TWD 8x13 "Do Not Send Us Astray" episode discussion... **SPOILERS**

[MinionZombie]

Please keep all talk of episode 8x13 "Do Not Send Us Astray" specifically inside this thread. If you have a theory for a following episode, please use the "spoiler tags" (visit the HPOTD FAQ to find out how to use them if you don't already know). Similarly, if you're going to discuss plot points from the comic book, please use "spoiler tags" - not everyone is up-to-date on them, and some people don't read them at all. Enjoy! Directed by: Jeffrey F. January Written by: Angela Kang & Matthew Negrete Trouble arises when unexpected visitors arrive at the Hilltop and the community is thrust into action; heartbreaking discoveries are made.

[beat_truck]

I see AMC pulled a dick move like they did with Into the Badlands. They shoe horned their new show in between TWD and Talking Dead and put next week's previews for TWD in the new show's first commercial break, which took over 20 minutes to get to. Nothing like trying to force folks into watching a show they don't give a shit about.

[MinionZombie]

Cracking episode! Saw Tobin was getting some good screentime today, so figured he'd be up for the chop - sure enough, heh. I liked his character, but we didn't quite get enough of him, but at least he made an impression and I'm sad to see Tobin go. Interestingly Tara hasn't fallen ill with a fever (yet, anyway), whereas all the others have already had the fever, carked it, resurrected, and been laid to rest again - so could Tara be okay? I'd assume we'd have to set up the possibility of surviving such a wound, especially as everyone is already infected (i.e. if they died of natural causes they'd still resurrect). Great action with the battle at Hilltop. Loved all the coordinated workings of the groups - the horns, the bus, the flanks of shooters, the use of light and dark etc. Henry ... ... boy oh boy, way to screw the pooch there, kiddo. The lanky haired guy who killed his brother is surely for the axe soon, but how's it gonna shake out? Will Henry die in the process of seeking revenge? Although Henry still doesn't know for sure who killed his brother, mind you. I like the cut of the "good Saviour's" jib. Hopefully he doesn't turn bad, but he's shaping up to be an example that not all "enemies" are bad folks. I see AMC pulled a dick move like they did with Into the Badlands. They shoe horned their new show in between TWD and Talking Dead and put next week's previews for TWD in the new show's first commercial break, which took over 20 minutes to get to. Nothing like trying to force folks into watching a show they don't give a shit about. I understand why they do it from the point of view of pimping their new show, but there's gotta be a better way - pissing off your bread and butter fans isn't a smart move.

[Moon Knight]

Apparently people are upset because they thought the episode was gonna be two hours because the guide's all had it listed as such. I didn't believe it for a second. One- the show NEVER advertised a two hour episode, and two- it's AMC, they are known for shit like this. They are the worst. The Terror actually looks pretty interesting but because of how they promote, I'm passing. Good episode, horrible child acting. Totally killed it for me. Can't believe this dweeb has gotten more screen time than Rosita. Some nice horror elements sprinkled in this one. Although, I find it hilarious that walker tumbled down the stairs and no one woke up haha. Tara is fine. Nice callback to her association with the Governor. That was much needed and I'm glad they slapped some sense back into her character. Just didn't feel right. Overall a mixed bag for me. Some of the pieces felt kinda recycled; but with a satisfying twist, and the terrible Henry scenes kinda pulled me out. Still pretty excited for the remainder of the season though. I'm just afraid this Henry character isn't going away anytime soon.

[JDP]

AMC always pulls that tactic whenever they have a new show. They pick their most successful show at the time (and for a while now it happens to be TWD), and then interject with the new show. Very "aggressive" promotion. Regarding the kid: see, I told y'all back in the pertinent episode that the best thing to do would have been to inform the kid that the person responsible for killing his brother is already a prisoner, and that he will eventually pay for his crime. Gavin would not have been needlessly killed (who would have made a valuable prisoner, BTW, as he was one of the Savior's lieutenants), Morgan would not be having guilt hallucinations, and the kid would not have ended up doing something stupid like he did in the last episode. Bad decision which really should not have happened in the first place. It does not take a "prophet" to predict that not telling the vengeful kid this bit of info would likely lead to trouble. They had nothing to lose by telling the kid about it. Dwight should have killed Simon and saved everyone a lot of trouble in the long run. He had a couple of good chances to do it during the battle, when there were no other Saviors around or they were busy with the battle to be paying attention.

