having to deal with ourselves. Also, you don't actually help this with the statement that it's a religion "for the elite" - if this is how the elite feels about each other, then excuse me while I step outside with the peasants. Another thing that's stuck in my mind is this statement: "If you feel like turning the other cheek & treating people only how you wish to be treated, be my guest. I for one prefer enjoying life & standing up for myself & not allowing others to impact my life in a negative way." This very statement tells me you consider a caring attitude one to be of lesser value than your own right to enjoy yourself - it avoids completely the very well taught lesson in life that you get out what you put back in, and if your focus is simply to indulge and enjoy yourself (at other's expense?), you've just added another layer of shit to the layercake. For instance I don't consider myself to be any of the things that the Satanic bible propogates because I'll always attempt some form of altruistic response to people. If someone at work for instance, has seen fit to cause trouble for my working life, I'll take them out to lunch and have a friendly get-to-know-you session (at my expense) and will in the future reap the rewards that their loyalty and support gives from such a gesture. This always works. It's much more rewarding to turn the other cheek and work progressively with people than it's ever going to be smiting them back in the face with an equally childish response. I do remember the SB being quite rife with funny moments and it was well written - but it was written by a bitter, dejected old man who saw the world through twisted eyes. As for conservative values, I put myself so far away from those notions of being that it really isn't worth me commenting on - so to have the SB marry up to a belief system that I absolutely despise only strengthens the fact that this "survival of the fittest" idealogy has completely departed from the fact that we are the ONLY species on this planet with the foresight to look outside ourselves and realise the cause and effect of our actions in the long term. With this ability I believe we can all strive for a peaceful and loving species however, with things like conservatism and the satanic bible beating their drums, I fear we'll always be stuck in a selfish, "grass is greener" mentality. Thanks for reading, I hope too that I didn't offend you!!! Cheers, take care T