9/11 conspiracies

[Neil]

They had a great documentary last night (UK BBC2) about 9/11 conspiracy theories, how in actuality most of them have little/no factual basis at all. It seems basically the people who perpetuate them are selective about the facts at best... Very interesting! I myself have never given any credence to the crazy idea that the US government risked killing thousands of it's own people instigate other action. How anyone can believe this is totally beyond me... But then there's people who believe the lunar landings were faked as well

[MinionZombie]

I watched the same doc last night (after Top Gear, w00t!) ... initially I wasn't going to watch it as my initial thought was it was just going to show a bunch of these lunatics and I'd get all pissed off, but then I thought "no, give it a chance" and indeed, they show both sides of the argument ... and then pummel the conspiracies with actual fact. As for the conspiracy nuts themselves, what a bunch of self-obsessed wankers, they so clearly love themselves to death that it's sickening and they're so BLOODY SMUG about it all. As for that Loose Change guy, he blatantly thought he was "the sh*t" when they followed him through his 'house' (the bloke going around like he was on MTV Cribs for crying out loud, ending up saying "this is where the magic happens") - the dude's a f*cking college drop-out, if he can't hack college, how the hell is he going to make an accurate "documentary" about 9/11? He can't - that's how, and I loved it when the interviewer challenged him about the quote from the Coroner who was at the scene of the crash site for United 93. The Coroner used a simile to describe the site, a simile isn't a fact, you bloody numpty ... the guy's a moron though, so no wonder he looked both confused and scared by the notion of a simile. Did you see how he started twitching, itching and looking hastily over to his friends who were most likely standing behind the camera goading him on? What a loser. Some other bits that debunked the conspiracy theories that I found very interesting (and kinda entertaining, in a way, because they blow these crackpot conspiracy theories out of the water with an atomic bomb size blast)... The apparent wreckage from United 93 being littered over that lake, which Loose Change says is around 7 miles away from the crash site ... yeah, by a f*cking CAR driving on a ROAD, but as the crow flies or more accurately as the plane flies, it's a mere 1 mile between the lake and the crash site. Also, the debris that was found was paper and light material, which was carried on the wind that was blowing in the direction of the lake from the crash site, and that's consistent with other plane crashes. The steel in the Twin Towers - it only takes the heat from the jet fuel to weaken it by over half, so of course the whole thing is going to buckle and fail - also, the central core of the building (which holds the whole thing up) was destroyed, so once it starts to pancake, it just builds momentum and will come down as it did - saying that it looks like a controlled demolition is just that - a simile again. Countless people (me included) said 9/11 looked like a movie, does that mean it was all fake and we're plugged into The Matrix watching movie screens? Nope. As for the controlled demolition 'theory' - how on earth could you, without anyone seeing evidence of it, lay all the charges and do all the work (and hide it inside as well) without people noticing? It's completely and utterly physically impossible, especially on that scale. As for Number 7 or whatever it was, that collapsed due to structural damage caused by the Twin Towers (both directly and indirectly - nuff said). As for the Pentagon, the actual bit where people sit is essentially like a needle going through material, whereas the wings are filled with fuel and are surely a very weak structure when it comes to smashing into a building, they burst open in an instant and the fire caused a massive explosion - I liked the CGI recreation of the event that an independent group produced...then the conspiracy nuts come out saying they were paid by the gubment ... and what evidence beyond pot-smoking-conjecture do they have? Bollock-nothing, that's what. The whole 4,000 Jews thing was completely barmy, but just goes to show what happened on the day - mass 24 hour news reporting going on very weak and confused information at the time, led to MASSIVE CHINESE WHISPERS on a global scale. Interesting that Loose Change uses 'news', that was quickly proved to be totally false, as utter fact. An example? - the Delta flight that was confused with United 93 (which were in similar air space together) was routed to Cleveland to set down, the BBC2 documentary interviewed one of the passengers on that re-routed plane. These conspiracy theorists seem to think that just because there is an "agency", it makes them work like clockwork - no, they're run by humans, humans who make human errors, and that was the case, ad nauseum, on that terrible day. Also, a lot of the conspiracies seem to be driven by nothing more than a hatred for the current administration ... hate them or not, I seriously doubt any of them could live with themselves without showing signs of severe trouble in public, after having apparently condemned so many people to their deaths by their own actions ... it's just ludicrous. Once again, the gubment is - essentially - just like everyone else, they're human beings. All they have over us is a position of high power and a nuclear bunker to hide in. I also liked the conclusion of the BBC2 doc, the only conspiracy surrounding 9/11 was after, and it was merely the gubment trying to cover up how many times they and everyone else f*cked up that day to save face - and that's not exactly new news is it? Countless governments for years and years and years have done the exact same thing, saving face in the wake of a crisis...big deal. Take that you wanker conspiracy theorists!

[axlish]

Whenever I hear about 9/11 conspiracies, I think it best to post this link before moving on... http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...w/1227842.html

[capncnut]

I watched the same doc last night (after Top Gear, w00t!) S**t! I missed Top Gear.

[HLS]

Yes a lot of people believe bush killed his own people. That he knew about it and allowed it to happen. I find it hard to believe that any government would alow so many people to die on our own soil.