[MinionZombie]

RE: Dwight/Simon - hmmm ... I think Dwight was more busy trying to not get shot/killed during the skirmish than to try and sneak a kill of Simon in the fray. Yeah, people are busy, but there's eyes everywhere. Rick almost snuffed Sidiq (thinking he was a Saviour), with Sidiq thinking he was safe where he was. Dwight couldn't be sure he'd not be seen - and then his cover would definitely be blown and he'd definitely be killed by the other Saviours (or worse). Too risky. Regarding Henry. They chose to do what they did out of compassion, and both knowing (particularly Carol) that vengeance is a paltry gain when the balance is calculated. They definitely knew it wouldn't be a good thing for him, but you can't know what might happen out of a bunch of possibilities. Even if they had told him, what then? Henry grabs a gun and could just as easily make a complete arse up of his vengeance like he did in tonight's episode - he may very well have opened the gate, gone after the Saviour, but a little kid versus a full grown man (and a Saviour with zero scruples, no less) isn't an even match in Henry's favour (even with a gun). Basically - damned if you do, damned if you don't. What they definitely should have done was keep a better eye on Henry ... but even then that's not always possible. Tara calling back to The Governor was good to see - I like that we're getting some self-awareness hitting back for these characters in this half of the season after some rather selfish choices by some of the characters. Yeah ... the stair fall walker - that would have woken me up in a start! I would have preferred a herky-jerky stagger down the stairs with a creeping, tense inevitability. Anyway, I got a surprising thrill out of the gang piecing together the puzzle of what went down. It's nice to see some thought getting employed, and tonight's episode had a fair bit (Henry aside). Like I said before, Maggie evidently had a battle plan laid out with coordinated cues - nice - and it was good (as an audience member, but bad for them as characters) to see the Hilltop cemetery growing. The public perception of Maggie as a leader versus Maggie's private motivations was a good juxtaposition (nice moment between her and Rick when she thanked him for trying to kill Negan).

[Moon Knight]

Maggie's expressions were pretty good there. You could almost see her beating herself up in her head but doing a decent job of not letting the others see weakness. You're right, seeing our people put it all together was great and having Daryl at the forefront of all of it was classic Daryl. Reminded me of Daryl from season 2.1

[JonOfTheShred]

Good episode. I was pissed at my cable provider, though. They had "Walking Dead" taking up a 2 hour slot. But it was only an hour long and that "The Terror" was the second hour. That's not Walking Dead.

[JDP]

RE: Dwight/Simon - hmmm ... I think Dwight was more busy trying to not get shot/killed during the skirmish than to try and sneak a kill of Simon in the fray. Yeah, people are busy, but there's eyes everywhere. Rick almost snuffed Sidiq (thinking he was a Saviour), with Sidiq thinking he was safe where he was. Dwight couldn't be sure he'd not be seen - and then his cover would definitely be blown and he'd definitely be killed by the other Saviours (or worse). Too risky. There were a couple of times when they weren't in the thick of battle with the rest of the Saviors, like when they were sneaking behind the Hilltop's lines. There were no other Saviors around, perfect place to kill Simon without him ever even suspecting what hit him. Regarding Henry. They chose to do what they did out of compassion, and both knowing (particularly Carol) that vengeance is a paltry gain when the balance is calculated. They definitely knew it wouldn't be a good thing for him, but you can't know what might happen out of a bunch of possibilities. Even if they had told him, what then? Henry grabs a gun and could just as easily make a complete arse up of his vengeance like he did in tonight's episode - he may very well have opened the gate, gone after the Saviour, but a little kid versus a full grown man (and a Saviour with zero scruples, no less) isn't an even match in Henry's favour (even with a gun). Basically - damned if you do, damned if you don't. What they definitely should have done was keep a better eye on Henry ... but even then that's not always possible. There are no valid reasons to have kept this information from the kid. No matter how you want to see it, not having informed him that his brother's killer was already captured was an obvious mistake. Even if the kid wanted to do something crazy, like take a gun and try to kill him, he could easily have tried to do so through the fence. The only reason why he opened the gate and went in was in fact because he still had no idea which one of them was the guilty one and was trying to sort him out.

[Moon Knight]

The group couldn’t have predicted the kid would have done something so idiotic. Especially with Carl’s death on their minds and The Saviors breathing down their necks.

[MinionZombie]

There are no valid reasons to have kept this information from the kid. No matter how you want to see it, not having informed him that his brother's killer was already captured was an obvious mistake. Even if the kid wanted to do something crazy, like take a gun and try to kill him, he could easily have tried to do so through the fence. The only reason why he opened the gate and went in was in fact because he still had no idea which one of them was the guilty one and was trying to sort him out. The kid could have done the 'warning shot' (as he planned to do in this episode, seeking the identity of his brother's killer) through the fence as well, but he didn't, the dope unlocked the cage and stepped inside. Like I said, damned if they did tell him, damned if they didn't. Not telling him at least gives the possibility of keeping him at bay, but telling him definitely sends him down a bad path - and both Morgan and Carol have plenty of experience with going down a dark path (plus Carol's other experiences with Lizzie). Their decision makes sense for their characters. The group couldn’t have predicted the kid would have done something so idiotic. Especially with Carl’s death on their minds and The Saviors breathing down their necks. Aye! They've got a shitload on their minds as it is!

[Harleydude666]

I’ve been a regular here for years, but the apologists for this show are cracking me up. It’s a complete mess as the weeks go on. It’s time to bury the Walking Dead. Spraying a group of people with machine gun fire five feet away and no one gets hit??? Haha, laughable shit. And how many chances did Dwight have a chance at killing Simon? It’s a real shame that this has turned into a real shit show and the show runner is alllowing the writers to have their retarded way. It really ran its course 3 years ago if not 4 years ago. It’s embarrassing at this point. I kept tuning in because I’ve flowed the characters this long and I was hoping for some improvement at this point. And now even the zombie they’re going the way Romero did at the end of his career, the same ole zombie kills, where a walker always comes up behind you and grabs you and bites down into your neck. Nicotero is even saying I’m getting too lazy. And the choreography of the action is pathetic, I don’t feel the least pit of peril

[Moon Knight]

I’ve been a regular here for years, but the apologists for this show are cracking me up. It’s a complete mess as the weeks go on. It’s time to bury the Walking Dead. Spraying a group of people with machine gun fire five feet away and no one gets hit??? Haha, laughable shit. And how many chances did Dwight have a chance at killing Simon? It’s a real shame that this has turned into a real shit show and the show runner is alllowing the writers to have their retarded way. It really ran its course 3 years ago if not 4 years ago. It’s embarrassing at this point. I kept tuning in because I’ve flowed the characters this long and I was hoping for some improvement at this point. And now even the zombie they’re going the way Romero did at the end of his career, the same ole zombie kills, where a walker always comes up behind you and grabs you and bites down into your neck. Nicotero is even saying I’m getting too lazy. And the choreography of the action is pathetic, I don’t feel the least pit of peril It’s okay if you don’t like it. Everything is subjective. Nice post anyway.

[MinionZombie]

I’ve been a regular here for years, but the apologists for this show are cracking me up. It’s a complete mess as the weeks go on. It’s time to bury the Walking Dead. Spraying a group of people with machine gun fire five feet away and no one gets hit??? Haha, laughable shit. Except for all the people who caught lead and face planted into the ground, that is. I'll respond to your apparent hatred of the show now and counter that I just don't get the vitriol that some fling its way. I've spoken of various problems that need fixing (and others that have been fixed in years passed), but at the same time I just don't get the hatred that some viewers target at it. It boggles my mind, the extent of some of it.

[Harleydude666]

Except for all the people who caught lead and face planted into the ground, that is. I'll respond to your apparent hatred of the show now and counter that I just don't get the vitriol that some fling its way. I've spoken of various problems that need fixing (and others that have been fixed in years passed), but at the same time I just don't get the hatred that some viewers target at it. It boggles my mind, the extent of some of it. Because I’m the biggest zombie fan going and finally after all these years we finally get our own show which was great and now it’s being run into the ground. No reason at all that bad writing has to be tolerated. Just shows you Gimple, Nicotero or AMC DO NOT CARE AT ALL ANYMORE. A real slap in the face.