[_liam_]

Whenever I hear about 9/11 conspiracies, I think it best to post this link before moving on... http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...w/1227842.html yep, this one is worth a look too http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/factsheets/faqs_8_2006.htm

[LouCipherr]

As for that Loose Change guy... the dude's a f*cking college drop-out, if he can't hack college, how the hell is he going to make an accurate "documentary" about 9/11? He can't... MZ - it's no different than listening to weathermen (and women) trying to scare us about the 'end of the world' due to global warming - yet none of these bozos can even predict what the wheather will be like THIS WEEK much less a few years from now. But hell with it, they're the so-called "experts" and know exactly what they're talking about. Same sh*t, different day, only deeper. LC

[Terran]

MZ - it's no different than listening to weathermen (and women) trying to scare us about the 'end of the world' due to global warming - yet none of these bozos can even predict what the wheather will be like THIS WEEK much less a few years from now. But hell with it, they're the so-called "experts" and know exactly what they're talking about. Same sh*t, different day, only deeper. LC Meteorology, climatology, atmospheric physics, and atmospheric chemistry are sub-disciplines of the atmospheric sciences. The people that predict the weather for this week(Meteorology) arent the same people who make long term climate predictions (climatology, atmospheric physics, and atmospheric chemistry)....they are different disciplines and use different techniques.... Furthermore the majority of the people making weather predictions for tomorrow or the next week on TV are not even meteorologists .... they are just reading predictions off of computer simulations....

[axlish]

yep, this one is worth a look too http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/factsheets/faqs_8_2006.htm Nice one, I'll add that one to the mix as well

[Tricky]

Same mentality of those who claim the holocaust never happened,ive read in depth reports saying that the nazis didnt kill any jews,backed up by "diagrams" showing that gas chambers didnt exist etc,what a load of crap!theres plenty of elderly jewish people with numbers tattooed on their arm who will tell different!

[Arcades057]

I think it's due in part to the idea that, while they're trashing the US, they are also mistified as to how an act such as the terror attacks of 9/11 could have been carried out by a few nutjobs in the face of the FBI, the NSA, the CIA, and all the other alphabet orgs. They can't believe that someone could pull something like this over on the .gov, so they fabricate the conspiracy to make it make sense to them. Does the UK have nutters there who insist that the terror attacks of a few years ago were actually carried out by the government, or is that purely an American thing?

[MinionZombie]

I haven't heard of any 7/7 deniers nor 7/7 conspiracy theories ... although 7/7 is pretty massively overshadowed by 9/11, it gets washed over a fair amount I guess, these days...(globally I mean). Apparently there are people who deny 9/11 happened ... isn't that the most absurd beyond belief notion you've ever heard of?! So where did the buildings go? What was all that world-wide 24 hour news coverage about? What about the first-hand experiences of an entire city (and then some for the Pentagon/United 93 parts of the day)? Denying the holocaust happened is f*cking retarded, but 9/11 as well?! What massively potent 'erb are they tokin' on?

[El_Hooligan]

The biggest 9/11 conspiracy is the government's official story. If you really believe that a handful of ragtag islamic fundementalists operating out of a cave in Tora Bora were able to penetrate the world's safest and well guarded airspace and hit three of their four targets with no help from criminal elements within the US government, then you're the nut. 1.) Building seven wasn't even hit by a plane and was three blocks away from the North and South tower but still collapsed at nearly freefall speed. I doubt it. 2.) Bush's brother was in charge of security at the North and South towers and his security contract expired on Sept. 10th. Very fishy. 3.) Two weeks before the attack, contruction workers closed down both towers for "rennovations" and in the days leading up to 9/11, had ten floors of both towers sealed off. 4.) One month before 9/11, the pentagon's walls had been reinforced, the first rennovations on the pentagon since the 1950s, and at the time of the attacks, only one side was completed, the side that was hit. And astonishingly enough, the rennovation was shortly cancelled. If the pentagon was attacked, would you really cancel the reinforcement project after 9/11 or would you go ahead and strengthen it? Very odd. 5.) Atleast four of the five hijackers were trained and facilitated at American naval bases and recieved money from the CIA and the Pakistani ISI. The FBI informant that testified to this before the 9/11 whitewash commission, was fired shortly afterward and his testimony mysteriously erased from the final report, the report that was for public viewing. 7/7 was a false flag black op too. Don't think western governments don't perpetrate acts of terrorism on their own people because they do. Hitler burned the Reichstag and blamed it on the Communists. Operation Northwoods. Nero blaming the burning down of Rome on the Christians. Numerous IRA bombings perpetrated by MI-5 infiltrators in order to secure a complete military takeover of the Ulster.

[_liam_]

Same mentality of those who claim the holocaust never happened,ive read in depth reports saying that the nazis didnt kill any jews,backed up by "diagrams" showing that gas chambers didnt exist etc,what a load of crap!theres plenty of elderly jewish people with numbers tattooed on their arm who will tell different! indeed. my uncle (or my nans brother, what ever that makes him) was part of the crew that liberated bergen belsen. he didn't seem like he was lying when he told me about what he saw, he's a proper no bulls*** yorkshire dude...not the sort to "balloon", as it were.

[Craig]

I saw the episode of Penn & Teller: Bull**** about 9/11 conspiracies, it was pretty interesting, as well as hilarious.